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Alchenar posted:Look if you ever want to see success then you are going to have to drop the 'hero of the revolution' cult attitude and make a hard nosed assessment of what worked and what didn't. Corbyn's problems perhaps run a bit deeper than having a poor relationship with Buzzfeed. This also applies to the Labour right. They see themselves as the sensible grown-ups who want to be in government, unlike the Labour left (which is obviously bullshit but there you go, if they want Labour to be in government so much they'd not be briefing against the leadership during a general election), so you'd hope to see them learn that actually left wing ideas ARE popular with the country. Of course, they won't because they are haram to neoliberals. Can one of you mugs who actually still watches Question Time (I hear last night was one of the rare ones without UKIP representation!) confirm if this actually happened? https://twitter.com/wolfdancer/status/862917873945247745 forkboy84 fucked around with this message at 09:18 on May 12, 2017 |
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May 12, 2017 09:15
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Alchenar posted:Look if you ever want to see success then you are going to have to drop the 'hero of the revolution' cult attitude and make a hard nosed assessment of what worked and what didn't. Corbyn's problems perhaps run a bit deeper than having a poor relationship with Buzzfeed. His post was perfectly reasonable - the press have ripped corbyn apart from day 0, it's massively hypocritical for them now to say "well his manifesto is great but for some reason people hate him". The only cult-like behaviour i see is the endless mantras of "dear leader" this and "corbynista" that. I think it's born out of a terrified refusal to accept the idea that left wing policy can be popular in britain. Much better to make it about a messianic personality cult.
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May 12, 2017 09:16
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"Labour's policies are amazing! I agree with every single one of them! Whoa whoa, voting them? Why would I vote Labour???"
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May 12, 2017 09:17
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Alchenar posted:Look if you ever want to see success then you are going to have to drop the 'hero of the revolution' cult attitude and make a hard nosed assessment of what worked and what didn't. Corbyn's problems perhaps run a bit deeper than having a poor relationship with Buzzfeed. lol it's not a cult attitude to notice the media has been biased and know that that bias comes from the need to protect the material interests of press barons rather than Seamus Milne's press strategy. But yea let's just try this all again with Clive Lewis having the BBC edit interviews to show him answering entirely different questions to what he actually was and then be surprised when yougov has him trailing.
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May 12, 2017 09:23
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OK, which of you guys has been having some fun by Denmark Hill station? Suspect med students as it's right next to King's College Hospital. e: fixed image link. Maugrim fucked around with this message at 13:37 on May 12, 2017 |
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May 12, 2017 09:38
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Why doesn't the government set up an investment bank or something that creates a lot of profit for the country from foreign sources instead of taxes? Probably a really stupid question with a very basic answer. Or why not a govt bank that provides uk mortgages? Risks are minimal, it could help first time buyers that way and control prices to some extent. Plus it would generate a constant and large profit? As I say probably stupid idea but I'd like to know why not.
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May 12, 2017 09:41
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thehappyprince posted:lol it's not a cult attitude to notice the media has been biased and know that that bias comes from the need to protect the material interests of press barons rather than Seamus Milne's press strategy. Can't wait to see what dogwhistles the Tories come up with to try and discredit Clive Lewis. They've done jews and muslims already, let's whip up the racial anxiety over black people and complete the trifecta! Bape Culture posted:Why doesn't the government set up an investment bank or something that creates a lot of profit for the country from foreign sources instead of taxes? Probably a really stupid question with a very basic answer. One of the basic tenets of neoliberalism is that the state cannot interfere in the affairs of the market without loving everything up. The only way to provide value to consumers (because literally everything is a commodity now, and therefore everyone is a consumer) is by fostering competition by creating new markets where ones didn't exist before. Closing markets by state interference is anathema. Having said that there are pretty concrete reasons why you wouldn't want taxpayers money to be used in investment banking - Labour have put up the idea of a "National Investment Bank" but that's more for big infrastructure projects and it's a little bit muddy about how that is different to just straight up government spending. Also, we do already have foreign investment in British infrastructure projects like the new nuclear power stations. Whether this is cheaper or a good idea is...mixed at absolute best. As for home mortgages, the government has decided that it's better to prop up the property market through things like Quantitative Easing and Help To Buy schemes than get straight into the business of banking. I'm sure there have been government run mortgages at some point in the past but it's not really my area of expertise. Ronya can probably use big PPE words to explain exactly why this is all a terrible idea in ways I can't. MikeCrotch fucked around with this message at 09:54 on May 12, 2017 |
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May 12, 2017 09:42
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Bape Culture posted:Why doesn't the government set up an investment bank or something that creates a lot of profit for the country from foreign sources instead of taxes? Probably a really stupid question with a very basic answer. There is a European Investment Bank which does exactly that and there are national banks like the Kreditanstalt für Wiederaufbau in Germany. Not sure about the UK though.
