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spacetoaster posted:Yeah but doesn't the qu'ran specifically tell muslims it's okay to lie about that to non-muslims? "You know what this religion needs? A clause that makes it so no infidel can ever trust us." - A wise prophet
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May 24, 2017 21:17
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spacetoaster posted:Yeah but doesn't the qu'ran specifically tell muslims it's okay to lie about that to non-muslims? drat, they thought of everything. Maybe they deserve to win.
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May 24, 2017 21:17
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the trump tutelage posted:"You know what this religion needs? A clause that makes it so no infidel can ever trust us." - A wise prophet Spunky Psycho Ho posted:drat, they thought of everything. Maybe they deserve to win. Apparently it's even got it's own name as a thing in their religion. "Taqiya"
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May 24, 2017 21:19
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That's for the shia muslims. Because they kept getting massacred by Sunnis, their clergy came up with a clause that says you can keep your religion on the down low if it's going to get you killed.
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May 24, 2017 21:19
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People defend Islam as a whole because the religion is almost always just clothing for the reasons behind what people do. If the state of the world was topsy turvy and Christianity or any other mainstream but exclusionary religion was the minority, while there was an affluent Islamic status quo that occupied and generally interfered with the Christian homelands, there would probably be sects of radical Christians willing to martyr themselves in horrible ways too. Religions of almost all kinds have gone through phases of liberalisation and radicalisation, tolerance and persecution depending on their place in the world and how secure they felt. Being Islamic doesn't make you any less moral than anybody else inherently, so it is essentially bullshit to persecute all Muslims for the actions of a few. Read the justifications behind the Anarchist bombings of the late 19th and early 20th century and honestly you'll find them almost the same as those of current Islamic extremists, despite the fact that Anarchism and Radical Islam could probably not be more diametrically opposed. Both justified their attacks on civilians as a means of striking back against state sanctioned violence that killed many times more people daily without any moral repercussions. To me, it's a pretty reprehensible mindset. And not one I can easily understand. But I've never felt particularly persecuted so maybe I would feel differently if I had emigrated from some war-torn homeland. I'm equally at a loss for people like Anders Breivik who will just murder dozens of children and teenagers one by one just to make some political point.
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May 24, 2017 21:20
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Pawl posted:How many more islamic terrorist attacks before somebody actually does something about it the fun thing is the longer this goes on, the more draconian and actually fascist the response is going to be one day the dam is gonna burst and Europe is going to revert back to the late 19th century and it's gonna be ugly as gently caress
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May 24, 2017 21:21
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VikingSkull posted:the fun thing is the longer this goes on, the more draconian and actually fascist the response is going to be This is the real problem on the horizon.
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May 24, 2017 21:22
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Testikles posted:That's for the shia muslims. Because they kept getting massacred by Sunnis, their clergy came up with a clause that says you can keep your religion on the down low if it's going to get you killed. Not really. It's right there in the holy book. Sura 3:28: "Let not the believers take the unbelievers for protectors rather than believers; and whoever does this, he shall have nothing of (the guardianship of) Allah, but you should guard yourselves against them, guarding carefully " "meaning, except those believers who in some areas or times fear for their safety from the disbelievers. In this case, such believers are allowed to show friendship to the disbelievers outwardly, but never inwardly."
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May 24, 2017 21:23
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Secular Humanist posted:did you guys know it's *not all* muslims who are murdering, religious lunatics? I'll bet that you thought it WAS all just because they are reliably exploding children with nail bombs You're supposed to reliably kill children with missiles or Navy SEAL bullets. Get it together, terrorists.
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May 24, 2017 21:24
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spacetoaster posted:Not really. It's right there in the holy book. This is the kind of thing you have to think about when your religion forces conversions at the tip of a sword.
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May 24, 2017 21:25
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Agag posted:You're supposed to reliably kill children with missiles or Navy SEAL bullets. Get it together, terrorists. Obama was a muslim though? 
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May 24, 2017 21:25
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A chill seeming Muslim got me my current job, but reflecting back on it now I think that he had murder in his eyes.
