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That wrath would be really good except for the fact that the scary aggro threats are immune to sorcery-speed removal
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Jun 1, 2017 15:48
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Tainen posted:Hopefully that Samut is from the Planeswalker deck Collector number is 144/199, PW deckwalkers have a collector number thats higher than listed capacity (would be like 204/199) so this would be the regular Samut.
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Jun 1, 2017 15:48
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I can imagine a silly deck that just uses Samut + one of Standard's pseudo-proliferate effects to just slam out giant threats on turn 5.
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Jun 1, 2017 15:50
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Jabor posted:That wrath would be really good except for the fact that the scary aggro threats are immune to sorcery-speed removal
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Jun 1, 2017 15:50
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https://twitter.com/mtgaaron/status/869943977562198016 Who will win in the battle of "who in a high level position at wotc is more out of touch"? My money is still on you sam.
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Jun 1, 2017 15:55
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Sickening posted:https://twitter.com/mtgaaron/status/869943977562198016 How can anyone be that clueless that magic players like looking at magic decks for inspiration to give your company money.
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Jun 1, 2017 16:25
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DangerDongs posted:How can anyone be that clueless that magic players like looking at magic decks for inspiration to give your company money. Nah, you don't get it - The problem with Magic is that people solve formats way too fast, not that WotC keep printing bullshit threats and refuse to print good answers for them. Basically, you all are literally Satan for wanting deck lists and you should be ashamed of yourselves.
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Jun 1, 2017 16:33
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Netdecking scrubs
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Jun 1, 2017 16:34
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Jenx posted:Nah, you don't get it - The problem with Magic is that people solve formats way too fast, not that WotC keep printing bullshit threats and refuse to print good answers for them. Basically, you all are literally Satan for wanting deck lists and you should be ashamed of yourselves. Same but for Commander because gently caress having to build a 99 card list. I didn't even know Devout Witness existed but I sure as hell put it in Alesha.
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Jun 1, 2017 16:37
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Letting Seth datamine league results would kill Standard and probably also Modern, so in a sense Forsythe is not wrong. Just imagine MTGS, but every poster is suicidesteve calling everyone not playing Marvel idiots.
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Jun 1, 2017 16:41
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Siivola posted:Letting Seth datamine league results would kill Standard and probably also Modern, so in a sense Forsythe is not wrong. If ignorance is the only thing stopping standard and modern from being ruined they're already ruined
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Jun 1, 2017 16:46
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Siivola posted:Letting Seth datamine league results would kill Standard and probably also Modern, so in a sense Forsythe is not wrong. It didn't seem to kill Standard when they were using bots to watch every replay on MTGO and analyze the results. But Wizards asked them to stop anyway.
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Jun 1, 2017 16:47
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lockdar posted:I looks like Wizards leaked something by accident, you can find them here:
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Jun 1, 2017 16:49
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Sickening posted:https://twitter.com/mtgaaron/status/869943977562198016 I don't understand WotC's resistance to publishing data. Even if the issue is that they don't want to spend money on infrastructure or personnel for an API to get MTGO data, mtggoldfish was basically already doing that for free until they were told to stop. I'm guessing that their motive is that they don't want their game to be "solved" with perfect data but that's dumb because the pros already do their own data aggregation and metas inevitably reach an equilibrium anyway. That reminds me, the Metagame Analysis project I did turned out to work pretty well. I should post about it once I get home and have access to my PC with Mathematica on it. It's probably going to work best in Modern but since no real-world matchup data is publicly available it's not going to be particularly useful unless I can aggregate a bunch of data myself. 
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Jun 1, 2017 16:51
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Dehtraen posted:What's the right wording on the +2? I've seen people saying it is "non-land card" and others saying it is "creature card," if it is creature card that card will be busted vs the normal control decks in standard where they're running 4 creatures preboard and maybe 7 creatures post board - exile their lands, counters, draw spells and steal their finisher. Seems to say Non-land card.
