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https://twitter.com/senatorcollins/status/879471862694256641 seems to be going over well imo
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Jun 27, 2017 00:08
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Zikan posted:https://twitter.com/senatorcollins/status/879471862694256641 This sounds like an actual good thing. Is hope alive?!
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Jun 27, 2017 00:11
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Cactus Jack posted:This sounds like an actual good thing. Is hope alive?! Yes. She's still Senator Collins so seeming moderate and then voting with the conservatives once she's gotten good press is still usually the most likely bet, but her statement was a lot stronger than you'd expect if she was planning on backing down.
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Jun 27, 2017 00:13
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Rad Valtar posted:I mean all this points to single payer as the number one solution. We just have to reprogram millions of people or have them all die. The only way we get single payer is if the richest Republican kills off everyone else.
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Jun 27, 2017 00:21
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If they do pass it I will go ahead and call the snowball effect that losing that many people from the market will cause when the Healthcare industry which employs a shitload of people starts laying people off and then those people cannot get insurance
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Jun 27, 2017 00:25
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Rad Valtar posted:I mean all this points to single payer as the number one solution. We just have to reprogram millions of people or have them all die. Single payer will not solve the millions of people retiring in poor health flooding our health system. We need massive reforms at every point of the system - from our overlong schooling and residency programs to our for profit hospital and pharma schemes. Seniors are going to start dying a lot more when being treated in this country either way you cut it. There is no humanitarian way to deal with this crisis. Even Japan is basically forcing people to weight a certain level or not receive health care.
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Jun 27, 2017 01:32
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Is McCain voting for this piece of poo poo? I thought he was a moderate, or somewhat. Per NY Times there are about 25 unclear votes. Maybe some sane conservatives in there.
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Jun 27, 2017 03:15
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Mokelumne Trekka posted:Is McCain voting for this piece of poo poo? I thought he was a moderate, or somewhat. This speaks to the effectiveness of his marketing https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/congress-trump-score/john-mccain/
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Jun 27, 2017 03:19
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Mokelumne Trekka posted:Is McCain voting for this piece of poo poo? I thought he was a moderate, or somewhat. McCain may have, at one point, been a moderating influence in the GOP. That ended around 2000. And was forever dead and buried in 2008.
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Jun 27, 2017 03:21
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Mokelumne Trekka posted:Is McCain voting for this piece of poo poo? I thought he was a moderate, or somewhat. yes, he has loads of concerns with it but apparently voting against it as a result isnt how things work
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Jun 27, 2017 03:42
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If there's a big problem with insurers not participating in non-group markets in some states, wouldn't that be the easiest way to slide in the public option as a compromise? Just say it can only operate where there are no other options under a certain price and, voila, I'm sure private insurers will begin offering plans just to preclude the public option gaining a viable toehold.
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Jun 27, 2017 03:53
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ThisIsWhyTrumpWon posted:Single payer will not solve the millions of people retiring in poor health flooding our health system. Actually single payer will solve that problem, because human empathy will overcome a number on a piece of paper written down by rich people.
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Jun 27, 2017 04:43
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awesmoe posted:This speaks to the effectiveness of his marketing like 80% of those are votes on trump's nominees... and he's still the third lowest score re agreeing w trump?
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Jun 27, 2017 05:20
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Freakazoid_ posted:Actually single payer will solve that problem, because human empathy will overcome a number on a piece of paper written down by rich people. Is that anything like praying the AIDS away? That seems to work pretty well
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Jun 27, 2017 05:40
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I've talked to some of my friends working as lobbyists in DC and The 2017 Omnibus Better Care Reconciliation Act, or whatever they end up calling it, will never get to Trump's grubby orange fingers to sign.
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Jun 27, 2017 05:47
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Freakazoid_ posted:Actually single payer will solve that problem, because human empathy will overcome a number on a piece of paper written down by rich people. While I totally disagree with the guy you quoted, this is absurd.
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Jun 27, 2017 06:30
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The Phlegmatist posted:I've talked to some of my friends working as lobbyists in DC and Are you talking about the bill which gets drafted, if this one is shut down? And why do you have several lobbyist friends.
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Jun 27, 2017 06:46
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cant cook creole bream posted:And why do you have several lobbyist friends. Probably knows a couple interns on K street.
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Jun 27, 2017 07:11
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Azhais posted:What are those people going to do, vote Democrat? Like some sort of Liberal pussy? Not to mention gerrymandering, vote rigging, and now tacitly endorsing hacking by a foreign power. Our country is actively being sold out literally and figuratively by traitors sinking to somehow surprising new depths.
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Jun 27, 2017 09:59
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Azhais posted:What are those people going to do, vote Democrat? Like some sort of Liberal pussy? They don't have to vote Democrat. If even a small percentage of them just stay home, that's a big deal.
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Jun 27, 2017 10:11
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:McCain may have, at one point, been a moderating influence in the GOP. That ended around 2000. And was forever dead and buried in 2008. Yeah; he likes to make a lot of noise about working together, and how bad this healthcare bill is, etc.....and then he just votes along party lines anyway.
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Jun 27, 2017 10:16
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cant cook creole bream posted:Are you talking about the bill which gets drafted, if this one is shut down? There will be a third bill drafted if the Senate bill passes, through a conference committee, which then must again be voted on by both chambers. And there's been a bit of grumbling in the House about how "they better not change it."
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Jun 27, 2017 11:34
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cant cook creole bream posted:Are you talking about the bill which gets drafted, if this one is shut down? Not all lobbyists are bad and evil. I have friends that work for left-wing and left-leaning lobbying groups like the ASPCA, ACLU, etc.
