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The Dems are becoming more centrist because the Replubican party is as weak as ever. Most voters vote by straight party lines, especially in the smaller local elections. So the Dems see a chance to capture a large block of Repulican voters and take it. Its the nature of politics.
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Jun 6, 2017 14:09
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Jesus Christ, it's like a bunch of battered wives in here. You get to hold your politicians to a high standard. And sorry, not voting does not count as a vote for the other party. That's the biggest line of bullshit I've ever heard, and that's coming from someone who swallowed his pride and voted for the centrist war hawk (and regrets it deeply.) How the democrats were unable to see this was a year for radicalism is beyond me. How their more vocal supporters are still crowing on that "no vote is a vote for the enemy!" poo poo after they spent a year alienating those with principles and forcing Queen Hillary down our throats is beyond me. No one else would have lost to trump. No one.
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Jun 6, 2017 14:14
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and the notion that democrats are some kind of civil rights heroes is entirely laughable. The two parties ARE exactly the same. Republicans just don't bother hiding their disdain for the poor, the black, and the trans
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Jun 6, 2017 14:16
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TXT BOOTY7 2 47474 posted:and the notion that democrats are some kind of civil rights heroes is entirely laughable. The two parties ARE exactly the same. Republicans just don't bother hiding their disdain for the poor, the black, and the trans So which party is trying to kill everyone while screaming gently caress YOU? No vote is a vote for the enemies. It's mathematics.
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Jun 6, 2017 14:29
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King Vidiot posted:Fine, democrats aren't nearly as bad as republicans, but they're still not good enough. They're bad, just not "as bad as". Saying that they're not doing nearly enough to represent their base is a good and legitimate point, because it's true. It's when you start getting into BOTH SIDES ARE EUQALLY BAD TRUTH IS IN THE MIDDLE TWO WINGS SAME BIRD bullshit that people will start rolling their eyes and telling you to gently caress off. oohhboy posted:They are good enough when they are your only realistic choice in the system you have. How hard is this for all the hand wriggling people to understand? Not voting for Democrat means one more vote in favour of the Republicans. The democrats are not perfect but they represent you far, far better than any Republican. So basically, what you're saying that people should encourage complacency and mediocrity and not demand better of their elected officials, because this turd sausage sandwich might be made of poo poo, but it's not as bad as the diarrhea sloppy joe that the other guys are gonna force feed you. quote:If you want to change policy, write letters, attend meetings and if you have the resources, run for office under their flag so you can change things from the inside. 
raditts fucked around with this message at 14:56 on Jun 6, 2017 |
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Jun 6, 2017 14:49
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oohhboy posted:Not really, *sort of*. It is a natural response to being attacked. I don't think the rationale was good then and it isn't good now.
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Jun 6, 2017 14:59
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Watching Oliver get super frustrated having to explain the dumb poo poo Trump does and says is how I feel about people who blindly follow him. Just listen to that shithead for 10 minutes, he can't even form a complete sentence and it infuriates me.
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Jun 6, 2017 15:09
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Servaetes posted:I don't think the rationale was good then and it isn't good now. Don't tell me you have never wished death upon someone who have wronged you as that would be a lie.
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Jun 6, 2017 15:23
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Invalid Validation posted:Watching Oliver get super frustrated having to explain the dumb poo poo Trump does and says is how I feel about people who blindly follow him. Just listen to that shithead for 10 minutes, he can't even form a complete sentence and it infuriates me. Donald Trump has early stage dementia. It's the only way I can understand why he just strays from thought to thought like that. It reminds me of my grandmother not too long before hers got really bad and her home was foreclosed because she forgot about the mortgage entirely and thought the bills were from con artists. Conversely she also fell for a lot of real cons. It's all so drat frustrating. Afro fucked around with this message at 16:10 on Jun 6, 2017 |
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Jun 6, 2017 16:08
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oohhboy posted:Don't tell me you have never wished death upon someone who have wronged you as that would be a lie. Sure, I have and everyone does but most people don't sit there endlessly fantasizing about it because it is extremely weird to dwell on murderous thoughts.
