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psydude posted:I don't get the south. I was in Huntsville this week and a dude in a coal rolling pickup was sporting Confederate plates. But if it weren't for NASA egg heads from Stanford and MIT (and frankly, a bunch of Nazi rocket scientists), Huntsville would still be a depressed loving poo poo hole like 95% of Alabama. Honestly, I saw more Confederate plates when I was in high school in Jersey than when I was in college in Huntsville. That probably says more about what a shithole South Jersey is than anything about Huntsville though. (Also, the best job offer I got from anywhere in Huntsville was 20k less than the one I got in upstate NY, so  ).(Huntsville has fuckloads better food than Schenectady though)
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Jun 10, 2017 03:42
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Victor Vermis posted:Yeah this sort of hyperbole in no way trivializes the country's sad history of actual human slavery nor completely disregards the debts these prisoners (including black prisoners) owe to their communities (including.. wait for it.. black communities). How is it hyperbole? The 13th amendment specifically says that slavery is cool when someone has been convicted of a crime. It's the legal justification for the working conditions prisoners can be put in, and Clinton justified it as cheap gardening services. It's a direct extension of the system that the south used to railroad people, mostly minorities, for crimes to exploit them for their labor. Strongly recommend this book - https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0067NCQVU
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Jun 10, 2017 03:47
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Re: coal rollers They're all over Colorado. I'm dumb and live surrounded by mil-folk. There's no point in calling the cops about it either, the local department is understaffed and paid less than the Denver or even county cops. They don't care. If they see someone do it, maybe they'll give out a ticket, but no one is getting a ticket from a call in for rolling coal. It's so goddamn dumb of a trend, but it's not over until I see someone do it with a slammed, off-camber volkswagen.
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Jun 10, 2017 03:47
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Casimir Radon posted:I've yet to see coal rolling in the wild. If I did I'd probably call the cops on them. With any hope they don't acknowledge that what they're doing is stupid and try to escalate things with the cops. First time I saw it was in CA of all places. Saw it a few times in ol' Virginia last year.
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Jun 10, 2017 03:47
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LITERALLY SHAKING posted:Re: coal rollers You could probably find someone in AI to do that for you.
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Jun 10, 2017 03:50
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psydude posted:I don't get the south. I was in Huntsville this week and a dude in a coal rolling pickup was sporting Confederate plates. But if it weren't for NASA egg heads from Stanford and MIT (and frankly, a bunch of Nazi rocket scientists), Huntsville would still be a depressed loving poo poo hole like 95% of Alabama. https://youtu.be/xeYGo33_wkY
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Jun 10, 2017 03:51
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orange juche posted:You could probably find someone in AI to do that for you. I'm sure it's been done, I just haven't seen it rolling around the wild 30mph zones, where their wheels are slightly less likely to go flying off into traffic.
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Jun 10, 2017 03:53
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Casimir Radon posted:I've yet to see coal rolling in the wild. If I did I'd probably call the cops on them. With any hope they don't acknowledge that what they're doing is stupid and try to escalate things with the cops. I have seen it in the Bay Area. 
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Jun 10, 2017 03:55
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Chris Christie signed a bill making those mods illegal so Chris Christie is a good man 
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Jun 10, 2017 03:57
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TBeats posted:Chris Christie signed a bill making those mods illegal so Chris Christie is a good man Lets not get ahead of ourselves.
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Jun 10, 2017 03:59
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TBeats posted:Chris Christie signed a bill making those mods illegal so Chris Christie is a good man
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Jun 10, 2017 03:59
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Casimir Radon posted:That and jailing Daddy Kushner are the only good things he's ever done. I dunno, all the comedy he generated by having Trump treat him like a foot stool then throwing him out like a used condom was pretty good.
