|
Tatsuta Age posted:Yeah if the Republicans aren't scared of the traditional boogie men (AARP/other huge lobbies, mega low approval ratings, etc) then what the gently caress are we gonna do? I wonder if at this point they're somewhat resigned to very likely going down in 2018 and are going 'Okay, we push everything we can in, do as much damage as we can, grab whatever we can, and then make our ultimate bet on if the public will ever punish us for anything and if we lose, eh, we already got what we wanted and also the SC.'
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 05:53
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 9, 2024 22:49 |
|
|
Skex posted:To the "nothing matter" crew. No one thing is going to result in the GOP suddenly deciding to impeach and remove Trump. THANK you. Trump being removed from office is not what we're hoping for here. That is not the best-case scenario (since that leaves us with President Pence). The best-case scenario is that Trump's ability to ruin Americans' lives becomes impaired, and (truly progressive) Dems retake the government at all levels over the next few years. And we already know that the first part is happening: Trump's agenda has been hampered by this investigation. How do we know this? Because his director of legislative affairs has flat-out admitted it. This poo poo absolutely matters. The Dems shouldn't assume that it's going to sweep them into power by itself, or that they don't need to work for votes. But the investigation is genuinely making it more difficult for Trump to make Americans poorer, sicker, and dumber.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 05:53
|
|
|
Young Freud posted:You know that the second that they get their supposed "all-white utopia", this is exactly what will happen, too. They'll start reclassifying who's white. I mean, the way the mindset works is if you haven't fixed your problems yet, you need to keep narrowing down who is allowed in the clubhouse, so yeah. Since these people are garbage, they are going to want to keep doing it until they are the only people in the room and still have problems. Edit: @ above, it's easy to see how this stuff stops Republicans from making things worse, but it is really hard to see how it's going to lead to Dems making things better. What is the imaginary scenario where we get any progressive legislation in the next 4 years? Is our best case basically that 2018 and 2020 are both strong dem waves and we somehow end up with house/senate/presidency? Even if we are inclined to believe that will happen, we still won't have the SC, and the best-case is just that we manage to pass another bill or two that the Republicans will try to repeal just like they've been trying to repeal the ACA. There are some really bad structural problems with the US right now, and I'm not convinced that anything other than a rewrite of the constitution and/or reformulation of the Senate or state borders will really fix it. What are we supposed to do about Kansas/Utah/ND/SD/MS/MO/AL/etc. getting 2 votes a piece when they are being just as lovely now as they were during Reconstruction? Honestly, I feel like priority #1 for 2020 needs to be PR and DC getting statehood, because otherwise I don't see how we can stop the Republicans from gumming up the works basically at will. Our best case is still worse than basically every first-world country, so how are we going to get our heads out of our asses and fix education, health care, voting rights, the prison-industrial complex, and violent crime on anything approaching a reasonable timetable? BougieBitch fucked around with this message at 06:03 on Jun 8, 2017 |
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 05:54
|
|
|
Night10194 posted:I wonder if at this point they're somewhat resigned to very likely going down in 2018 and are going 'Okay, we push everything we can in, do as much damage as we can, grab whatever we can, and then make our ultimate bet on if the public will ever punish us for anything and if we lose, eh, we already got what we wanted and also the SC.' Still hopeful (but not convinced) that this swing happens in 2018. If not though... Seriously, how does the country ever bounce back
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 05:56
|
|
|
Tatsuta Age posted:Still hopeful (but not convinced) that this swing happens in 2018. If not though... Seriously, how does the country ever bounce back I think the fact that Kansas finally went 'oh poo poo we're literally killing our entire state' is a hopeful sign that the fever can break.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 05:58
|
|
|
Night10194 posted:I wonder if at this point they're somewhat resigned to very likely going down in 2018 and are going 'Okay, we push everything we can in, do as much damage as we can, grab whatever we can, and then make our ultimate bet on if the public will ever punish us for anything and if we lose, eh, we already got what we wanted and also the SC.' Well the lesson of the Bush administration is that you can be openly corrupt, lie the country into a war that kill thousands of Americans, gently caress up everything, drown a major city, set the economy on fire and push it off a cliff, and at most you'll be out of power for two years before everyone forgets and partisan tribalism reasserts itself and gets you back in. They will destroy as much as they can and if they're punished they'll just rile up America with conspiracy theories until they get back in and can start hacking away at something else, Medicare and Social Security probably.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 05:59
|
|
|
Skex posted:To the "nothing matter" crew. No one thing is going to result in the GOP suddenly deciding to impeach and remove Trump. Heh, you just don't get it maaaan. America is doomed, MAAAAAN
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:00
|
|
|
