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Attestant posted:I do wonder if the "You = Yu" thing is intentional. Without any doubt.
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May 18, 2017 12:38
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About 15 hours in or so. I've run in to 3 nightmares, the "big bad" that punishes you for leveling up too fast, so far of which 2 didn't even move or even look at me while I blasted them away. The third was stuck in a door frame. Didn't they patch them to fix that?
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May 18, 2017 14:11
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Megaman's Jockstrap posted:I just got through the GUTS to the Arboreteum. This is a great game. Anyway, I have a pretty wild theory about where this game is going (you should only read this if you've finished the game or are willing to take a chance that some rando figured out a big plot twist). thats a cool theory, it would explain why you can throw items so far, unless that's just a zero gravity thing i think that the typhons are actually sentient neuromods/lost memories. so with all the memories that morgan has presumably had overwritten from repeating the same day over and over, typhon-morgan would be supercharged from having all those lost memories. you know all those Rorschach tests? "what do you see when you see this" well what if that stuff was actually what was in your head? its weird that a bethesda game has a story that is actually interesting. i blame arkane still barely into it at this point too
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May 18, 2017 14:15
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where the red fern gropes posted:its weird that a bethesda game has a story that is actually interesting. i blame arkane my head is going to explode
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May 18, 2017 14:28
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where the red fern gropes posted:thats a cool theory, it would explain why you can throw items so far, unless that's just a zero gravity thing This wouldn't work because the Typhon were encountered long before neuromods were invented. Neuromod development began after the Typhon encounter by the Soviets.
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May 18, 2017 14:54
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where the red fern gropes posted:its weird that a bethesda game has a story that is actually interesting. i blame arkane This "Bethesda" game is actually good because it didn't involve Bethesda in any way when it comes to actual development.
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May 18, 2017 14:56
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Bethesda has published numerous games with good stories so I don't know what people that keep posting that are even about. Both Dishonored games were published by Bethesda, Fallout: News Vegas, The Evil Within, the new Wolfenstein and Doom. Ok, Doom didn't have a great story but it was a great game.
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May 18, 2017 15:41
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i don't think people understand what the difference between publishers and developers are
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May 18, 2017 15:42
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Palpek posted:Bethesda has published numerous games with good stories so I don't know what people that keep posting that are even about. Both Dishonored games were published by Bethesda, Fallout: News Vegas, The Evil Within, the new Wolfenstein and Doom. Ok, Doom didn't have a great story but it was a great game. Hey, to Bethesda's storytelling credit, they successfully wrote and predicted the 2016 Presidential elections 5 years earlier! That takes a lot of skill!
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May 18, 2017 15:48
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I'm pretty sure I've spent the past five hours searching for an ending that might not even exist in this game. Can someone who's completed it help me out? I'm at the endgame and have the choice of blowing up the station or using Alex's plans to subdue the Typhon. I discovered a TranScribe recorded by Morgan that seems to reveal the existence of a third operator called "October" and a third ending - a unique Nullwave device that will kill every Typhon but leave the station intact. Morgan says the fabrication plan is on the data tower next to the "scary chair - you'll know where it is." I don't know where it is and I've searched everywhere on the station. Any hints?
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May 18, 2017 15:50
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the black husserl posted:I'm pretty sure I've spent the past five hours searching for an ending that might not even exist in this game. Can someone who's completed it help me out?
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May 18, 2017 15:54
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Question about a cheevo: When the Impostor cook kills himself with recycle charge it doesn't count as a kill for the "Do no harm" acievement, right?
