|
This was alright. More focused on the family humor then I wanted, but eh. I was hoping it'd be weirder and Quill turning into Pacman was pretty lame. Liked the father and son theme though.
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 16:39
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 30, 2024 14:09 |
|
|
Phylodox posted:So "diffused light" is an overused aesthetic? Visually busy? They're both seedy-looking places with a lot going on, basically. One looks like, well, a prison, while the other looks kind of like the streets in Blade Runner. And you keep getting mad that the movie isn't doing things it's not trying to, but that you want it to. The Kyln is a rough place full of corruption and danger. It's the rear end-end of the Xandar empire. It's obviously somewhere neglected by the empire because that's where they shuffle off all the people they don't want to think about. The aesthetic reflects that. And, again, Knowhere is a giant head where they get knowledge. Its name is literally "know here". Why would it be a whole body? I'm suggesting more compelling alternatives. I don't need them, because there are other works which have done such things. You seem to be working backwards from these concepts and assuming these things are immutable. For example, nothing actually dictates that Knowhere must be a giant head except that it was so in the comics. Phylodox posted:Also, no grandeur here: Well, there isn't much. Those shots all emphasise detail and life. It's as busy as an anthill, emphasising the gross organity of what's going on.. Again, that's where GotG2 shines, busy but polished environments. This is more grand:  Disgusting Coward posted:Yo bro I actually agree with you on a lot of points but you keep going back to this IMAGINE IF IT WAS A WHOLE CORPSE!!! thing and I gotta tell you that's lame as gently caress. 
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 16:43
|
|
|
Jose Oquendo posted:How old are you? I'm guessing Gunn had no problem remembering those were both early 80's things. 34 haha born in 83 So a little younger than Quill. I don't have fond memories of Pacman or Knight Rider but I do remember loving KITT and having a toy of it but I never watched the show. And Pacman was just a game I didnt like on my Nintendo.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 16:48
|
|
|
BravestOfTheLamps posted:I'm suggesting more compelling alternatives. I don't need them, because there are other works which have done such things. Again, it's where they go to get knowledge. "Know here". It's a head, where the brains are. Where memories and ideas are stored. It's a pretty clear, effective metaphor. quote:Well, there isn't much. Those shots all emphasise detail and life. It's as busy as an anthill, emphasising the gross organity of what's going on.. Again, that's where GotG2 shines, busy but polished environments. This is more grand: Those shots emphasize scale and volume. The Milano is a tiny spec, all that life is just clusters of light. The spinal column in the background is titanic. If you're going to say that doesn't display grandeur, then I just don't understand you on a fundamental level.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 16:48
|
|
|
Phylodox posted:Again, it's where they go to get knowledge. "Know here". It's a head, where the brains are. Where memories and ideas are stored. It's a pretty clear, effective metaphor. You seem to have misunderstood the metaphor. The point of the place is to show life teeming in midst of death, which is why it's a skull. The Collector even presides over a zoo full of exotic lifeforms to emphasise the biological aspect of it. Phylodox posted:Those shots emphasize scale and volume. The Milano is a tiny spec, all that life is just clusters of light. The spinal column in the background is titanic. If you're going to say that doesn't display grandeur, then I just don't understand you on a fundamental level. Knowhere is a vast thing, but it doesn't have splendour of appearance (it's purposefully degraded, prosaic, and anthill-like), magnificence, or loftiness, which are things that make up 'grandeur'. Those are things that are present in the other shot. There's even a David Bowie song that's existential instead of majestic. Again, the problem is that you think reactively, so when I propose some idea you end up letting it define your own arguments. I mentioned that a setting doesn't have grandeur to it, so you find it necessary to prove that it does. You need to think proactively. BravestOfTheLamps fucked around with this message at 17:11 on May 8, 2017 |
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 17:01
|
|
|
I have a fetish for gold women now.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 17:03
|
|
|
