NBA Draft 2017: It's not "my pick."

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Sports Argument Stadium > NBA Draft 2017: It's not "my pick."

Kibner: Oct 21, 2008; Acguy Supremacy

A Pelican blogger wrote up some words on potential second round picks for the team. What do you guys who actually look at players that go that deep think?

quote:

Wesley Iwundu, G/F, Kansas State (13.0 pts, 6.3 rebs, 3.5 assists)

This is my guy. I love him, and if he doesn�t make it eventually, then my system is off and I don�t know what I am talking about. He is athletic, long, can defend, is smart and hard-working, and can play well within a system. So, why isn�t he a first-rounder? Same old story � he is �too old� (22) and isn�t a great shooter for a wing (made less than a half of a three per game over college career; sub 35% shooter)

Two dozen guys who did nothing in college but have more �upside� will be taken ahead of him. So will several guys who shoot better but lack the IQ and vision, because coaches will arrogantly think they can teach that part of the game. But in the end, Iwundu will be better than most of them, if not all of them. He is in that Demarre Carrol/Jae Crowder mold, and could even have a ceiling of Josh Howard if he fully develops his game. He also has a hitch in his shot that is reminiscent of MKG, and maybe he never fixes it, but maybe he develops it like Kawhi Leonard. Kawhi was just 41 for 164 in college from deep. Iwundu is actually better (51 for 151) and took a big leap this past season.

Nigel Williams-Goss G, Gonzaga (16.8 pts, 6.0 rebs, 4.7 assists)

Goss might not even get drafted, but like Yogi Ferrell, that will be a mistake. He will be an NBA player simply through sheer will, IQ, and tenacity. He will be almost 23 by the time the season starts and isn�t insanely athletic, so teams will pass on him, but you can�t deny the impact he has on every aspect of the game, and that will translate to the NBA.

For the Pelicans, he would push the ball up the floor, be terrific in the pick and roll, and rebound extremely well for his position. More than anything, he can be a coach on the floor, arranging the chess pieces around better than any of the low IQ the Pelicans have had recently. For NWG, I see Derick Fisher, another second round pick who had a terrific career. He is smart, crafty, clutch � basically the ideal role player. He is the Brogden of this class IMO.

Jordan Bell, F, Oregon (11.0 pts, 8.7 rebs, 2.3 blks, 66% FG)

If you want to find the next Chuck Hayes, Kenneth Faried, Montrezl Harrell, etc � the guy who has a non-stop motor and wears his heart on his sleeve, it�s Jordan Bell. He can easily become a poor man�s DeAndre Jordan, playing both the 4 and the 5 in the modern NBA. He will protect the rim for you on defense while also having the foot quickness to defend on the perimeter. On offense, he will rim run, finish lobs, clean the glass, and even has a nice little jump hook in the paint.

Most surprisingly for a guy as raw as he is offensively, Bell can really pass the ball, and sees the court well for a big man. He runs like a deer in transition, and has really good hands for a big. Now, the Pelicans might pass because he is a lot like Diallo, but maybe you double down on the same type of guy and figure the odds say at least one of them hits. If both do, wouldn�t that be a tremendous problem to have?

Jonah Bolden, F, Adriatic League (12.9 pts, 7.2 rebounds, 42% 3-Pt)

Let�s get one thing straight � there is not going to be any �next Draymond Green�, but if you want to talk about skill sets, this guy has a lot of what Green brings to the table. Imagine I told you about a 6�10�, 230 pound big who could run the floor, handle on the break, had tremendous vision in transition, could stroke the 3, board like crazy, and defend both at the rim and on the perimeter. That�s Bolden.

Now, he didn�t do a lot of these things at a high level his one year at UCLA (except rebound), but he has flourished since going over to play professional ball in Europe, and his upside is tremendous. Watching him play, it is obvious that he sees the game develop faster than 99% of guys his age, and that will make him a better pro than college player if he gets into the right system. He needs to have the freedom to push the ball and let the three-ball fly � two things Gentry will encourage.

Damyean Dotson, G/F, Houston (17.4 pts, 6.9 rebs, 44.3% 3-Pt)

You want to find the next Anthony Morrow or Marcus Thornton 2nd round gunner? It�s Dotson. He is a good athlete, a solid rebounder, but he is on the court for one reason and one reason only � to shoot from deep. This past year at Houston, almost 57% of his shots came from deep, and he nailed over 44% of them.

