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Doctor Spaceman posted:Not much different from how the Philosopher's Stone was guarded then. It was good enough to stop Voldemort, so I think that's pretty good. Honestly, the stone is pretty well protected, because it requires an incredibly varied assortment of skills with no preparation - and of course, you generally don't know what they are beforehand. 1. Get to Hogwarts. Hard enough on its own, really, since you can't apparate in. 2. Find the right room. 3. Pass the idiot test (Can you open a lock with magic?). 4.Fight a big three-headed dog in a narrow space, unless you know it was put there by Hagrid, in which case you can trick him into giving up the information that you just need to play some music. 5. Have decent knowledge of Herbology so you don't get Devil Snared. 6. Be good at flying so you can catch the right key. 7. Be a master of chess so you can win against the magic pieces without losing the piece you replaced. 8. Beat a troll. 9. Be good enough at logic to make it through the flames. 10. Now that you've made it through all those things - it is imperative that you don't actually want the stone, because then you can't get it. Harry and the others made it through because 1-2 were a gimme, 3 was easy, 4 was done for them, they legitimately did 5. 6 was literally the only thing Harry was good at in his first year at Hogwarts. 7 is literally the only thing Ron is ever good at (except for being a goalkeeper later). 8 was done for them. 9. is Hermione's forte, and of course, they could do 10 because Harry didn't want the STONE per se. Voldemort has the advantage of skipping 1-2 as well, having prior knowledge of most of the trials because Quirrell was part of setting them up, and he still fails.
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Jul 5, 2017 13:47
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If only they'd had the Trial of the Password of Minimum 8 Characters Including Capitals, Lowercase, Numbers and Symbols with No Dictionary Words.
MikeJF fucked around with this message at 15:04 on Jul 5, 2017 |
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Jul 5, 2017 15:00
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MikeJF posted:If only they'd had the Trial of the Password of Minimum 8 Characters Including Capitals, Lowercase, Numbers and Symbols with No Dictionary Words. You know it'd just be on a piece of parchment spellotaped to the door.
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Jul 5, 2017 15:16
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MikeJF posted:If only they'd had the Trial of the Password of Minimum 8 Characters Including Capitals, Lowercase, Numbers and Symbols with No Dictionary Words. I'm not sure passwords work nearly as well in a world where you can read minds and mind control people. It's the entire "let's beat up the guy with the password until he gives us the password" but even easier. Security has a lot of different concerns in a HP world than in our muggle world. Though if you can make a line that can only be passed by people older than x, why not just make a line that can only be passed by 300 year olds? There you go, Nicolas Flamel can cross it, and his wife can cross it - but no one else can, afaik.
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Jul 5, 2017 16:30
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Or instead of flying around the room, the key could've been in Dumbledore's pocket. Ah well, though. It's a staple of magic worlds to have trials like that.
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Jul 5, 2017 16:33
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If I'd been designing the logic puzzle trial, everything would be the same except all the potions would be poison and you'd have to brew the real potion in advance and bring it in
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Jul 5, 2017 16:54
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If you really want to cut through the silliness, the logical thing for Dumbledore to do would have been to stick it in his desk and put the drawer under the Fidelius charm.
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Jul 5, 2017 17:11
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Dumbledore should have just used the Philosopher's Stone as a buttplug. You'd have to be really desperate to go after an old wizard's unwashed sex toy. Imagine the smell.
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Jul 5, 2017 17:21
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From a little while back, but I did find it amusing that after Harry's panic and caution about eating sapient non-humans, Quirrelmort orders them both dishes that are references to cannibalism: quote:"I shall have a bowl of green lentil soup, with soy sauce," Professor Quirrell said to the waitress. "And for Mr. Potter, a plate of Tenorman's family chili."
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Jul 5, 2017 17:34
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There's a fairly common idea in Potter fanfics that Dumbledore wasn't actually trying to keep the stone 100% safe, but instead was trying to bait Voldemort out and/or groom Harry into becoming one of them heroic types, depending on how poorly you think of ol' Dumbles. I don't really agree but it is an interesting angle.
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Jul 6, 2017 02:27
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Fenrisulfr posted:From a little while back, but I did find it amusing that after Harry's panic and caution about eating sapient non-humans, Quirrelmort orders them both dishes that are references to cannibalism:
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Jul 6, 2017 06:28
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Tunicate posted:Sirius at least was partially protected by turning into a dog, since dementors don't work so well on animals. That was always an interesting idea for me, because it kind of implies that animagi aren't just 'human personality overlaid on an animal shape' and actually have some biological affects of the change. Neat parallel to Remus' lycanthropy, and a strong influence on how Pettigrew ends up (especially with all the years he spent as a rat).