Detective No. 27 posted:I have a fetish for gold women now. Same. Especially if they don't blink.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 17:04
|
|
|
BravestOfTheLamps posted:You need to think proactively. Again, no literary criticism is proactive. You are just talking about someone else's work without creating anything of worth yourself. It's an entirely reactionary undertaking. You can shitpost all you want, you don't get to pretend it's original or matters.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 17:13
|
|
|
Mulva posted:Again, no literary criticism is proactive. You are just talking about someone else's work without creating anything of worth yourself. It's an entirely reactionary undertaking. You can shitpost all you want, you don't get to pretend it's original or matters. You're appealing to the old rejection of literary criticism as innately parasitical. In reality, literary criticism is simply the practice of seeking to understand texts. This is a creative and proactive effort despite always existing in relation to 'superior' texts (but really, what doesn't?). BravestOfTheLamps fucked around with this message at 17:20 on May 8, 2017 |
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 17:18
|
|
|
BravestOfTheLamps posted:You seem to have misunderstood the metaphor. The point of the place is to show life teeming in midst of death, which is why it's a skull. The Collector even presides over a zoo full of exotic lifeforms to emphasise the biological aspect of it. How does one thing preclude the other? In any way? You think it's a coincidence that it's a head and they're in search of knowledge? You're just willfully ignoring things to prove you're right at this point. quote:Knowhere is a vast thing, but it doesn't have splendour of appearance (it's purposefully degraded, prosaic, and anthill-like), magnificence, or loftiness, which are things that make up 'grandeur'. Those are things that are present in the other shot. There's even a David Bowie song that's existential instead of majestic. It absolutely has those things. You're confusing what we know it to be (a dirty, teeming mining colony) with how it's presented in those shots: vast, colourful, beautiful. It's only when you descend to the micro-level, where the people exist, that you see the dirt and the chaos. And, Jesus, if you don't like me responding to your points, then stop talking.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 17:20
|
|
|
Phylodox posted:How does one thing preclude the other? In any way? You think it's a coincidence that it's a head and they're in search of knowledge? You're just willfully ignoring things to prove you're right at this point. The pun that it's a place where the heroes go know things is discernible, but it's not really even a metaphor. What's more important is how it ties into the larger theme of death in the movie. Phylodox posted:It absolutely has those things. You're confusing what we know it to be (a dirty, teeming mining colony) with how it's presented in those shots It is presented to be a dirty, teeming mining colony. The giant head is visibly degraded and falling apart, and is presented as fading into the nebula. The insides are messy in a organic sense, like a human body, with buildings and industry. What you're looking at is a very down-and-dirty city, and it's clearly shown in those screenshots. When I say that you think reactively, it's because you don't invest your imagination into this and depend on received knowledge. You've read Knowhere blandly as a pun, instead of the symbol of life and death that it is.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 17:28
|
|
|
oh I have a theory/question(?) about (post-credit spoiler) Adam Warlock Okay so all I know about the guy is that he 1) is a hero 2) he is like a guardian of one/multiple of the infinity stones at some point(s)? and 3) he is an enemy of Thanos. Anyway, what I am saying is is that it would be awesome if he is "born" and because he is made to be perfection personified, he just immediately rejects whatever stupid revenge plan these guys have cooked up for him, and instead he goes to seek knowledge and realizes what he really needs to be doing is protecting the universe from Thanos or whatever
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 17:34
|
|
|
BravestOfTheLamps posted:You're appealing to the old rejection of literary criticism as innately parasitical. That's just accurate. Of course it's parasitical, it lives off the work of others and gives nothing back to the process that created it. By the time there is a work to critique, it's already happened. It's effectively fan fiction with a more analytical bent. An editor at least can deconstruct the work at a point where input can actually make it better. By the time the critic sees the ship it's already sailed, and the best they can do is say "Man of Steel was a better ship".
