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A little TL note: 官房室長 or what I translated as "General Secretariat" seems to be a fictional title, and possibly a reference to a character named Onoda from a Japanese detective show Aibō. I picked the translation from some random subtitles of one the Aibō movies.
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Jul 7, 2017 07:20
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There's a lot of feelings in this TIPS section. I was not expecting Cornellia to have nearly the level of backstory as this, and the part about childhood dreams crashing against reality is very real. I'm glad at least that this had a happy ending.  Thank you for the update, it was a good read.
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Jul 7, 2017 16:44
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I wonder if it's a partial criticism of the Japanese workplace culture, given part of Cornelia's isolation is her refusal to go drinking with them.
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Jul 7, 2017 17:00
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Hm. Are these TIPs official, or extra content expanded upon by people other than the author with his blessing? I ask because these types of fan things, when it comes to this subset in particular, can be weird when it comes to "official" material, because there's the authors original stuff, and other stuff not by them that they give their approval on, and stuff that they never even see that are there... thus you have "official fan works" and "unofficial fan works" and all this crazy poo poo... and sometimes it's good, but others really not. Anyway, I ask because this story is really good at seeming official, if it wasn't written by R07, not just in terms of writing quality, but in terms of linking to the greater themes of the work- not, you know, murder, but the clash of ideals/reality, childhood's end, the folly of doing everything yourself... and of course, the importance of love, but not really the kind that's come up before, like screaming at a painting or killing your sibling/self, but... you know, self love, being kind yourself as well as others. You know, the kind that hasn't really come up in this story very much, more's the pity: up with love and down with "OH DESIRE", sort of thing. I'd have helped you with them flyers, Cornelia!  (No really, I hate smoking and never cared for drinking and I find the whole drinking culture of places like Japan to be skeevy in the extreme, so I'm right with her there.)
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Jul 7, 2017 17:20
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All of these Tips are written by r07 himself and are varying levels of canon. Most of the screencaps came from an official disk released after episode 8 compiling them. Only exception is the honeymoon, which was written by a witch.
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Jul 7, 2017 17:25
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Oh, Cornelia. 
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Jul 7, 2017 17:38
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resurgam40 posted:I'd have helped you with them flyers, Cornelia! I'm an occasional drinker, but never like bar culture or the attitude that you drink to get hosed up. Yeah, the work-drinking culture is really bad, especially for women working in the office - Aggretsuko kind of goes into it that female employees are expected to serve the men and anyone complaining about drink-induced bad behavior is scolded for disrupting the office harmony. (Aggretsuko is kind of my spirit animal)
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Jul 7, 2017 17:58
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  BGM: About Face And he had come here for a little peace and quiet... As soon as he let out a sigh of relief, that voice rang out.  "That's my line."It was as though she had been sitting there all along. Bernkastel appeared on top of the altar once more. Apparently, Beatrice's altar was extremely comfortable.  "Unlike Ushiromiya Battler's games, I have nothing standing in my way. It's easy." "That sort of game has already ended. Tales can be enjoyed twice. First you love them. Then you tear out their guts. *giggle*giggle*." "Tch. You think I'm a butcher?" "So? Do you think you know who killed Beatrice...?" "Rosa's confession is something I already know from a previous Fragment. There was no brand new information. We're still at square one." "*giggle*giggle*..." "Unless Ushiromiya Kinzo tells us what really happened, we won't get any further than this. Don't tell me that arguing with Kinzo and persuading him to spill the beans, is supposed to be part of this game." "That'd be fatally boring. Kinzo refuses to speak of the truth and is himself the king protected by his castle, but it wouldn't be any fun to have that stand in the way of your game..." "...I won't torture. It's not my style." "I know. As the Game Master, I will grant you power. So that you can get the truth from Kinzo, of course."Still wearing shoes, Bernkastel stepped into the casket, picked up one of the flowers that had been set as offerings, and blew hard, as though scattering fluff from a dandelion. Then, a single petal broke off and drifted down towards Will, no longer gold, but with the shine of a transparent crystal...  "The 'detective's authority'?" "Hmph, what, that pathetic ability? No. This is an invitation to the grandstands."  "I'm giving it. On my game board. Who's going to stop me...?" "...Hmph."Though the crystal flower petal danced in the wind, it wouldn't fly away anywhere until Will accepted it. Will remembered how useless it was to argue with witches, and he snatched it up. When he did, the petal flashed brightly for an instant, melted into Will's palm, and disappeared... "Entertain me if you can. And try and enjoy yourself. You must also be interested in seeing what the guts of Beatrice's game board look like, right?" "Not really."After Will's rude answer, Bernkastel vanished into thin air, leaving behind an obnoxious laugh... "...Tch." BGM: None ...When he did, it felt as though his gaze had crossed that of a shadow standing right in front of him, by the door that led outside. "Who is it?" BGM: L&D Circulation "Ah, Shannon. So you're running the reception desk this time...?" "Yes. I've been taking it in turns with Kanon-kun to run the reception desk..." "And Kanon?" "A short while ago, he was ordered by... umm, L, Lion-sama to take a break, so he's resting now." "...So, you don't know Lion either?" "Huh? No, of course..." "Ushiromiya Lion is the successor to the head, the one who wears the silver ring. Why are you stumbling over that name when you've worked here for 10 years?" "Th, that's..." "Don't worry. I don't recognize Lion either. Krauss is supposed to be the successor to the head. Jessica is supposed to be his