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Paxman posted:Some of the Young People are actually pretty right wing. That's because the left is hermetic and isolationist and locked in a cycle of perpetual defeat and wounded introspection and has been for the entire lifetime of anyone under 30. No confidence even in their own ideas. 69 is the sex number, I'm too tired for anything more interesting
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May 9, 2017 01:14
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jabby posted:
On aggregate yes, but the people switching are different each time. Basically 50% of the electorate are natural Conservatives (home-owners, significant money in the bank, etc.). But within that group, ~10% are worried they are too 'statist', and a similar number they are too European. Both groups have currently had that worry dealt with. No other worry has taken off as significant. No meaningful demographic change has taken place. Escaping this situation requires picking one of the above and making it no longer true.
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May 9, 2017 01:14
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https://twitter.com/britainelects/status/861726915572486145 https://twitter.com/britainelects/status/861726711238590467
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May 9, 2017 01:14
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learnincurve posted:And then we go right back to commuters using them as free parking. All fairness, if there's one time I do not want to be using public transit it's when I'm sick enough to need the hospital. e; ^lmao the gently caress
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May 9, 2017 01:14
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forkboy84 posted:gently caress off Nazi. I have to say I agree with the Nazi. And with you - he should still gently caress off, because one good post doesn't make up for his usual poo poo.
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May 9, 2017 01:15
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LemonDrizzle posted:https://twitter.com/britainelects/status/861726915572486145 Honestly, Britain deserves the Tories
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May 9, 2017 01:38
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It's just a parody at this point. Not even die-hard Tories actually believe this.
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May 9, 2017 01:39
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TheRat posted:It's just a parody at this point. Not even die-hard Tories actually believe this. People disagree about what makes society fairer.
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May 9, 2017 01:42
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hakimashou posted:People disagree about what makes society fairer. I for one think it's rather unfair that you''re not dying of nazi cancer right now.
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May 9, 2017 01:44
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https://twitter.com/huwjordan/status/861720968305266688
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May 9, 2017 01:46
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You should be ashamed of yourself.
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May 9, 2017 02:18
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hakimashou posted:You should be ashamed of yourself. turn you're monitor on
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May 9, 2017 02:20
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Namtab posted:Honestly, Britain deserves the Tories Yep. And they'll get them. Our society is sick. Deeply sick. It'll need direct impact by repercussions to cure it. These people cannot be "educated" into being better people. Maybe it was always like this. Much of the 20th century was formed by World war I and II. Maybe poo poo always needs to hit the fan before there's change.
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May 9, 2017 02:29
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yes people don't care about the actual statistically-expected effect of your policies, they can't care about the numbers because they're innumerate in the extreme they care about affiliations and credibility. This element is not unique to Britain; what is the unique is the cultural landscape of institutions and symbols to affiliate with one can go all Die Losung on this, but I think the reasonable course is to acknowledge that this is the case regardless I should point out that certain pundits have been calling for a Labour leader to move the zeitgeist leftward. well - we have done it. this is what it looks like. it looks like this: a Tory government adopting the same headline policies, but modified to benefit the middle class over the rock bottom, and tax the upper middle less; socialism-by-class thus cheaply buying the political capital to be much, much more right-wing in other areas (are soverinty!). ronya fucked around with this message at 03:33 on May 9, 2017 |
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May 9, 2017 03:26
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I have a question about UK labour law. I'm reading wikipedia and from what I can tell, the UK basically has the equivalent of nationwide right-to-work, in American terms, IE employees cannot be forced to join a union that is recognized as representing a particular workplace? Is that accurate? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trade_Union_and_Labour_Relations_(Consolidation)_Act_1992#Part_III.2C_Union_activity_rights
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May 9, 2017 05:37
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Regarde Aduck posted:Our society is sick. Deeply sick. It'll need direct impact by repercussions to cure it. These people cannot be "educated" into being better people. Maybe it was always like this. Much of the 20th century was formed by World war I and II. Maybe poo poo always needs to hit the fan before there's change. lol Now tell us everyone is a Nazi piece of poo poo if they don't chug down the Corbyn koolaid, because it means they lack the compassion for ordinary people that the Corbynistas are just overflowing with.
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May 9, 2017 06:15
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Don't you have some Palestinians' deaths to celebrate? gently caress off out of here.