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 17:35
|
|
|
BravestOfTheLamps posted:The pun that it's a place where the heroes go know things is discernible, but it's not really even a metaphor. What's more important is how it ties into the larger theme of death in the movie. It can work as both. That is, if anything, more interesting. Wow, a metaphor that does double duty! Guardians of the Galaxy is a great movie. quote:It is presented to be a dirty, teeming mining colony. The giant head is visibly degraded and falling apart, and is presented as fading into the nebula. The insides are messy in a organic sense, like a human body, with buildings and industry. What you're looking at is a very down-and-dirty city, and it's clearly shown in those screenshots. All we see are lights and shapes and colours, really (  ). It's only towards the end of the sequence, when we start to move closer, that we see the shabby buildings, teeming people, and neon signs. And the fact that the giant skull is degrading and drifting in a colourful nebula doesn't really rob it of beauty or majesty. It's still both of those things in spades.quote:When I say that you think reactively, it's because you don't invest your imagination into this and depend on received knowledge. You've read Knowhere blandly as a pun, instead of the symbol of life and death that it is. So "head = knowledge" is a bland pun, but "skull = death" is somehow a revelatory symbol? Right.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 17:37
|
|
|
Mulva posted:That's just accurate. Of course it's parasitical, it lives off the work of others and gives nothing back to the process that created it. By the time there is a work to critique, it's already happened. It's effectively fan fiction with a more analytical bent. An editor at least can deconstruct the work at a point where input can actually make it better. By the time the critic sees the ship it's already sailed, and the best they can do is say "Man of Steel was a better ship". You seem to be so angry about someone criticising a movie that you've determined that literary criticism and critical discussion are in themselves bad, and anything but reciting plot points is a fool's errand. That seems a bit insecure. It's okay to engage in criticism. Phylodox posted:It can work as both. That is, if anything, more interesting. Wow, a metaphor that does double duty! Guardians of the Galaxy is a great movie You're confused, because the fact that the heroes go to a place called Knowhere (that's shaped like a head) to know things isn't a metaphor. A giant skull being full of life on the other hand is perfectly in keeping with the movie's theme of life overcoming death (the same sentiment is repeated throughout the movie). The giant head is shot as not to make it very magnificent or lofty. It's even shot as to make the audience examine it an impassionate distance and melded into the sedate if colourful environment, and up close it's anything but grand. e: you need to be proactive and ask yourself why the head having grandeur is important? The reason you're trying to prove it is because you're trying to argue that the whole of the movie possesses the same grandeur as that cool and mysterious sequence of Star-Lord exploring Morag. If you'd think about this, you'd realize that the whole movie is expressly not like that Moraq scene. BravestOfTheLamps fucked around with this message at 17:54 on May 8, 2017 |
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 17:37
|
|
|
To be fair Literary Criticism does indirectly influence further works, in that by understanding and dissecting the text you can give suggestions to how to improve next time, not that anyone has to listen to these suggestions or that your suggestions are right; and particularly I doubt anyone making Marvel or DC movies is going to visit Something Awful Cinema Discusso to work out just where they should take their next superhero movie to make it a masterpiece, or a massive financial success for that matter. Also Bravest he wasn't saying it isn't okay to engage in criticism, he's saying that criticism is inherently parasitic in that it requires a literary work in the first place and doesn't meaningfully provide to the creation of the literary work. This doesn't mean it has no worth, but it is an entirely reactionary process to the existence of the initial work.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 17:38
|
|
|
Guy A. Person posted:oh I have a theory/question(?) about (post-credit spoiler) Adam Warlock That's the theory my friend with encyclopedic comic book knowledge is going with. He's basically "Space Jesus" or "Space Vision", but since the latter already exists, it's hard to predict how they're going to treat him.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 17:38
|
|
|
Guy A. Person posted:oh I have a theory/question(?) about (post-credit spoiler) Adam Warlock This sounds like the JLU take on Amazo, who realises revenge on Luthor is petty and goes out to space and then Dr. Fate seeking enlightenment.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 17:42
|
|
|
Jose Oquendo posted:How old are you? I'm guessing Gunn had no problem remembering those were both early 80's things. It's practically a rule when it comes to either cinematic period pieces (or parts of movies that are supposed to be period pieces, like the songs in this movie) that the folks doing the picking don't usually do their research to make sure everything lines up. So you inevitably get things where a song didn't get popular until a few years after the movie is set, or a shoe didn't exist, or whatever. Because they have no problem remembering the era, they don't need to check, pfft.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 17:43
|
|
|
BravestOfTheLamps posted:That seems a bit insecure. It's okay to engage in criticism. Unless of course it's criticism *of* criticism.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 17:44
|
|
|
Lord_Magmar posted:Also Bravest he wasn't saying it isn't okay to engage in criticism Mulva posted:Unless of course it's criticism *of* criticism.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 17:45
|
|
|
Franchescanado posted:You're right. I was hoping it'd get into an actual discussion. on the subject of soundtrack chat, can we talk about how Peter is the result of his mom gettin' down with an alien, and his mom nicknamed him Starlord, but across her two mixtapes there's only one Bowie song and it's not Starman?