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May 24, 2017 21:25
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Dmitri-9 posted:They don't want anti-muslim sentiment to snowball into some genocide Hmm yes and their strategy for doing this is by trolling white people and making them even more neurotic lol.
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May 24, 2017 21:26
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Helical Nightmares posted:This is the real problem on the horizon. It really is. The current status quo isn't working. Some people might want Muslims to do more to disavow this stuff because of a latent hate of Islam or religion as a whole or whatever, but I'd like to see them wake up and realize that radicals in their faith are directly hoping for this exact outcome, and they've horribly miscalculated what the end result will be.
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May 24, 2017 21:26
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Agag posted:You're supposed to reliably kill children with missiles or Navy SEAL bullets. Get it together, terrorists. It's also really fun to starve kids through sanctions
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May 24, 2017 21:26
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im the moment where you realize page 70 is about to hit and none of the people who called the truth racist come back to apologize now that the suspect was in fact a muslim terrorist from a muslim terrorist family what's this happen about 200 times a year if you include the 195 times it happens in the middle east and isn't usually reported in the west? and how many apologies have we gotten for being called "racist" for assuming a non raced based religion was involved? somewhere about zero
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May 24, 2017 21:26
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VikingSkull posted:the fun thing is the longer this goes on, the more draconian and actually fascist the response is going to be Franco-Prussian War 2.0!!! 
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May 24, 2017 21:26
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lol but seriously I posted:A chill seeming Muslim got me my current job, but reflecting back on it now I think that he had murder in his eyes. You'd be surprised how many people (of all faiths) don't actually know anything about the religion they claim to practice.
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May 24, 2017 21:26
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Blue Train posted:I'm down to remove religion totally
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May 24, 2017 21:27
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extra stout posted:im the moment where you realize page 70 is about to hit and none of the people who called the truth racist come back to apologize now that the suspect was in fact a muslim terrorist from a muslim terrorist family Everyone who hates Islam and Muslims is a racist. %100. You're all the same as Klansmen. And yet Islam is not a race, that's obvious. This fascinating paradox requires more study.
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May 24, 2017 21:28
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Agag posted:Franco-Prussian War 2.0!!! This time Switzerland takes alsace lorraine
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May 24, 2017 21:28
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Any updates on the explosion? I don't want to have to go through 70 pages of piss
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May 24, 2017 21:28
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spacetoaster posted:Not really. It's right there in the holy book. Yeah but the shias emphasize it more because it was a bigger problem for them because even in Muslim lands they could be under threat. The sunni take on it is largely that you shouldn't denounce your faith if its convenient, but if you're coerced or basically tortured into it, you won't be held accountable.
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May 24, 2017 21:29
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Luxury Communism posted:Hmm yes and their strategy for doing this is by trolling white people and making them even more neurotic lol. I'm torn between the media trying to damper the anger vs Actually trying to stoke race war Because it almost seems like both
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May 24, 2017 21:30
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Not so fast guys about removing religion totally. Many of the atheistic governments and countries of the 20th century committed horrible acts of genocide.
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May 24, 2017 21:30
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Jeza posted:People defend Islam as a whole because the religion is almost always just clothing for the reasons behind what people do. If the state of the world was topsy turvy and Christianity or any other mainstream but exclusionary religion was the minority, while there was an affluent Islamic status quo that occupied and generally interfered with the Christian homelands, there would probably be sects of radical Christians willing to martyr themselves in horrible ways too. Christians can never be the minority to Muslims because they'll already be dead by that point.
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May 24, 2017 21:30
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Over There posted:Any updates on the explosion? I don't want to have to go through 70 pages of piss it was a water pipe that burst
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May 24, 2017 21:30
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Snatch Duster posted:Not so fast guys about removing religion totally. Many of the atheistic governments and countries of the 20th century committed horrible acts of genocide. The solution is to remove the people. If you want to see the enemy, look in the mirror.
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May 24, 2017 21:32
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XxXCaptainNoxXxX posted:like what the gently caress do these people even think the crusades were initially about. politically expedient excuse for large governments to excuse wars the people might otherwise not have wanted? not to mention, unlike the muslim holy book, the new testament does not anywhere call for the violent conquering and forced conversion of non believers
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May 24, 2017 21:32
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your friend a dog posted:politically expedient excuse for large governments to excuse wars the people might otherwise not have wanted? not to mention, unlike the muslim holy book, the new testament does not anywhere call for the violent conquering and forced conversion of non believers The Old Testament just prescribed eradicating non-believers from the lands you needed - but who reads that part of the Bible anyway?