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May 9, 2017 06:17
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icantfindaname posted:I have a question about UK labour law. I'm reading wikipedia and from what I can tell, the UK basically has the equivalent of nationwide right-to-work, in American terms, IE employees cannot be forced to join a union that is recognized as representing a particular workplace? Is that accurate? Closed shops are not common in Europe and there have been several legal tests for the few countries that still operated them since the 80s (Sweden, Denmark and the UK) and broadly the ECHR has found that compelling union membership violates the negative right to refuse association granted by article 11 that defines free association of individuals You can still require employees to pay wage monitoring fees to unions if I remember correctly but you can not compel post-entry membership
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May 9, 2017 06:18
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hakimashou posted:People disagree about what makes society fairer. "A fair society is one where people get to keep what they earn! I work hard to support my family: why should I lose half of that in taxes just to subsidise a bunch of irresponsible scroungers?" *Someone who's veeeeery sure that he'll never ever lose his well-paying job, or become seriously ill and unable to work.*
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May 9, 2017 06:57
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icantfindaname posted:I have a question about UK labour law. I'm reading wikipedia and from what I can tell, the UK basically has the equivalent of nationwide right-to-work, in American terms, IE employees cannot be forced to join a union that is recognized as representing a particular workplace? Is that accurate?
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May 9, 2017 07:16
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European law is more hostile to closed shops due to the historical prevalence of sectarian trade unions on the continent. Catholic and Protestant differences are a thing. note that in the EU a union can negotiate a collective bargaining agreement that binds nonmember terms of remuneration, minimum wages, safety, etc. it merely cannot require membership or fees. EU countries can be quite hot on granting unions statutory powers over employer-backed funds or otherwise codeterminatory statutory bodies and yes, leftists have been battling with liberals over whether this has an intrinsically corrupting tendency on labour radicalism for over a century now...
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May 9, 2017 07:22
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Since we are on the subject, does anybody know if people who work for foreign states in the UK are bound by uk employment law for their contracts and such, or by the state they work for? For example, can a contract for the equdorian embassy staff be illegal by uk standards if it's legal by equdorian standards? I haven't been able to find anything on it, and it's a very important issue for a good friend of mine.
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May 9, 2017 07:25
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Taear posted:Man that's terrifying. There's so many constituencies where the UKIP vote added to the Tory vote would mean the tories win. So, so many. This is the key. Labour could have just 150 MP's, yet be only a few percent down on their 2015 vote total all thanks to the Tories now having almost 33% more voters. There are large swathes that will be turned blue, and from what I remember its mostly all the none city districts. We could end up with only a small number of Labour MP's outside of the cities.
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May 9, 2017 07:57
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ukle posted:This is the key. Second election in a row where Labour's vote share doesn't change but they lose a fuckton of seats to FPTP.
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May 9, 2017 08:19
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Miftan posted:Since we are on the subject, does anybody know if people who work for foreign states in the UK are bound by uk employment law for their contracts and such, or by the state they work for? For example, can a contract for the equdorian embassy staff be illegal by uk standards if it's legal by equdorian standards? I haven't been able to find anything on it, and it's a very important issue for a good friend of mine. Embassy staff are complicated because there's such a complicated mesh of laws dependent on exactly what their diplomatic status is (and the fact you're asking about the Ecuadorian embassy is... intriguing, I think you need to expand). In general though if the member of staff is permanently employed in the UK then UK employment law prevails regardless of who their employer is, but as embassy staff are normally only on assignment in their host country then (most) UK employment law won't apply.
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May 9, 2017 08:19
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Uh oh
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May 9, 2017 08:20
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Nice impartial description of Marxism there
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May 9, 2017 08:23
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forkboy84 posted:How long do they have? Will there ever actually be a way to convince the yoofs that the reason they get shat on so much is because they can't bother themselves to vote & their racist granny can? May 20th I believe.
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May 9, 2017 08:25
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This is probably a good move. It'll stop the Pissflaps of the UK voting tory purely to dethrone Corbyn.
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May 9, 2017 08:25
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SDP 2: Split Harder
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May 9, 2017 08:28
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If Clive Lewis wins his seat (as is probably likely given the results of the locals in his area all stayed comfortably Labour) I kind of expect the PLP to get behind him as a challenger if Corbyn wont go. They wont risk another Blandy McBland, and will go with someone they know will win against Corbyn with the membership.
