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Hallucinogenic Toreador posted:Rich List 2017: Six surprising ways to make money Emigrate to Australia and sell pet food. Sell bread at your grocery store in the 1870s. Open a soap factory in a British colony using cheap African labor and money from commodities trading. Make a new type of milk packaging in the 1950s. Set up yet another pound shop. brb off to try all these. e: 1962 - The Commonwealth Immigrants Act removes free movement from the citizens of the Commonwealth of Nations, several African colonies frustrate poor honest soapmakers by declaring independence. Guavanaut fucked around with this message at 20:19 on May 7, 2017 |
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May 7, 2017 20:15
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At this point it looks like we got ~5 years left before everything goes to hell everywhere. Signs of a global crisis coming, but then again we get one every 10 years or so. At least we didn't get a literal nazi in power in France... for now. Still, 35% of french voters voted for a literal nazi. We learned gently caress-all as a species from World War 2, I see. Pochoclo fucked around with this message at 20:30 on May 7, 2017 |
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May 7, 2017 20:28
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Pochoclo posted:At this point it looks like we got ~5 years left before everything goes to hell everywhere. Signs of a global crisis coming, but then again we get one every 10 years or so. At least we didn't get a literal nazi in power in France... for now. Human beings don't learn a lot socially generation to generation as far as anyone can tell - we all get to make the same mistakes over and over again.
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May 7, 2017 20:34
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Some prick 'expert' on BBC news saying that it's impossible to raise much money from the rich because they already pay such a high percentage of taxes and their tax burden has actually gone up a lot over the last seven years. Someone remind me when taxes on the rich were increased in the last seven years?
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May 7, 2017 20:35
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jabby posted:Some prick 'expert' on BBC news saying that it's impossible to raise much money from the rich because they already pay such a high percentage of taxes and their tax burden has actually gone up a lot over the last seven years. I've gone from sleeping on friends sofas to earning quite a bit (by total fluke, studying paid off at loving looooong last). When I tell anyone that I want taxes to go up, they either laugh at me or think I'm making it up. If you taxed me an extra 10%, It'd just take a bit longer to do what I want to do, and at the same time it'd help a whole bunch of people. Which is pretty much what I want.
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May 7, 2017 20:39
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France just shamed britain, but it's a valuable lesson you can learn a lot from. Centrist politics is alive and well, you don't fight the far right from the far left. France and all of Europe and the whole of the democratic world breathe a sigh of relief tonight that Le Pen wasnt running against a French Corbyn.
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May 7, 2017 20:39
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hakimashou posted:France just shamed britain, but it's a valuable lesson you can learn a lot from. gently caress off, you're a racist genocide apologist. Hexyflexy posted:I've gone from sleeping on friends sofas to earning quite a bit (by total fluke, studying paid off at loving looooong last). When I tell anyone that I want taxes to go up, they either laugh at me or think I'm making it up. If you taxed me an extra 10%, It'd just take a bit longer to do what I want to do, and at the same time it'd help a whole bunch of people. Which is pretty much what I want. My parents basically  'd at me when I told them I wanted 100% inheritance tax.
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May 7, 2017 20:45
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hakimashou posted:France just shamed britain, but it's a valuable lesson you can learn a lot from. You're not as good at this as pissflaps. Don't bother.
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May 7, 2017 20:53
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Hexyflexy posted:I've gone from sleeping on friends sofas to earning quite a bit (by total fluke, studying paid off at loving looooong last). When I tell anyone that I want taxes to go up, they either laugh at me or think I'm making it up. If you taxed me an extra 10%, It'd just take a bit longer to do what I want to do, and at the same time it'd help a whole bunch of people. Which is pretty much what I want. I had a good discussion with a (lefty) doctor friend, back in the Cameron days, where we agreed that the NHS needed more money, and the most efficient way to do that was through general taxation, but he argued that this wouldn't go down well in Britain, so maybe some other payment stream (pay £10 at the GP, or everyone pays £50 a month "health insurance", or something) would be necessary. Even if you'd need to raise more from this system to get to the same place, and even if it would have adverse effects. My assertion that people like me should pay more tax were met with "well yes, but the other people like you wouldn't go for it". The perverse thing being, "like me" was a comfortable amount of money relative to a Big Mac, or an iMac, or a holiday. But housing costs were such (didn't help that my job was in the very centre of London) that a juicy tax increase would actually have been detrimental. Hmmm if only housing costs didn't reflect a real thing, and could be cut in half and then half of that half taken in income tax (certainly for the okly-off), leaving both the people and the country better off. E: Miftan, yep that makes people  even more than "I should definitely be paying more income tax"
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May 7, 2017 20:57
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Bobstar posted:I had a good discussion with a (lefty) doctor friend, back in the Cameron days, where we agreed that the NHS needed more money, and the most efficient way to do that was through general taxation, but he argued that this wouldn't go down well in Britain, so maybe some other payment stream (pay £10 at the GP, or everyone pays £50 a month "health insurance", or something) would be necessary. Even if you'd need to raise more from this system to get to the same place, and even if it would have adverse effects. It was a hell of a day when I realised I'd be paying enough tax to fund a student nurse for a year. For me personally, that was awesome - made me want to do more. Unfortunately a lot of people don't seem to think beyond "I've paid money, how is that going to benefit me? (and don't let those dole scummers have any!)". Ugh. I might be slightly Communist, so I'm probably a bad person to judge this stuff.