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May 18, 2017 15:56
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Regarding the October stuff: I think that's a recording Alex has, either on their person or in their hideout. The hiding place it mentions is the exact same place the arming key is supposed to be hidden. Most likely it's Morgan's go-to hiding place but they keep forgetting they've used it before, and Alex knows about it already. October itself is hooked up to the computer in your apartment in Crew Quarters i think. SinineSiil posted:Question about a cheevo: When the Impostor cook kills himself with recycle charge it doesn't count as a kill for the "Do no harm" acievement, right? You can still get the achievement when that happens, yeah (It's what I did)
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May 18, 2017 16:00
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Cicadalek posted:Regarding the October stuff: I think that's a recording Alex has, either on their person or in their hideout. The hiding place it mentions is the exact same place the arming key is supposed to be hidden. Most likely it's Morgan's go-to hiding place but they keep forgetting they've used it before, and Alex knows about it already. Appreciate yalls help, but man I think I'm even more confused  Regarding the arming key - Alex just gives you the arming key, it's not hidden anywhere. Do you mean the escape pod key that was hidden under the lamp in Alex's room? Morgan's secret nullwave device can't be hidden there, I searched everywhere in that area. Is there another hiding place that appears if you somehow don't get the key from Alex?. Palpek posted:Hmm the unique Nullwave device that will kill every Typhon but leave the station intact IS Alex's plan to subdue the Typhon so if you just follow his objectives you'll get it. However, I haven't found that transcribe mentioning October. The transcribe reveals that Alex actually WANTS you to blow up the station and remove all evidence of his misdoings. Morgan seems to be talking about a different Nullwave device than Alex is - Alex's device will preserve the Typhon research while Morgan's will destroy it entirely. Finding this one transcribe has completely changed the game for me and there's almost zero information available online. I almost feel like it's a glitch or an old version of the story or something. Really cool game, been a while since I've actually felt a sense of mystery. the black husserl fucked around with this message at 16:25 on May 18, 2017 |
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May 18, 2017 16:18
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the black husserl posted:The transcribe reveals that Alex actually WANTS you to blow up the station and remove all evidence of his misdoings. Morgan seems to be talking about a different Nullwave device than Alex is - Alex's device will preserve the Typhon research while Morgan's will destroy it entirely.
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May 18, 2017 16:25
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Palpek posted:At the very end there's a direct confrontation between Alex and January about blowing up the station vs using the Nullwave and Alex is 100% in favor of using the Nullwave, weird. I haven't listened to that transcribe though and the device was in fact developen by Morgan so maybe the audio comes from a time when Alex didn't support it yet? The transcribe appears to reveal that Alex (who has been manipulating and lying to you the whole game) is in fact also manipulating you about his desired outcome (for reasons unknown), so I suppose that confrontation isn't too surprising. Clearly there's layers to this poo poo though. I'll post the transcribe audio in the thread so you can hear for yourself when I get back to my PC, it frustratingly has not been posted online anywhere yet that I can tell. .
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May 18, 2017 16:33
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Palpek posted:At the very end there's a direct confrontation between Alex and January about blowing up the station vs using the Nullwave and Alex is 100% in favor of using the Nullwave, weird. I haven't listened to that transcribe though and the device was in fact developen by Morgan so maybe the audio comes from a time when Alex didn't support it yet? I have a bug with that scene: If I kill January any time before it tasers Alex the script breaks and the fat guy will just stand there unresponsive to anything, no way the devs didn't think of that Edit: Okay, I went away from him about 10 meters and the script started running again. Sininu fucked around with this message at 17:07 on May 18, 2017 |
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May 18, 2017 17:03
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the black husserl posted:The transcribe appears to reveal that Alex (who has been manipulating and lying to you the whole game) is in fact also manipulating you about his desired outcome (for reasons unknown), so I suppose that confrontation isn't too surprising. Clearly there's layers to this poo poo though. (Ending spoilers) I just checked it out. For anyone having missed the October Transcribe, it's inside Alex's hideout. I just walked in while Alex was talking, before Apex arriving. I guess it's probably a lot easier to miss if you only get in there in the middle of the chaos to drag Alex in after he falls unconscious -- perhaps it ends up flying away. To me, it's fairly obvious: One of Morgan's plan Bs was to arm the Nullwave Device s/he designed. Alex had no knowledge of this device and therefore his plan B was to destroy the station. But once Alex stumbled on Morgan's transcribe about October, he went and got the Nullwave Device plans himself. Having seen them, he changes his mind that the station can be preserved after all. Which is in line with the transcribe you find on his unconscious/dead body, that mentions he believes they can save the station, and to use the Nullwave Device you designed (Morgan). The location of the October transcribe just makes sense in that perspective, too. It's basically the confirmation that the Nullwave Device plans are indeed a creation of Morgan's, as opposed to an attempt at manipulating you. It's just super easy to miss because the world is ending, there's basically 5 incoming calls in a row and overlapping transcribes to boot. 
