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I beat FFXV without ever seeing a summon prompt that wasn't part of a forced cutscene. The summons in X were great but I didn't like using them all that much because then I wouldn't be using my rad party members. Although to be fair, by the end Yuna could probably single-handedly annihilate most encounters anyway.
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Jul 6, 2017 03:50
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dukerson posted:This is also probably my biggest complaint of the game: almost all of the optional content is dumped on you right at the end, right as the plot hits its climax. The optional content unlocking before the final dungeon is Square-Enix 101.  Star Ocean 2 even jacked up the strength of the final boss if you unlocked the bonus dungeon.
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Jul 6, 2017 04:38
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The side quest completion/Conqueror strength thing in Last Remnant wasn't too bad.
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Jul 6, 2017 04:46
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Post-game/pre-last-boss content is tough to do properly, you've gotta strike that balance between "more challenging than the last boss" and "requires endless hours of grinding." I always thought FFXII ramped up the hunt difficulty curve pretty well.
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Jul 6, 2017 05:25
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Die Sexmonster! posted:The optional content unlocking before the final dungeon is Square-Enix 101. No, final boss got harder if you saw specific private actions.
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Jul 6, 2017 05:39
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Chaotic Flame posted:specific private actions.  ?
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Jul 6, 2017 05:46
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CAPTAIN CAPSLOCK posted:Somewhere between 3 to 5. It was probably FF4 Look at this dude forgetting Knights of the Round. PS1 era summons were pretty great. 7 arguably had the best summons, 8 had Eden which you could break the damage barrier with, and 9 had Ark. I would agree 3-5 outclassed black magic with 6 being the opposite mainly because quick / dual cast for Ultima was a thing.
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Jul 6, 2017 06:02
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exquisite tea posted:I liked FFX because I think it was the series' first successful attempt at building an internally consistent setting, with histories and locations in the world that at least kind of made sense as opposed to medieval castles floating right next to mechanized cities. Spira felt like its own self-contained place rather than a pastiche of settings from other fiction. But most importantly, you can think of FFX as the extended prologue for the unquestionably amazing FFX-2. What  whatThere were 9 games before 10 that had internally consistent settings  Maybe you could say 8 doesn't count... but the rest? Zaphod42 fucked around with this message at 06:24 on Jul 6, 2017 |
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Jul 6, 2017 06:22
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Zaphod42 posted:What You're right, but I think they more meant that X was the first was with such a cohesive setting, which I think is probably accurate. Everything about X's world exists to further it's themes and tone and it's probably the best FF game about that.
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Jul 6, 2017 09:40
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4 and 5 alternate between Black Magic and Summon Magic being better for different parts of the story, and even in the end game while Summon is slightly better in both, Black Magic is still valuable (FF4's Flare's near-instant charge time, FF5's rod-boosted -agas). For 3 though Summons clearly outclass Black Magic, Black Magic is terrible once you leave the Floating Continent. It's just Conjurers suck so you have to wait until the end of the game when you unlock Summoner to wreck face.
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Jul 6, 2017 10:08
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Being able to control the summons in FFX however was a 1st. It was a very welcome addition.
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Jul 6, 2017 12:57
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Sefal posted:Being able to control the summons in FFX however was a 1st. It was a very welcome addition. Summons being something other than target-all elemental spells was a first as well; they headed that way first in VI where they're a kind of one-shot desperation ability, and again in VIII where they shield you during their charge up. But X was the first game to really make them a resource separate from your characters, which I thought was fun and interesting. It's a shame that the titles since then have been a step backward in that regard.
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Jul 6, 2017 13:13
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They were pretty useful in 13, biggest problem was that unless you were constantly swapping your leader you got the same one all the time.
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Jul 6, 2017 13:18
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I think FF12 Zodiac version has them controllable now? Maybe that'll be great. I was disappointed in how useless they were in FF12 Vanilla. I do like how they were in FFXV. Truly devastating and glorious. Shame you had no control on making them pop up.
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Jul 6, 2017 13:21
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Sefal posted:I think FF12 Zodiac version has them controllable now? The few times that I made them pop up in XV it felt epic.
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Jul 6, 2017 13:52
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Sefal posted:I think FF12 Zodiac version has them controllable now? Zodiac does have them controllable and you can even trigger their ultimates without dumb conditions now.
