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kurapika's new chain is strictly inferior to every other power theft nen we've seen. that's only natural, as specializing in one thing is usually better when it comes to nen.
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Jun 23, 2017 02:07
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tbp posted:its pretty funny how much gons abilities kinda suck compared to like 99% of the cast. they're so boring in a reader sense and straightforward as gently caress in a in-universe sense It's classic jojos.
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Jun 23, 2017 02:13
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MonsterEnvy posted:Leol's was not single use. He just only had access to an ability for 24 hours once he activated it. 1 hour, not 24. My memories hazy, but I think it worked like 1 favor = 1 IOU to use a power for 1 hour. Leol had to rip up the IOU thing, which seems to imply that once you've activated it, that particular favor has been paid off. Since Leol was already proficient in the use of the ability he used against Morrel, it seems likely that he can do multiple favors for the same person and get multiple IOUs from them. So it technically is a single use, but you can gather multiple uses. Sorta like consumable items.
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Jun 23, 2017 02:13
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The one hour thing was even pointed out because Leol listened to an album that was exactly 60 minutes, and it just so happened to be an album that Morrel himself liked.
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Jun 23, 2017 02:14
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Yeah misremembered. And he does not actually need to do a favor or anything he just needs to get them to say they owe him a favor.
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Jun 23, 2017 02:17
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Yeah his plan was to get a Royal Guard or Meruem to owe him a favour.
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Jun 23, 2017 02:38
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EmmyOk posted:Yeah his plan was to get a Royal Guard or Meruem to owe him a favour. Getting an hour of 'eat people to permanently gain their powers' is a pretty nice goal.
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Jun 23, 2017 02:41
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Turin Turambar posted:Yes, it seems to have some drawbacks. The normal function is to suck someone's Nen and put him in a temporal Zetsu state, but it needs x seconds to act, the victim can defend himself and quit the syringe from himself before he is 'empty'. To steal the ability Kurapica need Emperor Time, which is limited, and even then it's a single use and after that the power returns to the owner. He also can't get rid of abilities without using them (tricky if there's conditionals) and he's stuck in Emperor Time until he uses it up, which is probably dangerous because IIRC the red eyes state is supposed to be like some sort of supercharged adrenaline rush and overusing it risks crashing hard.
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Jun 23, 2017 03:09
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Kurapika became even more of a Swiss Army Nen Knife, huh. I'm pretty sure sooner or later trying to do EVERYTHING by himself is gonna backfire, especially now that they're stuck on the MURDERBOAT. Also he has an option now, that's cute!
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Jun 23, 2017 03:13
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Kyte posted:He also can't get rid of abilities without using them (tricky if there's conditionals) and he's stuck in Emperor Time until he uses it up, which is probably dangerous because IIRC the red eyes state is supposed to be like some sort of supercharged adrenaline rush and overusing it risks crashing hard. Also it takes time for his syringe to empty the target of Aura and Ability.
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Jun 23, 2017 03:15
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I wonder how hard or uncommon it is to make nen objects with a degree of sapience. A bunch of them seem to have personality and not always perfectly aligned with the user's wishes.
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Jun 23, 2017 03:27
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i think that's probably due to any decently skilled nen user being weird as heck.
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Jun 23, 2017 04:44
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Dias posted:Kurapika became even more of a Swiss Army Nen Knife, huh. I'm pretty sure sooner or later trying to do EVERYTHING by himself is gonna backfire, especially now that they're stuck on the MURDERBOAT. Also he has an option now, that's cute! I mean, Izunabi explicitly called him out on that and he even acknowledged it in his pre-reveal monologue. It's definitely going to cause him problems. Even more than it already has, I mean. Kyte posted:I wonder how hard or uncommon it is to make nen objects with a degree of sapience. A bunch of them seem to have personality and not always perfectly aligned with the user's wishes. I think it's in part a preference or personality thing of the creator. Probably part of how things like habits, personal flairs, and so on (like Gon always doing his "Show me rock" thing and Hisoka naming his abilities after his favorite candies) improve an ability's effectiveness, due to personal... Synergy? Appeal? There's a word here I'm looking for but can't find. The really interesting thing is what this implies about Kurapika. Despite his edgy loner exterior, apparently something about him makes the ideal way for his nen to manifest apparently be as an artistic little dolphin robot helper thing. That's kind of funny, and also cute in a way I guess. Guy has a lot more personality than he tries to let on.