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Jun 10, 2017 04:21
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AreWeDrunkYet posted:How is it hyperbole? The 13th amendment specifically says that slavery is cool when someone has been convicted of a crime. It's the legal justification for the working conditions prisoners can be put in, and Clinton justified it as cheap gardening services. It's a direct extension of the system that the south used to railroad people, mostly minorities, for crimes to exploit them for their labor. nah thanks. I bear witness daily to the racial (ECONOMIC) disparity in corrections and the institutional blindness towards it while working in the most segregated city in America. ... and that has zero impact on my views on prison labor because one has nothing to do with the other. If you take from your community, your community should be able to take back from you. A jury of your peers (AND YOUR INCOME) stands between you and that. In the meantime, you will be provided with food, shelter, programming, medical, dental, legal, housing, etc, etc, etc. The only person more hosed than a prison inmate is the person/people who were victimized by that inmate. At least the prisoner gets a support system. The victims don't get assigned a guiding hand to navigate public resources and the victims aren't guaranteed basic needs for the duration of the offender's sentence. The victims don't get rehabilitation programming tailored to serve the under-educated, the abused, and the socially mal-adjusted. The victims get to pick their lovely job from the same pool of lovely jobs as everyone else. Prisoners make poo poo for pay? Everyone makes poo poo for pay. Welcome to the world of most of us. You want to see slaves? Go to loving Walmart. I won't be shedding a tear for Mr.Never-worked-a-day-in-his-life-because-heroin-sells-itself while he assembles new chairs for University of Whatever's alumni-sponsored lecture hall at $2/hour, because every day he's turning screws is another day his neighbors can hope their kids might actually get through high school and one day sit in that lecture hall. They might even one day have the privilege of dealing with the misery that is coddling convict balls while human being liberals on the internet play the goddamn GHETTO LORAX and declare every black man a martyr and every public servant a devil. I'm Victor Vermis and I approve this message. SMDFTB. Victor Vermis fucked around with this message at 05:39 on Jun 10, 2017 |
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Jun 10, 2017 05:37
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AreWeDrunkYet is probably on the same page w/r/t economics and racism going hand-in-hand, I'm just an angry person and I hate non-vets in my vet safespace. Sorry bud.
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Jun 10, 2017 05:43
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I mostly agree with your points. In other news, people have sued Trump for violations of the emoluments clause. The response the DoJ submitted points to poo poo Washington and other contemporaneous political figures received. However they kindof miss the point because most of those gifts predate the constitution and are a reason the emoluments clause exists in the first place.
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Jun 10, 2017 06:05
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People like these don't deserve to be used as slave labor the rest of their lives. Not everyone in prison is there for being a druglord murderer selling to kids.
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Jun 10, 2017 06:15
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ZombieApostate posted:People like these don't deserve to be used as slave labor the rest of their lives. Not everyone in prison is there for being a druglord murderer selling to kids. I don't think anyone will disagree that bullshit mandatory minimums and other stupid poo poo shouldn't put people behind bars for life. However that's not what we're talking about and those weren't the people working for Clinton. The majority were people convicted of murder.
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Jun 10, 2017 06:18
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Noted maverick and totally with it, definitely-not-Hillary's-soul-transplanted-in-a-younger-body senator from New York Kirsten Gillibrand is cursin' again. Her subroutines are good enough that we're nearly out Disney-ride animatronics and into the uncanny valley. http://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/world/senator-curses-in-speech-to-show-frustration-with-washington/ar-BBCnuVC
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Jun 10, 2017 06:46
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The California prison labor system is cool because they get paid and usually certifications too
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Jun 10, 2017 07:20
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Victor Vermis posted:Words On the other hand private corporations running prisons as profit extraction vehicles is 50 shades of hosed and maybe shouldn't be allowed based on both how hosed up that is and also the effect that profited money has on our law making.
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Jun 10, 2017 07:56
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bird food bathtub posted:On the other hand private corporations running prisons as profit extraction vehicles is 50 shades of hosed and maybe shouldn't be allowed based on both how hosed up that is and also the effect that profited money has on our law making. Absolutely right, but that's not the point. Clinton didn't have private prison imates working for her. One of the Arkansas work programs for prisoners was to function as stewards/caretakers of the governor's mansion. This is worlds apart from modern private prison contracting to work for private companies and exploit minor drug offenders as free labor.
