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IPA Regulations posted:I meant that there are parts of the game that stand out as not having the same quality as you'd expect from 3D Zelda if you were coming from OOT and MM, like I did. For instance the underwater collecting moving color coded macguffins section or the escort/stealth section across the same piece of map you've done 3 times previously seem pretty phoned in, and recycled boss fight against the Imprisoned, which wasn't good the first time. The fact that they reused the relatively small surface maps so heavily in the first place speaks to a game that was kinda rushed out as well. Oh okay, I thought you meant something actually unfinished left in the game. Fwiw, lots of games have troubled developments, and lots of things get rushed and have cut content. Happened to OoT, MM and WW for certain. Skyward Sword was in development for ~5 years. They deliberately held off of releasing for a full year before relasing it. It's not that abnormal, unless you're FF15 or The Last Guardian or something. You bring up them re-using the same areas as signs of cut content, but this interview with Miyamoto suggests otherwise: this random forum transcript of interview because the original is down posted:With previous Zeldas, we took what we thought was good from the past and used that as a base to build on. Sooner or later, though, we need to add some new play structure to the thing, or else people will say 'Well, Zelda's just the same old puzzles going across the same eight dungeons.' I don't feel a need to stick with that system, because I think Zelda's core lies in playing around in the same world over a period time, gradually learning more about it and building experience as you discover new secrets. The NES Zelda had a small map so that worked, but as hardware progressed, the scale got large enough that often you'd see places that you only visited once in the game. I wasn't entirely sure that made for a real Zelda-like experience. You can claim that as just saving public face, sure. But considering Skyward Sword, it was definitely an experimental title in a lot of ways. I'm willing to give the benefit of the doubt here. Only other things I can imagine being related are 1. the game's first 2 years of dev time being attributed to experimentation, and 2. this weird anecdote that they didn't decide on the whip item until shortly before E3 2010. But again, both of these aren't that abnormal and don't indicate either way the game was really rushed to save time. Ventana fucked around with this message at 01:52 on Jun 23, 2017 |
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Jun 23, 2017 01:46
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Dungeons are poo poo. Open world exploring owns, hth
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Jun 23, 2017 02:31
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The Sandship and Ancient Cistern were two of the best things to ever be in a Zelda game. Koloktos, the Ghirahim fights, and final Demise were some of the greatest boss battles in the entire franchise. Plus, Skyward Sword brought back sword beams. I loving love sword beams. 
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Jun 23, 2017 02:41
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Jim Silly-Balls posted:Dungeons are poo poo. Open world exploring owns, hth I do like the shrines and the divine beasts. The shrines are a nice one-off puzzle that you'd ordinarily find in a dungeon, and the divine beasts have some cool gimmicks and the feeling that you can tackle them in cool and unintended ways by playing with the physics. My main complaint with the shrines is the lack of direction - the difficulty feels ransom since the shrines are found at random. I'd love to have a more directed difficulty with them.
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Jun 23, 2017 03:08
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Spergatory posted:The Sandship and Ancient Cistern were two of the best things to ever be in a Zelda game. Koloktos, the Ghirahim fights, and final Demise were some of the greatest boss battles in the entire franchise. Plus, Skyward Sword brought back sword beams. I loving love sword beams. The Sandship was such a great dungeon and I would've been happy just fighting the pirate-bot as the final dungeon boss. Ancient Cistern was so almost perfect that it kept me motivated to the Sandship, which kept me motivated through Imprisoned round 3.
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Jun 23, 2017 03:48
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FartingBedpost posted:which kept me motivated through Imprisoned round 3. That's where I just dropped it. Didn't care to run through the same boss battle Yet Again. The imprisoned was much better in Hyrule Warriors.
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Jun 23, 2017 03:59
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JawnV6 posted:That's where I just dropped it. Didn't care to run through the same boss battle Yet Again. The imprisoned was much better in Hyrule Warriors. Same, I don't even think I attempted it the third time, because it felt so ... half-hearted.
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Jun 23, 2017 04:01
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Is there anything that has no use besides selling for cash? Like, should I sell this diamond I found
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Jun 23, 2017 05:17
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I think diamonds are only used in upgrading one accessory (diamond circlet or tiara or whatever). You need a lot if you're gonna do that though.