Now, there are some read flags with Dotson, including his dismissal from Oregon after he was accused of rape, though the state prosecutor never brought charges on Dotson. He also isn�t going to fill in many other categories in the box score, so if his shot is off, he won�t have much (if any) value. But for a Pelicans game who needs shooting on the wing, Dotson is sure to be the best shooter left when they pick at #40, and that alone should make them consider adding him if they clear his troubled past. Or, he can go undrafted like Selden last year and be contributing by the end of the season.

# ? May 17, 2017 20:42

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ? May 16, 2024 14:10

Timby: Dec 23, 2006; Your mother!

I'm just starting to get back into basketball again, so let me see if I have this straight: Lonzo Ball is a good to very good player, but his father is obsessed with making billions of dollars off of him and promoting him as an unholy basketball monster made from the seed of Wilt Chamberlain, Michael Jordan, Kobe Bryant and Magic Johnson, and will throw an Archie Manning-esque tantrum if the Lakers don't draft him.

Close enough?

# ? May 17, 2017 20:46

Kibner: Oct 21, 2008; Acguy Supremacy

Timby posted:

I'm just starting to get back into basketball again, so let me see if I have this straight: Lonzo Ball is a good to very good player, but his father is obsessed with making billions of dollars off of him and promoting him as an unholy basketball monster made from the seed of Wilt Chamberlain, Michael Jordan, Kobe Bryant and Magic Johnson, and will throw an Archie Manning-esque tantrum if the Lakers don't draft him.

Close enough?

Pretty much.

# ? May 17, 2017 20:47

Paul Zuvella: Dec 7, 2011

Timby posted:

I'm just starting to get back into basketball again, so let me see if I have this straight: Lonzo Ball is a good to very good player, but his father is obsessed with making billions of dollars off of him and promoting him as an unholy basketball monster made from the seed of Wilt Chamberlain, Michael Jordan, Kobe Bryant and Magic Johnson, and will throw an Archie Manning-esque tantrum if the Lakers don't draft him.

Close enough?

He also is a misogynist and his son is in no way a sure thing to succeed in the NBA.

Also he thinks that he can beat Jordan one on one.

# ? May 17, 2017 20:47

EvanTH: Apr 24, 2004; i like to express my inner pain by being really boring on the phone
or just when i'm kickin it
that's me though
i'm kind of oddddddd

IcePhoenix posted:

Actually after thinking about it can we just trade our pick for Butler instead please

i would also like my team to trade their pick for Jimmy Butler

# ? May 17, 2017 21:14

IcePhoenix: Sep 18, 2005; Take me to your Shida

EvanTH posted:

i would also like my team to trade their pick for Jimmy Butler

I called dibs and also our pick is one higher than yours so nyah

# ? May 17, 2017 21:21

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Kibner posted:

A Pelican blogger wrote up some words on potential second round picks for the team. What do you guys who actually look at players that go that deep think?

I have not seen Bolden or Dotson yet but the rest of these are pretty solid.

I also love Iwundu. Like he's probably the player he is, which is to say, he isn't going to get much better. But he's already pretty good! I'm not sure how he's going to do against NBA talent since we mostly saw him against low quality schools.

I like Nigel Williams too, although I'm not as confident about his ability to translate his skills to the NBA, but they might which is what you want in a second round pick.

And I think the tournament and combine have really shown what Bell can do.

# ? May 17, 2017 21:46

kiimo: Jul 24, 2003

Kibner posted:

A Pelican blogger on potential second round picks for the team. What do you guys who actually look at players that go that deep think?

Frank Mason, G, Kansas � A true winner, who can be a nice backup for a team if given an opportunity.

Nobody says anything about Frank except a nice player lacking athleticism. 41 inch vertical sounds pretty athletic to me but am I confusing vertical for athleticism?

# ? May 17, 2017 21:56

Metapod: Mar 18, 2012

Paul Zuvella posted:

He also is a misogynist and his son is in no way a sure thing to succeed in the NBA.

Also he thinks that he can beat Jordan one on one.