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Jul 6, 2017 14:02
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Onmi posted:Zodiac does have them controllable and you can even trigger their ultimates without dumb conditions now. That's pretty awesome. The dumb ultimate conditions were a major part of what made them so useless. Zodiark's ultimate gambit is literally "Summoner: status = Petrify -> Final Eclipse" so you better make sure whoever summoned it can cast Break on themselves lol
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Jul 6, 2017 15:08
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Onmi posted:Zodiac does have them controllable and you can even trigger their ultimates without dumb conditions now. But how does that work with the Job System? Can everyone still use Summons even if you're not any sort of mage? I'm wondering if I'll actually have to use more than just three characters this time around. I always stick with a main team in these games but if Zodiac Age is harder, and with the job system now, I might have to actually level up m y B Team to call in them if I need a different Job's skillset for whatever reason. Ashe will be in my main party and she will be a Red Mage. Best Character gets Best Job. (it is the best job, even if it isn't in this game)
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Jul 6, 2017 15:14
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NikkolasKing posted:But how does that work with the Job System? Can everyone still use Summons even if you're not any sort of mage?
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Jul 6, 2017 15:25
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NikkolasKing posted:But how does that work with the Job System? Can everyone still use Summons even if you're not any sort of mage? Every job board can get any summon but once you get it for one character it becomes unavailable for all other characters. Plan ahead because certain summons let certain jobs access extra skills on the board.
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Jul 6, 2017 15:28
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NikkolasKing posted:But how does that work with the Job System? Can everyone still use Summons even if you're not any sort of mage? Yeah, you assign them to party members on the license board and every job has a slot for each summon (limited to three I think).
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Jul 6, 2017 15:28
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exquisite tea posted:I liked FFX because I think it was the series' first successful attempt at building an internally consistent setting, with histories and locations in the world that at least kind of made sense as opposed to medieval castles floating right next to mechanized cities. Spira felt like its own self-contained place rather than a pastiche of settings from other fiction. But most importantly, you can think of FFX as the extended prologue for the unquestionably amazing FFX-2. Not to get into a fight about "muh final fantasy!", but 7 and 8 both do this pretty well - 7's "ancient ruins" being actual Ancient ruins and 8 having that + weird Cetra fashions but an otherwise modern world with trains and cars and cool cityscapes. I guess 8 had the weirdness of Esthar just being that much more advanced than everywhere else.
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Jul 6, 2017 15:35
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VIII tried to build a world by dumping you smack in the middle of all that political conflict and such but it mostly fizzles out by the 2nd disc IIRC
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Jul 6, 2017 15:49
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Cavelcade posted:Not to get into a fight about "muh final fantasy!", but 7 and 8 both do this pretty well - 7's "ancient ruins" being actual Ancient ruins and 8 having that + weird Cetra fashions but an otherwise modern world with trains and cars and cool cityscapes. I guess 8 had the weirdness of Esthar just being that much more advanced than everywhere else. What I meant for FFX was more like, "it's plausible that the world, its regions and its technology would exist in the current state they're in, given the logic and history of the setting." FFVII + VIII have some excellent and immersive settings, but they come off more as a pastiche of other fictional works, loving tributes to their own sci-fi and fantasy influences rather than a group of people sitting down and really putting a lot of thought into making the world's inhabitants and their cultures cohesive. I recognize that this is just a feeling, but I think FFX did the worldbuilding aspects better than most games in the series before or after it. Spira felt like a world that continued to exist even when the player left it.
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Jul 6, 2017 16:04
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I think 12 broke the game in a different way, because the yellow gauge for mist charges is now segmented into 3, so it's much easier to spam mist chains.
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Jul 6, 2017 16:13
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Kelp Me! posted:VIII tried to build a world by dumping you smack in the middle of all that political conflict and such but it mostly fizzles out by the 2nd disc IIRC All world building is centered around the theme of "A sorceress did it"
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Jul 6, 2017 16:13
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Kelp Me! posted:VIII tried to build a world by dumping you smack in the middle of all that political conflict and such but it mostly fizzles out by the 2nd disc IIRC VIII also has a lost, unkowable ancient civilization that died out 120 years ago in a world where satellite television is a thing that was invented more than 20 tears ago. This is the same world where steam powere locomotives are a big deal while another country has a literal space program and holographic invisibility technology. The world and story of 8 really only make sense if you assume Time Kompression has been ongoing for a while by the start of the game which is why eveything is a jumbled up mess of time periods technology and nations.
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Jul 6, 2017 16:16
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exquisite tea posted:What I meant for FFX was more like, "it's plausible that the world, its regions and its technology would exist in the current state they're in, given the logic and history of the setting." FFVII + VIII have some excellent and immersive settings, but they come off more as a pastiche of other fictional works, loving tributes to their own sci-fi and fantasy influences rather than a group of people sitting down and really putting a lot of thought into making the world's inhabitants and their cultures cohesive. I recognize that this is just a feeling, but I think FFX did the worldbuilding aspects better than most games in the series before or after it. Spira felt like a world that continued to exist even when the player left it. I dunno, VII gave me that feeling as well so I guess it just depends on what you're into? Like, no part of VII makes me think "hey wait!" - the tech level is fairly consistent (we still have horse drawn carriages, so why not chocobo drawn ones?). I guess the exception is maybe the weapons but it's mostly the ultra soldiers who use swords that shoot magic so.
