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If they lack good armor-piercing units, I imagine magic is supposed to somehow aid in that regard.
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Jun 16, 2017 20:12
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Cythereal posted:No, and their artillery such as it is tends to be awful. If they're like the tabletop, their units will also be expensive. When did Repeater Bolt Throwers become awful?
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Jun 16, 2017 20:12
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yeah the high elves' weakness to armor is that while their dedicated anti-armor infantry will loving mulch anything that they make contact with, they are going to be extremely small, expensive units vulnerable to having the poo poo arrow'd out of them.
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Jun 16, 2017 20:31
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Eager to stick them full of arrows as wood elves
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Jun 16, 2017 20:37
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I just wanna see the magic they get in action. High magic is supposed to be v v good, no?
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Jun 16, 2017 20:40
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High Elves looking like they have the spearwall thing down in their animations at least, looks pretty cool. Also, I guess the Fallen Gates are a space ship engine or something?
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Jun 16, 2017 21:01
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Rygar201 posted:When did Repeater Bolt Throwers become awful? No but for real, who could ever have looked at this unit in TT and said "High Elf Artillery and War Machines are bad" Total Warhams Elves are going to be insane, we just haven't seen anything from their perspective yet. Not that it's going to matter, they're still elves and will be treated as such.
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Jun 16, 2017 21:11
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gently caress elves, give me rats or battletoads any day of the week.
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Jun 16, 2017 21:13
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Angry Lobster posted:Full footage of the Quest battle shown at the E3: The Carnosaur just straight up sliding through a pile of elves, sending them flying... god drat this game is amazing sometimes.
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Jun 16, 2017 21:14
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Psycho Landlord posted:No but for real, who could ever have looked at this unit in TT and said "High Elf Artillery and War Machines are bad" How to Piss Off Your Friends with High Elves in 6th Edition Bring a level 4 and three level 2 wizards, and 4 Repeater Bolt Throwers. Season the rest of your army to taste.
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Jun 16, 2017 21:18
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Gonkish posted:The Carnosaur just straight up sliding through a pile of elves, sending them flying... god drat this game is amazing sometimes. And that's before the bloodpack. 
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Jun 16, 2017 21:21
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Yeah, I am eager to see all of this dinosaur action with the blood pack on. Minotaurs have some competition?
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Jun 16, 2017 21:24
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Psycho Landlord posted:No but for real, who could ever have looked at this unit in TT and said "High Elf Artillery and War Machines are bad" To be fair, they do occupy a slightly different role than many of the other artillery pieces. With the Empire you get massive cannons that can knock the head off of a giant in a single shot, actual rocket batteries turning half the battlefield into an exploding hellscape, or a massive oversized machine gun that can cut a bloody swathe through a unit of Chaos Knights in a single moment (and explodes afterwards). The bolt thrower is a very solid and reliable performer, but it really doesn't have the same kind of flash as ye olde gunpowder artillery. Perestroika fucked around with this message at 21:41 on Jun 16, 2017 |
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Jun 16, 2017 21:39
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MilitantBlackGuy posted:Yeah, I am eager to see all of this dinosaur action with the blood pack on. Picture a giant t-rex modded to use a minotaurs "cannon ball" charge animation. Sigvald is easily the best chaos hero. Great for running a doomstack of Chosen and generally just amazing to listen too. Archonex fucked around with this message at 21:46 on Jun 16, 2017 |
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Jun 16, 2017 21:42
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I want some rats!
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Jun 16, 2017 21:53
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Mordja posted:I fail to see the problem with this. it ain't no problem
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Jun 16, 2017 23:09
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Rygar201 posted:When did Repeater Bolt Throwers become awful? They're good but they're also the only thing they have. Sort of like how trebuchets/hellcannons are good but not strong enough to anchor a force around like empire/dwarf artillery. High Elves strengths are their magic and their elite infantry
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Jun 16, 2017 23:13
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If High Elves are going to be at all like table top they'll be powerful but small unit sizes, general fragility and high cost per unit means if you screw up you're going to be punished severely since you can't really sustain casualties.
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Jun 16, 2017 23:18
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Carcer posted:If High Elves are going to be at all like table top they'll be powerful but small unit sizes, general fragility and high cost per unit means if you screw up you're going to be punished severely since you can't really sustain casualties. Sure, but in practice that means like the WElves once you've got some research underway and a few red line skills you'll be unstoppable.
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Jun 16, 2017 23:44
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I don't think they will be able to mitigate their OP-ness with isolationism like with Wood Elves in this game, so I imagine AI High Elves would be quite toned down at least.
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Jun 16, 2017 23:49
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How do the dark elves play on tabletop? Haven't heard much about them at all yet.
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Jun 16, 2017 23:52
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Trujillo posted:How do the dark elves play on tabletop? Haven't heard much about them at all yet. Dark Elfs have some skirmishy units and have repeater crossbows, they also have magicians and infantry that are good but not as crazy as what the High Elfs have -- maybe a Witch Elf horde with some of their special characters can match up, but probably not. High Elfs elites are just bonkers.
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Jun 17, 2017 00:04
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Trujillo posted:How do the dark elves play on tabletop? Haven't heard much about them at all yet. They have War Hydra's and repeater crossbows.
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Jun 17, 2017 00:08
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Randarkman posted:High Elves looking like they have the spearwall thing down in their animations at least, looks pretty cool. It's a big star gate thing.