only child. There hasn't been a single Fragment with anyone named Lion in the Ushiromiya family."When she realized that Will didn't recognize Lion either, Shannon relaxed. Apparently, she was a bit relieved to find that she wasn't going crazy by herself. However, her expression quickly grew uncertain once more. "Wh, where... is this place...? I think it's the Ushiromiya family chapel. However, something feels different about it. Also, I never knew that someone named L... Lion-sama existed. And yet, Madam, Krauss-sama, the Master, Milady, and all the relatives all talk as though it's perfectly natural... I just... don't understand what's happening..." "...Lion is a piece placed by Bernkastel. She also said that she'd moved into a larger cat box to place that piece. On top of that, it seems this world isn't a proper world, but one made out of several different Fragments sewn together."It's as though... this is a special stage set up specifically for this game. I'm sure she's nodding at my thoughts right now, laughing and chomping down popcorn.  "T, ten years."I see. So it really is a special stage. After all, right when I entered the chapel, I spotted Kinzo. Since Shannon has worked for 10 years, this is the stage of Beato's game, 1986. In that case, Kinzo shouldn't exist. However, he definitely was here a few minutes ago. Bernkastel promised that all of the information needed for reasoning was gathered here. She must have really packed it together to fit everything in... I see, so it really is a special stage. "You have served the Ushiromiya family for many years. So, just how much do you know about Beatrice?" "...I know the Master loved her deeply, but other than that..." "Is that all?" "A, and, umm, they say that she's the master of Rokkenjima's night... umm..." "That's right. The name of the ghost rumored to wander the mansion night after night is also Beatrice."That brings the number of Beatrices to three. The first is the Beatrice from more than 30 years ago, who is said to have given Kinzo the gold. The second is the Beatrice from 20 years ago, who met Rosa. The third is the Beatrice of the ghost stories, who is rumored to be the master of the night on Rokkenjima. "...Furudo Erika's reasoning was probably correct. It started out as the legend of the evil spirits on Rokkenjima. Later on, elements such as Kinzo's occult hobbies, the name and portrait of the mysterious woman, Beatrice, and the epitaph got mixed in, and it was all integrated into the legend of the Golden Witch." "...Then, the darkness of the night gained the personality of a witch. That's the third Beatrice. This became the veil for the serial murders." "...Uh, umm..."Apparently, she didn't understand a word of Will's sudden monologue. Shannon tried to follow along, but she seemed to be having difficulty. "Don't waste your time trying to understand. You'll just get a headache." "M, my apologies..." BGM: None "...Yes. Kanon-kun was the same as me."Shannon... and Kanon, is it... "...Call Kanon over here. I want to talk to the pair of you about something."When Will said these words, Shannon's face went blank and her eyes went wide. "My apologies. We aren't allowed to leave the reception desk unmanned, so I can't leave to go get him." "Then find a replacement and have them take over the reception desk until you get back. You, me, and Kanon. We, the three people who don't know Lion, need to talk." "..." "..." "...We've been told that one person is enough to run the reception desk." "But no one told you there was anything wrong with two people manning it, right?" "We are low on helpers today, so we were told that having two people at the reception desk would be unnecessary." "Who gave you that order? Kinzo? Krauss? Or was it Lion? I will ask about it."  Video: Blocked MoveBGM: 7 Weights "Who is this person? I'll negotiate with them." "You cannot... NEGOTIATE. It iS the oNE who orDERS US." "Call Kanon over here. I hate theatergoing just as much as I hate torture."Slowly, Will pulled his right hand out of his pocket. When he slowly opened his fist, a small, bright glow emanated from it. The flower petal Bernkastel had given him had become a glowing birthmark, which sparkled... He held that hand out towards Shannon... and slowly approached her. "Call Kanon. I want to check something with you two." "I... C A N N O T CALL HIM. DO YOU S T I L L ... WANT ME TO...?" "If you don't call him, I'm going to use my authority." "IF YO U INS IST... I CA N CA LL HIM SPECI ALLY FOR YOU, BUT..." "..." " ."There was some kind of incomprehensible tension between the two. Will stood there, his left hand still in his pocket and his right palm glowing and stretched out towards her. Shannon just stood there, her hands still folded politely in front of her, her posture beautiful. And yet, it felt oddly as though raindrops were sparking and crackling in midair...  "..."Will's expression had remained unchanged the whole time. Shannon's face was still kind and gentle. And yet, the tension was as icy as a frozen lake... ...Beginners in chess will sometimes move their king into check without noticing it. One might mercilessly capture the king in this situation, but high-level players are supposed to calmly tell their opponent about their mistake. 'If you take one more step, you'll get captured'. This was... similar to that... "..."...I see. So, after all...  BGM: None Slowly, Will lowered his hand.  "Thank you for understanding."The glow slowly vanished from Will's palm. That completely incomprehensible tension melted away like a sugar cube in water. However, nothing had changed since the beginning. Will's expression and Shannon's expression... were the same as they always had been.  BGM: L&D Circulation Footsteps approached them. It was Lion. "I'm just standing here, talking. I wanted to ask her something." "...What could that be? Did you find what you were looking for?" "...Yeah." "I'm honored to have been of service." "..." "That's a shame. If you were looking for an umbrella, I could have gotten you one right away." "Did you convince Kinzo?" "...I told him that a rare guest wanted to greet him. He says he'll meet with you." "Did you tell him that I wanted to ask about Beatrice?" "Isn't that your job?"With a slightly mischievous look, Lion turned away. Will scratched his head and shrugged, looking annoyed.  Will opened his right hand and showed it to Lion. It was just a hand, without anything remotely remarkable about it. Lion's head tilted to the side in bafflement at this strange gesture.  "Good work... Umm, wait, your name was..." "It's Shannon." "That's right, Shannon. Please take over the reception desk. Make sure you keep warm." "Thank you very much, Lion-sama."Shannon bowed deeply in response to Lion's kind words. There was not even a trace of tension in her manner... "Let's go, Will. Wouldn't want to miss this chance. The Head's mood changes quicker than the autumn sky." "Good luck." 