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May 12, 2017 09:46
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Bape Culture posted:Why doesn't the government set up an investment bank or something that creates a lot of profit for the country from foreign sources instead of taxes? Because capitalism is my bad my friend.
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May 12, 2017 09:47
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Bape Culture posted:Why doesn't the government set up an investment bank or something that creates a lot of profit for the country from foreign sources instead of taxes? Probably a really stupid question with a very basic answer. Government interference in the market?  It's a good idea though, generally I think a government hand in most industries helps anchor prices and provide a basin-level service. I'd argue any essential service (e.g. car insurance) would benefit from the same. winegums fucked around with this message at 09:56 on May 12, 2017 |
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May 12, 2017 09:52
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A couple of issues at first glance: Regulation: although the FCA is independent of the UK Gov, so is the Bank of England, and we all saw what happens with the government puts pressure on the BoE with respect to LIBOR. It would be hard to trust that 'HM UK Investment Bank' was being properly regulated, and not taking more risk than it should. Competition: Competing with a Government banked enterprise like HMUKIB is fundamentally difficult - how do you have faith that you're going to get a fair shot at financing a project, when Sir Percival is also running a pitch? And if you're a house builder, for instance, or running any size of infrastructure project, do you really want to go with someone else over a government bank? Wouldn't it be terrible if your licences got held up in the planning phase. Public interest: If you go with them you can be sure that your application to bulldoze that conservation land is going to get a decent chance of being approved. Isn't it just much easier to get a project off the ground if you're sure the licences are just going to be a box-ticking exercise?
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May 12, 2017 10:04
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The British media is a relentlessly hostile, feral creature, strongly in need of regulatory muzzling.
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May 12, 2017 10:39
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Concerning the mortgage front the government has tried to do that softly with Help2Buy and similar schemes which transfer some of the lending risk from banks to the government.
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May 12, 2017 10:42
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Bacon Terrorist posted:It was more the point of how pathetic that reasoning sounds when justifying something evil. I don't think fox hunting really rises to the level of 'evil.' I envy some people their sheltered existences I guess.
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May 12, 2017 10:47
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Foxes are Evil little shits but I don't really care for the past methods of their execution, even though many of my relatives were heavily involved in hunts.
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May 12, 2017 10:59
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Any one hear barry gardiner on the radio this morning? I just randomly turned on and heard it. I missed what sun headline that nick robinson read out but he properly had a go at him.
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May 12, 2017 11:05
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Yep, the PLP have lost their goddamned minds. 
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May 12, 2017 11:06
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now i am no fan of Corbyn but this is really loving stupid
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May 12, 2017 11:08
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its the telegraph and there are no quotes
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May 12, 2017 11:11
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The Telegraph is fun to read and laugh at as they get progressively more histrionic about THE PERFIDIOUS SOCIALISTS IN OUR MIDST but please don't think they actually have any inside scoops on Labour
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May 12, 2017 11:14
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Completely unsourced. At best though, this type of reporting could help drive complacency in the right wing vote.
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May 12, 2017 11:15
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MikeCrotch posted:The Telegraph is fun to read and laugh at as they get progressively more histrionic about THE PERFIDIOUS SOCIALISTS IN OUR MIDST but please don't think they actually have any inside scoops on Labour Well, someone did leak the Labour manifesto to them, so I'd assume it's the same people feeding them this.
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May 12, 2017 11:16
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Tess is going to offer the workers an alterative to the "Bleak tax and spending manifesto" lol okay then so take back Suez and bring back hanging for ISIS first and BBC nonces second it is.
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May 12, 2017 11:17
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It's common knowledge that the majority of the PLP are ignoring the central campaign entirely to run their own local campaigns.
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May 12, 2017 11:18
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Jippa posted:Any one hear barry gardiner on the radio this morning? I just randomly turned on and heard it. I missed what sun headline that nick robinson read out but he properly had a go at him. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/blogs/the_papers You can see it here, it's extremely partisan and I think there's a fair argument that if the BBC are just going to repeat front-pages verbatim they're undermining ostensible political neutrality due to the right-wing bias of print media.
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May 12, 2017 11:20
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SpaceCommie posted:You ever live in a rural area you Nazi gently caress? The Hunt shows up trespasses on private land (aided by their dipshit fans who go around opening gates to fields full of livestock). They block roads and refuse to move. A whole bunch of posh folks block up the roads parking on verges so they can watch some other toffs run about in a field. He's one of those weird anglophile Americans who probably wears a monocle and demands worrsestershyur sauce at McDonalds
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May 12, 2017 11:22
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Alchenar posted:It's common knowledge that the majority of the PLP are ignoring the central campaign entirely to run their own local campaigns.