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Jun 23, 2017 04:54
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tbp posted:i mean i get the eventual disparity in power but its kinda weird that chrollo has to go through absurd lengths to get access to his stolen abilities (albeit he can then use them essentially forever) but kurapika just uses a syringe It's sort of the cosmic balancing act for Nen abilities. Zeno deduced that a stealing ability like Chrollos's needs a larger number of restrictions to be made which should imply that other similar abilities are equally complicated. While people like Leol and Kurapika, who can only take things temporarily, have really light restrictions. Hate-Senpai posted:1 hour, not 24.  I'm a bit confused as to why people look down on his ability. I think the only thing holding it back was the same thing that held Cheetu back, the user was overconfident and not used to nen combat. (Also going up against Morel)
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Jun 23, 2017 05:07
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Brought To You By posted:I'm a bit confused as to why people look down on his ability. I think the only thing holding it back was the same thing that held Cheetu back, the user was overconfident and not used to nen combat. (Also going up against Morel) I think it's in part because "Kurapika is OP" is something of a thing here, so people immediately took his ability as worse than Leol's, which we also saw quite a while ago so the details weren't fresh in our memories. Plus, him getting clowned in such an ignominious way affects how he's remembered.
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Jun 23, 2017 05:18
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Morau's a beast though
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Jun 23, 2017 05:50
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Brought To You By posted:It's sort of the cosmic balancing act for Nen abilities. Zeno deduced that a stealing ability like Chrollos's needs a larger number of restrictions to be made which should imply that other similar abilities are equally complicated. While people like Leol and Kurapika, who can only take things temporarily, have really light restrictions. The narration does note that "number of rentals recorded" is a category alongside with the name and the ability, so it would seem to imply that there is a limit. EDIT: Of course, I'm assuming that "number of rentals recorded" means how many times a particular ability can be rented (in other words how many favors Leol has done for the ability's owner) and not how many total rentals (different abilities) there are in the device.
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Jun 23, 2017 05:57
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I think people just tended to look down on ability stealing/copying in general before the Hisoka vs Chrollo fight. Since nen abilities are so personalized, you wouldn't really expect a bunch of unfamiliar abilities to work as well as a single ability or two that really suit the user.
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Jun 23, 2017 06:09
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It probably also didn't help that people with nen stealing powers didn't really have that great a track record till Hisoka vs Chrollo. Chrollo couldn't steal mid-fight when up against someone as good as Silva and Zeno, plus when he did bring out Owl's cloth thing his combat ability was further hampered because both of his hands were occupied (one with the book, the other with the cloth). It made hand-to-hand combat virtually impossible. Chrollo had to modify his own ability to make it something that could work in an actual fight. Prior to that, he killed some random mercenary assassin but a nameless dude doesn't really count. Leol also died, but to be fair, he just had the worst luck in picking an opponent. Morrel was a) a Sea Hunter, meaning an ability that creates a mass of water isn't going to hinder him much, and b) friends with the original owner of the ability, meaning he had a grasp of how it worked.
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Jun 23, 2017 06:13
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Chrollo was just terrible with his ability during his fight against Zeno and Silva, all he did was wave it around a bit and then he ended up shelving his book because it didn't do jack poo poo for him.
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Jun 23, 2017 06:19
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Kyte posted:I wonder how hard or uncommon it is to make nen objects with a degree of sapience. A bunch of them seem to have personality and not always perfectly aligned with the user's wishes. Obviously making the nen object an rear end in a top hat increases its power.
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Jun 23, 2017 07:08
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trucutru posted:Obviously making the nen object an rear end in a top hat increases its power. The ultimate restriction: Being completely insufferable.
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Jun 23, 2017 07:46
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Hate-Senpai posted:Chrollo was just terrible with his ability during his fight against Zeno and Silva, all he did was wave it around a bit and then he ended up shelving his book because it didn't do jack poo poo for him. To be fair he wasn't trying to win, he was just buying time.
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Jun 23, 2017 09:00
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Hate-Senpai posted:It probably also didn't help that people with nen stealing powers didn't really have that great a track record till Hisoka vs Chrollo. Meruem stole powers from the strongest creatures alive but it didn't help him for poo poo.
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Jun 23, 2017 09:36
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RatHat posted:To be fair he wasn't trying to win, he was just buying time. Even worse than that, he was trying to capture them to steal their powers.
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Jun 23, 2017 09:49
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By Netero's standards Chrollo is one of the people living up to what it means to be a hunter.
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Jun 23, 2017 10:16
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Kyte posted:I wonder how hard or uncommon it is to make nen objects with a degree of sapience. A bunch of them seem to have personality and not always perfectly aligned with the user's wishes. Iirc it was said in a blurb during YS arc that manipulated or conjured items could get a personality if used enough. Raizer also talked about how Goreinu's power wasn't yet able to be kept up when he was unconscious, so I suspect that having an item has has a personality is one of the common ways to do that. Given that this particular chain 'forces' the nen to stay active, that seems to follow that theme too (so he can't just stop it by getting unconscious).
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Jun 23, 2017 10:26
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Just re-read the arc up to the new chapter. I can't tell if it's because of a bad translation or what but a lot of the dialogue early on in the arc was next to impossible to parse. When the V5, the Zodiacs, and Pariston's group were talking about the voyage planning and Beyond and his motives and all that, I had to read over panels multiple times and it still didn't help for a lot of it. But I think things started to smooth out a bit once Hisoka vs Chrollo happened. Regarding the new chapter: I like and appreciate Kurapika. That's all for now.
