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sexpig by night posted:Also you haven't actually interacted with most of these kinds of people have you? I've interacted with various people who held opinions that ranged from questionable to horrible. Some ended up getting better, some didn't. It's not an exact science. I can say I've never met anyone who changed their opinion upon being threatened with violence, though.
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Jun 27, 2017 00:09
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Bakeneko posted:No, the old ways of trying to intimidate people who speak racist ideas into silence or pretend that they don’t exist in the hopes that they’ll go away. That’s what doesn’t work. Countering untrue facts with the truth is important and it’s one thing that the article promotes. Countering with facts just makes these people double down on their beliefs. Critical thinking is definitely important, but the Sargon's of the world think they're already pros at that. The skeptic/atheist crowd actively refused to admit a woman might have felt uncomfortable at a con, and suggested she be more polite to the guy following her. People tend to agree with racist facts because they're already racist in lots of little unexamined ways. You can't change someone's mind all at once by giving them a bunch of facts any more than you can by screaming at them. The trouble is, these things take more time and energy than most marginalised people can afford to invest. That's why having allies do it is actually kind of good, because they have an extra buffer of privilege. Unfortunately, it also means they get attacked for trying by people who mean well, I guess. Anyway, the RLM Transformers reviews are very good and insightful.
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Jun 27, 2017 00:20
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kaleidolia posted:Countering with facts just makes these people double down on their beliefs. Critical thinking is definitely important, but the Sargon's of the world think they're already pros at that. The skeptic/atheist crowd actively refused to admit a woman might have felt uncomfortable at a con, and suggested she be more polite to the guy following her. Yeah, in the case of debating with the real bad guys like Sargon, the goal wouldn’t be to convince him, but to convince some of the wavering bystanders who might otherwise just listen to him and accept what he’s saying. Not that I envy anyone who would actually try to take on that dinosaur.
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Jun 27, 2017 00:46
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I found out a new channel yesterday Strat-Edgy, another guy with long form videos but I found his video "Hyper-normalization and Gaming" interesting. He relates his conditioning in the army with micro transactions. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AdI757JhSeU
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Jun 27, 2017 00:48
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TheMaestroso posted:He took it down and uploaded a revised version because of stuff he explains in a more recent video. Gotcha. Good thing YouTube has absolutely amazing UI/UX like this A+ good jorb.
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Jun 27, 2017 00:52
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Bakeneko posted:Yeah, in the case of debating with the real bad guys like Sargon, the goal wouldn’t be to convince him, but to convince some of the wavering bystanders who might otherwise just listen to him and accept what he’s saying. Not that I envy anyone who would actually try to take on that dinosaur. lol
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Jun 27, 2017 01:03
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I assume since they're still talking about 'debating' that they mean "The guys that are irreversibly stuck with their heads up their rear end" on that one, not that Sargon is worse than the literal neo-nazis.
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Jun 27, 2017 01:13
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Sterling took the video down and reuploaded because it had an email address belonging to the game's developer in it that shitheads sent horrible things to.
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Jun 27, 2017 01:16
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Yardbomb posted:I assume since they're still talking about 'debating' that they mean "The guys that are irreversibly stuck with their heads up their rear end" on that one, not that Sargon is worse than the literal neo-nazis. Exactly. He hasn't murdered anyone so he's not at the absolute bottom of the barrel, but he's still among the lowest of the online pundits.
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Jun 27, 2017 01:21
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Bakeneko posted:Exactly. He hasn't murdered anyone so he's not at the absolute bottom of the barrel, but he's still among the lowest of the online pundits. He's definitely caused real harm to his targets that he won't even take responsibility for, which is the absolute lowest bar for moral action. He got Laci Green doxxed by arguing for weeks that she lied about being raped, for example.
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Jun 27, 2017 02:05
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Bakeneko posted:Exactly. He hasn't murdered anyone so he's not at the absolute bottom of the barrel, but he's still among the lowest of the online pundits. Are you sure youre not setting the bar too high?