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May 24, 2017 21:34
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Testikles posted:The Old Testament just prescribed eradicating non-believers from the lands you needed - but who reads that part of the Bible anyway? New testament dog. Also the book of Mormon is God's latest attempt at solving humanity.
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May 24, 2017 21:35
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Testikles posted:The Old Testament just prescribed eradicating non-believers from the lands you needed - but who reads that part of the Bible anyway? People read it and acknowledge that it is dated.
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May 24, 2017 21:35
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Testikles posted:Yeah but the shias emphasize it more because it was a bigger problem for them because even in Muslim lands they could be under threat. The sunni take on it is largely that you shouldn't denounce your faith if its convenient, but if you're coerced or basically tortured into it, you won't be held accountable. You don't seem to know very much about this subject. Quran (16:106) Whoever disbelieved in Allah after his belief, except him who is forced thereto and whose heart is at rest with Faith but such as open their breasts to disbelief, on them is wrath from Allah, and theirs will be a great torment. Quran (9:3) And a declaration from Allah and His Messenger to mankind on the greatest day (the 10th of Dhul-Hijjah - the 12th month of Islamic calendar) that Allah is free from (all) obligations to the Mushrikun (see V.2:105) and so is His Messenger. So if you (Mushrikun) repent, it is better for you, but if you turn away, then know that you cannot escape (from the Punishment of) Allah. And give tidings (O Muhammad) of a painful torment to those who disbelieve. Quran (2:225) Allah will not call you to account for that which is unintentional in your oaths, but He will call you to account for that which your hearts have earned. And Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most-Forbearing. Sahih Bukhari (52:269) The Prophet said, "War is deceit." Sahih Bukhari (49:857) "He who makes peace between the people by inventing good information or saying good things, is not a liar."
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May 24, 2017 21:36
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Testikles posted:The Old Testament just prescribed eradicating non-believers from the lands you needed - but who reads that part of the Bible anyway? thats jews, not Christians???
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May 24, 2017 21:36
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Pawl posted:Christians can never be the minority to Muslims because they'll already be dead by that point. Liberalisation and tolerance is derived from power and stability. To me Christianity and Islam, while containing minor differences, are functionally the same thing. Obviously in this hypothetical world, things wouldn't be a perfect mirror, but I see no reason to assume that a rough parallel wouldn't emerge. History can show us a number of periods where Islam was a notably more tolerant religion than Christianity, and of course the reverse. It's one of life's little ironies that Jews were once more welcome in some segments of Islamic society than most Christian ones, for example.
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May 24, 2017 21:36
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Testikles posted:The Old Testament just prescribed eradicating non-believers from the lands you needed - but who reads that part of the Bible anyway? Jews. I'm pretty sure that's jewish stuff. 
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May 24, 2017 21:37
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Testikles posted:The Old Testament just prescribed eradicating non-believers from the lands you needed - but who reads that part of the Bible anyway? the jews don't have to read it because when they are spawned the hive queen imprints the memories of it into their data banks
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May 24, 2017 21:37
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Snatch Duster posted:New testament dog. Also the book of Mormon is God's latest attempt at solving humanity. I read it. I'm just saying he's acting like the New Testament exists in a vacuum. Jesus might have said that the things he said were the new rules, but people frequently go back to the Old Testament when they need a reason for something. The two testaments even come in the same book after all. I have no comment on the book of Mormon.
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May 24, 2017 21:38
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Jeza posted:To me Christianity and Islam, while containing minor differences, are functionally the same thing. Can you elaborate on how they're the same? Beyond believing in a "god"?
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May 24, 2017 21:38
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*liberals tear down Robert E Lee statues because of slavery* ''Islamaphobe! Slavery is just part of their culture and religion. How dare you judge them!" *forgets that General Lee never owned slaves*
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May 24, 2017 21:38
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