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Jun 23, 2017 05:20
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Diamonds are pretty rare; you can always get more but not quickly. Some armor upgrades and optional items require them, so I wouldn't sell them unless you need the cash now and are willing to spend some time later finding more. Edit: I forget if there's anything besides the diamond circlet; I seem to remember needing them for something else, but I couldn't tell you specifically off the top of my head. Winifred Madgers fucked around with this message at 05:24 on Jun 23, 2017 |
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Jun 23, 2017 05:22
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Hmm, OK then, I guess I will hold off. I just got to Hateno Village and died a couple dozen times along the way, so I'm thinking in addition to figuring out the combat I should also get some armor soon
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Jun 23, 2017 05:42
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Diamonds are used to re-make champion weapons iirc, but there's an npc you can trade 10 luminous stones to and he'll give you a diamond so if you really need one they aren't too hard to generate. It's mostly just a pain in the rear end to wait for him to slowly count each stone you give him, I have no idea why they thought that was a good idea.
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Jun 23, 2017 05:43
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By my count, the maximum amount of minerals you will need to acquire and upgrade all of the clothes is: 25 Diamonds 40 Sapphire 40 Ruby 57 Topaz 102 Opal 108 Luminous Stone 75 Amber a pretty good amount of Flint That doesn't include DLC, amiibos, or non-clothes things you can use them for, nor requirements for things other than minerals like Star Fragments. You can always get more of these by fighting Stone Taluses or rare ore deposits or whatever (Death Mountain and the far end of the Hebra region have high concentrations). If you need money now, you might as well just sell things. There are other ways to get money quickly, too. Here is my favorite: there's an NPC in Rito Village who buys baked apples. The more you sell her, the higher the price per unit. For 100 baked apples she gives 12 rupees each, for a total of 1200 rupees. Near Death Mountain, you can just drop apples on the ground and they'll start baking. Don't leave them too long, though, or they'll catch fire. If you drop more than 10 before picking any up, they'll despawn, so cook them in batches of 10. You've surely seen that apples are very abundant, but on the east side of Satori Mountain there's a very dense grove of apple trees. (Use bombs, not weapons. This is also a good place to gather wood, which you'll need a lot of for several sidequests.) Bongo Bill fucked around with this message at 05:56 on Jun 23, 2017 |
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Jun 23, 2017 05:51
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Piss Christ, apparently you need 23 on this horse torture mini game for the Bridle. Oh well, out of charge, will try again later. Pretty Pony Dressup will be completed At least I found the trick, which is use an Ancient Bow and Bomb Arrows. gently caress you, horse man, you said twenty and that's what I did. Oh, also can I get a general area of where the shrine you apparently need a blood moon for is? Thanks E:oh and maybe a clue for the one you have to take pics of the tablet for, I found the bits but have no idea what to do now. Thanks again
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Jun 23, 2017 06:53
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The shrine you seek is kind of near a bridge across the canyon, and you can find Kass nearby. The trick to to side quest you're stuck on is that it's taking about kneeling, but the game has no kneel button, so you'll have to so the next closest thing. Is that vague enough?
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Jun 23, 2017 08:15
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Frankston posted:I like that I didn't find Lake Hylia until 60 hours in, whereas if I'd just turned to the right after I left the plateau I would have walked straight into it. It was my first stop after the plateau. Made it into the jungle-like area, met Kass and got my first shrine quest, which I followed until I came across a Wizzrobe that was too strong for early-game me, so I ran away like a coward and explored elsewhere. aware of dog posted:I gotcha, thanks. I tried feeding them, but I guess I just didn't give them enough meat 3-4 food pieces seems to be enough. I usually feed them an apple, meat, another apple. there are 2 doggos that lead you to star fragment chests turn left hillary!! noo posted:Diamonds are pretty rare; you can always get more but not quickly. Some armor upgrades and optional items require them, so I wouldn't sell them unless you need the cash now and are willing to spend some time later finding more. I have 30-40 diamonds after 180 hrs. They are somewhat rare but not that you couldn't sell a few if you're strapped for cash early on in the game. You can always get more by farming luminous stones and trading them at the Zora Village if you need them for upgrades. Of course there are better ways to make money.