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 17:45
|
|
|
To be fair his mom probably doesn't want to give him a song about banging kids to base his identity on.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 17:47
|
|
|
Guy A. Person posted:oh I have a theory/question(?) about (post-credit spoiler) Adam Warlock If I'm remembering the comics correctly, this is exactly what happens -- so...good odds.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 17:53
|
|
|
raditts posted:on the subject of soundtrack chat, can we talk about how Peter is the result of his mom gettin' down with an alien, and his mom nicknamed him Starlord, but across her two mixtapes there's only one Bowie song and it's not Starman? Peters mom has better taste than that, shocking, I know
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 17:55
|
|
|
BravestOfTheLamps posted:You seem to be so angry about someone criticising a movie that you've determined that literary criticism and critical discussion are in themselves bad, and anything but reciting plot points is a fool's errand. No one's angry. It's frustrating that you think you have original criticisms, when you've put no effort whatsoever towards criticism, but we're not angered by it (I'm not anyway; I'm trying to talk with you to see if you'll actually present ideas). You've said other movies are better. That's not criticism. It's just an empty statement. Other people are reading the movie's themes and ideas and critiquing them for you, and you just repeat them and add "Which is lame". Your criticism is on par with The Dude's use of dialogue in The Big Lebowski--repeating key phrases spoken by other characters who have actually thought about the situation. I don't usually agree with K. Waste or SMG, and they come up with some off-the-wall poo poo, but at least they put in thought and effort into the off-the-wall poo poo. You think screen grabbing MoS is criticism. It is not. Guy A. Person has at least elaborated on your talking points and put effort into why they are actual criticisms, his point of saying there are similarities to Doctor Manhatten is valid, though the themes of the story's they are in diverge enough for the character to seem distinct (to me at least), even though Ego the Living Planet was a character invented in 1966 and Dr. Manhatten, who was created as a metafictional deconstruction on God-like comic book characters, was created in 1986. I liked the movie. It was fun. It has flaws, for sure, but more positive points than negative, and it's above average for a crowd-pleasing blockbuster created by Disney. I think it's fine that you don't like the movie, some people have said as much but actually put effort into the criticism that didn't involve sucking Zack Snyder's dick (Snyder's fine, he's a visual director that works with lovely scripts, because he admits he's a visual director. He liberally uses frames from the comic books for his films because that's how low-effort his writing is--he admits it himself! 300 and Watchmen have featurettes where he's saying "Yeah, this is from page 23, this is from page 92, look!" He's also, in my opinion, very boring now that he's just required to turn in a "Snyder looking film"). I, and many others in the thread, get to watch a fun movie with great characters that does more right than it does wrong. You get to look like a fool incapable of actual film criticism and you miss out on enjoying a movie because you don't want to. Why would that anger me or anyone else? You're the one missing out on the film and the discussion. raditts posted:on the subject of soundtrack chat, can we talk about how Peter is the result of his mom gettin' down with an alien, and his mom nicknamed him Starlord, but across her two mixtapes there's only one Bowie song and it's not Starman? Bowie was apparently supposed to make an appearance in Vol. 2 but died before they could work him in. Gunn's also said he's tried to work variety into the soundtrack, so multiple Bowie songs, especially from The Rise and Fall of Ziggy Stardust wouldn't really have the effect. I wish we had Starman, but Moonage Daydream is arguably more fitting. Though Soul Love would be great for Star-Lord and Gamora. Mulva posted:To be fair his mom probably doesn't want to give him a song about banging kids to base his identity on. I have never thought Starman was about banging kids.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 17:56
|
|
|
Barudak posted:Bowie was apparently supposed to make an appearance in Vol. 2 but died before they could work him in. Gunn's also said he's tried to work variety into the soundtrack, so multiple Bowie songs, especially from The Rise and Fall of Ziggy Stardust wouldn't really have the effect. I wish we had Starman, but Moonage Daydream is arguably more fitting. Though Soul Love would be great for Star-Lord and Gamora.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 18:01
|
|
|