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May 18, 2017 17:10
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I see what you're saying but it just doesn't all add up. I think that's more to do with the game being vague, having a minor plot hole or something being hidden than your analysis being flawed. Alex's goal is to preserve the Typhon so he can continue his evil (but in his opinion, justified) experiments. Everything he says implies that activating the Nullwave device he gives you will subdue and defeat the Typhon, but won't destroy them. If you saved Doctor Igwe, he confirms this as well. Remember that all the Neuromods are Typhons - why would Alex ask you to save his life's work and research and then give you the plans to a device that would destroy it all? That's why Mikhaila (if you saved her) passionately argues for you to blow up the station - it's the only way to actually kill the Typhon instead of preserving and trying to control them (again). The October Transcribe seems to reveal a third option: kill the Typhon for real but also keep the station intact. I'm not sure why that matters so much since Talos is really just a floating pile of metal without the Typhon experiments, but I guess it would be cleaner and you'd save the lives of the unconscious crew members who couldn't make it to the escape shuttle. Also it's really weird they would introduce two mysterious "directors" (January and December) and imply the existence of a third (October) but not actually put that character in the game. I felt like I had cracked a major code when I found that transcribe but it's looking more and more like a dangling thread.
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May 18, 2017 18:04
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October is in the game. he/she is connected to Morgans computer in the crew quarters
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May 18, 2017 18:10
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the black husserl posted:I see what you're saying but it just doesn't all add up. I think that's more to do with the game being vague, having a minor plot hole or something being hidden than your analysis being flawed. It's not really dangling. Alex's plan and October's plan are one-to-one congruent. October's plan is also congruent with one version of Morgan's (From the Morgan Transcribe). The big things that October is cementing is 1. Alex's plan is actually something that came from Morgan; 2. Morgan's personality shifts from repeated neuromod extraction. Each operator was created by a different version of Morgan. There are many other elements in the game which point to Morgan actually being the one pushing for more brutal and exploitative Typhon research, and Alex is just trying to honor the wishes of what seems to be the "real" Morgan in his eyes
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May 18, 2017 18:18
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the black husserl posted:Remember that all the Neuromods are Typhons - why would Alex ask you to save his life's work and research and then give you the plans to a device that would destroy it all? Erm, no... While it's obviously implied that exotic matter comes from Typhons, and that Neuromods are made from exotic matter, there's absolutely nothing to indicate that Neuromods are still conscious Typhon beings after being scavenged, recycled, fabricated, etc. By the description of the Nullwave Device, and by extrapolating from the grenade with the same name, it operates on the consciousness of Typhon beings, not on their matter. Neither the description from October's transcribe or Alex really indicate otherwise, it's just the wording of "destroying the Typhon" that is left to interpretation.
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May 18, 2017 18:36
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the black husserl posted:I see what you're saying but it just doesn't all add up. I think that's more to do with the game being vague, having a minor plot hole or something being hidden than your analysis being flawed. That's not the impression I get. Apologies for adding to the mess of spoilers but: Morgan changed over the course of the neuromod tests. Its referenced in emails and a few conversations that their personality became markedly different as their memory was re-wiped. So it's important to remember that the different recordings of Morgan you find throughout the game are from different periods and different personalities. This ties into the January/Dec/Oct stuff aswell. The most likely theory I heard in this thread is that Morgan repeatedly made an Operator as a backup plan in case Alex trapped them in the neuromod tests. The problem is, due the memory loss, Morgan keeps making new operators because they forget about the previous ones. There's an email about Morgan constantly ordering Operator parts that supports this theory. So each of the Operators are part of different plans by Morgan, but all of them are from different stages in their personality. When they made October, they were worried Alex would blow up the station, so they made plans for a Nullwave device that will just zap the Typhons instead. When they made December, their plan was "gently caress all this I'm running", so December tries to guide you to an escape pod. And January apparently came from your "gently caress all this, we need to blow it up" phase. January originally directs you to find your plans for the Arming Key on top of a server rack in the room where you made your recording. But Alex gets there first, which is why he gives it to you personally later. The October recording says that the nullwave device is in the same place, but of course Alex found it already. I don't think the device mentioned is separate than the one Alex proposes by the time you talk to him.
