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What is the best flav... you all know what this question is: This poll is closed. |
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| Labour |
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907 | 49.92% |
| Theresa May Team (Conservative) |
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48 | 2.64% |
| Liberal Democrats |
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31 | 1.71% |
| UKIP |
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13 | 0.72% |
| Plaid Cymru |
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25 | 1.38% |
| Green |
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22 | 1.21% |
| Scottish Socialist Party |
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12 | 0.66% |
| Scottish Conservative Party |
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1 | 0.06% |
| Scottish National Party |
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59 | 3.25% |
| Some Kind of Irish Unionist |
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4 | 0.22% |
| Alliance / Irish Nonsectarian |
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3 | 0.17% |
| Some Kind of Irish Nationalist |
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36 | 1.98% |
| Misc. Far Left Trots |
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35 | 1.93% |
| Misc. Far Right Fash |
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8 | 0.44% |
| Monster Raving Loony |
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49 | 2.70% |
| Space Navies Party |
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39 | 2.15% |
| Independent / Single Issue |
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2 | 0.11% |
| Can't Vote |
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188 | 10.35% |
| Won't Vote |
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8 | 0.44% |
| Spoiled Ballot |
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15 | 0.83% |
| Pissflaps |
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312 | 17.17% |
| Total: | 1817 votes | ||
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Are we doing that thing where we pretend Corbyn would be anywhere near the leadership position let alone doing a good election if he was the kind of person to flip-flop on things as important as loving nuking people? Holy poo poo, some people are terminally dense
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Jun 2, 2017 23:30
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Vitamin P posted:For the first half he was eloquent, passionate and on a whole other level than May in terms of the depth, specificity and nuance of his answers. Even if someone was hostile they weren't able to express it because he had the room onside and the questions were flowing so smoothly. Yes, he didn't handle the question on Trident well and it allowed the audience and Dimbleby to really hammer him. I don't think anyone is disagreeing with you there. Most people don't think the entire election swung on it though.
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Jun 2, 2017 23:30
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Corbyn not answering is actually better than if he says "no I won't kill us all," because it's ambiguous enough that hypothetically no-one would chance it anyway. Unfortunately the optics of nuclear deterrance and the optics of appeasing jingoistic fuckwits with no real understanding of how second strikes work don't overlap very much.
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Jun 2, 2017 23:31
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OwlFancier posted:I did say I would prefer him to categorically and bluntly state that he wouldn't nuke anybody but I suspect you wouldn't be any happier with that answer I think we should have nukes and that our leaders should posture that they'll use them but actually write 'let france or some other ally decide' on that little letter/not make a retaliatory strike but honestly your answer there would have been better. At least then he could have moved on instead of wittering dishonestly on for 5 minutes getting visibly pissed off with the audience and poisoning the rest of the debate.
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Jun 2, 2017 23:32
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On second thought, nukes might be useful: https://twitter.com/iainmartin1/status/870759257607725056 Vitamin P posted:I think we should have nukes And that makes you a massive, massive, massive oval office
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Jun 2, 2017 23:32
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When I feel strongly about a candidate (e.g. Corbyn) the wins feel great but there's always the temptation to wallow and doomsay when they slip up a bit. In the grand scheme of things Corbyn's performance tonight isn't really going to matter that much. He was about on par with May in terms of answers, and the press coverage seems to more or less be saying that they both did about the same. In a couple of days time this'll be old news.
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Jun 2, 2017 23:34
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In regards to the poll, despite having 657 total votes cast the Misc. Far Right Fash are outgaining the Scottish Tories, but as is everyone else
ShaneMacGowansTeeth fucked around with this message at 23:37 on Jun 2, 2017 |
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Jun 2, 2017 23:35
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For a bit of perspective the Guardian is saying that while May gave a solid performance Corbyn had the better night. Yes, they're officially a Labour paper now, but they wouldn't be saying that if he had clearly been destroyed. EDIT: Looking around it's pretty much as you'd expect. Right-wing papers call it for May, left-leaning call it for Corbyn. Broadcasters largely call it a draw or praise the audience. jabby fucked around with this message at 23:41 on Jun 2, 2017 |
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Jun 2, 2017 23:36
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TheRat posted:On second thought, nukes might be useful: Just another reason to get Labour in charge because the Tories won't do it! Entropy238 posted:In a couple of days time this'll be old news. The loving election is in a couple of days. Vitamin P posted:I think we should have nukes and that our leaders should posture that they'll use them but actually write 'let france or some other ally decide' on that little letter/not make a retaliatory strike but honestly your answer there would have been better. Isn't that actually worse? Not just refusing to make a decision but passing it off onto someone else?
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Jun 2, 2017 23:36
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Bit surprised by the negativity in this thread. Explain to me, like an idiot, why it's so bad? He didn't even lose a lot of the audience over his answers. Unless everybody was watching a different show to me, one of the loudest rounds of applause that evening was the girl saying she was shocked at the murderous intent of the room. Far louder than all the  for May.
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Jun 2, 2017 23:38
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Entropy238 posted:When I feel strongly about a candidate (e.g. Corbyn) the wins feel great but there's always the temptation to wallow and doomsay when they slip up a bit. It's not really Corbz' responses that're getting me down, just realising/remembering that these selfish, bloodthirsty morons are everywhere.