Quinn2win fucked around with this message at 19:34 on Jul 7, 2017 |
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Jul 7, 2017 18:27
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I have to say, it feels kind of strange for the game to still be acting so coy about Shannon and Kanon unless there's still something major we're missing.
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Jul 7, 2017 18:44
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Well, Shannon just completely glitched out.
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Jul 7, 2017 18:45
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... This really is one of those games that makes me lament that I cannot share my reactions live, isn't it? I mean, I could just use  , but it seems insufficient to describe the way my mouth hung open and my head tilted at... well, THAT part. As creepy as I find it... I can't actually help but wonder what would have happened if our Will had pressed the issue and used his... um ability? Whatever "theatergoing authority" means. Would Blank Eyes Shannon just assume the manner stance and vocabulary as Kanon? Wholuld there have been a Sailor Moon-esqe quick change into Kanon's cap and waistcoat? Or... or would she have just taken out a knife and started stabbing?Jesus, I feel cold. What the hell did we just see?
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Jul 7, 2017 18:49
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7 Weights is a good song, probably my favorite in the series. It's not as hyped as some of the battle songs, but nothing else in the game captures that same ambient dread of "something rotten in Denmark".
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Jul 7, 2017 18:55
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resurgam40 posted:Jesus, I feel cold. What the hell did we just see? My guess, a personality on the verge of breaking down over being exposed as an alter and not a distinct person - but what catches my eye is Shannon's vague reference to being given orders - dodging any clues as to who gave it, thinking that "It" is the core personality.
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Jul 7, 2017 19:09
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Confused Llama posted:I have to say, it feels kind of strange for the game to still be acting so coy about Shannon and Kanon unless there's still something major we're missing. We might have had it wrong the whole the whole time. That update seems to push pretty hard that both Shannon and Kanon are masks. Also, that felt the most Higurashi of anything we've seen thus far.
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Jul 7, 2017 19:19
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Not only do neither Shannon nor Kanon recognize Lion, Lion doesn't recognize either of them either. This should not be possible in any reasonable universe based on what we know from previous episodes. Therefore, there must be something unreasonable about this universe. Perhaps it relates to this:ProfessorProf posted:
The different episodes of Umineko are stories told by different people about what could have happened on Rokkenjima. Is this line saying that there are multiple stories being told here at once?
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Jul 7, 2017 19:21
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Robindaybird posted:My guess, a personality on the verge of breaking down over being exposed as an alter and not a distinct person - but what catches my eye is Shannon's vague reference to being given orders - dodging any clues as to who gave it, thinking that "It" is the core personality. idonotlikepeas posted:Not only do neither Shannon nor Kanon recognize Lion, Lion doesn't recognize either of them either. This should not be possible in any reasonable universe based on what we know from previous episodes. Therefore, there must be something unreasonable about this universe. Putting these together: Could Lion be the separated embodiment of the core personality? We've in a bizarro world where Cliff Baby simultaneously lived and died? * The cat box is closed, so we've hit quantum Rokkenjima. *E: Or rather was accepted and not accepted. CottonWolf fucked around with this message at 19:27 on Jul 7, 2017 |
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Jul 7, 2017 19:24
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CottonWolf posted:Putting these together: Could Lion be the separated embodiment of the core personality? We've in a bizarro world where Cliff Baby simultaneously lived and died? * The cat box is closed, so we've hit quantum Rokkenjima. I think that makes sense. If Lion exists as Lion, then Shannon and Kanon should never have come into being, so of course they wouldn't know each other.
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Jul 7, 2017 19:33
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CottonWolf posted:Putting these together: Could Lion be the separated embodiment of the core personality? We've in a bizarro world where Cliff Baby simultaneously lived and died? * The cat box is closed, so we've hit quantum Rokkenjima. You know... I've been thinking about this, and I think you might be right here. Shannon speaks of "the one who gives her orders," and because of our S=K=B theory, we assume that that one is OG Beatrice, but... what if it's not? If some of us are correct in Cliff Baby= Beato, and that this is a world where Beato didn't fall off the cliff and became Lion instead, that would mean Kanon/Shannon, as extensions of Beato, would not exist here... at least naturally. So what if it's actually Bernestakel giving out orders: what these aren't the personalities we've known, but simulacrums created by Berne, just chopped off the whole and deposited here to make this universe seem more authentic? That would certainly explain why Lion can never recognize either (we've just met them, but they really don't seem to be the type to just keep forgetting long serving servant's names), and why Shannon seemed so... incomplete this update.
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Jul 7, 2017 19:36
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I looked up DID after this scene, and several personal accounts make mentions of discovering hidden alters, or even the "Main" person in control of the body isn't actually what's considered the core personality for various reasons, it's something to chew on in light of everything so far.
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Jul 7, 2017 19:40
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Agreeing that this was the most Higurashi I've felt this entire LP. But one thing I'm not grasping is the theatregoer's power. Is it the ability to act as the impartial audience and see the play as it's happening, backstage shenanigans and all?