Franchescanado posted:No one's angry. It's frustrating that you think you have original criticisms, when you've put no effort whatsoever towards criticism My criticisms are original, they're just concise - the movie is an inferior retelling of Man of Steel, with visuals that are uninspiring despite being technically accomplished, and writing that at worst degenerates into meta-ish mumbling about character traits. Strange Matter posted:Moonage Daydream's placement in the film is also my favorite moment in the first movie, especially how it goes from being diegetic to being part of the soundtrack right when they enter Knowhere. I think it was thematically unfitting. Maybe Money by Pink Floyd instead.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 18:08
|
|
|
Yakmouth posted:If I'm remembering the comics correctly, this is exactly what happens -- so...good odds. I guess I had kind of assumed he had a drastically different origin in the comics. Was he literally created as a weapon by some "superior" race, only to immediately surpass them by being above that kind of poo poo? Because that is an awesome origin story
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 18:13
|
|
|
Guy A. Person posted:I guess I had kind of assumed he had a drastically different origin in the comics. Was he literally created as a weapon by some "superior" race, only to immediately surpass them by being above that kind of poo poo? Because that is an awesome origin story quote:Originally, Adam Warlock was simply known as Him. He is an artificial being created by the hand of several mad scientists whom formed an elite scientific cadre, The Enclave, and whom based their work in a scientific complex called The Beehive. Adam Warlock was created by these men. He was formed in and born from a cocoon. The goal of his creators was to create the perfect human for their own gain. ... After Him was born, he immediately sensed how corrupt his creators were and promptly abandoned them to leave for space for the purpose of gathering his thoughts. Source
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 18:15
|
|
|
Guy A. Person posted:I guess I had kind of assumed he had a drastically different origin in the comics. Was he literally created as a weapon by some "superior" race, only to immediately surpass them by being above that kind of poo poo? Because that is an awesome origin story I'm working from memory here, but not a superior race but a human supremacist cult. Otherwise, yeah.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 18:18
|
|
|
Ok that is super cool
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 18:23
|
|
|
Thinking about it it's really weird that the first "space" marvel movie would be this, because it's now established that the whole universe is super wacky and silly.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 18:24
|
|
|
raditts posted:on the subject of soundtrack chat, can we talk about how Peter is the result of his mom gettin' down with an alien, and his mom nicknamed him Starlord, but across her two mixtapes there's only one Bowie song and it's not Starman? I figure there probably would've been a good chance of Starman being included in Vol. 2 except that it was featured prominently in The Martian somewhat recently.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 18:25
|
|
|
Owlofcreamcheese posted:Thinking about it it's really weird that the first "space" marvel movie would be this, because it's now established that the whole universe is super wacky and silly. Eh, not really. If you think about it on a cosmic scale, the whole universe is wacky and makes no sense and our entire lives are meaningless so why not have fun with it, y'know?
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 18:29
|
|
|
Cant wait for that Zune to have all of the hottest 90s or early 00's pop music on it.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 18:30
|
|
|
Dexo posted:Cant wait for that Zune to have all of the hottest 90s or early 00's pop music on it. next movie will open up with Groot having "shaggy" hair in the form of a bunch of leaves and he'll be jamming out to Smells like Teen Spirit
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 18:31
|
|
|
Dexo posted:Cant wait for that Zune to have all of the hottest 90s or early 00's pop music on it. Weapon of Choice, maybe?
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 18:49
|
|
|
Detective No. 27 posted:Eh, not really. If you think about it on a cosmic scale, the whole universe is wacky and makes no sense and our entire lives are meaningless so why not have fun with it, y'know? I guess it's just funny that the silliest movie gets to define the largest part of the setting. Like ant man was the other very silly marvel story and they went so out of their way to make it a tiny teeny corner that didn't effect anything else much. Like they were worried about comedy rules besmirching their more grown up setting. Then this series gets to set the default rules for the entire universe and is sillier than anything marvel has ever done.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 18:52
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 30, 2024 14:09 |
|
|
Why doesn't he just go to earth and steal a bunch of new music? They got a space ship.
|
|
#
?
May 8, 2017 19:09
|
|