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Jul 6, 2017 14:33
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The transformation affected their morphic fields, obviously. Like what happened to Greebo.
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Jul 7, 2017 01:59
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Mad Hamish posted:The transformation affected their morphic fields, obviously. Like what happened to Greebo. You laugh, but it's actually kind of disturbing how many Pratchett-isms I've internalized over the years, to the point where that poo poo just kind of makes sense now automatically.
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Jul 7, 2017 04:20
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Admittedly, that'd be a much more interesting crossover than the Ender's Game crap Yud is cribbing. I'm not sure if Mustrum Ridicully ( D.Thau., D.M., D.S., D.Mn., D.G., D.D., D.C.L., D.M. Phil., D.M.S., D.C.M., D.W., B.El.L.) or a certain Rincewind would make a better poor bastard to get the DADA slot for a year, though. Rincewind taking Yud's Quirrel out with a half-brick in a sock would be great, though. I think this fanfic is getting to me, I'm starting to wish violence on the characters.
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Jul 7, 2017 08:55
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Liquid Communism posted:I'm not sure if Mustrum Ridicully ( D.Thau., D.M., D.S., D.Mn., D.G., D.D., D.C.L., D.M. Phil., D.M.S., D.C.M., D.W., B.El.L.) or a certain Rincewind would make a better poor bastard to get the DADA slot for a year, though.
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Jul 7, 2017 09:05
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'but if you do, always have a few fireballs up your sleeve.' Ridcully would then use the class as a transparent excuse to go hunting. MikeJF fucked around with this message at 09:40 on Jul 7, 2017 |
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Jul 7, 2017 09:38
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Exercu posted:It was good enough to stop Voldemort, so I think that's pretty good. The Mirror of Erised is what really brings the whole thing together. Anyone who makes it through all that difficult, dangerous, and just plain tedious bullshit has to be pretty determined to get the Stone, and then there's a final safeguard that says that the more you want it, the less you can have it. It's pretty brilliantly evil, and still means that if the setup is compromised and you need to relocate the Stone to somewhere safer, you can just waltz past all those puzzles you know the answer to and the Mirror will cheerfully hand your incredibly valuable relic over.
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Jul 7, 2017 10:50
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Liquid Communism posted:Admittedly, that'd be a much more interesting crossover than the Ender's Game crap Yud is cribbing. Unfortunately, Yudkowski would still be writing it, so it would still be painful.
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Jul 7, 2017 11:31
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Cavelcade posted:Unfortunately, Yudkowski would still be writing it, so it would still be painful. oh God I'm imagining his Vetinari and Drumknott talking about Bayes
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Jul 7, 2017 12:28
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Oh god. Yeah, that might be the only thing worse than Yud's Potter. Yud's Vetinari.
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Jul 7, 2017 21:14
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I'm thinking of what he'd do to Granny and now I'm really, really unhappy.
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Jul 8, 2017 03:03
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Mad Hamish posted:I'm thinking of what he'd do to Granny and now I'm really, really unhappy. He wouldn't even use the Witches. They're too tied into the natural cycles, death especially, for Yud's tiny screamingly terrified hindbrain to cope with. Remember, he'd consider Reaper Man a horror story.
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Jul 8, 2017 05:46
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Liquid Communism posted:He wouldn't even use the Witches. They're too tied into the natural cycles, death especially, for Yud's tiny screamingly terrified hindbrain to cope with. Remember, he'd consider Reaper Man a horror story. Of course, he'd have to ignore that the setting has an actual, confirmed-real afterlife. But he already did that with Harry Potter, so that probably wouldn't stop him.
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Jul 8, 2017 07:32
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Tiggum posted:Of course, he'd have to ignore that the setting has an actual, confirmed-real afterlife. But he already did that with Harry Potter, so that probably wouldn't stop him. But what if he did act on that knowledge? 
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Jul 8, 2017 07:54
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Tiggum posted:Of course, he'd have to ignore that the setting has an actual, confirmed-real afterlife. But he already did that with Harry Potter, so that probably wouldn't stop him. I don't think we were reading the same Disc world. What happened to almost anyone more then 30 seconds after they die was ambiguous. There was only one person who hung around longer than that I can recall and it was implied that it was torment for him.