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Jun 23, 2017 09:04
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Ventana posted:Oh okay, I thought you meant something actually unfinished left in the game. I think the issue was far more egregious in SS. Like MM reused engine and even assets from OOT but it doesn't matter because they successfully took the series in an interesting new direction (atmosphere-wise at least). SS had the new direction but not enough good stuff to mask the problems. Don't want to keep on at this, but I did hear production time was considerably shorter than it appeared on SS, both due to the experimental phase and,also a conflict between producers or somesuch that resulted in tons of rework. FWIW I think I was also conflating it with MM in my head which had a very short production time. But anyway BOTW = good.
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Jun 23, 2017 09:38
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Spergatory posted:The Sandship and Ancient Cistern were two of the best things to ever be in a Zelda game. Koloktos, the Ghirahim fights, and final Demise were some of the greatest boss battles in the entire franchise. Plus, Skyward Sword brought back sword beams. I loving love sword beams. The whole of Lanayru was awesome; I love time stones and I wish they'd make a comeback. I still couldn't be arsed to fight the Imprisoned again to finish, though, and I haven't been tempted to replay SS either.
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Jun 23, 2017 11:22
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Bongo Bill posted:The shrine you seek is kind of near a bridge across the canyon, and you can find Kass nearby. The trick to to side quest you're stuck on is that it's taking about kneeling, but the game has no kneel button, so you'll have to so the next closest thing. The latter one stumped me for at least 100 hours of gameplay. Not that I was thinking about it the while time, but I felt like an idiot when it finally dawned on me.
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Jun 23, 2017 13:24
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Been savescumming for the Fierce Deity parts and upgrading them and I noticed I never upgraded the "of the Wild" set. Do they really want me to get 15 energetic rhino beetles? Jesus Christ. Anyone have any advice for where to find these guys? I know the Sheikah set is the way to go to catch 'em, but drat. I think I've found 4 of them in probably 300+ hours combined playtimes.
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Jun 23, 2017 13:26
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Reinanigans posted:Been savescumming for the Fierce Deity parts and upgrading them and I noticed I never upgraded the "of the Wild" set. Use the Sheikah sensor and go to North Akkala. I think I got all the beetles I needed in less than half an hour. They are on trees, so just keep running through wooded areas.
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Jun 23, 2017 13:38
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IPA Regulations posted:
That's all the exact things I said and posted there: SS's first 2 years were experimental where they came up with a bunch of different concepts.The last 3 years were spent trying to put it all together. They said it was not wasted time, nor called it a rework. That's not really super troubled (or abnormal). The troubled bits you bring up sound like from the beginning of this interview, where they just had initial struggles with Wii Motion +. It doesn't say they scrapped much. You could argue the quote Miyamoto said where they said they "could've released a half finished product" 1 year before release as evidence it was behind schedule. But knowing Nintendo, that's not literally what they meant. Ventana fucked around with this message at 14:48 on Jun 23, 2017 |
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Jun 23, 2017 14:45
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Ventana posted:That's all the exact things I said and posted there: SS's first 2 years were experimental where they came up with a bunch of different concepts.The last 3 years were spent trying to put it all together. They said it was not wasted time, nor called it a rework. That's not really super troubled (or abnormal). You didn't mention the conflict between director/producer that the LP I watched speculated on. Apparently Miyamoto and Aonuma (went and looked up the names mentioned) disagreed on a good deal of things for a while in SS, and were trying to pull production in different directions, which wasted a fair amount of time, and the LPer speculated this was the reason for a lot of the game's issues i.e. reusing the bits that both could agree on to pad the games length, or something. Which I suppose is a bit different from pure "rushing" but the end result was the same - a game that was more than a little half-baked feeling with lots of padding, but some really cool dungeons. I don't have any articles to back this up and I appreciate it seems you know your stuff probably better than me on this, but for me it made sense as an explanation of why skyward sword was the way it was.
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Jun 23, 2017 15:05
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Reinanigans posted:Been savescumming for the Fierce Deity parts and upgrading them and I noticed I never upgraded the "of the Wild" set. I found a ton on the beach near Lurelin, especially when it rains. They're on the side of trees at eyelevel. Just approach the tree slowly so they don't fly away.