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Jun 17, 2017 00:18
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Trujillo posted:How do the dark elves play on tabletop? Haven't heard much about them at all yet. They were basically more offensive oriented high elves; fast and can tear poo poo up in melee but lightly armored and extremely vulnerable to ranged fire. For comparison, the differences between the two "elite guard" of the respective races (black guard vs phoenix guard) was that black guard could reroll failed hits while phoenix guard had a 4+ ward save(!). They also have some pretty cool monsters. Were kind of weak but then they got buffed after I stopped playing and apparently they became really good?
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Jun 17, 2017 00:34
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At one point, eating a charge from DE Cold One riders could give Chaos Knights a run for their money.
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Jun 17, 2017 00:39
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Depends on the edition. Just bunches of repeater crossbow troops and repeater bolt throwers, backed by one or two good melee units, was relatively popular for DE in certain editions.
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Jun 17, 2017 01:03
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Well, 354 hours in, I finally got all the achievements. Now I am prepared for game 2
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Jun 17, 2017 07:15
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Though Malekith was always really powerful.
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Jun 17, 2017 07:44
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I've always expected that the high elves would be something like the Empire +magic - gunpowder. See how it works out.
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Jun 17, 2017 11:44
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Blinks77 posted:I've always expected that the high elves would be something like the Empire +magic - gunpowder. It's not too far off, but definitely there's some differences. High Elves best units are actually their infantry and flying monsters, (So pretty much the opposite of Empire) but they have good enough Cav and Ranged options to be considered versatile. Definitely lacking the Empire's gunlines and long-range artillery though. Lizardmen from what we've seen look like they'll have very cost-effective/versatile infantry while simultaneously being a bit light on both armor and armor-piercing, so against other races elite Heavy Infantry they'll probably need Dinosaur support to deal with them effectively. They're also not going to be great at ranged combat and have to deal with the rampage thing, but they'll have a strong melee line and lots of support options. Dark Elves should be somewhat similar to High Elves but more mobile and aggressive, with ground monsters instead of flyers. I could see them having something similar to Martial Prowess but flipped, so that they get increased melee attack but only when they're winning battles or have high HP. Skaven will be really interesting to see how CA manages to pull them off. They should be swarms of Chaff Infantry, no Cav, and reliant on their weapon teams and bizarre warmachines to do the bulk of the killing. They have some monsters but not as many as you'd expect. Carcer posted:If High Elves are going to be at all like table top they'll be powerful but small unit sizes, general fragility and high cost per unit means if you screw up you're going to be punished severely since you can't really sustain casualties. Their unit sizes seem pretty normal from the playthrough vids. Looking at their stats I think the main balance pivot for High Elves is intended to be Martial Prowess. Like the basic High Elf Spearmen are really good when they have Martial Prowess up, but once they lose half HP they're kinda mediocre, slightly worse stats than Empire Spearmen aside from their better armor and tower shields. It's early though, I expect balance will shift a lot from now to when the game releases.
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Jun 17, 2017 13:19
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Something else to note about how lizardmen play in this game according to the developers is that their units both regenerate when not in combat for a bit, and go berserk and become uncontrollable when damaged enough. I think managing that - their interpretation of Cold Blooded and Predatory Fighters - is going to make or break the lizards in a lot of battles.
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Jun 17, 2017 14:16
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That's pretty cool. I like the tactical implications of some potentially uncontrollable units (reminds me of the old war dogs in rome). The regen may end up being a good way to clown the dumb AI if it's too good though.
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Jun 17, 2017 14:20
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Cythereal posted:Something else to note about how lizardmen play in this game according to the developers is that their units both regenerate when not in combat for a bit, and go berserk and become uncontrollable when damaged enough. I think managing that - their interpretation of Cold Blooded and Predatory Fighters - is going to make or break the lizards in a lot of battles. Almost. They clarified later that the Regen ability is tied to characters and limited in use. You can see in the battle videos that Kroq-gar has Three uses of Cold Blooded, and he can burn them to either heal himself or any friendly. There's also two tiers of Rampaging for the Lizardmen. The feral dinosaurs have the higher one, where they can go berserk almost immediately and become completely uncontrollable, and what the Saurus Warriors have, which only kicks in at low HP but can still lead to situations where your infantry is chasing a routing unit all the way across the map and you can't do poo poo about it.
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Jun 17, 2017 14:28
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Thats an interesting contrast to the incredible reliability of Lizardman leadership on the tabletop. Coldblooded in that game made them mega reliable. Leadership tests were taken on 2D6, lower numbers being better. Cold Blooded let you take them on 3 D6, and take the lowest two.
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Jun 17, 2017 15:36
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I think the sauruses in TT had a thing where they had to resist dropping everything and chasing fleeing units? Going off half remembered forum posts here
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Jun 17, 2017 15:44
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RentACop posted:I think the sauruses in TT had a thing where they had to resist dropping everything and chasing fleeing units? Going off half remembered forum posts here Not in the editions I played. Predatory Fighters gave them extra attacks, except for the second rank if fighting with spears.
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Jun 17, 2017 15:44
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In the 8th edition yeah. They got extra attacks if you rolled a 6, but had to pursue fleeing enemies. This could be negated by having a skink character near bye.
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Jun 17, 2017 15:48
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jokes posted:If they lack good armor-piercing units, I imagine magic is supposed to somehow aid in that regard. They'll probably have ap spears as core like wood elves. Eternal guard with shields are so insane
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Jun 17, 2017 17:14
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It is amazing just how draining hard can be on the diplomatic front. Almost every Empire faction had the distrust the empire trait and different dwarf factions keep on declaring war on me despite me doing jackshit. Add that to the fact that declaring war on the vampire counts after they ended the non-aggression treaty tanked my rep for no reason. On the plus side I got to enjoy watching Manred watch as I chewed up his entire army before he finally could be bothered to charge my lines.
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Jun 17, 2017 17:52
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