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Jul 6, 2017 16:47
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For the IZJS is there a good primer on job combinations and so on? Since it's a Final Fantasy game I assume you can beat it as long as you're vaguely trying you can beat it, but I wouldn't mind knowing about some cool combos going in since if I understand correctly the job assignments are permanent.
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Jul 6, 2017 18:37
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Relax Or DIE posted:For the IZJS is there a good primer on job combinations and so on? Since it's a Final Fantasy game I assume you can beat it as long as you're vaguely trying you can beat it, but I wouldn't mind knowing about some cool combos going in since if I understand correctly the job assignments are permanent. I found this one on GFAQs. https://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/191202-final-fantasy-xii-the-zodiac-age/75477310
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Jul 6, 2017 18:38
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Cavelcade posted:I dunno, VII gave me that feeling as well so I guess it just depends on what you're into? Like, no part of VII makes me think "hey wait!" - the tech level is fairly consistent (we still have horse drawn carriages, so why not chocobo drawn ones?). I guess the exception is maybe the weapons but it's mostly the ultra soldiers who use swords that shoot magic so. Not that FF10 isn't also a misery amusement park, it just does it in a more natural way than saying here is the blade runner city and here are the mining towns and here is the amusement park built on top of maxsec. E. My bone to pick is mostly with old fashioned jrpg maps I guess because it always distorts scale in a way geopolitics start making less sense than they could.
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Jul 6, 2017 18:55
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Huxley posted:I found this one on GFAQs. These seem logical, but one thing I didn't know was that the spell buffer thing is gone? drat casters are gonna own
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Jul 6, 2017 19:05
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exquisite tea posted:What I meant for FFX was more like, "it's plausible that the world, its regions and its technology would exist in the current state they're in, given the logic and history of the setting." FFVII + VIII have some excellent and immersive settings, but they come off more as a pastiche of other fictional works, loving tributes to their own sci-fi and fantasy influences rather than a group of people sitting down and really putting a lot of thought into making the world's inhabitants and their cultures cohesive. I recognize that this is just a feeling, but I think FFX did the worldbuilding aspects better than most games in the series before or after it. Spira felt like a world that continued to exist even when the player left it. Sorry Exquisite Tea, but if you actually play the games all the way through and talk to NPCs, everything about the worlds of FF1, FF4, FF6, FF7, FF9, (and probably the others I haven't played) all have internally consistent settings and reasons for why things are they way they are. Huge complex internally consistent worlds are like, one of the main appeals of final fantasy games to me. You slowly piece together bit by bit how and why things are the way they are, how they got there, and how they should be instead; and what you can do to fix it. I would really argue that FF7 more than any of the others has continued to exist even when the player left it, since people can't loving put it down and they've cranked out like 10 more games in the same world. But I really don't think that's fair to lots of the other games; especially FF6. Holy moly. What does FFX do that FF6 doesn't? They both have a world of conflict between magic/religon and technology and extensive historical reasons for setting that up. Kelp Me! posted:VIII tried to build a world by dumping you smack in the middle of all that political conflict and such but it mostly fizzles out by the 2nd disc IIRC It also confuses itself with time travel and plots that are overly complicated for little thematic benefit. I love the in-media-res political conflict personally, I live for that poo poo. But the time compression / sorceress poo poo ruined everything. I like 8 a lot but its probably the weakest story.. well, I'd say 15 is the worst story in Final Fantasy history, then 13, then 8. Zaphod42 fucked around with this message at 19:14 on Jul 6, 2017 |
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Jul 6, 2017 19:10
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Having not quite finished it yet, I'd say 13's story has a cool concept but so far is pretty poorly executed.
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Jul 6, 2017 19:16
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8 has the coolest mythology, too bad its only mentioned twice optionally and once its a permanently missable dialog!
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Jul 6, 2017 19:16
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So its the same as FFXV's mythos then
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Jul 6, 2017 19:39
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Meridian posted:Having not quite finished it yet, I'd say 13's story has a cool concept but so far is pretty poorly executed. I agree with this statement. The problem with the recent Final Fantasy games is that the world building comes in the form of Encyclopedia entries which kind of forces you to read them to understand what's going on in detail.
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Jul 6, 2017 19:58
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Meridian posted:Having not quite finished it yet, I'd say 13's story has a cool concept but so far is pretty poorly executed. 13 has an pretty cool story thats never actually mentioned in the game which im fine with tbh, i only care about 13 for it's combat
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Jul 6, 2017 20:01
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What was the mythos for 8. For some reason I remember a god or sorcerer with a really goofy name
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Jul 6, 2017 20:05
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mandatory lesbian posted:13 has an pretty cool story thats never actually mentioned in the game ...no, gently caress that guy, even then it's not obvious that it's Etro's Gate behind the final boss
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Jul 6, 2017 20:15
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