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Jun 10, 2017 08:12
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ZombieApostate posted:People like these don't deserve to be used as slave labor the rest of their lives. Not everyone in prison is there for being a druglord murderer selling to kids. Nobody's going to argue that mandatory sentencing can be hosed. For instances of seemingly unreasonable parole revocation, I'd suggest you look at each case and see why each person was in a position to serve a life sentence for such minor offenses, and what other behaviors may have been present that are not mentioned in that article. Revoking parole on a life sentence involves more than a racist cop and a lazy judge, and believe it or not, people facing harsh consequences (and the people selling that story through ads and mouseclicks) sometimes do pick and choose the details which make for the most outrageous story or the most compelling lawsuit. But sure, I bet there are instances of crazy unjustified revocations of parole on life sentences. Better luck next time. And you are correct. Not everyone deserves employment while in prison. It should be reserved for those who have earned the privilege. bird food bathtub posted:On the other hand private corporations running prisons as profit extraction vehicles is 50 shades of hosed and maybe shouldn't be allowed based on both how hosed up that is and also the effect that profited money has on our law making. I got no dog in that fight but yes government corruption is bad.
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Jun 10, 2017 08:16
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Jesus loving Christ you people are talking about hillary clinton. Prison labor chat aside, can we treat hillary chat like gun control chat? The conversation always goes nowhere. Like gun control chat. Not dictating, just pleading. 
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Jun 10, 2017 08:47
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Victor Vermis posted:Nobody's going to argue that mandatory sentencing can be hosed. The article is based on (and links to) a report written by the ACLU. The report is a lot longer, but the Mother Jones article seemed like a decent summary since it mostly lifts a few interesting points straight from the report. Both mention that the sentences were not typically for first offenses, but regardless of your past transgressions (that you've already done time for, presumably), I don't think you should be imprisoned for life and used as cheap labor for siphoning gas from a truck or cashing a stolen check. Really, I don't think the state should profit from prisoners at all, because of the potential for abuse. If you want to make it an economics argument, the report estimates revising life without parole sentencing would save taxpayers ~$1.8 billion. I can't find a great source for how much money is made using prison labor, but UNICOR's website (the federal company that handles prison labor) says they lost $18 million using prison labor to produce things in 2015. I am totally fine with paying prisoners a real wage to do actual work, but the way we're doing it right now is hosed up. ZombieApostate fucked around with this message at 09:20 on Jun 10, 2017 |
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Jun 10, 2017 08:56
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Lest we forget: Prison in America is big money and every single person profiting off it deserves a loving rope.
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Jun 10, 2017 10:08
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It is an obnoxious trend of discussion because jack-shack orgasms (wishing hillary would win) will forever haunt any smell of poo poo you encounter.
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Jun 10, 2017 10:12
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Casimir Radon posted:I've yet to see coal rolling in the wild. If I did I'd probably call the cops on them. With any hope they don't acknowledge that what they're doing is stupid and try to escalate things with the cops. I've seen it so many times. But, well, that's Texas and Oklahoma for you. I was very pleased, years ago, when Truck Nuts were banned on post and thus offender trucks got castrated by the duty NCOs. Unrelated: https://twitter.com/wsvn/status/872885287592108032
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Jun 10, 2017 13:19
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mlmp08 posted:I've seen it so many times. But, well, that's Texas and Oklahoma for you. I was very pleased, years ago, when Truck Nuts were banned on post and thus offender trucks got castrated by the duty NCOs. Wanna adopt that pup and be best friends
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Jun 10, 2017 14:08
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Hey, maybe ISIS good and part of Trump strategy? -Republican Congressman https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3vD1pJR98dA
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Jun 10, 2017 14:13
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mlmp08 posted:Hey, maybe ISIS good and part of Trump strategy? For those that don't remember, this is the rep that the republicans openly joke is on the Russian payroll.