Lol he doesn't think he can beat Jordan 1v1

He knows he can

# ? May 17, 2017 22:47

Nissin Cup Nudist: Sep 3, 2011; Sleep with one eye open

We're off to Gritty Gritty land

I'm cool with the Sixers using a second rounder on Goss

# ? May 17, 2017 22:54

Ty1990: Apr 22, 2011

Declan MacManus posted:

You can find shooters in free agency, you can't find a Josh Jackson in free agency

# ? May 18, 2017 00:51

DeimosRising: Oct 17, 2005; �Hola SEA!

Lockback posted:

I think there's risk all over at that place in the draft. I like Markkanen though, and you have me leaning back that way if he's there. If Isaac truly becomes Harrison Barnes +2 inches I'm coming back to you.

Barnes plus 2 inches is basically Rashard Lewis. Honestly if Lewis were reincarnated into the draft now he'd be worth a first overall.

# ? May 18, 2017 01:15

Dejan Bimble: Mar 24, 2008; we're all black friends; Plaster Town Cop

DeimosRising posted:

Barnes plus 2 inches is basically Rashard Lewis. Honestly if Lewis were reincarnated into the draft now he'd be worth a first overall.

Proto Rashard Lewis with better defensive instincts is going to go between 5-8 in this draft. If FSU had less selfish guards, who knows how high he'd be

# ? May 18, 2017 01:23

Nissin Cup Nudist: Sep 3, 2011; Sleep with one eye open

We're off to Gritty Gritty land

If the Sixers do take Jackson. I wan them to grab Williams-Goss and Hart in the second. Or package a couple seconds and Okafor to move back into the late 1st and pick, like, Jawun Evans or somebody like that

# ? May 18, 2017 01:25

DeimosRising: Oct 17, 2005; �Hola SEA!

Dejan Bimble posted:

Proto Rashard Lewis with better defensive instincts is going to go between 5-8 in this draft. If FSU had less selfish guards, who knows how high he'd be

tbf Lewis was raw as hell coming out of high school and iirc sucked for his first couple of years before just suddenly becoming a 17 ppg .400 3pt shooter overnight. The league just has so much better an idea of what to do with a guy who can shoot .400 on 7+ threes a game now, imagine that in place of LaMarcus on the Spurs.

# ? May 18, 2017 01:28

Dejan Bimble: Mar 24, 2008; we're all black friends; Plaster Town Cop

Nissin Cup Nudist posted:

If the Sixers do take Jackson. I wan them to grab Williams-Goss and Hart in the second. Or package a couple seconds and Okafor to move back into the late 1st and pick, like, Jawun Evans or somebody like that

They don't really need Williams-Goss, they have 3 below the rim slow point guards on the roster already. Hart is nice just because he's a nice all around player who could do well given minutes on a functional team. Jawun Evans has peg arms, when the wingspan hype dies down he might move down. But he's the kind of small guy that moves in the right way to succeed in the NBA. When he needs space for a jumper he pops like a little popcorn to get plenty of room, he uses his arms to do deceptive stuff off the dribble,
decent three point shooting could make him a solid backup pg on a normal team or starter for the Sixers

Declan MacManus posted:

You can find shooters in free agency, you can't find a Josh Jackson in free agency

He's not at risk of being another Michael Kidd GIlchrist, he knows how to fall and there's much more variety in his scoring than pure athleticism stuff, but he will compound their problems with spacing and floor balance in general, if the Lakers don't draft him first.

He has a hair impeded shot, I feel bad for posting it constantly but he needs to cut his loving hair and it would be so much easier for him. He'll also be good for the Sixers CULTURE because he cares about defense and plays hard, hopefully he can infect the team and not let Simmons's blahh autism be their team personality.

# ? May 18, 2017 01:35

euphronius: Feb 18, 2009

I think EMbiid is going to lead that team emotionally.

# ? May 18, 2017 01:37

Nissin Cup Nudist: Sep 3, 2011; Sleep with one eye open

We're off to Gritty Gritty land

Dejan Bimble posted:

They don't really need Williams-Goss, they have 3 below the rim slow point guards on the roster already. Hart is nice just because he's a nice all around player who could do well given minutes on a functional team. Jawun Evans has peg arms, when the wingspan hype dies down he might move down. But he's the kind of small guy that moves in the right way to succeed in the NBA. When he needs space for a jumper he pops like a little popcorn to get plenty of room, he uses his arms to do deceptive stuff off the dribble,
decent three point shooting could make him a solid backup pg on a normal team or starter for the Sixers

I'm kinda just throwing out names at this point. I'm just desperate for the Sixers to do something about their lack of guards that does not involve giving Lowry 4/160

# ? May 18, 2017 01:39

euphronius: Feb 18, 2009

Whats wrong with signing Lowry. THere is no obvious downside.