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Jun 6, 2017 16:13
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Servaetes posted:Sure, I have and everyone does but most people don't sit there endlessly fantasizing about it because it is extremely weird to dwell on murderous thoughts. Cough. coyo7e posted:I've never actively wished for the death of my president before.. Is this what people felt like with Obama? Except for their entire premise being "a black man is President" of course, rather than a corrupt, incompetent, and possibly mentally ill white dude. You read "Wish death upon" and forgot about the rest. Yes he is really dwelling on it I swear! gently caress Donald, him wreaking the country is a pretty good reason.
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Jun 6, 2017 16:20
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oohhboy posted:Not really, *sort of*. It is a natural response to being attacked. Also I see a big difference between literally desiring to murder someone, and wishing that they'd just fall in a hole and never be mentioned again. I can wish my neighbor's obnoxious dog would go away, or my neighbor, but I'm not going to plot and fantasize about killing him and his dog, post up signs with pictures of dead dogs on it, etc. Trump has literally been a cancer in America and American culture for his entire life, and I don't feel any need to lynch an effigy of him or find a bunch of armed people to drink beer and shoot guns and trade wishful fantasies about killing him. Obama came out onto the national stage rapidly and seemingly from nowhere unless you were really into Chicago's community action scene or went to school with him or something, and the amount of pure, unaldulterated bile that was immediately directed at him was truly shocking. Kathy Griffin's a lovely comic who probably thinks that everything she says and feels is some kind of performance art piece, and even when it literally is performance art, but she can't handle the heat and criticism. It's like Andy Dick, if he kept breaking down and apologizing on national for every lovely thing he says and does.
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Jun 6, 2017 16:45
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oohhboy posted:Remember who gave you ACA(Shame for missing single payer by one rear end in a top hat, my condolences)? Remember who pulled you out of the economy crashing and bringing back to some semblance of health? Who have been making it easier for immigrants? Who is not proposing tax breaks to the rich or not paying their fair share by giving tax holidays? LGBT community? Who raised USA's standing in the world? Helped wildlife. Net neutrality. I can't recall the exact figures but they are ridiculous, something like 98% of the income gains during the "recovery" went to to the top 10% of earners. Many of the millions of new jobs are pure poo poo with no benefits or part time or some other horseshit that exploits people. Guess who made the ridiculous Bush tax cuts PERMANENT? LGBT are better off, ok. Gets peace prize, starts bombing and sending special forces to 5 more countries on top of the 2 wars you already had. Obama was the best Republican president of the last decades, I'll grant you that.
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Jun 6, 2017 16:50
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It's a shame we're in the information age because I feel a fitting old timey punishment to happen to Trump would be to have his name stricken from the history books and every likeness destroyed and nobody allowed to mention him for a few generations. I think it should be frowned upon to "wish death" on him, especially since it's a situation where someone less stupid and just as evil could fill the vacuum.
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Jun 6, 2017 16:59
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Vodos posted:Obama pushed to kill the public option (which was only talked about to placate actual liberals) and single player was never, ever on the table. The Dem leadership would rather eat a plate of actual poo poo than come out in favor of single payer. I will give you that. The US is crazy right compared where it use to be or any on scale. Make no mistake your centre is to the right. Nixon would be called a leftist pig or their Golden Boy Reagan wouldn't be far enough for Republicans. In a different time Obama would have been a Republican given the policies he implemented. I do think however he was naive as to his dealings with the Republicans and that was his undoing as he expected good faith and it never came.
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Jun 6, 2017 17:05
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My view on the Democrats right now is quite simple. They have their weaknesses and in a system that made third parties an actual possibility then it would easy to just vote for them and make the Democrats work to win back your vote. The issue though is that beyond the lack of third party success is that the Republicans are just so loving awful. So as people have said the only real option is to try and reform the Democrats from within through primaries and stuff like that, whilst in the general election do all that can be done to support the Dems. As even if the democrats don't change, I much prefer a party that seems to have some interest in a working government that is at worst passively screwing over the country then one that is actively making everything worse.Ra Ra Rasputin posted:It's a shame we're in the information age because I feel a fitting old timey punishment to happen to Trump would be to have his name stricken from the history books and every likeness destroyed and nobody allowed to mention him for a few generations. I much prefer his name become a synonym for incompetence and stupidity to the point that it lasts well after he dies.