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May 18, 2017 18:48
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CharlieFoxtrot posted:It's not really dangling. Alex's plan and October's plan are one-to-one congruent. October's plan is also congruent with one version of Morgan's (From the Morgan Transcribe). The big things that October is cementing is 1. Alex's plan is actually something that came from Morgan; 2. Morgan's personality shifts from repeated neuromod extraction. Each operator was created by a different version of Morgan. There are many other elements in the game which point to Morgan actually being the one pushing for more brutal and exploitative Typhon research, and Alex is just trying to honor the wishes of what seems to be the "real" Morgan in his eyes Last bit from me on this, since I don't wanna hijack the thread with walls of blacktext and I probably should do more exploration on my own. Appreciate your perspective! How are they congruent? They have totally different outcomes, which seems to be the main choice of the endgame: Destroy the Typhon and end the threat, or Preserve the Typhon and save the technology. Alex, Igwe, and Mikhaila clearly state that Alex's Nullwave device won't destroy the Typhon - only defeat and subdue them so Talos can be saved and the Neuromods preserved. The October Transcribe has Morgan claim that Morgan's Nullwave device actually will destroy the Typhon for good (which necessitates destroying the Neuromods, since a huge reveal in the game is that ALL neuromods are created from Typhons). If you're saying that Alex's Nullwave device really will destroy all the Typhons and Neuromods, then what the hell kind of choice are you actually making in the endgame? That would make it come down to Destroy the Typhons vs. Destroy the Typhons (and keep a half-destroyed hunk of space metal intact). That's not really much of a choice... n4 posted:October is in the game. he/she is connected to Morgans computer in the crew quarters Weird, I completely missed it. Guess I've got some backtracking to do.
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May 18, 2017 18:51
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the black husserl posted:Last bit from me on this, since I don't wanna hijack the thread with walls of blacktext and I probably should do more exploration on my own. Appreciate your perspective!
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May 18, 2017 18:58
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the black husserl posted:Last bit from me on this, since I don't wanna hijack the thread with walls of blacktext and I probably should do more exploration on my own. Appreciate your perspective! The nullwave device kills all typhon, but keeps the research and neuromods intact. Which is probably better than just nuking everything. What is slightly strange to me is the notion that blowing up the station is somehow a more sure way to kill every typhon than using a device that specifically targets typhon.
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May 18, 2017 19:03
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Also it's a bit of a shame that the unreliable narrator idea hasn't been explored more. It would have been amazing to have all the other Novembers, Februaries, Marchs etc. all being 100% sure tha their Morgan was the correct one and they'd be plotting to kill one another to be the one true apostle of the real Morgan. I know that the devs probably considered it and decided against it but more December/January-like shenaningans present in the main story it would have made the plot thicker.
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May 18, 2017 19:03
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Mymla posted:The nullwave device kills all typhon, but keeps the research and neuromods intact. Which is probably better than just nuking everything.
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May 18, 2017 19:10
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the black husserl posted:Last bit from me on this, since I don't wanna hijack the thread with walls of blacktext and I probably should do more exploration on my own. Appreciate your perspective! You really need to beat the game and see the final cutscenes, is all I can say really. Just pick one. I can 100% guarantee you that you are reading way too much into this, there is no Secret Third Ending.
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May 18, 2017 19:16
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(more ending spoiler chat) I never really understood how destroying Talos 1 was really supposed to be able to stop the Typhon. We already know they can survive in space just fine, how do we know for sure that zero of these things will survive the explosion and spend a couple months flying to Earth? Even if you assume that the explosion is perfect and kills 100% of the typhon on Talos 1, that only delays the inevitable. They'd already made their coral beacon and let the other Typhon know we're here, who's to say there's not another Apex that's due to arrive in another week or so? All we'd be doing is guaranteeing that every human who knows anything about the Typhon is going to be dead, ensuring Earth is as unprepared as possible for Apex #2. I mean there's no doubt that everything going on on Talos 1 was just Umbrellacorp-tier immoral and stupid, but I don't see how blowing up the station is going to help at this point.