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Jul 8, 2017 18:03
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Added Space posted:I don't think we were reading the same Disc world. What happened to almost anyone more then 30 seconds after they die was ambiguous. There was only one person who hung around longer than that I can recall and it was implied that it was torment for him. The specifics of what happens are ambiguous (though we do know of at least three reincarnations I can think of offhand), but the fact that there's something that does happen and that there's a "you" for it to happen to are pretty black-and-white. Liquid Communism posted:Yud's Vetinari. I'd love to see a fanfic in which the only changed character was Lord Yudinari, patiently explaining to people how much he's manipulating them right now, with them reacting the way Pratchett's characters ordinarily would. inflatablefish fucked around with this message at 18:41 on Jul 8, 2017 |
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Jul 8, 2017 18:38
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inflatablefish posted:The specifics of what happens are ambiguous (though we do know of at least three reincarnations I can think of offhand), but the fact that there's something that does happen and that there's a "you" for it to happen to are pretty black-and-white. It's a recurring thing in the Discworld books that people end up in the afterlife they believe in. I think there's even a gag in one book about the optimal move being killing missionairies from range to stop them telling you about the idea of hell so that you're safe from it, which is like Roko's Basilisk but actually kind of clever.
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Jul 8, 2017 20:06
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Also Cohen and the Silver Horde steal horses from the Valkyries and ride off on them.
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Jul 8, 2017 22:47
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Chapter 54: The Stanford Prison Experiment, Pt 4 part 1 The plot of this chapter has very little to do with the Stanford prison experiment btw. And there are plenty of chapters that deal with obedience to authority and abuse of power. quote:"I knew - you would - come to me - someday," Bellatrix's voice quavered and fractured as she drew breath for quiet sobs, "I knew - you were alive - that you would come - to me - my Lord..." there was a long inhalation like a huge gasp, "and that even - when you came - you still wouldn't love me - never - you would never love me back - that was why - they couldn't take - my love from me - even though I can't remember - can't remember so many other things - though I don't know what I forgot - but I remember how much I love you, Lord -" 2. Harriezer is upset with Voldermort, and it manifests with a blaze of anti-death magic. Sure. Anyways, the patronus is eventually under control, but not before alarms are set: quote:In the Auror's quarters at the top of Azkaban, one Auror trio was snoring in the barracks, one Auror trio was resting in the breakroom, and one Auror trio was on duty in the command room, keeping their watch. The command room was simple but large, with three chairs at back where three Aurors sat, their wands always in hand to sustain their three Patronuses, as the bright white forms paced in front of the open window, sheltering them all from the Dementors' fear. I stuck with my name is my name from my days as a surly teenager and into (semi) reasonable adulthood. And it's my experience that "sorry, that name is just hard for me to pronounce" is just one step away from "aren't you people all called X anyway?" Need a more convenient name? Use it to call "all you people", not me. Anyways, on to the lovely Azkaban security arrangements: quote:"Mike," said McCusker, "what's with your Patronus?" People who like writing fanfic of fanfic - throw out the very first ideas you come up with for a secure prison in the HP-verse. Don't worry about how the heroes will get in or out of it, just try to come up with the most basic list of steps a quote:They'd gone up another four flights of stairs before the rough voice of the Defense Professor said, simply and without emphasis, "Auror coming." Unlike "anyone else", who would have had to transfigure the mirror from a random item, Harriezer can use... any material? Or were those examples of items those hypothetical people previously tansfigured a mirror into? Why? quote:The Auror was protected by a blue shimmer, it was hard to see the details but Harry could see that much, the Auror had shields already raised and strengthened. Xander77 fucked around with this message at 01:56 on Jul 9, 2017 |
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Jul 9, 2017 01:06
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It's been said already but the whole "partial transfiguration" thing already exists in canon and is rather unremarkable.
