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The Walrus posted:I said steroids do not give you natural ability. you sarcastically stated my position as being that steriods could give your aunt the ability to hit dingers. those are opposite statements. Whoa, whoa, whoa. Why would you assume my aunt couldn't already hit dingers? Seems a bit sexist buddy. So no, they are in fact not opposite statements. Also, if you want to actually discuss it, you mention that amphetamines can't help you get the bat around .01 seconds faster but that's literally what they would do since they help speed up reactions.
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May 17, 2017 15:19
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Yeah the whole "Greenies do nothing" point was hilarious I'd also love to hear how steroids made Bonds have a 13% O rating
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May 17, 2017 15:19
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Intruder posted:Yeah the whole "Greenies do nothing" point was hilarious Right? They're going to come back with "but adrenaline does the same thing!!!!" ignoring that amphetamines still enhance the natural reactions, it's not an either-or situation.
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May 17, 2017 15:21
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Jummy posted:My issue is that it's just impossible to quantify how they may help so there's no point in speculating. I'm sure we all agree with this but I suspect, without having done any analysis of my own, that you can show at least a very strong correlation if not causation between power numbers and age during the roid era. Has anyone ever done a good analysis on this? Specifically maybe, something like comparing SLG, or better yet ISO, to age during the roid era? I would bet pretty strongly that ISO-by-age rose pretty sharply.
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May 17, 2017 15:21
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Twenty-six adult male subjects were given a placebo, 20 mg. of amphetamine sulfate, or 800 mg. of meprobamate two hours prior to the administration of tests of reaction time and movement time. No statistically significant differences were found between mean scores or variances for the substances tested. It appears that neither drug in dosages commonly employed in connection with the preparation of athletes for competition has any effect on human simple reaction time or simple movement time in response to a visual stimulus.
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May 17, 2017 15:23
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How many of those subjects had been playing a grueling marathon of a season? Conditions matter
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May 17, 2017 15:25
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bewbies posted:I'm sure we all agree with this but I suspect, without having done any analysis of my own, that you can show at least a very strong correlation if not causation between power numbers and age during the roid era. Has anyone ever done a good analysis on this? Specifically maybe, something like comparing SLG, or better yet ISO, to age during the roid era? I would bet pretty strongly that ISO-by-age rose pretty sharply. I would also assume that is correct, but I don't know if you could just point to it being the steroid era. My assumption would also be that those numbers are still pretty consistent at this point even with the tighter testing and better methods of figuring out who's doing what. Mostly because of medical advances, better training/recovery techniques, and just knowing what it takes to build and maintain a body used for professional sports.
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May 17, 2017 15:26
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bewbies posted:I'm sure we all agree with this but I suspect, without having done any analysis of my own, that you can show at least a very strong correlation if not causation between power numbers and age during the roid era. Has anyone ever done a good analysis on this? Specifically maybe, something like comparing SLG, or better yet ISO, to age during the roid era? I would bet pretty strongly that ISO-by-age rose pretty sharply. Probably, but getting away with cheating is a time honored tradition in the game. They got away with it, kudos to them
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May 17, 2017 15:26
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The Walrus posted:Twenty-six adult male subjects were given a placebo, 20 mg. of amphetamine sulfate, or 800 mg. of meprobamate two hours prior to the administration of tests of reaction time and movement time. No statistically significant differences were found between mean scores or variances for the substances tested. It appears that neither drug in dosages commonly employed in connection with the preparation of athletes for competition has any effect on human simple reaction time or simple movement time in response to a visual stimulus. Congratulations on cherry picking one amphetamine with a specific purpose and limited number of active ingredients.
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May 17, 2017 15:29
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Intruder posted:How many of those subjects had been playing a grueling marathon of a season? Conditions matter Yeah, I think the test for athletes would need to be you have them sleep 5 hours a night for several nights or do rigorous exercise for several days in a row, or some combination, then do the experiment. For athletes, it's not "normal self" vs. "hopped up self", it's "fatigued self", sometimes severely fatigued self, vs. "closer to normal" self. That's also where the advantage is for steroids or HGH. By allowing yourself to train longer and harder in the off-season, you're building up endurance and strength that, theoretically, help you last later in the season. It's just two different approaches to a common goal. Also, we haven't even breached the subject of ADHD drugs or related drugs.
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May 17, 2017 15:29
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The Walrus posted:Twenty-six adult male subjects were given a placebo, 20 mg. of amphetamine sulfate, or 800 mg. of meprobamate two hours prior to the administration of tests of reaction time and movement time. No statistically significant differences were found between mean scores or variances for the substances tested. It appears that neither drug in dosages commonly employed in connection with the preparation of athletes for competition has any effect on human simple reaction time or simple movement time in response to a visual stimulus. What the gently caress are you even doing at this point.
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May 17, 2017 15:30
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Guys I just went outside and polled twenty-six people and none of them had cancer so good news, cancer is cured!
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May 17, 2017 15:33
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I can't even get assed to get mad about the steroid era, it largely helped the sport after the backlash from the strike since America is so anti-labor I won't even deny that taking steroids is cheating EVEN THOUGH IT WASN'T AGAINST THE RULES AT THE TIME. I just think it's stupid to classify it after the fact as a more egregious form of cheating than all the other ways players have cheated pretty much since the invention of the sport
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May 17, 2017 15:34
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IcePhoenix posted:Guys I just went outside and polled twenty-six people and none of them had cancer so good news, cancer is cured! I'm sorry, if you're going to try to come in here with this science bullshit, you'll have to do like The Walrus and find a study that's almost 60 years old. Then I'll be convinced.
