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Neo Rasa posted:Weird it's almost like superheroes are stand-ins for something. Wonder Woman isn't, conventionally, a stand-in for Akhilleus or Agamemnon or Herakles or Odysseus or Telemakhus. Indeed, Marston's version sets her as entirely distinct from those heroes, Perez's version places her as directly opposed to them, etc.
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Jun 5, 2017 23:59
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What has become clear with this movie is that people didn't have trouble with Batman killing after all. They simply resented Dawn of Justice for not painting a cheery veneer on the power fantasy. Someone who genuinely wanted to free the troops from the corrupting influence of Ares would do everything in their power to avoid harming them. This movie glorifies her wanton carnage in Snyder-esque slow-motion (remember when people complained about such things?). Diana only sides with Steve because he fought beside her on the beach. If a German had washed up on shore and fought with her against the British, she'd have been running in the opposite direction through No Man's Land (the correct direction, it turns out). There is no morality in this film. Just fighting for the sake of winning.
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Jun 6, 2017 00:04
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notthegoatseguy posted:I think Ant-Man was still very much an Edgar Wright film. Admittedly it could be because it was so far along and practically right before shooting maybe they didn't have a choice. And yeah Jenkins may have been a good fit for Thor 2...but at least it meant we got less Portman? I like Portman as an actor but she's just kind of there in both Thor films. Oh yeah I agree 100% (with the caveat that Portman being "just kinda there" might've been fixed if Jenkins had stayed on) just pointing out that it happens everywhere. Executives do dumb rear end poo poo all the time in the name of what they think will work. Marvel has the advantage in the Feige seems to have his finger on the pulse in ways that other film studios don't, but there's still bad decisions to be made all around, and I usually side with the artist. It's just super rare we get to see such a direct and unambiguous example in the form of a scene they didn't want but did get shot and was amazing (at least with the decisions I criticized for Marvel, they're "what-if" scenarios that can't really be proven).
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Jun 6, 2017 00:05
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Whatever happened to the German Destroyer that blundered into Themacyra along with all the German troops that got massacred? Why did Zeus plop that island down in the Mediterranean where countless cultures would inevitably blunder onto it via sea trade routes? He's a Motherfucking God, he could have put the island on the south pole or somewhere else prohibitively remote. Freaking Skull Island was harder to find for Christ sakes.
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Jun 6, 2017 00:18
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Panfilo posted:Whatever happened to the German Destroyer that blundered into Themacyra along with all the German troops that got massacred? Thread believes that all the crew on board joined with the beach assault and died.
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Jun 6, 2017 00:23
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Panfilo posted:Whatever happened to the German Destroyer that blundered into Themacyra along with all the German troops that got massacred? It's listing in the background when the crew is rowing ashore, presumably they hit a shoal and had nowhere else to go.
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Jun 6, 2017 00:25
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How did the German destroyer let a boat with a sail escape the island? There's so many plot holes.
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Jun 6, 2017 00:27
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Tenzarin posted:How did the German destroyer let a boat with a sail escape the island? There's so many plot holes. They didn't, they were chasing an airplane at the time.
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Jun 6, 2017 00:29
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Panfilo posted:Why did Zeus plop that island down in the Mediterranean where countless cultures would inevitably blunder onto it via sea trade routes? As we're told a little earlier, Diana growing in power will make her easier for Ares to find. So, right after she does that big energy blast, Ares's war finds the island. It's not the sort of place you just stumble upon.
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Jun 6, 2017 00:57
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Speaking of Zeus, who caught the bull observing Diana break into the armory?
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Jun 6, 2017 01:01
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Good thing the old gods are dead, bring on the NEW GODS (tm)!
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Jun 6, 2017 01:24
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Whoever knew Harry Greyson-Williams had a brother who could write great music for movies?
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Jun 6, 2017 02:12
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I don't know, I thought the music was a little cloying and on the nose in several areas
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Jun 6, 2017 02:35
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Unsourced "production tidbits"quote:WB originally planned to release the movie after JUSTICE LEAGUE.
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Jun 6, 2017 03:10
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Oh man Sean Bean would have been amazing.