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Jul 7, 2017 20:22
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bman in 2288 posted:Agreeing that this was the most Higurashi I've felt this entire LP. But one thing I'm not grasping is the theatregoer's power. Is it the ability to act as the impartial audience and see the play as it's happening, backstage shenanigans and all? That's what I'm suspecting. Detective's Authority grants power and unquestioned authority, but it's limited to the world of the stage. You can't forcibly question a person that doesn't want to answer. This update seems to suggest two things - Will suspects Shannon=Kanon, and for some reason forcing that proof would be a mistake. That's the biggest thing I find really weird here. No matter what, whether Shannon started assuming Kanon's mannerisms, or flipped out and started stabbing, or just broke down entirely, all of that would be the proof that Will wanted. Yet the game seems to imply that forcing the proof would be a mistake, and the reason behind that is what I want to know. And yeah, I'm echoing the intense Higurashi feelings. Quantum Rokkenjima is weird. (On a mildly different topic, I picked up and read through She Died a Lady during the week. Twas pretty good.)
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Jul 7, 2017 21:28
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I can see why this is everyone's favorite episode. The music is really fresh and different, and the tone of the narrative feels very... deliberate. It's almost like stumbling into the debug room while playing a game. so far this one is my favorite because S=K=B--CONFIRMED yoooo witchcore ricepunk fucked around with this message at 21:46 on Jul 7, 2017 |
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Jul 7, 2017 21:42
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Cyouni posted:No matter what, whether Shannon started assuming Kanon's mannerisms, or flipped out and started stabbing, or just broke down entirely, all of that would be the proof that Will wanted. Yet the game seems to imply that forcing the proof would be a mistake, and the reason behind that is what I want to know. I suspect with the reoccurring theme of love/care and the game is ultimately set up for a specific person's benefit, that Will forcing them to submit to the proof is a mistake because this is not for him even as an audience member, the person that should learn this truth is Battler, and that this truth must be divulged willingly, not forced out.
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Jul 7, 2017 21:58
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It definitely seems like this isn't a proper gameboard, more like... Bern took a bunch of scenarios and squashed all the pieces together, then called it a real scenario. If that makes sense? Like a homebrew "Betrayal at House on the Hill" haunt.
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Jul 7, 2017 21:58
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curiousCat posted:It definitely seems like this isn't a proper gameboard, more like... Bern took a bunch of scenarios and squashed all the pieces together, then called it a real scenario. If that makes sense? Like a homebrew "Betrayal at House on the Hill" haunt. Either that or a game of Calvinball.
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Jul 7, 2017 22:13
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Robindaybird posted:I suspect with the reoccurring theme of love/care and the game is ultimately set up for a specific person's benefit, that Will forcing them to submit to the proof is a mistake because this is not for him even as an audience member, the person that should learn this truth is Battler, and that this truth must be divulged willingly, not forced out. The thing is that Battler already knows this truth, as of the end of episode 5, or 6 at worst.
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Jul 7, 2017 22:38
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Cyouni posted:The thing is that Battler already knows this truth, as of the end of episode 5, or 6 at worst. I think this is mainly for Ange. She's the one who has to take the knowledge and live on, since everyone else is dead.
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Jul 7, 2017 23:05
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resurgam40 posted:Jesus, I feel cold. What the hell did we just see? The beginning of the end.
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Jul 8, 2017 00:58
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I'm with you there, resurgam. The more I think about today's scene with Shannon, the more anxious I get about the whole thing. She won the love battle in the last episode, but... how long could that relationship really last? When you think about her personality, all it is is the face many of us who've worked in retail or food service have worn on the job. Shannon, at her core, is the act of smiling and saying, "The bathroom is this way, ma'am," over and over again until your throat is hoarse. She's that unceasingly placid pleasantness, endurance, and selflessness that we wear until we clock out and melt into our real selves. Except Shannon doesn't get to go home and be herself. That is her self. This sense of fatigue is definitely colored by the fact that I am finally sitting after a long day in a very hot hot humid kitchen and I'm still annoyed that a male customer insistently touched my arm in a too-close manner 
witchcore ricepunk fucked around with this message at 04:09 on Jul 8, 2017 |
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Jul 8, 2017 04:06
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I guessed a while back that Shannon would tell you she was following orders when killing, even though the one giving the orders exists only in her imagination. It's hard for me to find the words to explain. It's like when Natsuhi had tea with Beatrice, or spoke to Kinzo after his death. She doesn't think she's Beatrice or Kinzo; she perceives them as independent entities. Likewise, Shannon doesn't have a Beatrice personality; she thinks she gets orders from Beatrice. But even if that's correct, it only explains the "one who gives orders," not why she starts acting like a short circuited robot. Even if faced with her world being shattered, that's an odd way to react. Maybe Kinzo was really building Terminators in his study and she's the result. Maybe I'm being stupid, but whose death is being investigated? There never was a Beatrice running around in 1986, right? She was never a piece on the board, that is. We had Beato in the meta world, and a few of the murder plots faked a Beatrice running around, but we only know of two actual and physical Beatrices, and they're both long dead.
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Jul 8, 2017 07:02
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BurningStone posted:Maybe I'm being stupid, but whose death is being investigated? There never was a Beatrice running around in 1986, right? She was never a piece on the board, that is. We had Beato in the meta world, and a few of the murder plots faked a Beatrice running around, but we only know of two actual and physical Beatrices, and they're both long dead. Beatrices' death. What that actually means is the first mystery, it's why Will got fussy over there not being a body, only a coffin, right now he doesn't even know for sure there's even been a death.