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May 17, 2017 15:35
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hey you guys were the ones talking about willie mays I wanted to be timely
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May 17, 2017 15:39
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The Walrus posted:hey you guys were the ones talking about willie mays I wanted to be timely And here I thought you were the only one discussing things.
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May 17, 2017 15:39
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Also: Astros bitch
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May 17, 2017 15:40
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The San Francisco Giants have won five straight Major League Baseball games, which is 29% of their season-long wins  (they're losing today because Kershaw has to pitch against the Giants, by law)
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May 17, 2017 15:42
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Just convince the Giants this is a playoff game somehow The Rangers have won 7 straight and are still 8 back of the Astros, it owns Only the Nationals have a bigger lead in their division because lol NL East (granted the AL West is also pretty weak this season, but not "Second place is six games under .500" weak)
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May 17, 2017 15:43
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MLB N/V May: Straw Man Thunderdome
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May 17, 2017 15:44
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Intruder posted:Baseball players have literally always cheated to get an edge, but somehow steroids are different I guess It's basically the most moronic game of No True Scotsman ever played.
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May 17, 2017 15:44
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The year Bonds hit 73 HRs Shawn Green hit a career high 49 and the dude was built like a stick figure. There were likely non-steroid related factors at work that led to increased HR totals.
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May 17, 2017 15:46
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Speaking of which, I've seen a lot of speculation that balls are juiced this year to increase offense. Thoughts?
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May 17, 2017 15:47
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Personally I never care about the specificity of morals on one aspect over another so long as everyone gets to play by the same rules. Sounds to me like everyone did, in the 90s and forever so let's please just open up this sport to the future of human athleticism and let cyborgs and augmented people play. I want to see someone with transtibial blade prosthetics make a joke of pickoff attempts or someone with a Luke arm take out a runner going for home from deep left field. Not sarcasm.
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May 17, 2017 15:48
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I think giving the ball amphetamines would have a greater effect.
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May 17, 2017 15:49
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Zigmidge posted:Personally I never care about the specificity of morals on one aspect over another so long as everyone gets to play by the same rules. Sounds to me like everyone did, in the 90s and forever so let's please just open up this sport to the future of human athleticism and let cyborgs and augmented people play. I want to see someone with transtibial blade prosthetics make a joke of pickoff attempts or someone with a Luke arm take out a runner going for home from deep left field. When will someone finally make Base Wars a reality??
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May 17, 2017 15:50
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I am not sure where this line began, or where it is now, but I think it has reached its conclusion.
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May 17, 2017 15:51
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Baseball Simulator 1.000 damnit So underappreciated
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May 17, 2017 15:51
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Hand Knit posted:I am not sure where this line began, or where it is now, but I think it has reached its conclusion. The Houston Astros They good
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May 17, 2017 15:54
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Jummy posted:When will someone finally make Base Wars a reality?? No robots allowed will become baseball's unspoken rule.
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May 17, 2017 15:56
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Spoeank posted:My cat needed some ear medicine that had steroids in it. I came home and he had the greatest batting eye of all time  The steroid era happened. Just like the no blacks era happened. Just like the greenies era happened. You can't just refuse to acknowledge the players that were really good from that era. That's what the hall of fame is for, to determine the best players from the era that they played in, regardless of what you think they might have been consuming. These drugs weren't banned from MLB during this time period and it took almost 7 years after people getting mad about it for rules to be in place to ban players for these drugs. This is one great thing about baseball; all of the different eras. It's fun to compare and debate them, but just because one produced mass dingers doesn't mean you get to ignore it and write it off because CHEATERS (again, the drugs weren't banned). It happened. On another note, one of the greatest pitchers of all time pitched in the heart of the steroid era and put up a 2.20 ERA and a K/9 of 11.3 for 7 straight years. Maybe pitchers should have been more like him   On another another note: Steve Carlton did a surprise in the booth interview on the Cardinals network last night and it was pretty good. He is trippy as hell. He hasn't owned a TV in 14 years. It was his first time to the current Busch Stadium. He ended it with "I'm on a different journey, you know that, I'm on a vision quest." I wanna hang with Steve Carlton and talk about Bob Gibson and visions. Thom P. Tiers fucked around with this message at 16:01 on May 17, 2017 |
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May 17, 2017 15:57
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Zigmidge posted:No robots allowed will become baseball's unspoken rule. They won't even let robots call balls and strikes
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May 17, 2017 16:00
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just play baseball on spreadsheets already its what the fans want
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May 17, 2017 16:09
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Intruder posted:Speaking of which, I've seen a lot of speculation that balls are juiced this year to increase offense. Thoughts? My only thought is that it seems no one will ever be happy with the level of scoring in baseball.
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May 17, 2017 16:10
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The Walrus posted:so all cheating should be allowed then Hell yes.
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May 17, 2017 16:16
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Beltran got off to a hot start but has cooled significantly lately and actually has a negative WAR Thanks a lot jerk But seriously, this The Ringer article goes into how this is one of the worst seasons for players over 35 ever and is the worst in wRC+ since 1965 https://theringer.com/mlb-veteran-player-statistical-decline-c431a2690c06
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May 17, 2017 16:17
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Intruder posted:Baseball Simulator 1.000 damnit Hell yes, running around the bases with Boyd so fast even Rickey Henderson would be like, "drat, son."
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May 17, 2017 16:19
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Babe Ruth used performance-enhancing hot dogs and he's in the Hall.
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May 17, 2017 16:23
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He also drank a poo poo ton of alcohol. Alcohol was his steroid.
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May 17, 2017 16:26
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Rand alPaul posted:I like him pitching with a SNES stuck in his hair. Julio Cruz posted:My favorite is the cow who doesn't think Thoracic Outlet Syndrome is a real thing. They're all gold, but I really want to see a TV show about a dog who drives a bus and plays for the Mets.
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