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May 9, 2017 08:28
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Good. There really is no-one else right now who looks like they'd be good for the job. ukle posted:If Clive Lewis wins his seat (as is probably likely given the results of the locals in his area all stayed comfortably Labour) I kind of expect the PLP to get behind him as a challenger if Corbyn wont go. They wont risk another Blandy McBland, and will go with someone they know will win against Corbyn with the membership. If they (the PLP) do, and he goes along with it, that's him probably crossed off the list of favourables. That's really just how badly the PLP have screwed the pooch since Corbyn's election. They'll taint anything they manage to get their hands on. Kokoro Wish fucked around with this message at 08:34 on May 9, 2017 |
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May 9, 2017 08:32
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Miftan posted:Since we are on the subject, does anybody know if people who work for foreign states in the UK are bound by uk employment law for their contracts and such, or by the state they work for? For example, can a contract for the equdorian embassy staff be illegal by uk standards if it's legal by equdorian standards? I haven't been able to find anything on it, and it's a very important issue for a good friend of mine. Depends on the nature of the work, if it involves the exercise of sovereign powers (consular staff) sovereign immunity still applies so no domestic labour court has jurisdiction to hear the matter. If it doesn't then staff can be subject to domestic labour requirements. There's a bit of case law enforcing this, Cudak vs Lithuania and Sabeh eh Liel vs France relating to the wrongful dismissal of a switchboard operator at the polish embassy and an accountant at the Kuwaiti embassy respectively where both heard at the ECrtHR and the court found immunity did not apply. Similarly the CJEU found in favour of an embassy driver in Mahamdia v Peoples Democratic republic of Algeria, allowing his case for wrongful dismissal to be referred to German labour courts Its probably worth noting all the above cases where brought after initial refusals to hear the cases in domestic courts kustomkarkommando fucked around with this message at 08:36 on May 9, 2017 |
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May 9, 2017 08:32
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ukle posted:If Clive Lewis wins his seat (as is probably likely given the results of the locals in his area all stayed comfortably Labour) I kind of expect the PLP to get behind him as a challenger if Corbyn wont go. They wont risk another Blandy McBland, and will go with someone they know will win against Corbyn with the membership. If Clive Lewis stands with the backing of 'moderate' MPs I'd vote against him. Primarily because I think he'd simply be used as a lever to get Corbyn out and then promptly be forced out himself by the same MPs. Anyone who thinks they would be happy with a 'unity candidate' rather than full control of the party back is deluding themselves. Getting rid of 'one member, one vote' is top of their to-do list. Also it's probably best for Corbyn to say he'll stay on despite defeat. It helps prevent it becoming a question put to him endlessly on the campaign trail, and helps take the wind out of the sails of anyone who thinks a crushing Labour defeat is the best way to get rid of him (like half the PLP).
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May 9, 2017 08:42
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What a wretched man.
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May 9, 2017 08:46
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2017-39852719 posted:Mr Corbyn will also claim that "the tax cheats, the press barons, the greedy bankers" would celebrate a Conservative victory, adding: "We have four weeks to ruin their party. What's he going to do, run for the leadership? e: \/\/ Brexit was a little different, but you just refuse to answer the question and say you are fighting to win. Alchenar fucked around with this message at 08:52 on May 9, 2017 |
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May 9, 2017 08:47
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Do leaders ever say they'll stand down after losing an election before it happens? I don't think Miliband did and Cameron said he'd stick around to make Brexit happen.
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May 9, 2017 08:49
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jabby posted:If Clive Lewis stands with the backing of 'moderate' MPs I'd vote against him. Primarily because I think he'd simply be used as a lever to get Corbyn out and then promptly be forced out himself by the same MPs. Anyone who thinks they would be happy with a 'unity candidate' rather than full control of the party back is deluding themselves. Getting rid of 'one member, one vote' is top of their to-do list. Yup, this.
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May 9, 2017 08:50
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Yeah it's really weird you guys expect him to admit defeat and go home before the results.
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May 9, 2017 08:51
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Irony Be My Shield posted:Do leaders ever say they'll stand down after losing an election before it happens? I don't think Miliband did and Cameron said he'd stick around to make Brexit happen. No but i also dont recall them usually saying explicitly that they'll stay on if they lose. Usually if faced with a question like that they dodge it with some noncommittal bullshit about focusing on the election and blah blah blah
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May 9, 2017 08:53
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