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Jul 8, 2017 08:36
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 BGM: Voiceless "..."Kinzo and Genji could be seen in the VIP room. Kinzo was sitting back in a chair, his eyes closed as though in a troubled sleep.  "...Master. The guest has come to see you." "...Nn."Kinzo slowly opened his eyes. Those eyes were red from crying. They regained their focus and slowly fell on Will.   "...Will." "I'm Willard. Allow me to express my condolences." "...So, you've come to visit Beatrice's funeral. Just who are you?" "I'm no one. I have no connections with anyone. Don't think too deeply about it. You'll just get a headache." "...Ow." "I ask that you choose your words a little more carefully." "...Hmph, what a strange guest. So? What business do you have with me?" "I want to ask about Beatrice." "What...?"Kinzo's gaze grew sharp. Lion felt a bit lightheaded and wondered why this guy had to be so direct.  "Why do you ask? I thought you were no one. Why do you want to know about Beatrice? What is your purpose?" "Because I am no one, I can listen to your tale openly and record it. You will probably leave this world before too long. If you die without telling anything about Beatrice, your children will adorn Beatrice with whatever tale they like, and write that into their memories." "But that is none of your business. Beatrice is mine alone. No matter what anyone says, no one can defile me and that tale. What they say is of no consequence! No matter how Krauss and the others misconstrue it, it will not be painful or vexing for me." "...Willard-sama. The Master does not like wills. He is not one to abandon anything while he still lives." "...Probably true. I thought it sounded a bit unlike you." "The ability to struggle on as long as we have life is what makes us human! You think I would give up so soon and leave behind a will? How laughably absurd!" "Yes, that does sound a bit more like you. It's not your style to ask someone to write about the past just because you feel you might die soon." "...We know how deeply you loved Beatrice-sama. You are the model most worthy of respect that any of us know, and an example for us to follow in every aspect of our lives. Please guide our wandering souls and tell us just how much you loved her, Grandfather. How you were able to live so strongly because of her love. Can I not ask for you to guide us by showing us the strength of that love...?" "You're pretty good at this." "It's your fault for being so tactless." "Boy. What do you know of Beatrice? A truly ignorant person would not hold any interest at all. The mere fact that you know Beatrice's name shows that you are neither ignorant nor unconnected." "Good point. The Beatrice I know of is the woman you loved, the one you met before the mansion on Rokkenjima was even built. However, she probably departed from this world, leaving behind a daughter. That is the girl who was raised in Kuwadorian." "...Oho." "Willard-sama. There is no building known as Kuwadorian on Rokkenjima." "...That name, Kuwadorian... You mentioned it when we were talking with Aunt Rosa too. What in the world does it mean?" BGM: Witch in Gold (cembalo) "Interesting. So, you actually know the name of Kuwadorian. Continue. You have sparked my interest."Kinzo shrugged and grinned... "The one living in Kuwadorian was probably Beatrice's daughter. However, it seems that you didn't think of her that way." "Oho. Then how did I think of her?" "When Ushiromiya Rosa went to Kuwadorian, Beatrice told her a little about herself. In that conversation, she referred to you as Kinzo. It was the same when she spoke to you directly. Though she said that she thought of you as a father, she didn't call you Father. She either didn't call you that, or she wasn't allowed to call you that. That can only mean one thing." "And what might that be...?" "...Genji. Once in the past, you spoke in front of Natsuhi and several other family members, stating that there had never been a child between Kinzo and Beatrice." "...I have no memory of saying this."Of course, 'this game's' Genji probably wouldn't remember that. However, near the end of the first game, when the survivors had all gathered in Kinzo's study... Genji was asked whether Kinzo and Beatrice ever had a child together, and he denied it, saying 'I have not heard of anything like that'. "That may have been a lie, but in a way, it was a perfect sort of answer for one of Kinzo's confidants. After all, in Kinzo's eyes, she wasn't a daughter, but Beatrice reborn." "Will...! I don't know what you're talking about, but I will not let you slander the family head!" "This isn't slander. It's reasoning. However, I understand the heart. In your eyes, Beatrice was the woman you loved most. She remained that way even after death, for all eternity, and without fading in the slightest. I doubt you thought of her as Beatrice reborn at the moment of her birth." "However, it would not be strange if you slowly began to wonder whether that child, whose blue eyes and beautiful blonde hair reminded you of a younger Beatrice, might actually be Beatrice reborn." "...Master. Shall I...?"Shall I drag this rude child out? Genji asked Kinzo. For a while, Kinzo hung his head in silence, as though remembering something from his own past. "Your daughter grew to be beautiful, and nearly identical to her mother. You must have been ecstatic. However, it's doubtful that you were fully satisfied by this. After all, though she was Beatrice reborn to you, she didn't feel that way herself." "...How can you know that?" "Whenever she was called Beatrice, she got this feeling she couldn't shake away, a feeling like something was out of place. People never feel anything out of place about the name they were given at the time of their birth. However, she did have that feeling. That must mean that she was aware that the name Beatrice was not hers."In Kuwadorian, she asked both Kinzo and Rosa about who she was.   