Night10194 posted:I wonder if at this point they're somewhat resigned to very likely going down in 2018 and are going 'Okay, we push everything we can in, do as much damage as we can, grab whatever we can, and then make our ultimate bet on if the public will ever punish us for anything and if we lose, eh, we already got what we wanted and also the SC.' This is almost certainly what they're doing at this point. They're going to lose the House in 2018 unless something really crazy happens, and they're probably going to lose the Senate and White House in 2020. Their best bet is to push through what they can, because without large majorities it isn't likely that the Democrats will be able to accomplish much. The ACA wasn't an easy fight and a ground-up replacement is going to be even harder, especially if it's all coming on the heels of Republican tax cuts. The best thing Republicans can do is to pass as much of their agenda as they can and then try to control the bleeding so that Democrats only get 2-4 years of real control. The country can't function if every four years are spent undoing the last four years. Paradoxish fucked around with this message at 06:03 on Jun 8, 2017 |
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:01
|
|
|
TyrantWD posted:They voted to take their own healthcare away. They absolutely deserve everything they get. Ignorance is not an excuse on this. They are not a bunch of barely literate two year olds. They are adults, and this is literally a matter of life and death. Do your homework. Desperate, politically ignorant people get taken in by conmen all the time; that doesn't mean they "deserve everything you get." A lot of the folks you're describing got bilked into thinking that Trump would lower their premiums. They were dumb, but it's really ghoulish of you to blame them, instead of blaming the conman. (edited for a better article) Majorian fucked around with this message at 06:06 on Jun 8, 2017 |
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:03
|
|
|
Night10194 posted:I wonder if at this point they're somewhat resigned to very likely going down in 2018 and are going 'Okay, we push everything we can in, do as much damage as we can, grab whatever we can, and then make our ultimate bet on if the public will ever punish us for anything and if we lose, eh, we already got what we wanted and also the SC.'
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:05
|
|
|
Majorian posted:Desperate, politically ignorant people get taken in by conmen all the time; that doesn't mean they "deserve everything you get." A lot of the folks you're describing got bilked into thinking that Trump would lower their premiums. They were dumb, but it's really ghoulish of you to blame them, instead of blaming the conman. No maaaan you don't get it! Those stupid hicks deserve everything they get! America is DOOMED but I hope before it gets all the way there all Trump voters DIE! -Literally people in this very thread right now
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:05
|
|
|
Also anyone scared of a President Pence has to acknowledge, if we somehow get into a scenario where we force Trump out we are loving through the looking glass on how angry the country probably is at the GOP.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:05
|
|
|
Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:The economic gains unleashed from the reduction in the capital gains tax will be massive. Especially during this bull market. Maybe this is :duff: but this is eugenics and literally indicates the death of the disabled for the economic advantage of others.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:09
|
|
|
voltroon posted:Maybe this is :duff: but this is eugenics and literally indicates the death of the disabled for the economic advantage of others. There's nothing more American than that. Nazis took notes on us and gasped in awe for a reason.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:10
|
|
|
Majorian posted:Desperate, politically ignorant people get taken in by conmen all the time; that doesn't mean they "deserve everything you get." A lot of the folks you're describing got bilked into thinking that Trump would lower their premiums. They were dumb, but it's really ghoulish of you to blame them, instead of blaming the conman. Yeah, the people I hear in bars using racial slurs constantly and saying they think BLM protestors should be executed in the streets are just good people who got duped.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:10
|
|
|
Night10194 posted:Also anyone scared of a President Pence has to acknowledge, if we somehow get into a scenario where we force Trump out we are loving through the looking glass on how angry the country probably is at the GOP. Yeah, but the dude would still be able to work with a suddenly-very-friendly Republican Congress much more easily than his predecessor. Plus unlike Trump, he actually believes in all of the regressive poo poo that he pushes. Also you just know that the media is going to suddenly shift to, "Oh, PHEW! Now we have someone who is SO PRESIDENTIAL in the Oval Office! All our problems are over." empty whippet box posted:Yeah, the people I hear in bars using racial slurs constantly and saying they think BLM protestors should be executed in the streets are just good people who got duped. I know it feels good to think that they represent every single Trump voter, but maybe you could make the monumental effort of reading the Vox piece that I posted, that describes people who don't really match the caricature that you've drawn here.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:10
|
|
|