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Jun 6, 2017 17:05
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coyo7e posted:I've never actively wished for the death of my president before.. Is this what people felt like with Obama? Except for their entire premise being "a black man is President" of course, rather than a corrupt, incompetent, and possibly mentally ill white dude. I occasionally have that same thought, but then I remember Pence. I hate Trump as much as the next guy but I'd take a bullet for him to keep Pence away from the big chair.
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Jun 6, 2017 17:05
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Azhais posted:I occasionally have that same thought, but then I remember Pence. I hate Trump as much as the next guy but I'd take a bullet for him to keep Pence away from the big chair. As someone that doesn't really know anything about Pence, why is that?
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Jun 6, 2017 17:18
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oohhboy posted:So which party is trying to kill everyone while screaming gently caress YOU? A reminder that Churchill allied with Stalin to defeat Hitler  When you're facing an existential threat to the stability of your democracy, you don't get to whinge about how the people on your team aren't perfect.
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Jun 6, 2017 17:24
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See your points are fair, sure, but it's your perspective. Trump is evil, Obama shining beacon, etc. Some folks think the opposite. I know you're not a crazy idiot and the other guy thinks I'm really trying to call you out but I'm just saying like it is weird to wish ill on people. It's not a very productive thing for people to do. I think you might be inflating a guy that is inarguably a jackass to being something way more. As for Kathy Griffith I dunno what the hell she was thinking. It's hilarious this exploding in her face because while people do not like Trump they don't take pictures holding a mockup of his severed head covered in blood because like I said, people are generally pretty reasonable!
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Jun 6, 2017 17:35
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Pence is a gigantic piece of poo poo with horrible policies. However. Pence is less likely to get us into a nuclear conflict. Pence would not leak intelligence to other countries because he wants to brag. Pence is not installing family members at all levels of of government. Pence likely could look past his own ego enough to staff the government properly. Pence doesn't have anywhere near the conflict of interest on a domestic and global stage that could influence policy. Basically, president pence would do a lot of things that I wouldn't agree with and I would think were immoral, but he would likely do it within the established framework of government. He can be negotiated with. He at least as a sliver of capacity to listen to an opposing viewpoint or consider evidence. He would have a terrible agenda and legacy, but we would likely be able to recover. I don't think we would be able to recover from 4 years of Trump. Society and our standing in the world will be set on a path that can't be reversed, at least not in our lifetimes.
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Jun 6, 2017 17:35
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Donald Trump is proof that sometimes the world is unfair and just doesn't give a gently caress what you do. He was stupid and incompetent and kept sinking everything he was involved with, and somehow he failed forward, never losing his wealth and getting into the highest office in the country. He commits crimes, but everything gets deflected between lawyers and boys' clubs. He eats horribly and never exercises, and still he lives to 70 with no real signs that death is imminent. There's even a lot of people who are convinced that he has good hair. If the world was fair, he'd be long dead in a prison cell by this point. Of course, with some of the things coming out about the Russian connection, you could put together an interesting case about treason and seek the death penalty, but y'know, unfair world.
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Jun 6, 2017 17:37
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Servaetes posted:See your points are fair, sure, but it's your perspective. Trump is evil, Obama shining beacon, etc. Some folks think the opposite. I know you're not a crazy idiot and the other guy thinks I'm really trying to call you out but I'm just saying like it is weird to wish ill on people. It's not a very productive thing for people to do. I think you might be inflating a guy that is inarguably a jackass to being something way more. You did call him out. You are calling him out right now. He is the President of the US of A, you can't inflate him more than that. Kathy Griffith should have stuck to it. It was her deplorable moment and she flinched.
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Jun 6, 2017 17:42
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Dante80 posted:As someone that doesn't really know anything about Pence, why is that? Here's a Reddit thread that documents the various ways in which he was a terrible governor and all around croneyistic lizard man. It helped me shed light on why it's not just as easy as telling Trump to take a long walk off a short pier
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Jun 6, 2017 17:54
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oohhboy posted:You did call him out. You are calling him out right now. I don't think Trump is the literal embodiment of evil, a blight on humanity that has plagued us since time immemorial. Stupid yes, potentially dangerous given position of power yes, darkness incarnate no, herald of the apocalypse, no, the last president because we're all gonna die no. He's a jackass, and if things go the way they are with the Russian thing he might be gone sooner! Servaetes fucked around with this message at 17:58 on Jun 6, 2017 |
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Jun 6, 2017 17:55
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oohhboy posted:You did call him out. You are calling him out right now. Honestly I hadn't even seen the picture until after I'd heard about all the controversy and I was underwhelmed. Is that really what people got so upset about? It was like a paper maché head covered in red paint. From the way people were describing it I thought it would be something like the severed head from Tropic Thunder.