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May 12, 2017 11:22
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baka kaba posted:He's one of those weird anglophile Americans who probably wears a monocle and demands worrsestershyur sauce at McDonalds Notably SpaceCommie's post was ignored in favour of wanking on about sheltered city types who just don't understand the country.
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May 12, 2017 11:32
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https://twitter.com/MichaelPDeacon/status/862781770466545667 politics is not policy not to diss policy. One should have policies. But pushing policies have their effect via 'the sense of the possible' held by bureaucrats - they are maximally effective precisely when voters are uninterested and quite willing to calmly submit to whatever three-hundred-page white paper. The curious result of consistently beating the drum on policy is shaping what governments actually do - but this well might be a Tory government conceding to new establishment wisdoms, at least as far as these wisdoms do not directly conflict with main ideological planks.
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May 12, 2017 11:44
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Haha I do want them to win but I dont think the below is great for Labour  Id like to but ive already got a very metro-sexual looking man purse thing without any slogans on it.quote:
e: http://imgur.com/a/uZXEM Seaside Loafer fucked around with this message at 11:55 on May 12, 2017 |
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May 12, 2017 11:51
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http://www.chathamhouse.org/livestreamChatham House posted:Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn will outline the key national security and foreign policy positions upon which the Labour Party will contest the country’s general election in June. Blasting the military-industrial complex. Yesssssssss. Actually been a really good, forward-thinking, reflective vision for foreign policy. May well be very welcome when contrasted with Trump. LemonyTang fucked around with this message at 12:00 on May 12, 2017 |
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May 12, 2017 11:52
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Lib Dems have pledged to legalise cannabis
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May 12, 2017 11:53
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Alchenar posted:Polly Toynbee has it right, the manifesto is full of good and popular stuff but it doesn't matter if you haven't earned the credibility as a leader for people to believe you will be able to deliver it. Party Boat posted:Lib Dems have pledged to legalise cannabis
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May 12, 2017 11:55
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Party Boat posted:Lib Dems have pledged to legalise cannabis Their first sound economic policy.
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May 12, 2017 12:00
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forkboy84 posted:
Yes it did although mostly because the microphone was still next to the questioner and he had a really obnoxious laugh.
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May 12, 2017 12:03
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Party Boat posted:Notably SpaceCommie's post was ignored in favour of wanking on about sheltered city types who just don't understand the country. You mean the post that went "A whole bunch of posh folks block up the roads parking on verges so they can watch some other toffs run about in a field." I wonder what the Banwen Miners' Hunt feel about that. The hunting ban was never for one second about animal welfare - I might be more sympathetic to it if it was, but any appeals to ending cruelty are hypocritical (when will we have a ban on angling, which also meddles with the environment and inflicts far more animal suffering on a far greater scale - and don't bother with the usual weaselly excuse about food, as most angling is catch-and-release) and an insincerely distant secondary concern to the main issue, to stick it to "the toffs" (and the thousands of working class people who participate in hunting are just class traitors anyway), to exact revenge for the miners' strike (in the words of Dennis Skinner), and latterly to get a few rah-rah-rahs in the Commons (as when the SNP declared that it would oppose relaxing the ban even though Scottish hunt laws are more liberal than English ones). Tony Blair needed to throw his left a bone to distract them after the Iraq War started falling to pieces and they obligingly gnawed on it.
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May 12, 2017 12:18
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So was the ban on coursing for hares in the same act just to stick it to the Irish and Travellers?
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May 12, 2017 12:20
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ronya posted:https://twitter.com/MichaelPDeacon/status/862781770466545667 People have had their minds loving poisoned by the whole 'the sense of the possible' idea in liberal politics. Anybody with an ounce of sense knows you start high and negotiate to someone you want, forcing the other side to either refute your position or come to an agreement. It's not rocket science. The Dems in America are the loving worst for this - every policy idea they put out is so mealy-mouthed and whittled down to something "acceptable" that it just gets negotiated out of existence, leaving the Democrats with literally nothing to show for their efforts. Even the stuff they do get through, like Obamacare, is so loose and technocratic that it gets blown away with ease. At least the Tories have to employ multiple different underhanded methods to get rid of the NHS, because it turns out if you give everyone something that is Good and Simple they don't want you to get rid of it.
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May 12, 2017 12:24
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kapparomeo posted:You mean the post that went "A whole bunch of posh folks block up the roads parking on verges so they can watch some other toffs run about in a field." I wonder what the Banwen Miners' Hunt feel about that. That post, and yours, also completely disregard the legal and less disruptive option of trail hunting.
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May 12, 2017 12:28
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kapparomeo posted:You mean the post that went "A whole bunch of posh folks block up the roads parking on verges so they can watch some other toffs run about in a field." I wonder what the Banwen Miners' Hunt feel about that.
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