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Jun 2, 2017 23:39
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namesake posted:The loving election is in a couple of days. Assuming someone can be swayed in the first place, I think political campaigns are more about how people form an impression of the candidate/party over a long period of time rather than any one event (unless that event is particularly egregious). Corbyn's still saying all the things he needs to say to GOTV.
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Jun 2, 2017 23:41
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Henry Black posted:Bit surprised by the negativity in this thread. Explain to me, like an idiot, why it's so bad? He didn't even lose a lot of the audience over his answers. Unless everybody was watching a different show to me, one of the loudest rounds of applause that evening was the girl saying she was shocked at the murderous intent of the room. Far louder than all the i think it's just because media has such a right wing slant that you kinda have to play it perfectly while may and tory scum can pretty much just do whatever and have excuses made for them.
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Jun 2, 2017 23:41
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Henry Black posted:Bit surprised by the negativity in this thread. Explain to me, like an idiot, why it's so bad? He didn't even lose a lot of the audience over his answers. Unless everybody was watching a different show to me, one of the loudest rounds of applause that evening was the girl saying she was shocked at the murderous intent of the room. Far louder than all the Probably because everyone in the thread's allowed themselves a small glimmer of hope and it's on such a complete knife edge they're terrified of any wobbles from our man Jezza. I kind of wish he'd been on first, just so that folk would be busier mulling over Theresa May's aftertaste rather than Jezza's small gaffe about not wanting to kill us all.
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Jun 2, 2017 23:41
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crispix posted:They post about us on other forums. I'm being serious :/ My opinions on pizza are famous, I'll have you know https://twitter.com/BevisSimpson/status/624638853215682560
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Jun 2, 2017 23:41
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^^That's some sort of very solid casserole served on a flatbread (needs to be a Yorkshire imo). Henry Black posted:Bit surprised by the negativity in this thread. Explain to me, like an idiot, why it's so bad? He didn't even lose a lot of the audience over his answers. Unless everybody was watching a different show to me, one of the loudest rounds of applause that evening was the girl saying she was shocked at the murderous intent of the room. Far louder than all the The actual course of the debate is extremely minor compared to the high and low points and the media coverage of those points. You give a solid performance but slip up once and it's the slip up that makes the news; that's why the Tories have always been against having straight debates since they gained power because they can lose so much so quickly. Corbyns handling of the nuclear weapon questions was definitely bad and reporting of that would expect to be one of the major points of the debate which ties into so much of the negative campaigning about him on defence that it'll potentially deal much more damage to him. Basically that woman is a national hero. namesake fucked around with this message at 23:44 on Jun 2, 2017 |
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Jun 2, 2017 23:41
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At least the clip on the BBC of that segment includes the girl at the end pointing out how psychopathic the jingoists trying to nail Corbyn over his lack of bloodlust are, and getting a loud ovation from the room.
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Jun 2, 2017 23:42
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Pochoclo posted:My opinions on pizza are famous, I'll have you know Me wrt your pizza opinions. 
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Jun 2, 2017 23:43
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TheRat posted:On second thought, nukes might be useful: If the youth are not properly educated they may vote Tory in future once they have enough money to start paying taxes on things they don't personally use. A Good Tweet. Henry Black posted:Bit surprised by the negativity in this thread. Explain to me, like an idiot, why it's so bad? He didn't even lose a lot of the audience over his answers. Unless everybody was watching a different show to me, one of the loudest rounds of applause that evening was the girl saying she was shocked at the murderous intent of the room. Far louder than all the some people had some hope for a bit but we've been punched in the face so many times by British politics that any feeling of hope can't last more than a week or so, and this thread can only deal in absolutes
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Jun 2, 2017 23:43
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Ardent Communist posted:well, i tend to occasionally talk up you mates on the rhizzone, so it's not like it's all hate. what's rhizzone like these days anyway? I seem to remember going to check it out and saw some charming post about how trans people should kill themselves which rather put me off but I hear it's nothing like that now?
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Jun 2, 2017 23:44
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Entropy238 posted:When I feel strongly about a candidate (e.g. Corbyn) the wins feel great but there's always the temptation to wallow and doomsay when they slip up a bit. TBH I shouldn't have tried to quit smoking at an election cause I just had a cheeky one in the garden and have absolutely been doing this. namesake posted:Isn't that actually worse? Not just refusing to make a decision but passing it off onto someone else? It's the ambiguity of it that I think is important. Outright saying you won't ever use one means it doesn't work for MAD anymore. Liu posted:i think it's just because media has such a right wing slant that you kinda have to play it perfectly while may and tory scum can pretty much just do whatever and have excuses made for them. Mr. Flunchy posted:It's not really Corbz' responses that're getting me down, just realising/remembering that these selfish, bloodthirsty morons are everywhere. This is what made me so angry. It's the combination of how May could just not say anything and it's fine, the right-wing press and their power, the braying jackals in the audience, my perception of how much tougher Dimbleby seemed to be on Corbs than May and the unforced error over something so irrelevant as the nukes spoiling what was looking like an amazing display from Corbyn.