BGM: My Dear "...Her memory... would have returned. She must have been Beatrice reborn. Her memory was coming back bit by bit. My magical ceremonies were helping her regain her memories one little bit at a time..." "H, Head-sama..." "There's no need to be surprised. If you line up the information in all the games so far, this is the answer it leads you to. The high-level Beatrice talked about this, by metaphor, she said that Kinzo refused to let the witch's soul escape even after death, and instead caught it and locked it up in a body of flesh, she also said that her power and memory had been sealed. If you match that interpretation of hers to this theory, it all makes sense." "...Willard-sama. Thanks to a powerful magical ceremony, the Master gained a reborn child of the dead Beatrice-sama. That cannot be denied." "I won't contradict the stork. And I don't intend to doubt the depths of Kinzo's love for this woman called Beatrice. How a man shows his affection for a child who is the only living reminder of her mother is no one's business. If she grew to look more and more like Beatrice, and Kinzo's love gave rise to a new, special emotion, I find that a very human reaction." "...You think... you can understand my love...?" "I'm not qualified to understand it. However, I'm also not qualified to deny it." Kinzo sobbed quietly for a while, wiping away his tears... Because of love, he believed she was Beatrice reborn, and had raised her that way. However, somewhere in his heart, he might have felt pangs of conscience, telling him that he might be forcing his emotions on someone who wasn't really Beatrice. Then, the Beatrice of Kuwadorian had an unexpected guest, Rosa. That woman just couldn't believe that she was the Beatrice that Kinzo desired. She couldn't stand the fact that she didn't understand who she was, and she wanted to escape to the outside world. Then, she fell from the cliff... and died.  "..." "Funerals aren't for the dead. They exist so that those who are alive can sever their ties with the dead. You could never do that. That's why it festered within you." "...Beatrice... ooooooooohhhh..." "G, Grandfather..." "You lost your mistress's... no, you lost Beatrice twice. Unable to let that sorrow show on the outside, you kept it locked up in your heart, and it eventually festered and turned to madness. That's what spurred on your abnormally strong interest in the occult in your later years." "Oooooooooohhhh!! Beatriiiiiiiice, Beatriiiiiiice!! Why?!! Why did you leave me twice?! Your smile, that beautiful hair, those eyes... why did you die in my arms not once, but twice?! Is that how much... how much you... ooooooohhhh, oooooooooooooooooooooooohhhh... oohhh..."By now, Kinzo wasn't even trying to suppress his sobs. He sometimes scratched at his head in anguish. Sometimes faced the heavens like an opera singer. Kinzo yelled over and over again, repeating Beatrice's name... At that moment, there was a quiet sound of a door closing. When they turned around, she was already there. Kumasawa had appeared.  BGM: Mystic Forest "...Though, if they know that much, I don't believe there is anything more to tell..." "No, we should tell them. As a woman, I've always thought that the heart of Kuwadorian's Beatrice is a story that should be told. And now, someone has appeared who is worthy to hear it. I believe that now is the time to tell all, without holding back." "..." "Kumasawa-san, do you know something? About Beatrice...?" "Of course she does. In the fourth game, we have testimony from the ferryboat captain saying that Kumasawa went in and out of Kuwadorian. I'd be willing to bet that Kumasawa had different work shifts at the mansion and Kuwadorian. There was a young girl to be taken care of. Kumasawa, with her long experience in taking care of children, must have been of immense value." "...That is correct. You might even call me her wet nurse." "No way... I can't believe it. So, everything Will-san is saying is the truth." "...Yes. It is a fact. There was a secret mansion constructed on the opposite side of the island for Beatrice-sama. The existence of Kuwadorian is the truth." "I don't know when Kinzo married his official wife, but back when Kinzo already had an enormous store of wealth and had bought Rokkenjima whole, he built two mansions and set up two separate lives."Kinzo's children had also been aware of Kinzo's clandestine eccentricities at the time. It probably hadn't been easy to set up two lives. Moreover, Kinzo's wife had been suspicious and had sniffed around all the time... "The Master stayed in Kuwadorian as much as time allowed. He would sometimes pretend to go on a business trip and stay there for several days, treasuring the time he spent with Beatrice-sama." "...It was not simply a father-daughter relationship. You could sometimes catch a glimpse of his great love for the dead Beatrice-sama, and it was a heart-warming thing." "The way you say it makes it sound like he sometimes treated her... as a substitute for Beatrice." Kumasawa's tone made it sound as though she was scolding Kinzo. As a mother who had raised many kids, Kumasawa had probably spotted that Kinzo's love was often of a mistaken sort. However, the more she grew to look like her mother, the more distorted and twisted Kinzo's heart became... Because of his deep love, it grew very, very... twisted... "...You are right to scold me, my friend. I understand. My love is eternal and undying. However, I must acknowledge... that I poured that affection onto... the wrong person..." "...Grandfather... Wait, you don't mean..." "Lion-sama. All humans in this world are tied to each other. Even if they do not notice, there is always some sort of tie. Those ties... wrap themselves around people and bring them together." "No way... Grandfather..."Just as Kinzo had done, Lion also wiped away tears and stared down at the floor. Apparently, the truth had been too much of a shock for the young successor to handle...  BGM: Haruka "...I see. So, that time has come, my friend." "Unless you tell us, none of the truth will become clear." "...Master. I believe they may have the qualifications and the right to know." "I know. Perhaps on this day of my fickle funeral, Beatrice in heaven has given me a chance to atone... Forgive me for not telling you this before now."After taking a deep breath, Kinzo finally lowered the hands that had been covering his face, and looked at Will and Lion with those red eyes. "..." "...Grandfather..." "You listen too, Lion. Guest. Willard, was it?" "Yeah." "...I thank you for giving me a chance to speak of the truth while I still am able. You must surely be a messenger from heaven sent by Beatrice... You have my gratitude..." "Beatrice isn't the one you have to thank. It was some witch. Well, I guess they're both witches..." "Hmph, I do not care who it was. I have been given a chance. That is enough. Thank you, Willard."Kinzo slowly stood up and held out his right hand. He was offering to shake hands. It must have been Kinzo's way of expressing his gratitude... Will responded. Then, the two hands gripped each other tightly in silence. When they did, a bright light poured out from the gap between the two hands. "...Nn-"Will felt as though something the size of a grain had burned itself into his palm. It was that power that Bernkastel had given him. The light grew brighter and brighter. However, it seemed that Kinzo and the others could not see it.   