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May 7, 2017 21:03
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Between the catastrophic landslide defeat for Corbyn Labour in the local elections, and the strong French evidence that centrism is alive and well and perfectly capable of trouncing the right wing, the events of the past few days have been a crushing body blow to the obsolete and discredit leftism of corbynismo
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May 7, 2017 21:08
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We need a radical centrist. Someone who says "I will do what the Tories do, but I will look sad when I do it". Thats the key to defeating May.
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May 7, 2017 21:11
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Gorn Myson posted:We need a radical centrist. Someone who says "I will do what the Tories do, but I will look sad when I do it". Thats the key to defeating May. You need something different from what you've got, that's for sure.
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May 7, 2017 21:12
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hakimashou posted:You need something different from what you've got, that's for sure.
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May 7, 2017 21:16
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I was going to say that under the Cooper we would have the added bonus of the Tories running to the left of her on law and order, but then I realised that May would just take it as a challenge and we would be facing a referendum on restoring the death penalty in six months time.
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May 7, 2017 21:21
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hakimashou posted:We could have exterminated them forever when we had the only nuclear arms. Hmmmm
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May 7, 2017 21:19
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Bobstar posted:I had a good discussion with a (lefty) doctor friend, back in the Cameron days, where we agreed that the NHS needed more money, and the most efficient way to do that was through general taxation, but he argued that this wouldn't go down well in Britain, so maybe some other payment stream (pay £10 at the GP, or everyone pays £50 a month "health insurance", or something) would be necessary. Even if you'd need to raise more from this system to get to the same place, and even if it would have adverse effects. A lefty suggesting what is in effect a flat tax to pay for the NHS. Gosh. That's...wow.
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May 7, 2017 21:22
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jabby posted:Some prick 'expert' on BBC news saying that it's impossible to raise much money from the rich because they already pay such a high percentage of taxes and their tax burden has actually gone up a lot over the last seven years. Rich people exist in a quantum state where they pay way too much tax already but also taxing them more would certainly not be able to bring in enough money to pay for public service X, and they're all really smart with their accountants and loopholes so it's futile to even try and tax them
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May 7, 2017 21:22
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hakimashou posted:Centrist politics is alive and well, you don't fight the far right from the far left. 
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May 7, 2017 21:23
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Miftan posted:My parents basically Inheritance tax is a weird one because people get worked up about the idea of being able to pass something along to 'their children' but the average person inherits at something like in the 50-60 age bracket. Value from rich parents is passed on to you while they are alive. The things people want to inherit are property, and the reason the government wants to tax away property is to pay for old age care costs. Fix housing and fix social care and the issue goes away. e: hypothecated taxes are a terrible idea, you always either end of overfunding or underfunding the service and you can't adjust taxes because 'I'm already paying for that' or 'you are taking bread out of the mouths of x'. Alchenar fucked around with this message at 21:30 on May 7, 2017 |
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May 7, 2017 21:24
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Hexyflexy posted:It was a hell of a day when I realised I'd be paying enough tax to fund a student nurse for a year. For me personally, that was awesome - made me want to do more. Unfortunately a lot of people don't seem to think beyond "I've paid money, how is that going to benefit me? (and don't let those dole scummers have any!)". Ugh. I might be slightly Communist, so I'm probably a bad person to judge this stuff. See also: "Why don't you just send a cheque to HMRC then?" forkboy84 posted:A lefty suggesting what is in effect a flat tax to pay for the NHS. Gosh. That's...wow. Yeah. To be fair, this was a pragmatic suggestion at a time where you couldn't picture either Tories nor Tory-esque-but-sadface (of either party) coming out and saying "the NHS needs money and we're going to tax you to get it".
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May 7, 2017 21:25
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Guavanaut posted:Looks like Macron won though, and the centrist didn't even get a look in. Eh he was a big part of the neoliberalness of Hollande's government, but that doesn't make him an arch-tory. He's more like Umunna or something. Probably will act similar to the way the current (nominally) PS government does.
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May 7, 2017 21:26
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Guavanaut posted:Looks like Macron won though, and the centrist didn't even get a look in. I'm rather surprised Jean-Luc "refugees are stealing the bread from French workers" Melenchon didn't get into the red quadrant, tbh.
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May 7, 2017 21:29
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TinTower posted:I'm rather surprised Jean-Luc "refugees are stealing the bread from French workers" Melenchon didn't get into the red quadrant, tbh. 
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May 7, 2017 21:32
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Gorn Myson posted:"Tories but sadface" pretty much summarised the lot of them. U.K. election 2017: Tories. Tories in clown-face Tories with a badge saying 'trust me I'm a liberal' Tories in sad-face Tartan Tories Tories who own property in the nice bits of the countryside Tories selling a newspaper explaining the orthodox Marxist-Leninist justification for them being Tories radmonger fucked around with this message at 21:35 on May 7, 2017 |
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May 7, 2017 21:32
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I like that Diane Abbott & Corbyn gave McDonnell an opening to bring Das Kapital up, that should help a lot.