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Jun 27, 2017 02:57
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MariusLecter posted:Are you sure youre not setting the bar too high? What aspect of what I said are you objecting to? Yeah, I was a bit flippant with that comment but I didn’t mean anything by it other than "he's not the worst person in the world but he definitely qualifies as a bad guy so I'm not sure why someone would go lol at the suggestion."
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Jun 27, 2017 07:06
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Why is it that you only seem to white knight people that seem to lean towards the right or hosed up by saying something that can be perceived as courting a certain segment of people. For example just because someone isn't spouting racial slurs doesn't mean that they aren't saying hosed up stuff that needs criticism. Why do you always only seem to give people who might be or clearly skirt the right the benefit of the doubt? and why do you always seem to say "hey this person is as bad as X so why are we being critical of them?". Whelp he ain't Hitler so no point in spending time criticizing him or being mean to them. Look, sometimes some people in here can feel overly shouty (me included), but it's mostly because some topics are pretty emotional for a lot of people. It's frustrating to see people "rational" manning all over stuff that has very real consequences and emotional and tangable impacts on a lot of people. I've seen the "poor 16 year old boys who get courted by the right" poo poo so many places. How about the poor 16 year old POCs, women and gay people who feel increasingly attacked and their valid concerns handwaved away as whiny milenial bullshit? Oh no one or two nazis got punched that is not the way to go you guys, but none of that gets said by the people trying so hard to balance on the edge when the other side does the same poo poo and have done so for a loooooong time.
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Jun 27, 2017 11:16
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So anyway, Kim has just finished there review of Final Fantasy VIII, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vVDgbl7OZgs I held of watching because I don't like waiting for the next part and internet reviewers can be prone to really bad schedule slipping. See you all in a few hours I guess.
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Jun 27, 2017 11:38
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Her review made me so nostalgic that I bought the game. It was my first FF game so I like it way more than it deserves. But drat had I forgotten how convoluted the story and lore is.
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Jun 27, 2017 12:04
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Baka-nin posted:So anyway, Kim has just finished there review of Final Fantasy VIII, KJ is remarkable in that regard, hour long documentaries come out on Mondays like clockwork. All assembled with a narrative, obscure old footage and a mountain of research. I always know what I'll do doing while having my Monday morning cup of tea. Seems impossible, KJ must have 10 day weeks and 48 hour days.
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Jun 27, 2017 12:16
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Sarcopenia posted:Why is it that you only seem to white knight people that seem to lean towards the right or hosed up by saying something that can be perceived as courting a certain segment of people. For example just because someone isn't spouting racial slurs doesn't mean that they aren't saying hosed up stuff that needs criticism. Why do you always only seem to give people who might be or clearly skirt the right the benefit of the doubt? and why do you always seem to say "hey this person is as bad as X so why are we being critical of them?". In this case I started out by defending group of left-leaning video makers from people who were attacking them for what I considered to be a very stupid reason. Lindsay, Hbomb and Contrapoints have devoted many hours of their lives to producing quality videos, and while I may not agree with everything each of them has said I respect their dedication to their work. And yet one “mistake” (that I don’t even consider a mistake) results in them being put in the crosshairs. That isn’t fair, and I try to speak up for those who I think are being treated unfairly and who don’t already seem to have a lot of people on their side. Sarcopenia posted:Look, sometimes some people in here can feel overly shouty (me included), but it's mostly because some topics are pretty emotional for a lot of people. It's frustrating to see people "rational" manning all over stuff that has very real consequences and emotional and tangable impacts on a lot of people. I've seen the "poor 16 year old boys who get courted by the right" poo poo so many places. How about the poor 16 year old POCs, women and gay people who feel increasingly attacked and their valid concerns handwaved away as whiny milenial bullshit? Oh no one or two nazis got punched that is not the way to go you guys, but none of that gets said by the people trying so hard to balance on the edge when the other side does the same poo poo and have done so for a loooooong time. None of us can help the way we feel. That’s fine; that’s just how humans work. What we can do is try to the best of our abilities to avoid having our emotions cloud our judgement when it comes to the important issues. I’m not immune to this by any stretch of the imagination, in fact it’s something I struggle with a lot, but I also believe that it must be done because nothing good ever comes from witch-hunts and snap judgements. I’m not trying to handwave away anyone’s feelings; what I am saying is that people should be careful that they don’t attack the wrong target, or attack the right target so much so that the "punishment" ends up far in excess of the crime. On the internet especially, a large number of people who feel threatened can turn into a hostile, unthinking mob very quickly, and mob justice is no justice at all.