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Jun 1, 2017 16:53
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So, was talking to my GF about potential uses for Samut. Double Season would make it so you can ult instantly, right? If so, Sorin Markov and Chandra Nalaar to win? Sorin sets them to 10 life, Chandra does 10 damage. Jace, Memory Adept and Ob Nixilis Reignited? Ob's ult makes them take damage when anyone draws, Jace makes them draw 20. Sarkhan Vol and Garruk Primal Hunter to get out a ton of 7/7 hasty wurms? Jace Memory Adept and Tamiyo, Field Researcher to play the top 23 cards of your library and your hand for free? I kind of want to try to make a janky combo deck out of this. Fantastic Alice fucked around with this message at 17:01 on Jun 1, 2017 |
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Jun 1, 2017 16:58
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TheKingofSprings posted:If ignorance is the only thing stopping standard and modern from being ruined they're already ruined  It's actually the price tag.
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Jun 1, 2017 17:01
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ThePeavstenator posted:I don't understand WotC's resistance to publishing data. Even if the issue is that they don't want to spend money on infrastructure or personnel for an API to get MTGO data, mtggoldfish was basically already doing that for free until they were told to stop. Old people sometimes have a hard time with dealing with time moving forward. I am sure he grumbles about the internet and anything else progressive in his life.
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Jun 1, 2017 17:04
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Sickening posted:Old people sometimes have a hard time with dealing with time moving forward. I am sure he grumbles about the internet and anything else progressive in his life. Sure, if you consider papers by John von Neumann or John Nash to be a new thing.
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Jun 1, 2017 17:14
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Cactrot posted:Seems to say Non-land card. I really want there to be a Grixis Control deck but A) The wrath not untapping lands gives opponents a chance to come back B) It being a sorcery also makes it miss some important threats C) This just gets played in Marvel instead
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Jun 1, 2017 17:19
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4c Marvel is going to be a thing... e: Especially if there's cheap black disruption in Hour.
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Jun 1, 2017 17:26
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ThePeavstenator posted:Sure, if you consider papers by John von Neumann or John Nash to be a new thing.
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Jun 1, 2017 17:26
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I'm probably crazy but this doesn't seem great in marvel to me. But then, I don't play standard
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Jun 1, 2017 17:35
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ThePeavstenator posted:I don't understand WotC's resistance to publishing data. Even if the issue is that they don't want to spend money on infrastructure or personnel for an API to get MTGO data, mtggoldfish was basically already doing that for free until they were told to stop. the funny thing is, the last time MTGO datamining was possible, during Khans Standard, the data showed a much more balanced format than the 'Siege Rhino OP' conventional wisdom narrative. pretty much every tier 1 & 2 deck was within a few % of 50% vs the field. The only exception was that the Sphinx's Tutelage mill deck that spiked a GP was basically unplayably bad (I think it was like 36% vs the field), and WotC made MTGGoldfish get rid of all their winrate data shortly after this came to light.
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Jun 1, 2017 17:40
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Dehtraen posted:What's the right wording on the +2? I've seen people saying it is "non-land card" and others saying it is "creature card," if it is creature card that card will be busted vs the normal control decks in standard where they're running 4 creatures preboard and maybe 7 creatures post board - exile their lands, counters, draw spells and steal their finisher. Nonland is enormously worse than creature in this instance, because it means his +2 doesn't necessarily protect himself. If it's creatures only, you can jam Bolas and your fail case is hitting a mana dork or some value idiot like Thraben Inspector - not exactly a backbreaking swing or a great use of seven mana, but at least they can jump in front of the God-Pharaoh and let you spin again next turn. With any noncreature spell you're running a very real risk of hitting complete air like Attune, and even a lot of good spells that won't put a body on board to protect your planeswalker. He also doesn't stabilize very well from behind. His minus kills most things, but it leaves him dangerously low on loyalty and a lot of the threats in this format don't give a poo poo about sorcery-speed removal, and he can't wipe the board. If I wanted a card like this, Big Chandra costs one less mana and seems like she does a better job at both stabilizing and consistently ending the game.
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Jun 1, 2017 17:44
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Yeah I'm pretty underwhelmed by Bolas, seems weaker than Karn despite the costing being a lot more prohibitive
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Jun 1, 2017 17:48
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TheKingofSprings posted:Yeah I'm pretty underwhelmed by Bolas, seems weaker than Karn despite the costing being a lot more prohibitive It's hugely weaker than Karn, to the point where it doesn't even warrant a direct comparison. You can't cast it on turn 3, and it doesn't have Karn's insane loyalty accumulation to let it function through pressure.