Majorian posted:Desperate, politically ignorant people get taken in by conmen all the time; that doesn't mean they "deserve everything you get." A lot of the folks you're describing got bilked into thinking that Trump would lower their premiums. They were dumb, but it's really ghoulish of you to blame them, instead of blaming the conman. They never really believed that. They believed he would give them permission to be their worst selves, and he has.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:12
|
|
|
Furnaceface posted:I live close enough to the border that I have now more than once seen an American come in and buy a lot of insulin because its 1/8th the price, doesnt require a prescription, and is non-taxed. Ive always been afraid to ask anything other than "Nice day outside?" because Ive heard about people literally bursting into tears over this because its their only option to continue living. The real double-whammy is the price of insulin combined with the price for needles and test strips.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:14
|
|
|
business hammocks posted:They never really believed that. They believed he would give them permission to be their worst selves, and he has. Indeed, the people in that article who are literally dying from lack of care for their cancer are just playing a really long con. Good for you, reading between the lines.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:15
|
|
|
Majorian posted:Desperate, politically ignorant people get taken in by conmen all the time; that doesn't mean they "deserve everything you get." A lot of the folks you're describing got bilked into thinking that Trump would lower their premiums. They were dumb, but it's really ghoulish of you to blame them, instead of blaming the conman. No actually it's fine to blame them. It's their fault, you see. Democracy only works if people bother to be the least bit informed, and only someone grossly uninformed could have been taken in by Trump. These incompetent voters hosed as all over.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:24
|
|
|
Ogmius815 posted:No actually it's fine to blame them. It's their fault, you see. Democracy only works if people bother to be the least bit informed, and only someone grossly uninformed could have been taken in by Trump. These incompetent voters hosed as all over. You're literally saying that they deserve to die because they were uneducated about politics.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:26
|
|
|
Majorian posted:You're literally saying that they deserve to die because they were uneducated about politics. I didn't say they deserve to die. I said they're blameworthy. Pretty big gap there.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:27
|
|
|
Nazzadan posted:No maaaan you don't get it! Those stupid hicks deserve everything they get! Ha ha. These are good and useful posts, just like the ones they're making fun of ha ha. Just like this post, also really good. Ha Ha (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:27
|
|
|
citybeatnik posted:The real double-whammy is the price of insulin combined with the price for needles and test strips. Wait, this hasnt ever been expanded on to me. Just how expensive are strips and needles for you guys? 
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:28
|
|
|
Ogmius815 posted:I didn't say they deserve to die. I said they're blameworthy. Pretty big gap there. There is, but I never said they don't deserve some blame. I was responding to a post that says, "they deserve everything they get." I mean, that's just all sorts of hosed up.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:29
|
|
|
Majorian posted:Indeed, the people in that article who are literally dying from lack of care for their cancer are just playing a really long con. Good for you, reading between the lines. quote:Medicaid is reserved for people who earn less than 138 percent of the poverty line — about $22,000 for a couple. This woman understood the Medicaid expansion is also part of Obamacare, and she doesn’t think the system is fair. It's not exactly a secret code. "Those people" don't deserve medicine, and the distinction between deserving and undeserving is so strong that she's obsessing over it as her husband dies. Do you deny that she's feeding something ugly inside of herself through her politics?
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:29
|
|
|
Yes they deserve to die, and I hope they burn in hell! Not my actual opinion
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:30
|
|
|
business hammocks posted:It's not exactly a secret code. "Those people" don't deserve medicine, and the distinction between deserving and undeserving is so strong that she's obsessing over it as her husband dies. Do you deny that she's feeding something ugly inside of herself through her politics? Oh sure, no question. But I don't think it means they deserve to die in complete agony, or go bankrupt because they got sick. No one deserves that. (at least no one who doesn't have the "Trump" surname) eyebeem posted:Yes they deserve to die, and I hope they burn in hell! Even if it were, I would excuse it because it's a good use of a good quote.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:31
|
|
|
Majorian posted:Oh sure, no question. But I don't think it means they deserve to die in complete agony, or go bankrupt because they got sick. No one deserves that. (at least no one who doesn't have the "Trump" surname) Jeff Sessions, Paul Ryan, Betsy Devos, Steve Bannon...
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:33
|
|
|
Furnaceface posted:Wait, this hasnt ever been expanded on to me. Just how expensive are strips and needles for you guys? My strips were $62 a month WITH a prescription plan from one of the big companies. Thankfully don't need them anymore but companies like Kroger and Walmart offer them cheaper off the shelf to get people in the door, probably poo poo quality strips though.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:34
|
|
|
Furnaceface posted:Jeff Sessions, Paul Ryan, Betsy Devos, Steve Bannon... Okay, a FEW more, but still!