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Jun 10, 2017 14:44
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LtCol J. Krusinski posted:Jesus loving Christ you people are talking about hillary clinton. Prison labor chat aside, can we treat hillary chat like gun control chat? much like her political campaigns
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Jun 10, 2017 14:56
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Mr. Nice! posted:Absolutely right, but that's not the point. Clinton didn't have private prison imates working for her. One of the Arkansas work programs for prisoners was to function as stewards/caretakers of the governor's mansion. This is worlds apart from modern private prison contracting to work for private companies and exploit minor drug offenders as free labor. It's not apples and oranges: the prisoners were not paid for these work programs, and were punished if they refused to participate, and anyone who used their labor saved money. At any rate, the truly blood-curdling bit is not that Clinton lived in a mansion whose grounds were kept by legal slaves, it's what she had to say on the subject in the book. I highly recommend tracking the excerpt down either in text or audiobook form. People are posting it all over. She calls it a long-standing tradition, assures the reader that she and Bill reported even minor infractions to the overseers, discusses the parts of the brain responsible for impulse control, all but says that they seemed remarkably human. Forgive me for not posting it myself, I plead the phoneth.
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Jun 10, 2017 15:41
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LITERALLY SHAKING posted:Re: coal rollers I take solace in knowing that they are causing damage to their engines, and will have to kick out thousands upon thousands of dollars to fix their adorable penis extensions when they inevitably break. Diesel poo poo ain't cheap. Terrible Robot fucked around with this message at 15:51 on Jun 10, 2017 |
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Jun 10, 2017 15:46
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Terrible Robot posted:I take solace in knowing that they are causing damage to their engines and will have to kick out thousands upon thousands of dollars to fix their adorable penis extensions when they inevitably break. Diesel poo poo ain't cheap. Pretty much. Either siezed piston rings or failed turbos, rolling coal does serious damage. I helped someone with one engine that had been subjected to it, and the valves were so coked they would no longer seat or close completely.
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Jun 10, 2017 15:49
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Terrible Robot posted:I take solace in knowing that they are causing damage to their engines, and will have to kick out thousands upon thousands of dollars to fix their adorable penis extensions when they inevitably break. Diesel poo poo ain't cheap. Same with the dummies who decided to run their cars off used restaurant grease.
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Jun 10, 2017 15:55
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Doc Hawkins posted:It's not apples and oranges: the prisoners were not paid for these work programs, and were punished if they refused to participate, and anyone who used their labor saved money. Which makes absolute sense when you look at it from the eyes of someone 40 years ago. I've read the excerpt. Yeah, she's tone deaf. This was (and is still) the way the grounds at many governor's mansions all across the south are kept and maintained. There's a lot of goon handwringing over this, but it's really not the story that people make it out to be. Clinton did not cause any of those people to commit the crimes nor did she convince a jury of their peers they were guilty. Yes, improvements have been made in prisoner treatment (in some ways) over the past couple decades, but you're still trying to judge someone harshly with the benefit of hindsight. There was zero she could have done to change the situation, and because of it she became close with convicted murderers and other criminals.
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Jun 10, 2017 16:01
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mlmp08 posted:Same with the dummies who decided to run their cars off used restaurant grease. Eh, the people still doing that are the kind of people who would tear an engine down once a year to "check on things" or whatever. They're forever stuck in a hobbyist venture that no reasonably paid mechanic would want to gently caress with. Like those guys that run propane on old jeeps. Rolling coal is so much easier for idiots. The skill level required is low and the payoff for local mechanics is high. I love the idea of some moron loving up a diesel and trying to fix it in his garage like it's an old chevy 350.
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Jun 10, 2017 16:09
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Mr. Nice! posted:Which makes absolute sense when you look at it from the eyes of someone 40 years ago. I've read the excerpt. Yeah, she's tone deaf. This was (and is still) the way the grounds at many governor's mansions all across the south are kept and maintained. There's a lot of goon handwringing over this, but it's really not the story that people make it out to be. I swear to god I'm inches from probating Hillary Clinton chat. I come in peace. I didn’t bring mods. But I’m pleading with you, with tears in my eyes: If you gently caress with me, I’ll probate you all.
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Jun 10, 2017 16:17
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I'm guilty of helping this argument snowball in the CE thread. That said, Shim is right, please discuss this in a new thread. Prompt: instead of prisoners manicuring governors' lawns for free, it should be soldiers.
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Jun 10, 2017 16:18
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Zeris posted:I'm guilty of helping this argument snowball in the CE thread. That said, Shim is right, please discuss this in a new thread. Prompt: instead of prisoners manicuring governors' lawns for free, it should be soldiers. Just as long as they don't have to hold umbrellas. 
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Jun 10, 2017 16:23
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