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Jun 23, 2017 11:30
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TriffTshngo posted:Just re-read the arc up to the new chapter. I can't tell if it's because of a bad translation or what but a lot of the dialogue early on in the arc was next to impossible to parse. When the V5, the Zodiacs, and Pariston's group were talking about the voyage planning and Beyond and his motives and all that, I had to read over panels multiple times and it still didn't help for a lot of it. But I think things started to smooth out a bit once Hisoka vs Chrollo happened. It's not you, I remember dropping Hunter X Hunter for a while because I couldn't make head nor tail of the V5 and Travel Board chapters. Even the official translation can be hard to follow but that's because Togashi kind of drops you into the middle of things but it's so much clearer it's insane. Even the good parts of the fan translation are really ropey too. When they're on the boat and Mizaitom is telling Kurapika about the problems there it's a big difference. Fan translation: "A rumour some criminal gang is causing peoples tickets to be invalidated due to that person supposedly already being on board" - this lead to people thinking the Troupe was in action! Official Translation: "There's a rumour that if you commit a crime your ticket is invalidated and someone on the waiting list gets it. Further more if you report a ticket holder's crime you get their ticket" I checked mangafox and they still have the pure muck translation but mangastream have one that's much closer to the official release!
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Jun 23, 2017 12:05
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giving nen a flaw can make it more powerful, but that only works when it is someone who was already capable of becoming powerful to begin with. too little ambition and you end up like the dog control guy. too much and you end up like the clone dude from the arena.
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Jun 23, 2017 13:10
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The best way is the base nen on a physical attribute, like lungs for morau or electricity resistance for killua
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Jun 23, 2017 13:27
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Who's watched darker than black? The nen conditions are quite similar to the remunerations in that series, the big difference being that the contractors don't get to choose them.
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Jun 23, 2017 13:32
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sharktamer posted:Who's watched darker than black? The nen conditions are quite similar to the remunerations in that series, the big difference being that the contractors don't get to choose them. The other big difference is that the strength of ability didn't relate to the cost. Sure Havoc had an absurdly strong power and had to drink the blood of children but you had a teleporter who only had to set rocks in a pattern, laser whip guy had to dogear books, November 11 just had to smoke, and April who only had to have can of beer. Their remuneration also came after and was separate to their ability rather than a condition they had to fulfill to use it.
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Jun 23, 2017 14:36
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Hate-Senpai posted:The narration does note that "number of rentals recorded" is a category alongside with the name and the ability, so it would seem to imply that there is a limit. That bit of wording is the deal breaker for his ability. I interpret it as "the number of times the ability has been used" like a ticker counting up. But the image we see has a bunch of 1's listed next to abilities so it's possible that he does have to continually get more favors to increase uses. In that regard it's probably a bit more wieldy than Kurapika's since it doesn't force Leol to remain in a state of body that wears him out, and he can presumably stack uses as well as retain multiple powers. I'm waiting to see what else Kurapika's thief ability can do and how long he can use the ability before it dissipates. Roland Jones posted:I think it's in part because "Kurapika is OP" is something of a thing here, That's a thing everywhere which is understandable. When Kurapika shows up after the HA arc he's got the most developed ability while Gon and Killua had just learned fundamentals. His ability is still one of the more flexible ones in the series, allowing him access to multiple types of Nen, and a way to counteract the affinity problem. And with this new power he's got even more tools at his disposal since he can take other people's powers. I don't think he's OP but that wasn't after Greed Island where we saw a wider variety of Nen abilities plus a greater emphasis on using fundamentals in combat. quote:Plus, him getting clowned in such an ignominious way affects how he's remembered.
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Jun 23, 2017 16:14
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A fusion of Morel and Mel would just utterly destroy the setting.
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Jun 23, 2017 17:57
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Leol even had the advantage. He just lost due to something he could never have seen coming. The guy trapped underwater sucking too much oxygen from the underground room they were in using his stupidly strong lungs. Had Leol chose an area without a ceiling that would not have happened, but he can't really be blamed for it, cause no one would have seen that coming.
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Jun 23, 2017 18:22
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MonsterEnvy posted:Leol even had the advantage. He just lost due to something he could never have seen coming. The guy trapped underwater sucking too much oxygen from the underground room they were in using his stupidly strong lungs. Had Leol chose an area without a ceiling that would not have happened, but he can't really be blamed for it, cause no one would have seen that coming. That's the explanation to get past the censors, the real answer is that Leol is a loving lightweight and can't keep his powers going when stoned.
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Jun 23, 2017 18:25
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don't hotbox your cat, kids.
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Jun 23, 2017 18:39
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Roland Jones posted:The ultimate restriction: Being completely insufferable. So Knuckle has the most powerful ability of all time?
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Jun 23, 2017 22:49
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Roland Jones posted:The ultimate restriction: Being completely insufferable. Nah the old man spider died pretty easily
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Jun 23, 2017 22:54
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