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:36
|
|
|
Majorian posted:Oh sure, no question. But I don't think it means they deserve to die in complete agony, or go bankrupt because they got sick. No one deserves that. (at least no one who doesn't have the "Trump" surname) I don't think they deserve to die either, but the reason they made such poor political choices is not that they took a desperate gamble to preserve their access to medicine. It's that their spite found a voice, and that their spite mattered to them more than their own quality of care. They totally ignored the literal promise to repeal the aca because they had a feeling that other people were getting a better deal (they weren't).
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:37
|
|
|
Furnaceface posted:Wait, this hasnt ever been expanded on to me. Just how expensive are strips and needles for you guys? Medical supplies are so expensive that old people here are at extraordinary risk for recurrent infection due to reusing catheters if that gives you any perspective.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:38
|
|
|
Also Trump campaigned on a naked blind rage more so than any other modern Republican I can think of. It was well and widely known the kind of atmosphere he generated at his rallies, and it certainly wasn't one of bipartisanship and unity, it was pure undiluted let's gently caress the people you don't like. You would have to have been wilfully misinformed to mistake his his message for anything other than an assault on all those liberals. All those people who are still supporting him and the wretched party that's covering for him every step of the way have to be doing some pretty hefty mental gymnastics to help themselves sleep at night, or they've finally just dropped the mask and have fully embraced the let's do as much damage to liberal (minority) communities as we can. It breaks my heart to see people give in to that kind of hatred. I don't actively wish death on anyone, but what do you do with people that not only refuse to examine issues and operate with any empathy, but actually celebrate their ignorance and wear it as a badge of honor. I mean that seriously, I have no idea how to approach people like that. Try and limit the damage they do clearly, but the only way I can think of to do that is to get down and dirty and try to marginalize their vote as much as humanely possible.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:39
|
|
|
Eltoasto posted:My strips were $62 a month WITH a prescription plan from one of the big companies. Thankfully don't need them anymore but companies like Kroger and Walmart offer them cheaper off the shelf to get people in the door, probably poo poo quality strips though. no the fact that half my readings don't work and my blood sugar varies 50 mg/dl within three minutes on them is a FEATURE not a bug because dposeikt gaelor;'t ker;l tkerl; taewkl;
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:43
|
|
|
Craig K posted:no the fact that half my readings don't work and my blood sugar varies 50 mg/dl within three minutes on them is a FEATURE not a bug because dposeikt gaelor;'t ker;l tkerl; taewkl; they're still like $20 for 100 instead of $60 for 50 so im sticking with them! now get on generic insulin walmart
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:44
|
|
|
Eltoasto posted:My strips were $62 a month WITH a prescription plan from one of the big companies. Thankfully don't need them anymore but companies like Kroger and Walmart offer them cheaper off the shelf to get people in the door, probably poo poo quality strips though. I was going to say that isnt too bad then i realized you said thats with coverage. Why are Americans not rioting in the streets, that poo poo is loving criminal.  voltroon posted:Medical supplies are so expensive that old people here are at extraordinary risk for recurrent infection due to reusing catheters if that gives you any perspective.  Well this is kind of a depressing thing to learn about so late at night.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:46
|
|
|
Majorian posted:Desperate, politically ignorant people get taken in by conmen all the time; that doesn't mean they "deserve everything you get." A lot of the folks you're describing got bilked into thinking that Trump would lower their premiums. They were dumb, but it's really ghoulish of you to blame them, instead of blaming the conman.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:47
|
|
|
business hammocks posted:I don't think they deserve to die either, but the reason they made such poor political choices is not that they took a desperate gamble to preserve their access to medicine. It's that their spite found a voice, and that their spite mattered to them more than their own quality of care. They totally ignored the literal promise to repeal the aca because they had a feeling that other people were getting a better deal (they weren't). I think you're ascribing way too much conscious decision-making to them. Most people who voted for Trump, have voted Republican for the last several decades. A lot of them do so because they're not very smart, they don't have the time, energy, or attention span needed to get educated about politics, and the "information" that they do get is from their equally ignorant friends and relatives on social media. Some of them genuinely are psychotic Nazis. But a lot of them are just dupes.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:48
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 9, 2024 22:49 |
|
|
I'm ready to be completely underwhelmed by Comey tomorrow. That guy seems about as hyperbolic as a sloth. Come on Comey, prove me wrong. Give us a real humdinger.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2017 06:54
|
|