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Jun 27, 2017 12:22
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Bakeneko posted:I’m not trying to handwave away anyone’s feelings; what I am saying is that people should be careful that they don’t attack the wrong target, or attack the right target so much so that the "punishment" ends up far in excess of the crime. On the internet especially, a large number of people who feel threatened can turn into a hostile, unthinking mob very quickly, and mob justice is no justice at all. I'm not trying to gang up on you but I'm genuinely confused by this. How are we to treat them if said person is spouting hateful rhetoric that has a very real and deleterious effect on the lives of others? People like Sargon, ShoeOnHead and the Armored Skeptic are normalizing dangerous ideologies to fairly large audiences and, as such, should be treated with the flagrant disrespect they show towards the minority communities they're attempting to delegitimize.
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Jun 27, 2017 13:23
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Vanderdeath posted:I'm not trying to gang up on you but I'm genuinely confused by this. How are we to treat them if said person is spouting hateful rhetoric that has a very real and deleterious effect on the lives of others? People like Sargon, ShoeOnHead and the Armored Skeptic are normalizing dangerous ideologies to fairly large audiences and, as such, should be treated with the flagrant disrespect they show towards the minority communities they're attempting to delegitimize. With that line I was referring to people like Pewdiepie, who do something like making a single offensive joke but end up getting dogpiled and accused of being full-time alt-right supporters. They’re not innocent and they do deserve criticism but at the same time I don’t think they deserve the level of hate they get. Also, I think a distinction needs to be made between the different people you mentioned. I know about some of the awful things Sargon has done, which is why I put him in a different category, but what about the other two? What exactly have they said that causes you to lump them together with him? EDIT: The question of what to do about people who do spread misinformation is a complicated one and I don’t claim to have all the answers. I’m not saying that you have to listen to them or reach out to them if you don’t feel comfortable doing so. That’s fine; I don’t enjoy interacting with people like that either. You don’t have to respect them or their bullshit ideas, either, but you have to at least realize that emotion-based insults directed at them only causes them to entrench further. Most importantly, you need to know that they aren’t all the same. You can’t just put them all together and assume they’re a hivemind. Different people believe stupid and incorrect things for different reasons, and not all of those who repeat hateful ideas do so out of hate. If even some of them can change their minds then that means less bigots in the world, which should be the point of all this, right? Bakeneko fucked around with this message at 14:13 on Jun 27, 2017 |
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Jun 27, 2017 13:43
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I dunno how popular MovieBob is around here, but I kind of liked his fantasy recast of Spider-Man in the MCU with bringing back Tobi Maguire as Peter Parker and retroactively tying those Spider-Man movies into the MCU.
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Jun 27, 2017 14:18
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SgtSteel91 posted:I dunno how popular MovieBob is around here, but I kind of liked his fantasy recast of Spider-Man in the MCU with bringing back Tobi Maguire as Peter Parker and retroactively tying those Spider-Man movies into the MCU.
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Jun 27, 2017 14:26
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SgtSteel91 posted:I dunno how popular MovieBob is around here, but I kind of liked his fantasy recast of Spider-Man in the MCU with bringing back Tobi Maguire as Peter Parker and retroactively tying those Spider-Man movies into the MCU.  don't really see why they'd need to bring back the actor to do that, they used to tie things together all the time when they did a total recast, just splice in some clips and a voice over and hey presto, if they wanted to do that
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Jun 27, 2017 14:49
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Baka-nin posted:
Yes! They should do Spiderman like the Witchcraft sequels!
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Jun 27, 2017 14:58
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 couldn't hurt. Hell including borderline pornography might actually help revitalise the franchise
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Jun 27, 2017 15:10
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Deciding that everything needs tying in to everything else in a very literal way is why we're getting increasingly lovely movie 'universes'. It's terrible and it sucks.