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Jul 9, 2017 01:43
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Xander77 posted:Unlike "anyone else", who would have had to transfigure the mirror from a random item, Harriezer can use... any material? Or were those examples of items those hypothetical people previously tansfigured a mirror into? Why? The difference that Yud seems to think is that Harry doesn't need to transfigure a discrete object; other people would need to pull one individual item out and turn it into one individual other item, but he's cool so he doesn't have to. However... Doctor Spaceman posted:It's been said already but the whole "partial transfiguration" thing already exists in canon and is rather unremarkable. It's a difficult thing to do but not the be-all end-all. McGonagall (who is admittedly very skilled) turns a single snake into a cloud of smoke and then the smoke into a lot of knives without really stopping in between, so you can clearly do one to many, and there's plenty of cases of people Transfiguring just hair or specific body parts. If Yud means half-finished Transfiguration, that's so easy to do by mistake you lose points for it on a test. Prism fucked around with this message at 01:55 on Jul 9, 2017 |
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Jul 9, 2017 01:51
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Eliezarry's "power" is knowing that any subdivision of an object is, in an abstract mathematical sense, an "object" in itself. Since "object" is a rather vague term which applies to both a flawless diamond, which is virtually identical throughout its composition, and a log, which is not at all homogeneous, and yet transfiguration works identically on both, the magic must choose what exactly to transfigure based on the user's intent, not any objective standard of what an object is. So, by thinking of part of the step as a separate collection of atoms from the rest, he can transfigure it separately. Non-science-literate wizards can do this, but only if they think of the parts of the object as separate things, so it's relatively intuitive to transfigure an arm separately from the overall human, or a doorknob rather than the whole door, but hard to do what Eliezarry is doing. It is a neat idea in its implications; Eliezarry uses it for trivial purposes because he's an unimaginative little poo poo, but in principle it could be used for precision transfiguration on a microscopic scale by a sufficiently knowledgeable wizard. Jazerus fucked around with this message at 04:59 on Jul 9, 2017 |
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Jul 9, 2017 04:53
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Prism posted:It's a difficult thing to do but not the be-all end-all. McGonagall (who is admittedly very skilled) turns a single snake into a cloud of smoke and then the smoke into a lot of knives without really stopping in between, so you can clearly do one to many, and there's plenty of cases of people Transfiguring just hair or specific body parts.
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Jul 9, 2017 04:59
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Tiggum posted:It's clearly something he wanted Harry to be super good at, but it's really easy in the books so he had to modify it so that in his version of the story it works completely differently. But it's one of the things where he changes something but doesn't think it through. In the books, transfiguration is a simple trick they teach to kids. Here, it's an incredibly difficult and super dangerous thing that... they still teach to kids for some reason? I think his justification was that if you didn't learn it early then you'd never be any good at it, but I don't think there's really anything that works that way? Anything you can learn as a child you can also learn as an adult, and as long as you practice enough you'll be able to do it just as well. Well learning a foreign language is hella easier when you're young, but yeah
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Jul 9, 2017 05:12
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Tiggum posted:Here, it's an incredibly difficult and super dangerous thing that... they still teach to kids for some reason?
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Jul 9, 2017 07:44
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Xander77 posted:If you want a prison that's hard to break out of, making it hard to break into is... I don't even know, a good first step? An obvious corollary? The least stupid thing you can do? Slightly better than sending a lone guard to check a disturbance that might very well involve a powerful wizard breaking into the prison? The Aurors aren't the wardens of this prison. The wardens are the Dementors, who are 100% effective at keeping prisoners in (at least until the Super-Duper Patronus 2.0 Premium Protagonist Edition), but they don't give a single poo poo if somebody drops by to extend the expiration date on their supply of souls-in-a-can. The Auror team is more of an early warning system, and they're also in charge of stopping break-ins, but as mentioned they don't particularly care either because so far the Dementors have always prevented any break-ins from turning into break-outs.
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Jul 9, 2017 09:21
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Xander77 posted:Now now. We all know that wizards have no sense of right and wrong, and adults in the HP-verse endanger children constantly. I mean, wasn't that meant to be part of the point of the books? That the adults have all these wise assurances that 'no no, wizard hitler won't be back' but at the end of the day most of them roll right over for him for the same reasons they did the last time, and once again leave it to children to be in horrible danger to save their sorry asses?
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Jul 9, 2017 15:04
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Night10194 posted:I mean, wasn't that meant to be part of the point of the books? That the adults have all these wise assurances that 'no no, wizard hitler won't be back' but at the end of the day most of them roll right over for him for the same reasons they did the last time, and once again leave it to children to be in horrible danger to save their sorry asses? Adults and authority figures are generally incompetent in any children's fiction. If they weren't, adventures wouldn't be so easily had.
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Jul 9, 2017 17:09
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No, that's totally not what I meant. Adults in HP are a whole different flavor of negligent. Instead of being over-protective, and trying to keep children out of trouble, they genuinely don't give a gently caress, and allow children to be placed in dangerous situations with wild abandon.
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Jul 9, 2017 18:21
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