BGM: L&D Circulation "...So, are you Kinzo?" "It's how Grandfather looked in the past. I've seen photos. Just what on Earth..." "It's the theatergoing power that Bernkastel gave me. Don't try to understand." "I'll just get a headache?" "You're getting the hang of this."At one time, Genji told Battler that he looked like Kinzo in his youth. Sure enough, though the young Kinzo wasn't exactly the same as Battler, they looked very similar.  "Grandfather..."Even the voice seemed to resemble Battler's somehow. Clearly, Battler had inherited Kinzo's blood more thickly than any other...  "I did not want to succeed the Ushiromiya family headship. My being chosen as the head was nothing more than a prank of fate." "...In the Great Kanto Earthquake, those in charge passed away, and you were selected from the branch families." "That's correct. After all, Grandfather was wise despite his youth, and he already possessed a dignity fitting for the headship." "Fuhahahahahahahaha... Ridiculous. Those greedy elders kept looking out for their own personal interests and couldn't decide on a new head at all. It was as foolish as arguing about who the new captain should be on a sinking ship." "So, since you had no connections with anyone in the main family, you were selected right out of the blue." "It's all because of my toes. If only I'd had one less toe on each foot, my life may have turned out quite differently..."In the Ushiromiya family, polydactyly was seen as a sign of good fortune. This was because many of the great ones in the family history had had it.  "It was all very pathetic. The elders didn't care whom they dragged in as long as it wouldn't benefit any one of them particularly." "So, they just happened to hear that someone in one of the branch families had six toes, and decided that would do well enough." "Precisely. The elders didn't care what sort of novice became the head, as long as they could make him their puppet. In fact, the more this person was ignorant of how to lead, the better it would be for them." "...Grandfather..." "Lion. It is quite different in your case. You will be the one who inherits everything I have. That is the fate you were granted on the day of your birth. That is why I gave you that silver ring and raised you so strictly. You are quite different from me. You are already a splendid successor, of whom no one could be ashamed..." "...Y, yes sir..." "A puppet for a head... I doubt that could've been easy." "...Heh, hehahahahahahahahaha..."As he pondered about where to begin, Kinzo laughed bitterly. It would probably bring back painful memories no matter where he started from... "It... lasted for so long, that span of gray days. That dizzying stretch of time I spent dead, like moss growing on a rock..."I became the rope in the tug of war between the elders, who thought of nothing but their own profit, and I probably could have snapped at any moment. However, people are far more resilient than one would think. Though I spent so many days as though I had been killed, I was not killed. So, I was forced to search for death on my own...  BGM: Fall That dizzyingly long stretch of gray was left completely empty. It lasted for a full 20 years. In 20 years, a person can be born, find a purpose, and even become their own man with their own place in the world. In short, if one truly becomes a human only when they have become a working adult... Then I spent a time long enough to create a human... by doing nothing except playing the part of those greedy elders' puppet. Ironically, though that time aged my body, it did not age my mind. My mind alone... was still as young as it had been during those rich, happy days before I had been summoned to Odawara. And yet, my body alone had grown older and older. Eventually, the vast gap between the two grew to almost incomprehensible levels. So, I could hardly believe that the worn out man in the mirror was really me. No, it really wasn't me. The 'Head of the Ushiromiya family' was just a name. It had no power. It didn't require that I have any independence. There was no need for me to get involved with anything. I was just a doll sitting there on the doll rack, gathering dust. I remember nothing but lazily flipping through Western books I liked, locking myself in my own world, doing nothing but playing with roses and drinking terrible drinks. And it lasted a full 20 years. Before I knew it... I suddenly had a wife I did not know. It wasn't any wife I had chosen. It was the daughter of some noble family that the elders had chosen and forced on me for their own reasons, but that did not matter to me. I did not love my wife, but neither did I dislike her. I just didn't care. I fathered a few children, but that wasn't out of love for my wife. They were just born before I knew it. That's all there was to it. None of it mattered. No, that's not quite right. Everything was decided by someone other than me, and I simply obeyed. That was the job... of the 'Ushiromiya family head'...  "I can't believe it. To think that you, the one who has been praised for being such a bold and wise ruler, lived life like that for so long..." "...Lion. There is nothing so long and faint as a life you do not live for yourself. And yet, it slides on by in the blink of an eye. Do not forget this." "A life... you live for yourself..." "Living means having your own will. You probably were dead during that time." "Precisely. I wanted to live. No, I wanted to die. How can a puppet die?" "...By cutting... the strings." "Correct. That would be death, and it would also be life, since it would mean being free."Before I realized it, the world had grown troubled.  