# ? May 18, 2017 01:40

DeimosRising: Oct 17, 2005; �Hola SEA!

Even if you believe he's allergic to the second round, a couple of second round outs would be manna from heaven in Philly. Health permitting, they're going to be good for a decade so it's not like even if he's a jinx it's closing their window.

# ? May 18, 2017 01:45

Nissin Cup Nudist: Sep 3, 2011; Sleep with one eye open

We're off to Gritty Gritty land

On no planet do I want to give Lowry 40 million a year for his 31-35 seasons

Especially since he wont' be the primary ball-handler

# ? May 18, 2017 01:46

euphronius: Feb 18, 2009

Nissin Cup Nudist posted:

On no planet do I want to give Lowry 40 million a year for his 31-35 seasons

Especially since he wont' be the primary ball-handler

Who cares how much he costs. What is it stopping the sixers from doing.

# ? May 18, 2017 01:48

euphronius: Feb 18, 2009

DeimosRising posted:

Even if you believe he's allergic to the second round, a couple of second round outs would be manna from heaven in Philly. Health permitting, they're going to be good for a decade so it's not like even if he's a jinx it's closing their window.

Right his contract goes off the books when the 2017 pick us up for an extension.

# ? May 18, 2017 01:49

Redgrendel2001: Sep 1, 2006; you literally think a person saying their NBA team of choice being better than the fucking 76ers is a 'schtick'

a literal thing you think.

Nissin Cup Nudist posted:

I'm kinda just throwing out names at this point. I'm just desperate for the Sixers to do something about their lack of guards that does not involve giving Lowry 4/160

Monte Morris is a solid PG who'll probably be available in the early 2nd.

# ? May 18, 2017 01:54

Nissin Cup Nudist: Sep 3, 2011; Sleep with one eye open

We're off to Gritty Gritty land

euphronius posted:

Who cares how much he costs. What is it stopping the sixers from doing.

Sign Lowry for 40 mil a year, that's the Sixers core for the foreseeable future. RobCo needs a big raise. Embiid (probably) needs a big raise. There will be little room to be flexible. Especially if Embiid gets a Brinks trunk and only plays 50 games year

Mostly, I just have a bad feeling any big Lowry deal will look real bad in a couple years

Nissin Cup Nudist fucked around with this message at 02:02 on May 18, 2017

# ? May 18, 2017 01:57

Dejan Bimble: Mar 24, 2008; we're all black friends; Plaster Town Cop

euphronius posted:

Who cares how much he costs. What is it stopping the sixers from doing.

Using their first round pick point forward to the full extent of his abilities, and then not being capped out when all their good young players sign their first post rookie deals.

I'm not against it in theory, though. They could always stretch him or waive him before year 4 of the contract

# ? May 18, 2017 02:05

Nissin Cup Nudist: Sep 3, 2011; Sleep with one eye open

We're off to Gritty Gritty land

Would any non-lotto teams that would trade their late 1st for Okafor and 2 seconds?

# ? May 18, 2017 02:23

euphronius: Feb 18, 2009

Nissin Cup Nudist posted:

Sign Lowry for 40 mil a year, that's the Sixers core for the foreseeable future. RobCo needs a big raise. Embiid (probably) needs a big raise. There will be little room to be flexible. Especially if Embiid gets a Brinks trunk and only plays 50 games year

Mostly, I just have a bad feeling any big Lowry deal will look real bad in a couple years

Roco and Embiid are both bird rights.

Maybe not ROco's extension but they have room to do both.

# ? May 18, 2017 02:25

kiimo: Jul 24, 2003

Dejan Bimble posted:

He has a hair impeded shot, I feel bad for posting it constantly but he needs to cut his loving hair and it would be so much easier for him.

What about cornrows

mentat analysis: shmoov

# ? May 18, 2017 02:29

Redgrendel2001: Sep 1, 2006; you literally think a person saying their NBA team of choice being better than the fucking 76ers is a 'schtick'

a literal thing you think.

Nissin Cup Nudist posted:

Would any non-lotto teams that would trade their late 1st for Okafor and 2 seconds?