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Jun 6, 2017 18:02
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Servaetes posted:I don't think Trump is the literal embodiment of evil, a blight on humanity that has plagued us since time immemorial. Stupid yes, potentially dangerous given position of power yes, darkness incarnate no, herald of the apocalypse, no, the last president because we're all gonna die no. He's a jackass, and if things go the way they are with the Russian thing he might be gone sooner! You are way pass "potentially dangerous". He has managed to turn everyone including the allies against him and by extension the US with one announcement. They are talking about banning Trump from the UK again. Europe has gone gently caress you rear end in a top hat. He has lit the fuse on the few stable countries in the middle east that contain your own HQ in it. That's just the big stuff from the past week. If you want more here is a link: https://whatthefuckjusthappenedtoday.com/ If anything you are understating the damage he has already done and will do. The Cheshire Cat posted:Honestly I hadn't even seen the picture until after I'd heard about all the controversy and I was underwhelmed. Is that really what people got so upset about? It was like a paper maché head covered in red paint. From the way people were describing it I thought it would be something like the severed head from Tropic Thunder. That would have been much cooler. Maybe she should have added a pike for added flavour. I was disappointed too.
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Jun 6, 2017 18:09
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He hasn't really demonstrated evil as much as he's demonstrated severe ignorance and ineptitude. One of the amazing things about Bush-era Republicans was communication. They could convince 98% of the country to help the wealthiest 2% by calling something a Death Tax or something. They were masters at making a Society For The Preservation Of Nature that was actually clubbing baby seals or some poo poo. Almost everything people hate about this administration revolves around poor communication. Unable to handle secrets like secrets. Spouting nonsense spontaneously on Twitter. Actually yelling on Twitter about what Justice Dept should do at the Supreme Court when the man could just pick up a secure line and call Sessions directly. I'm less bothered by him than anyone who continues to support him now, just because they seem to be a fraction of Midwesterners who want the rest of the country to feel hot and bothered and annoyed.
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Jun 6, 2017 18:34
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A lot of Bush's administration BS got sweep under 9/11 as it was cover for just about everything they did. What they were doing was obviously evil but as you said they buttered it up good. Post 9/11 the world gave them one free shot and they blew it by going into Iraq. If they just stuck to Afghanistan I believe that America would have had pulled out a win. But nope. Osama won big.
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Jun 6, 2017 18:47
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I remember when Dick Cheney shot his friend in the face and made his friend apologize and was like "yo dats p gangster, but also this is the end of political integrity, it really can't get worse." LoL Bust Rodd fucked around with this message at 21:37 on Jun 6, 2017 |
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Jun 6, 2017 21:28
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Servaetes posted:He's a jackass, and if things go the way they are with the Russian thing he might be gone sooner! I for one can't wait for the inauguration of President Mike Pence if/when this happens. That's definitely totally 100% going to be an improvement 
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Jun 6, 2017 23:23
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Dragonatrix posted:I for one can't wait for the inauguration of President Mike Pence if/when this happens. Depends on if he got wrapped up in any of Trump's bullshit before the election and if that comes to light. If he did, and it does, President Paul Ryan will take the stand. Can we just get a do over for this election I think we should just get a do over
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Jun 6, 2017 23:26
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Just stage an armed revolution already and burn your hosed up pastiche of a democratic system to the ground for the sake of the rest of the world. Thanks.
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Jun 7, 2017 00:47
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Afro posted:Donald Trump has early stage dementia. It's the only way I can understand why he just strays from thought to thought like that. It reminds me of my grandmother not too long before hers got really bad and her home was foreclosed because she forgot about the mortgage entirely and thought the bills were from con artists. Conversely she also fell for a lot of real cons. It's all so drat frustrating. I watch Dr Phil in the afternoons because I love watching afternoon garbage, and he had Shelley Duvall on not too long ago and the way trump was just randomly jumping topics based on word association sounded loving exactly like her. His brain is loving oatmeal.