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Jun 23, 2017 15:46
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I can't believe I'm saying this but motion assisted stick aiming is actually really good and probably the most precise you can get on consoles. I was skeptical but it really works now
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Jun 23, 2017 16:33
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Bongo Bill posted:The shrine you seek is kind of near a bridge across the canyon, and you can find Kass nearby. The trick to to side quest you're stuck on is that it's taking about kneeling, but the game has no kneel button, so you'll have to so the next closest thing. Oh yes, perfect. Thank you. Will have an experiment later
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Jun 23, 2017 16:38
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IPA Regulations posted:
I get it why you're sticking to your points, at least. But it really is worth remembering that there are a lot of things that don't go as they seem on the outside, when you try to look at development. Lots of case examples where some small detail became a huge issue, or where some big features were put in at the last minute (though Goldeneye is an extreme example). Speculation on development is incredibly easy to do, and a lot of times I've seen that speculation turn out wrong. You're best guess is at best a 50/50 if you have no real substance to back it up. If the LP directly referenced some interview that I couldn't find in my ~2 minute google search, then that's cool + I'd like to see it. But usually 90% of the poo poo you get from normal LPs is hearsay (unless it's one of the super informative ones). I'd just like to stick mostly to the facts or reporting that we can look at, is all.
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Jun 23, 2017 17:15
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McDragon posted:Piss Christ, apparently you need 23 on this horse torture mini game for the Bridle. Oh well, out of charge, will try again later. Pretty Pony Dressup will be completed 1) Horse archery minigame: Revali's Bow is much better than the Ancient bow due to the multishot (and still has crazy distance, which means flat trajectory). 2) Take a gander, around Ridgeland Tower. Cross a Ridge, yeah that's the stuff, It's near a big tree, up on a bluff. 3) If is the shrine you seek, then you need to be humble to gain entry. How could one stoop so low as to encourage their friend Neal to do the same?
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Jun 23, 2017 19:21
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Drewjitsu posted:1) Horse archery minigame: Revali's Bow is much better than the Ancient bow due to the multishot (and still has crazy distance, which means flat trajectory). That bow is also a quick draw by default, so you can fire arrows super fast if need be.
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Jun 23, 2017 23:36
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Ventana posted:Speculation on development is incredibly easy to do, and a lot of times I've seen that speculation turn out wrong. You're best guess is at best a 50/50 if you have no real substance to back it up. If the LP directly referenced some interview that I couldn't find in my ~2 minute google search, then that's cool + I'd like to see it. But usually 90% of the poo poo you get from normal LPs is hearsay (unless it's one of the super informative ones). I'd just like to stick mostly to the facts or reporting that we can look at, is all. I get you. If you're interested enough to look it up, the LP was by chuggaconroy who apparently does have some a reputation for being pretty knowledgeable on nintendo stuff (though he is also twee sometimes as he caters to a young audience I guess), but gently caress knows which video it was. I think it was around the second playthrough of the woods section (Faron?), where he began to gripe about some of the game's problems. e: fwiw one of the reasons I'd guess there is not much 'official' word on creative differences troubling SS Nintendo is I feel they're a company that would not really publicize internal problems like that, but again, just my uneducated opinion. On BOTW aiming, I'm actually finding it kind of a pain in the rear end. A lot of the time I'll find myself trying to just use the sticks only to accidentally shift the gamepad and move off target when I want to fire. Trying to adjust with the gamepad also feels super janky - does the angle the gamepad is at from the TV/sensor bar have much of an impact on this? My TV is angled between two couches so it's tough to get it facing the bar dead on while playing without rearranging things, would that make a huge difference does anyone know? Because it's also entirely possible that I just suck. Tiocfaidh Yar Ma fucked around with this message at 23:42 on Jun 23, 2017 |
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Jun 23, 2017 23:38
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It's just gyroscopic. The Switch has no sensor to detect the location of the TV. I think you can disable it.
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Jun 23, 2017 23:39
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I should have specified, I'm talking about the Wii U version. I pretty much only wanted the console for Zelda so 400 bucks was too rich for my blood.
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Jun 23, 2017 23:41
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It still only uses the gyroscope.
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Jun 23, 2017 23:48
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Bongo Bill posted:It still only uses the gyroscope. That's interesting. I guess I was overthinking it trying to twist the gamepad around silly ways and loving myself over. Thanks.