Not too many teams with need or PT for a traditional center in that range. Detroit, Denver, and Miami are all set. Probably would have to get to the late teens early 20s before it could be digestible. Maybe Atlanta at #19 if Dwight leaves or Portland/Brooklyn at #20/#22 considering they have multiple picks in the 1st.

IMHO he's probably more valuable as a piece in bigger deal; e.g. Okafor, TLC, Covington, Lakers 2019, etc. for Butler.

Edit: Misread and thought you meant late lotto.

# ? May 18, 2017 02:39

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Redgrendel2001 posted:

Monte Morris is a solid PG who'll probably be available in the early 2nd.

Monte is good but I think he's a bad fit for the Sixers because he's so pass-first, and just kind of generally not that great of a scorer when he does put his mind to it, that I just don't see him as aligning with a lineup that doesn't have a lot of other shooting.

# ? May 18, 2017 03:59

Redgrendel2001: Sep 1, 2006; you literally think a person saying their NBA team of choice being better than the fucking 76ers is a 'schtick'

a literal thing you think.

Rick posted:

Monte is good but I think he's a bad fit for the Sixers because he's so pass-first, and just kind of generally not that great of a scorer when he does put his mind to it, that I just don't see him as aligning with a lineup that doesn't have a lot of other shooting.

True. Not many PGs other than Evans after the bounty in the top 10. Edmond Sumner, Frank Jackson, and NWG are the only ones off the top of my head.

I guess the best option would be to package some of the 2nds to grab Evans somewhere in the mid-20s if possible.

I'm not super concerned about the position though unless McConnell or Bayless gets seriously injured.

# ? May 18, 2017 04:33

Rick: Feb 23, 2004; When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

I feel like Josh Hart would be converted into a PG in any era but this one and like the 1950s, and his on the ball stats make me think he can play it in the NBA (he was better in on the ball PnR than Ball). I also think P.J. Dozier should be playing point but that might just be me. Speaking of South Carolina Thornwell is very much my jam although he is not really a pg although maybe could play the spot with a natural distributor.

# ? May 18, 2017 05:07

Redgrendel2001: Sep 1, 2006; you literally think a person saying their NBA team of choice being better than the fucking 76ers is a 'schtick'

a literal thing you think.

Rick posted:

I feel like Josh Hart would be converted into a PG in any era but this one and like the 1950s, and his on the ball stats make me think he can play it in the NBA (he was better in on the ball PnR than Ball). I also think P.J. Dozier should be playing point but that might just be me. Speaking of South Carolina Thornwell is very much my jam although he is not really a pg although maybe could play the spot with a natural distributor.

Is Thornwell the defensive stopper that some sites are claiming he is?

# ? May 18, 2017 05:40

kiimo: Jul 24, 2003

If you don't get a point guard you can always wait for next draft and get lucky enough to snag this dominating killer

https://youtu.be/tcVKvvOfsr4

# ? May 18, 2017 06:57

Khagan: Aug 8, 2012; Words cannot describe just how terrible Vietnamese are.

Is there a ranking of players from both this class and next year's cause I'm curious if Michael Porter tops it.

# ? May 18, 2017 07:00

kiimo: Jul 24, 2003

If there is I don't know about it. You can bet this class will be deeper though.

I've never seen MPJ highlights so I couldn't tell you. Basically because my school was never a recruiting contender.

# ? May 18, 2017 07:03

Khagan: Aug 8, 2012; Words cannot describe just how terrible Vietnamese are.

Why does Fultz get a pass for having bad teammates but not Dennis Smith?

# ? May 18, 2017 09:37

paternity suitor: Aug 2, 2016

Dejan Bimble posted:

He has a hair impeded shot, I feel bad for posting it constantly but he needs to cut his loving hair and it would be so much easier for him. He'll also be good for the Sixers CULTURE because he cares about defense and plays hard, hopefully he can infect the team and not let Simmons's blahh autism be their team personality.

Sixers already have a very strong team personality, Embiid is going to be the guy that drives it. But they all play hard. I agree that Jackson fits very well with that though.

# ? May 18, 2017 13:06

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ? May 16, 2024 14:10

euphronius: Feb 18, 2009

McConnell is Garbage and needs to be banished to the Spanish league.

# ? May 18, 2017 13:07

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Sports Argument Stadium > NBA Draft 2017: It's not "my pick."

«‹›70 »