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Jun 7, 2017 01:48
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Woebin posted:Just stage an armed revolution already and burn your hosed up pastiche of a democratic system to the ground for the sake of the rest of the world. Thanks. At what point would the rest of the world be justified in invading for regime change? Although I don't know if the world is ready for that level of irony.
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Jun 7, 2017 01:51
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The Cheshire Cat posted:Honestly I hadn't even seen the picture until after I'd heard about all the controversy and I was underwhelmed. Is that really what people got so upset about? It was like a paper maché head covered in red paint. From the way people were describing it I thought it would be something like the severed head from Tropic Thunder. Same reaction I had when I first saw it a couple days afterward. As I've said before, if there is one critical weakness of the left, it's that they let the right control the dialogue and make up the language. Thus you wind up with poo poo like this where right wingers hypocritically clutch their pearls and transform into fainting goats, and the left rushes to their defense to absolutely no benefit to themselves.
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Jun 7, 2017 01:59
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Dragonatrix posted:I for one can't wait for the inauguration of President Mike Pence if/when this happens. He'll be the first religious fanatic president to have a white horse ride in on him to his inauguration.
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Jun 7, 2017 02:40
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BIG HEADLINE posted:He'll be the first religious fanatic president to have a white horse ride in on him to his inauguration. Only if it's a stallion. If it's a mare Mrs. Pence has to be there to make sure there's no hanky panky.
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Jun 7, 2017 05:01
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TXT BOOTY7 2 47474 posted:Jesus Christ, it's like a bunch of battered wives in here. You get to hold your politicians to a high standard. And sorry, not voting does not count as a vote for the other party. That's the biggest line of bullshit I've ever heard, and that's coming from someone who swallowed his pride and voted for the centrist war hawk (and regrets it deeply.) Not voting is effectively reinforcing whichever candidate is in the lead. If you voted for the opponent you'd be helping them and hurting the former. Think of it this way: let's say Trump has the lead over Clinton by one vote, and you & one other person are the only two votes left uncast. If you two do nothing, or vote for Trump, he wins. If you vote for Clinton, she wins. Your votes determine the outcome of the election, and your inaction also has the power to do so. Not voting doesn't strictly count as a vote for "the other party" but not voting does have an impact. Invalid Validation posted:Watching Oliver get super frustrated having to explain the dumb poo poo Trump does and says is how I feel about people who blindly follow him. Just listen to that shithead for 10 minutes, he can't even form a complete sentence and it infuriates me. Afro posted:Donald Trump has early stage dementia. It's the only way I can understand why he just strays from thought to thought like that. It reminds me of my grandmother not too long before hers got really bad and her home was foreclosed because she forgot about the mortgage entirely and thought the bills were from con artists. Conversely she also fell for a lot of real cons. It's all so drat frustrating. As an Internet Psychologist  I can confirm this. He's simply an elderly man with declining mental health. Compare him now to an early interview if you don't believe me:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-w47wgdhso oohhboy posted:Kathy Griffith should have stuck to it. It was her deplorable moment and she flinched. This, kinda. She gained nothing by apologizing. Might as well have doubled down and said "gently caress Trump" to at least gained the respect of the actual human beings who hate him.
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Jun 7, 2017 08:29
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Every compelled apology made for free speech makes it that little bit easier to lose, and every compelled apology made by a liberal both compels and empowers ultra-right-wing pundits and trolls to silence-by-proxy everyone else because it's a sign of weakness. Kathy Griffin didn't apologize for "going over the line," she apologized because it's what she needed to do to regain her support network (and it's what her publicist *told* her to do, because said publicist wants to keep their job and keep cashing Kathy's checks as long as they're good), who always desert pariahs the second they say something that might harm *their* self-image and personal gain. Alec Baldwin had it right - the right response was "gently caress them." Trump compelled "Second Amendment people" to *actually* assassinate Hillary during the campaign. gently caress this kid gloves poo poo when the other side's fighting bare knuckle - *lean in*. EDIT: This doesn't apply to Maher's gaffe, because he's just a lovely human being who pulled his "Mel Gibson card" on live television. BIG HEADLINE fucked around with this message at 09:19 on Jun 7, 2017 |
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Jun 7, 2017 09:11
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