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Jun 6, 2017 03:17
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Focus groups, bah.
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Jun 6, 2017 03:19
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There's no way that original ending was not Zack Snyder because in BvS that is exactly what is going on with Wonder Woman, she's become disillusioned.
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Jun 6, 2017 03:19
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I wonder how the original ending was written. If it was the same and they just added the stuff at the end or if it was completely different. One way does not favors for the character, another does no favors for humankind. I guess people don't like hearing how lovely we can be to each other. I think that's something should and needs to be explored more in our entertainment.
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Jun 6, 2017 03:22
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"After negative results from test-screenings, a new ending was added in reshoots where Diana remains protective of humanity throughout the years." Did I miss something? I don't recall seeing this at all. The little ending scene takes place after BvS so it makes sense she's back in the game. What was there to indicate she did superhero poo poo in the meantime?
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Jun 6, 2017 03:28
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Jose Oquendo posted:"After negative results from test-screenings, a new ending was added in reshoots where Diana remains protective of humanity throughout the years." they don't mean "protective" as in "she goes out and helps people" they mean it as in "well I think people are still good" which is ironic considering Bruce Wayne gives a remarkably similar speech to her at the end of BvS which is when she mentions her sabbatical, which I guess is just going to be ignored.
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Jun 6, 2017 03:36
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Possibly they mean the frame story was added later, because the ending is exactly as they describe the original to be.
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Jun 6, 2017 03:38
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Brainiac Five posted:Possibly they mean the frame story was added later, because the ending is exactly as they describe the original to be. nah, I think the original one is more Wonder Woman leaving the world of man in disgust at how lovely we all are instead of being sad about Steve Trevor but talking about the power of love *blingee blingee blingee*
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Jun 6, 2017 03:40
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Jose Oquendo posted:"After negative results from test-screenings, a new ending was added in reshoots where Diana remains protective of humanity throughout the years." When I saw the end scene I got the impression that she realized after the war that people had both dark and light in them and because of that she had to protect them. Basically retconing that this was a realization in BvS.
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Jun 6, 2017 04:01
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Yeah the BvS ending is clearly still canon, they just obscure it by having modern-day Diana narrate over past Diana's predicament.
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Jun 6, 2017 04:03
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Has there been talk about what they might do in a sequel, as seems likely? Would they want to jump right to the present or move up through the ages or what?
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Jun 6, 2017 04:14
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Maxwell Lord posted:Has there been talk about what they might do in a sequel, as seems likely? Would they want to jump right to the present or move up through the ages or what? I saw an article where Jenkins said that she wanted it in America, but hadn't yet decided if it would be set in the present or the past. Of course, it's early days. That could totally change.
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Jun 6, 2017 04:17
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Anything to get away from bad German accents is ok with me. And some of the German characters didn't even have accents. It was oddly inconsistent.
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Jun 6, 2017 04:21
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Vegetable posted:Anything to get away from bad German accents is ok with me. And some of the German characters didn't even have accents. It was oddly inconsistent. I'm pretty sure the thinking was that Germans are automatically assumed to speak German even if they're speaking English due to the translation effect, but Steve speaks English so when he switches to speak German it has to be indicated by an accent shift.
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Jun 6, 2017 04:30
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Is it too much to hope for that they give us another Zod-like villain for Diane to fight like he and Superman did? To date, the anything involving the kryptonians in Man of Steel are some of the best action sequences in any of the superhero films. Now I imagine that sort of power behind a character who actually knows how to fight. Icing is that Zod was a really good villain who was a presence throughout the entire film too.
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Jun 6, 2017 04:32
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Charlz Guybon posted:When I saw the end scene I got the impression that she realized after the war that people had both dark and light in them and because of that she had to protect them. Basically retconing that this was a realization in BvS. Diana Prince: A hundred years ago I walked away from mankind — from a century of horrors. Man made a world where standing together is impossible. Bruce Wayne: Men are still good. We fight. We kill. We betray one another. But we can rebuild. We can do better. We will. We have to. At the end of WW, Diana basically says exactly what Bruce says here, but in a lot more words.