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Jun 1, 2017 17:53
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Elyv posted:I'm probably crazy but this doesn't seem great in marvel to me. But then, I don't play standard In comparison to Ulamog yeah it's not hot, but once that rotates out it seems pretty good tho i will allow that I might just want it to be good, rather then having any basis for fairly reasoining if it is good
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Jun 1, 2017 17:56
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Okay so first you resolve a Sweep Away on an attacking Ulamog and then–
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Jun 1, 2017 18:01
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It seems decent to me. The fact he can dome an opponent for 7 is nice, since you can take out opposing planeswalkers with it. If it's good enough in a Marvel/Ulamog world I have no idea, but those won't be in standard forever.
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Jun 1, 2017 18:02
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Voyager I posted:It's hugely weaker than Karn, to the point where it doesn't even warrant a direct comparison. You can't cast it on turn 3, and it doesn't have Karn's insane loyalty accumulation to let it function through pressure. Karn being castable on turn 3 is an anomaly that has very little to do with Karn's intrinsic merits. It's still a lot worse and honestly pretty disappointing after the hype. The wrath on the other hand is pretty exciting and I really like that they're playing around more in the early interaction space.
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Jun 1, 2017 18:03
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GoutPatrol posted:Is the Battle of Wits deck any good in throwback standard, or am I just going to get poo poo on all day? The Wits deck is reasonably consistent and it just wins some matchups. Slide in particular can't beat Battle of Wits.
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Jun 1, 2017 18:23
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TheKingofSprings posted:Karn being castable on turn 3 is an anomaly that has very little to do with Karn's intrinsic merits. "How fast can I power this out?" is one of the most important factors in card evaluation, and one of the inherent upsides to straight colorless cards is that they are really good at getting ramped into. Nobody is playing Karn one land at a time and he would be a bad card instead of a format staple if you couldn't get him out before your opponent had emptied their hand onto the board. Being in three colors, none of which are even green, makes Bolas even less of a Karn analogue.
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Jun 1, 2017 18:30
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Samut is pretty bad, Bolas is weird in that I think he's backbreaking on turn 4 but weak on turn 9, and that wrath is impossible to evaluate without knowing how much haste and vehicles are in the format.
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Jun 1, 2017 18:32
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I think that Wrath has the most potential in Modern.
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Jun 1, 2017 18:38
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mandatory lesbian posted:In comparison to Ulamog yeah it's not hot, but once that rotates out it seems pretty good Obviously it's worse than Ulamog, that's not the interesting question. The real question is if you play it over 6 mana Chandra, and my instinct is "no". Chandra doesn't require the token dip into black, comes down a turn earlier if you're hardcasting her, and wipes the board against zombies or other creature decks. Nicol Bolas is probably slightly better against control since he pressures their hand so well, but I can't imagine Chandra is bad there either. He seems quite a bit better against midrange because he actually kills a big threat, but I don't think there's really a midrange deck in standard ATM? Again though, I haven't played this standard at all so this is even more theorycrafty than most theorycrafting
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Jun 1, 2017 18:43
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Compared to Ugins power as a control card a few years ago, it seems fairly weak, and Ugin didn't even have any color requirements.
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Jun 1, 2017 18:44
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TheKingofSprings posted:I think that Wrath has the most potential in Modern. It does for sure. The problem is that it basically wants a deck that can cast it off artifacts.
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Jun 1, 2017 18:45
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The wrath costs 6+ mana, it's only better than a 'normal' wrath in situations where your opponent has dumped their whole hand on turns 1-3 and you need to sweep or die.Sickening posted:It does for sure. The problem is that it basically wants a deck that can cast it off artifacts. You still lose a turn's worth of mana regardless of how you cast it.
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Jun 1, 2017 18:47
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ThePeavstenator posted:Sure, if you consider papers by John von Neumann or John Nash to be a new thing. Hell, even the specific phenomenon of using the internet to solve Magic metagames has been around for 20+ years at this point.
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Jun 1, 2017 18:52
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