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Jun 24, 2017 00:11
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IPA Regulations posted:
Yeah, that certainly could be the case as well and I acknowledged that before. That said, they did openly discuss these issues in the interviews themselves. It may be sugar-coated a bit, but I doubt it had to have been a huge fallout (otherwise we'd see a Yuji Naka or Hideo Kojima situation). IPA Regulations posted:I get you. If you're interested enough to look it up, the LP was by chuggaconroy who apparently does have some a reputation for being pretty knowledgeable on nintendo stuff (though he is also twee sometimes as he caters to a young audience I guess), but gently caress knows which video it was. I think it was around the second playthrough of the woods section (Faron?), where he began to gripe about some of the game's problems. Alright, I did look it up: he brought it up here. If you don't want to read a long response, basically he's talking hearsay and misreading what was actually reported. It's not a huge deal, but it does misrepresent the situation. He basically brought up 5 things, and I'll break them down: quote:1. SS was stuck in the planning phase for years quote:2. Aonuma and Miyamoto couldn't agree on anything; Aonuma wanted traditional controls, MIyamoto wanted motion controls This is basically true, though it's feels like it's a misread. Aonuma seemed on board motion controls at the beginning as well; it was only after the team failed to spark good use of Wii Motion + that he told the team to try working without it. Miyamoto did try to confront him about motion controls several times, but Aonuma wasn't convinced. Eventually, after the Wii Sports Resort producer The misread is in what was changed and when. WSR was in 2009, and by then they had already had multiple designs in the game with the "denseness" in mind. Certainly there had to have been big changes like Weapon enemies and layouts for the Eldin region, but it doesn't read like it was everything given all the other designs. quote:3. Miyamoto developed Wii Sports Resort to sell Aonuma on the idea of Motion Controls This doesn't seem true at all as far as I can find. WSR was planned before they even developed Wii Motion +, and picked the idea up again when WM+ gave them a new avenue to explore. This looks like a misread on the idea that Miyamoto was trying to sell Aonuma on the idea of WM+ after WSR by asking the producer to talk to Aonuma. quote:4. Miyamoto went behind Aonuma's back to change things This is a strange one, because it sounds reversed from what's been reported. Either this is a misread of Miyamoto asking the WSR producer to talk to Aonuma, or this is about the team sneaking in the Dash action before talking to Miyamoto. The latter case is explained in that article section to be kinda normal for the situation. quote:5. Meddling from #4 lead to the game only having a year and a half to finish This just looks like a misread on the timing of events. This could either talk about the WSR event from above, which would still be ~3 years like the team said, or it could from the whip incident I brought up before (which like I said before, isn't a correct conclusion to take from that snippet). tl;dr - SS had a long experimental development, but it wasn't exactly rushed. They planned quite early on to reuse the same areas with different content.
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Jun 24, 2017 05:33
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Also random note: the Iwata asks interviews for Skyward Sword are pretty extensive! They're actually really cool reads that everyone should check out or re-read. It's very interesting that they had a lot of similar intentions for what they did later in Botw, but with different perspectives about executing those intentions.
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Jun 24, 2017 05:35
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Just got BotW. How are you supposed to get to the shrines in the low temp areas? I found some spicy peppers but how do you cook food?
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Jun 24, 2017 15:56
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Nissin Cup Nudist posted:Just got BotW. How are you supposed to get to the shrines in the low temp areas? I found some spicy peppers but how do you cook food? The game doesn't explain this well. You'll see fires underneath metal pots around the world. Just hold the ingredients you want to use and walk up to one. It will prompt you for a button press to cook.
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Jun 24, 2017 16:00
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There are also alternatives to cooking food. Even on the Plateau before you find any cold-weather clothing there is at least one other way to keep warm. One of the best things about this game is thinking and/or discovering ways around obstacles like that, so I won't specify. Enjoy!
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Jun 24, 2017 16:04
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turn left hillary!! noo posted:There are also alternatives to cooking food. Even on the Plateau before you find any cold-weather clothing there is at least one other way to keep warm. "If you can think of it, it will probably work" is one of the best parts of BOTW's design philosophy
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Jun 24, 2017 16:06
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