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Jun 6, 2017 04:41
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DC Murderverse posted:Diana Prince: A hundred years ago I walked away from mankind — from a century of horrors. Man made a world where standing together is impossible. Of course, she's saying that after that conversation.
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Jun 6, 2017 04:56
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Saw it today, it's good. My 6 year old daughter loves Wonder Woman now and won't stop hummin "Is She With You". Although that has to have a different name now, right?
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Jun 6, 2017 05:12
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If I mostly liked this movie but was bothered by how many people Diana killed can I still hate the Snyder movies for being complete trash?
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Jun 6, 2017 05:14
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Brainiac Five posted:Of course, she's saying that after that conversation. That is true, but they really needed to make that clearer. I didn't make that connection until someone (you maybe?) actually brought it up in here. I wish she had said something about "sacrifice" rather than "love" because the latter, combined with Steve telling her that he loves her before he goes off to die, kinda conflates romantic love with love for humanity, which can be related but are definitely two separate things here. The notable thing about Steve Trevor is not that he loved Diana (because she definitely felt loved when she was on Themyscara, even if it wasn't romantic love),it was the sacrifice he made despite being a human and despite the negative tendencies of mankind that Diana was awakened to over the course of the movie. That sacrifice directly correlates to Superman's sacrifice at the end of BvS, but because they show us exactly what Steve's last words to Diana were ("I love you"), and Diana talks about love in her big wrap-up speech, it doesn't really jive with her loving off for 100 years until Superman comes into the picture. One mention of her coming back into the picture because she saw the same selfless heroism in Superman that she saw in Steve Trevor all those years ago and it would completely jive with what she says in BvS. edit: what *really* would have wrapped it up perfectly is Diana going away because she sees what goes on in Germany post WWI and sees that humanity really hadn't changed despite Ares' death and Steve's sacrifice, and she becomes disillusioned. DC Murderverse fucked around with this message at 05:22 on Jun 6, 2017 |
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Jun 6, 2017 05:19
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DC Murderverse posted:That is true, but they really needed to make that clearer. I didn't make that connection until someone (you maybe?) actually brought it up in here. I wish she had said something about "sacrifice" rather than "love" because the latter, combined with Steve telling her that he loves her before he goes off to die, kinda conflates romantic love with love for humanity, which can be related but are definitely two separate things here.
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Jun 6, 2017 05:39
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Jimbot posted:Is it too much to hope for that they give us another Zod-like villain for Diane to fight like he and Superman did? To date, the anything involving the kryptonians in Man of Steel are some of the best action sequences in any of the superhero films. Now I imagine that sort of power behind a character who actually knows how to fight. Icing is that Zod was a really good villain who was a presence throughout the entire film too. Well Zod's sub commander Faora was sucked into the Phantom Zone at the end of MoS, so theoretically if someone could create a portal to the PZ she could return.
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Jun 6, 2017 05:41
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Charlz Guybon posted:They also wanted to leave it ambiguous so they can have a sequel in the time gap if they want. This is understandable. Charlz Guybon posted:I'm pretty sure that they purposely removed explicity linking it to Superman's sacrifice in BvS because the audience didn't like that. This is totally loving stupid (not you, the people who took it out). It makes so much sense in the story that it feels like a missing piece when they don't acknowledge it. test audiences are dumbasses.
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Jun 6, 2017 05:43
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DC Murderverse posted:This is understandable. It gives Wonder Woman more agency if she figures it out by herself though. That's a good thing I think.
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Jun 6, 2017 05:45
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Hollismason posted:She probably can. She levitates at the end of the film If she could she would do it in Batman vs Superman. Maxwell Lord posted:Has there been talk about what they might do in a sequel, as seems likely? Would they want to jump right to the present or move up through the ages or what? Jumping through the ages would be the best option since having Diana gently caress off for a century while the world goes to poo poo makes her kind of a terrible hero/ambassador of love and friendship in the grand scheme of things compared to her other versions.
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Jun 6, 2017 06:06
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Didn't the Entente use poison gas to the same extend the Germans did? Anyway, good to see a few Krauts getting shot, it makes the world a better place.
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Jun 6, 2017 07:29
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