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Jun 27, 2017 15:58
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DrVenkman posted:Deciding that everything needs tying in to everything else in a very literal way is why we're getting increasingly lovely movie 'universes'. It's terrible and it sucks. I mean, yea but considering the MCU are the ones who famously did it right...
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Jun 27, 2017 16:04
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The only good cinematic universes are the Toho Godzilla eras and they don't even feel the need to connect eras with anything other than the first movie at most. Except Against Mechagodzilla tying itself into Mothra and... I wanna say Frankenstein Conquers The World? I'm not on the up and up with the nonGodzilla/Gamera Showa era kaiju movies.
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Jun 27, 2017 16:25
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Baragon is the one who fought giant Frankenstein, Frankenstein was the good guy in that I wanna say the nazis were involved too? Was frankenstein a nazi? That'd be awkward.
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Jun 27, 2017 16:27
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sexpig by night posted:Baragon is the one who fought giant Frankenstein They just sorta mention the movie at the beginning of Against Mechagodzilla in the Millenium era as a "Godzilla hasn't been around for like 40 years but we have had other monsters to deal with" and retroactively insisted they killed Mothra with heat waves until the sequel contradicts it.
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Jun 27, 2017 16:29
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sexpig by night posted:I mean, yea but considering the MCU are the ones who famously did it right... They're not doing it right at all. Character growth and motivation often vanish between films. They have cross overs, but when it comes to having a cohesive world, they screw up the finer details. Insomuch that character x appears in character y's movie, they do a good job yeah.
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Jun 27, 2017 16:29
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That Universal Monsters thing will be good if and only if it leads to a revival of those Abbott and Costello style movies but with Key and Peele
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Jun 27, 2017 17:16
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Vanderdeath posted:I'm not trying to gang up on you but I'm genuinely confused by this. How are we to treat them if said person is spouting hateful rhetoric that has a very real and deleterious effect on the lives of others? People like Sargon, ShoeOnHead and the Armored Skeptic are normalizing dangerous ideologies to fairly large audiences and, as such, should be treated with the flagrant disrespect they show towards the minority communities they're attempting to delegitimize. I think what Bakaneko is getting at is that some people look at the disdain towards people like Sargon, and they start applying towards people who they feel are the same. The problem is that they get so overzealous about it that they target people who aren't totally deserving of it, or are so relentless that it begins to alienate people. Moviebob is one example of someone who decries racists and bigots online, but at the same time, he's crossed into this really disturbing mindset that the people who voted for Trump or just blue-collar America in general are beyond redemption.
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Jun 27, 2017 17:21
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Honestly Tom Holland is easily the best Peter Parker so far. I would prefer to keep having him in that role.
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Jun 27, 2017 17:27
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FlamingLiberal posted:Honestly Tom Holland is easily the best Peter Parker so far. I would prefer to keep having him in that role. I would wait until the movie is out before declaring that. I get people are desperate for that but you would think they would learn their lessons.
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Jun 27, 2017 17:32
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DrVenkman posted:Deciding that everything needs tying in to everything else in a very literal way is why we're getting increasingly lovely movie 'universes'. It's terrible and it sucks.
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Jun 27, 2017 17:35
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CharlestheHammer posted:I would wait until the movie is out before declaring that. We've already seen him turn out a great Spidey performance in Civil War .
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Jun 27, 2017 17:37
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And people thought Garfield was great. People are often wrong.
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Jun 27, 2017 17:47
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Holland has potential, but it'll all come down to the writing. There were a couple of Spidey lines in Civil War that came off as a little stilted and awkward and it felt more the script's fault than the acting.
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Jun 27, 2017 17:52
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CharlestheHammer posted:And people thought Garfield was great. garfield at least gave us lasagna cat so it has been a net positive for the world
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Jun 27, 2017 18:17
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Didn't Edgar Wright get fired/quit because Marvel wanted him to jam a million useless cameos into antman, a movie he had wanted to make for over a decade.
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Jun 27, 2017 18:30
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