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May 18, 2017 19:20
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Palpek posted:No, you're wrong about that. Destroying Typhon doesn't mean destroying the technology. The research, devices, weapons and neuromod technology will stay on the station after using the Nullwave. They could always search for more Typhon elsewhere because the station is not the only place where it exists. However when they blow up the station the entire research based on Typhon will be gone and that's what Alex wants to avoid. Okay last one from me for real. The game's plot is really interesting and I want to untangle it. It doesn't make any sense that you can destroy the Typhon and simultaneously preserve the Neuromods. The Neuromods are MADE of Typhons (which is a very significant "holy poo poo" moment that gets completely defanged if what you're saying is true) and that's why Mikhaila is freaking out at the end about you using the nullwave device - if you preserve the technology, you risk the Typhons escaping containment again. It's the only way to be sure! Are ya'll just convinced she's wrong and the Nullwave device is actually a totally safe 100% guaranteed Typhon killer? Is there any evidence in the game to confirm that? Even Alex and Dr. Igwe act unsure (the technology is experimental), and all their dialogue seems to imply the Nullwave defeats rather than outright destroys. Besides, it's obvious that Alex and Igwe don't want to destroy the Typhon completely - they want them back in containment so they can continue doing Neuromod experiments as usual. If they're pushing you to use the nullwave, it follows that they aren't pushing you to eradicate the Typhon. Mymla posted:What is slightly strange to me is the notion that blowing up the station is somehow a more sure way to kill every typhon than using a device that specifically targets typhon.[/spoiler] See, my take explains this. The nullwave doesn't eliminate the Typhon, it only defeats them. Blowing it up is the only way to be sure the threat is actually eliminated. If you save both Igwe and Mikhaila, they actually debate this fairly explicitly in front of the player. Igwe admits he doesn't know what the results of the Nullwave will even be, he just hopes it will be enough to stop them for now. .
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May 18, 2017 19:21
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the black husserl posted:
The end cutscene shows the big typhon literally disintegrating when you use the nullwave prototype, I'd say it probably kills them.
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May 18, 2017 19:28
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Mzbundifund posted:(more ending spoiler chat) I never really understood how destroying Talos 1 was really supposed to be able to stop the Typhon. We already know they can survive in space just fine, how do we know for sure that zero of these things will survive the explosion and spend a couple months flying to Earth? Even if you assume that the explosion is perfect and kills 100% of the typhon on Talos 1, that only delays the inevitable. They'd already made their coral beacon and let the other Typhon know we're here, who's to say there's not another Apex that's due to arrive in another week or so? All we'd be doing is guaranteeing that every human who knows anything about the Typhon is going to be dead, ensuring Earth is as unprepared as possible for Apex #2. Some mimics must surely have made it to Earth by stowing away on shuttles. Heck, there is a derelict shuttle right outside Talos I where that happened.
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May 18, 2017 19:45
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Will destroying Dahl's tech Operator, Kasparov, save the people in the Cargo Hold? I hacked it and that worked, but what if I had destroyed it?
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May 18, 2017 21:31
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Kurzon posted:Will destroying Dahl's tech Operator, Kasparov, save the people in the Cargo Hold? I hacked it and that worked, but what if I had destroyed it? I did the latter and it had the same result.
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May 18, 2017 21:32
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I loving hate all of you and really want to click on all of those spoilers.
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May 18, 2017 21:35
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That modder guy keeps going through the files and now he activated the extra traumas cut from the game. quote:If you fall from a great height your leg bones will break, fire will cause third degree burns, etc. At the moment the only way to clear these conditions is to visit a Medical Operator. I will add the new medicines in that are made specifically for these conditions in the next version.
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May 18, 2017 21:40
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The devs have said they'd like to patch those in themselves.
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May 18, 2017 21:48
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Palpek posted:That modder guy keeps going through the files and now he activated the extra traumas cut from the game. how can you possibly be bad enough to take falling damage when all you have to do to avoid it is activate your jetpack a few moments before impact?
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May 18, 2017 21:54
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Wait, are the names of the Operators the months that they were built? Does that match the timeline?
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May 18, 2017 22:06
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