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May 7, 2017 21:35
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"You're very clever, young man, very clever," said the old lady. "But it's Tories all the way down!"
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May 7, 2017 21:37
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TinTower posted:I'm rather surprised Jean-Luc "refugees are stealing the bread from French workers" Melenchon didn't get into the red quadrant, tbh. Might have something to do with Political compass being ridiculous nonsense no one should ever take seriously.
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May 7, 2017 21:38
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radmonger posted:Tories selling a newspaper explaining the orthodox Marxist-Leninist justification for them being Tories isn't this how the chinese government works
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May 7, 2017 21:39
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Jean-Luc Melenchon posted:Je crois que l'Europe qui a été construite, c'est une Europe de la violence sociale, comme nous le voyons dans chaque pays chaque fois qu'arrive un travailleur détaché, qui vole son pain aux travailleurs qui se trouvent sur place, une Europe de la violence politique, comme nous l'avons vu appliquer à Chypre et à la Grèce, et une Europe de la violence guerrière, comme celle que vous êtes en train de préparer face à la Russie. Melenchon is rather infamous for anti-immigrant rhetoric that you'd expect more from the Tories than Labour. Codex Occultus posted:Might have something to do with Political compass being ridiculous nonsense no one should ever take seriously. Well, there's that.
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May 7, 2017 21:39
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Codex Occultus posted:Might have something to do with Political compass being ridiculous nonsense no one should ever take seriously.
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May 7, 2017 21:39
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hakimashou posted:Between the catastrophic landslide defeat for Corbyn Labour in the local elections, and the strong French evidence that centrism is alive and well and perfectly capable of trouncing the right wing, the events of the past few days have been a crushing body blow to the obsolete and discredit leftism of corbynismo Macron didn't win because everyone in France loves him. In the first round he got 24% in a tight four way race. He won the second round by such a big margin because there are still enough people terrified of Le Pen to vote for him even if they don't really like his policies. In a different system he might still be President but he would have 'trounced' the far right by less than 3% of the vote. Besides, France just voted to double down on neolibralism, the system that lead to an outright fascist getting 37% of the vote in one of the countries most devastated by the previous rise of fascism. This ain't gonna end well when people realise Macron isn't going to make their lives any better. AP posted:I like that Diane Abbott & Corbyn gave McDonnell an opening to bring Das Kapital up, that should help a lot. I wish McDonnell had tossed Das Kapital across the dispatch box instead of The Little Red Book. At least that way he might have seriously injured Osborne. jabby fucked around with this message at 21:44 on May 7, 2017 |
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May 7, 2017 21:41
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Guavanaut posted:"You're very clever, young man, very clever," said the old lady. "But it's Tories all the way down!" Notice it's "left-right" on the y axis, not "economic left-right". Quite aside from the political compass being bad (and/or terribad), he's not an arch right-winger either; if you object to my using the word Tory.
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May 7, 2017 21:41
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https://twitter.com/LeaveEUOfficial/status/861307433829924866 upstanding chaps of leave.eu
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May 7, 2017 21:42
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Guavanaut posted:"You're very clever, young man, very clever," said the old lady. "But it's Tories all the way down!"
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May 7, 2017 21:44
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TinTower posted:I'm rather surprised Jean-Luc "refugees are stealing the bread from French workers" Melenchon didn't get into the red quadrant, tbh. Maybe if he called them coconuts...
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May 7, 2017 21:44
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Gonzo McFee posted:Maybe if he called them coconuts... Hey-oh! Or something. But he really should be higher up than Hamon. Also he had support from Russia which is weird. Both Fillon and Le Pen did too to be fair.
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May 7, 2017 21:46
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jabby posted:Macron didn't win because everyone in France loves him. In the first round he got 24% in a tight four way race. He won the second round by such a big margin because there are still enough people terrified of Le Pen to vote for him even if they don't really like his policies. In a different system he might still be President but he would have 'trounced' the far right by less than 3% of the vote. Le Pen wouldn't have got into the final round under AV (either Fillon or Melenchon would've got over the line from Hamon transfers), and no sane multi-party democracy is going to suggest electing a president under FPTP.
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May 7, 2017 21:47
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Private Speech posted:Notice it's "left-right" on the y axis, not "economic left-right". Quite aside from the political compass being bad (and/or terribad), he's not an arch right-winger either; if you object to my using the word Tory. The one useful thing the compass does that the left-right spectrum fails miserably at is distinguishing between literal Strasserites and free market fetishists, otherwise you end up in the ridiculous situation of calling the one that wants to slash benefits and deregulate everything 'centrist' and calling the one that wants more jobs and welfare but death to Muslims 'far-right'. e: Also the attempts to explain why the 'far-left' also wants more jobs and welfare leads to 'truth in the middle' and 'horseshoe theory' and other things even worse than compasses.
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May 7, 2017 21:50
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TinTower posted:no sane multi-party democracy is going to suggest electing a president under FPTP. 
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May 7, 2017 21:51
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