BGM: Wingless Japan had extended their war fronts too far to the East and West, and the tide of war was changing. Thanks to the influence of the elders, I was able to avoid conscription. Of course, this was not out of compassion for me. It was because I was their precious puppet. So, the war never really felt that close to me. However, when I personally decided to abandon their protection, it was very easy. At that time, the Ushiromiya family had almost completely collapsed, and since the elders had apparently gathered enough of the scraps to last them the rest of their lives, they seemed to care little for what I did, now that they no longer had any use for me. So, I realized that I had finally found my time to die. One by one, I cut the threads I was hanging from, and began to search for a place to end my life. "So, you searched for death on the battlefield?" "...I thought that if I was going to die anyway, I should try to be of some use to my country. No, that's a lie. I probably just lacked the willpower to end my own life. War was a suitable excuse for death." "I heard that Grandfather had knowledge in public works and construction, so he was tasked with setting up facilities for the Navy construction team." "Hmph, and what a foolish mistake that was. If only I had just said that I had no useful skills, I could have been sent to the dangerous front lines right away..." "So, you didn't need to go to the front lines?" "Some of the others were overjoyed at their luck. It was the opposite for me. I had only wanted to get drunk on the liquor known as dying for the sake of one's country. The US planes did nothing but cut across the skies of that forgotten island. They didn't have even a bullet to spare for me, much less a bomb." "Is this the time you met Beatrice, Grandfather...?" "Correct. She came to me from the sea..." "Where did you meet her? You mentioned an island." "Yes, This island. That's where she arrived." "...So, you met here, on Rokkenjima?" "What's going on...? I heard that Rokkenjima was uninhabited until you bought it, Grandfather. I never knew there was a Japanese military base here." "Pft, hahahahahahahaha... Ah, yes, you could hardly call that a military base. It was just a cave. I was one of the guards of that cave." BGM: L&D Circulation Due to the honorable defeats at Saipan and Guam, Japan's Absolute National Defense Zone strategy was in shambles. Where had the gallantry shown at Pearl Harbor gone? The old attackers were now the ones on the defensive. At that time, it was said that the last trump card for the Japanese military was a type of manned torpedo known as the Kaiten. It was said that these ultimate weapons were packed with 1.55 tons of explosives and capable of sinking any kind of warship with a single blast. To strengthen homeland defense, the Navy drafted a plan to build a string of hidden bases from Hachijo Island to Yokosuka, all to house submarines loaded with Kaiten torpedoes.  "Just what sort of fool decided it would be a good idea to plant a base on this desolate island. To better preserve its secrecy? Hmph, ridiculous. I could never understand what the higher-ups were thinking, and I didn't particularly want to."The Kaiten, which could finish off a large warship with a single strike, truly was an ultimate weapon. It was hoped that the presence of submarines capable of loading these weapons in the waters just off of Japan would allow for a powerful sea ambush as a final line of defense. So, to aid in the establishment of a base with absolute secrecy, the uninhabited island Rokkenjima was raised as a possible candidate. An investigation of the island resulted in the discovery of a large cave in the cliffs, and this was apparently deemed to be a suitable location for a submarine base. "So, you were tasked with aiding in the establishment of that base?" "Establishment? Certainly, if you can call digging out a cave 'establishment'. Not only that, the base was abandoned before its completion." "Why?" "Wahahahahaha! Because at that time, Japan no longer had any submarines large enough to transport a Kaiten torpedo. How truly laughable. What's the point in having a submarine base if there aren't any submarines left? If there's one thing that never changes, it's politicians and their meaningless projects."The base on Hachijo Island was outfitted with Kaiten torpedoes and became a base for direct attacks, but Rokkenjima was never supplied with any. Furthermore, the construction was eventually suspended, and the minimum number of men were stationed on the island, waiting for orders from above that never came. Could it be the fact that it was a hidden base sealed our fate? The higher-ups had already completely forgotten about this useless and pointless cavern. We were nothing more than guards for a mere cave. We spent our days farming, fishing, playing with the dirt, all the while gazing up at the American formations flying past. Some of our group were relieved at the prospects of the war ending before anyone remembered we were here and before any of us had to face a real battle. Of course, it was the opposite for me. I hoped and hoped for the American troops to advance and kill me as soon as possible. Those days were empty and blank. Let us go back.  
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Jul 8, 2017 14:05
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god, my stomach felt tight during all of that. Having explicit confirmation about the two beatrice situation and Kinzo's story somehow making me sympathize with him, this is some powerful writing.
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Jul 8, 2017 14:44
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Well, that was exactly as hosed up as we thought it was going to be...
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Jul 8, 2017 14:52
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ProfessorProf posted:
Uh, Will, as much as I appreciate you getting confirmation of a bunch of stuff we'd already figured out and, I hope, eventually tying up the remaining loose ends, I think I'm going to have to disagree with you on this one. Unless Cliff Baby's parentage isn't what we've speculated that it is.
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Jul 8, 2017 14:55
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yeah, I think it's very weird that all the servants and Will were like "Yup, that happened."
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Jul 8, 2017 14:59
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I'm not gonna get into the current conversation until some more progress is made on this story thread, buuuut While I am an ardent stan of Ryukishi's sprites being good, I must be honest and say that "young Kinzo" is simply... well...  Not great.
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Jul 8, 2017 15:07
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Apparently the power of the theatergoer is to have things explained to you. The detective only gets clues and has to figure them out.
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Jul 8, 2017 15:19
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the power of exposition
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Jul 8, 2017 15:20
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Tired Moritz posted:the power of exposition Pretty good power when you're trying to solve a mystery.
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Jul 8, 2017 15:25
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