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Jun 2, 2017 23:46
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Screw it, the time for negativity has passed.... mostly because I've run out of alcohol and need to go to bed. Anyway let's remember some of the positives that the British press occasionally provide: 
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Jun 2, 2017 23:47
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ShaneMacGowansTeeth posted:In regards to the poll, despite having 657 total votes cast the Misc. Far Right Fash are outgaining the Scottish Tories, but as is everyone else I'm not sure why the Scottish Tories have a separate category but Scottish Labour don't. Neither are separate parties. Only the Greens are actually a separate institution in Scotland afaik. Also that they've clearly not been called the Scottish Tories for a good year or so but the Ruth Davidson Opposing A Divisive Independence Referendum Ruth Davidson Party.
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Jun 2, 2017 23:48
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The nukes thing might not be as bad as it looks. 50% of the public do support keeping trident but some of them would probably be put off by the clear bloodlust shown by the audience and accept Corbyn's refusal to partake. The woman at the end did get a good reception afterall.
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Jun 2, 2017 23:52
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Irony Be My Shield posted:The nukes thing might not be as bad as it looks. 50% of the public do support keeping trident but some of them would probably be put off by the clear bloodlust shown by the audience and accept Corbyn's refusal to partake. The woman at the end did get a good reception afterall. I'd be curious about a poll of younger folks as to how they feel about it.
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Jun 2, 2017 23:53
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The British public want Watchmen to become a reality.
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Jun 2, 2017 23:55
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OwlFancier posted:I'd be curious about a poll of younger folks as to how they feel about it. I'd say it's like 50% "Who even uses nukes lol" and 50% "Nukes mean END OF THE WORLD, thus bad". I've not really met anyone who was rabidly pro-nuke who was under thirty, though I've met a few "final defence of the realm" types.
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Jun 2, 2017 23:55
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none of these things have really hurt labour all election because they have the numbers to own the debate on social media and whatnot afterwards. this will be the same
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Jun 2, 2017 23:55
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Irony Be My Shield posted:The nukes thing might not be as bad as it looks. 50% of the public do support keeping trident but some of them would probably be put off by the clear bloodlust shown by the audience and accept Corbyn's refusal to partake. The woman at the end did get a good reception afterall. Wanting nuclear weapons is an emotional response not a strategic one though, people will flip out over being challenged that the idea that the nuclear umbrella is actually bad. I'm completely loving serious that that audience member being brave enough to state the obvious about it causing millions of deaths is a national loving hero not just for the election results but offering an alternative voice of the public that people can reference in the future.
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Jun 2, 2017 23:55
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It's also pretty much the same story that came out of the Paxman interview and I don't think that was too damaging in the end.
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Jun 2, 2017 23:57
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It sounds so loving obvious, but do people just not get that a retaliatory strike would incinerate millions of entirely innocent civilians?
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Jun 2, 2017 23:58
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I don't see why it even matters, if anyone nuked us surely the US would instantly respond anyway!
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Jun 2, 2017 23:59
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Anidav posted:The British public want Watchmen to become a reality. A blue titan growing increasingly out of touch with reality, that no one can bring down, and that humanity would be much better without? Hmmm
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Jun 2, 2017 23:59
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The exit poll's released pretty much as soon as the polls close right? I know I asked this before, but I don't think I cared as much before this election and I need to know if I have to call in sick on the Friday because I've been up all night yelling at my TV
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Jun 2, 2017 23:59
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Mr. Flunchy posted:It sounds so loving obvious, but do people just not get that a retaliatory strike would incinerate millions of entirely innocent civilians? Emotional connectivity exponentially decreases with each extra case of suffering. Being responsible for nuking millions of people is probably less traumatic to most people than the thought of ordering the death of a single person.
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Jun 3, 2017 00:01
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Do people normally troll Daily Mail comments? Out of morbid curiosity I scrolled down after reading their version of events and, like
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Jun 3, 2017 00:04
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None of tomorrows papers are running anything about the debate, I suppose it finished too late to get anything out in time?
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Jun 3, 2017 00:04
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Vitamin P posted:Do people normally troll Daily Mail comments? Out of morbid curiosity I scrolled down after reading their version of events and, like People comment contrarily, lefty articles attract the right, the heil attracts a weird smattering of sane people. Comments generally disagree with the article. Vaska is probably getting downvoted for being an unelected brussels eurocrat 
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Jun 3, 2017 00:06
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minema posted:None of tomorrows papers are running anything about the debate, I suppose it finished too late to get anything out in time? That means that if Labour are smart and lucky, they can bury it altogether. Especially since it's being treated as a draw, and those are boring.
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Jun 3, 2017 00:07
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minema posted:I don't see why it even matters, if anyone nuked us surely the US would instantly respond anyway! This is kind of the the real deal point for me. The actual deterrence protecting the UK is the US nuclear arsenal. If there is ever a situation where the US is unwilling to protect the UK under their nuclear umbrella then the UK is hosed anyway because the UKs arsenal is dependent on US support to remain operational.
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Jun 3, 2017 00:07
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