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Jun 27, 2017 13:16
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Ormi posted:There will be a third bill drafted if the Senate bill passes, through a conference committee, which then must again be voted on by both chambers. And there's been a bit of grumbling in the House about how "they better not change it." I think the House is just going to vote on the Senate bill.
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Jun 27, 2017 13:19
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Freakazoid_ posted:Actually single payer will solve that problem, because human empathy will overcome a number on a piece of paper written down by rich people. You don't seem to understand that Healthcare is a limited resource.
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Jun 27, 2017 14:09
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Queering Wheel posted:They don't have to vote Democrat. If even a small percentage of them just stay home, that's a big deal. Pretty much. Getting an R to vote D (or vice versa) is difficult; convincing a non-voting D to vote and a voting R to stay home has the same net effect & is far simpler.
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Jun 27, 2017 14:26
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ThisIsWhyTrumpWon posted:You don't seem to understand that Healthcare is a limited resource. Bullshit. We have more than enough healthcare to go around. What we're short on is money, and that's because the money-grubbing thieves in power on both sides nothing but grift and cut taxes for the ultrarich, loving everyone else over.
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Jun 27, 2017 14:26
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ThisIsWhyTrumpWon posted:You don't seem to understand that Healthcare is a limited resource. lol, funny how the most resource rich country in the world has the biggest problems with this, isn't it
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Jun 27, 2017 15:13
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ThisIsWhyTrumpWon posted:You don't seem to understand that Healthcare is a limited resource. unlike the Ingenuity of the Small Business Owner, which is of course limitless, only a limited amount of health exists to be chipped out by pickaxes from the Health Mines
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Jun 27, 2017 15:28
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Ze Pollack posted:unlike the Ingenuity of the Small Business Owner, which is of course limitless, only a limited amount of health exists to be chipped out by pickaxes from the Health Mines We'd get more health if we sacrificed more to the altar of the almighty job creator.
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Jun 27, 2017 15:36
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Pollyanna posted:Bullshit. We have more than enough healthcare to go around. What we're short on is money, and that's because the money-grubbing thieves in power on both sides nothing but grift and cut taxes for the ultrarich, loving everyone else over. No we don't. There's not enough doctors or specialists to serve the unhealthy boomer population. That's why healthcare is so expensive in the first place. You're absolutely delusional if you do not see that.
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Jun 27, 2017 15:38
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There just aren't enough doctors! There just aren't enough houses! There just isn't enough food! 
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Jun 27, 2017 15:50
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We certainly can't use tax money to pay for educating more X/buying more equipment/building houses. That would be socialism or something.
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Jun 27, 2017 15:54
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we have enough doctors but it's a distribution issue we also use physician extenders unlike other countries
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Jun 27, 2017 15:54
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Guy Farting posted:we have enough doctors but it's a distribution issue Could you expound on this?
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Jun 27, 2017 15:57
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i love the 14 year olds with no health issues posting like healthcare is a zero sum sector like if person A gets an appointment with a doctor then person B does not healthcare can be made more efficient and can be made more productive. our spending per capita is much higher than other developed countries and our health outcomes are worse the first step is to get people covered and have skin in the game, and then we can talk about costs this bill just wants people to get sick and die. they won't die quickly though so our kids will be having the same discussion as us 20 years from now about where to put their senile atherosclerotic parents before they drop dead
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Jun 27, 2017 15:59
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Doc Hawkins posted:There just aren't enough doctors! There just aren't enough houses! There just isn't enough food! Gross oversimplification of the situation. There are a limited number of surgery rooms. A limited number of surgeons. A limited number of devices needed to perform surgery. 40% of Americans will be diagnosed with Cancer at some time in their life. That is 128 million people who will need some form of treatment. Over the next 4 years over 10 million people will be diagnosed with cancer and require treatment. There are less than 60,000 operating rooms in the US. And that's not taking into account Heart Attacks - There will be 3 million of those over the next 4 years. There are approximately 30 million surgeries performed in the US each year. That's more than 500 surgeries a year for every single operating room in the US. And these numbers are only going to get worse - and exponentially so. There's a lot of people who don't even receive surgery because they can not afford it - if we go single payer demand will skyrocket. Single payer alone is not enough to deal with our public health crisis, anyone who thinks it is is delusional.
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Jun 27, 2017 16:00
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I edited out the paragraph on costs when I realized you weren't even talking about them, just saying there weren't enough doctors and that's that, total system crash man! What do you think would happen if single-payer passed somewhere?
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Jun 27, 2017 16:04
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silence_kit posted:Could you expound on this? we have more doctors per capita than many other developed countries and our outcomes are no better. so it's not a physician count issue. what is true is that few doctors want to take on $250k worth of debt and then go hang up a shingle in a small town in alabama. specialists even less so. instead they move to or near big cities and they find ways to make money there. we do have nurse practitioners and physician assistants in the US who can practice under the supervision of a physician but be fairly independent. physician extenders are cheaper and do a pretty good job. non US countries don't do this as much. they are often not included in the physician count numbers (unless they are now, j haven't checked in a few years)
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Jun 27, 2017 16:06
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Doc Hawkins posted:I edited out the paragraph on costs when I realized you weren't even talking about them, just saying there weren't enough doctors and that's that, total system crash man! Unless major efforts were made to train more medical professionals, and a decent amount of money invested in the system it would suffer the same fate as the NHS. Big delays to receive treatment, wage locks for nurses, and hospitals unable to buy notepads due to lack of funds.
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Jun 27, 2017 16:08
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