|
Wow, so Skorne has a theme list that lets them take Minion beasts in battlegropu. That's about the most gut punch thing I think they could print as a Minions player.
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2017 21:37
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 6, 2024 05:12 |
|
|
counterspin posted:Wow, so Skorne has a theme list that lets them take Minion beasts in battlegropu. That's about the most gut punch thing I think they could print as a Minions player. Wait what? My dicks can only get so hard.
|
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2017 21:38
|
|
|
New Skorne theme allows them to take ANY minions beast in battlegroup as a Skorne beast and any number of minions units. Which means they also gave access to channelling to all Skorne warlocks? Wait no, I'm wrong, it's Naaresh + Paingiver warlocks only? I thought there weren't going to be any more caster restricted themes?
counterspin fucked around with this message at 21:43 on Jul 11, 2017 |
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2017 21:39
|
|
|
counterspin posted:New Skorne theme allows them to take ANY minions beast in battlegroup as a Skorne beast and any number of minions units. Which means they also gave access to channelling to all Skorne warlocks? Wait no, I'm wrong, it's Naaresh + Paingiver warlocks only? I thought there weren't going to be any more caster restricted themes? Dunno why you'd think that? I don't remember them ever saying anything like that. They just aren't going to be doing themes for individual casters. e: Disciples of Agony Army Composition An army made using this theme force can include only the following Skorne models: Paingiver warlocks Master Ascetic Naaresh Non-character warbeasts Mortitheurge models/units Nihilator models/units Paingiver models/units Special Rules This army can include any number of Minion units. This army can also include one Minion solo and one Minion battle engine. These models/units can be included even if they have the Partisan [Skorne] special rule. Skorne warlocks in this army can control Minion warbeasts. Minion warbeasts in this army controlled that are controlled by a Skorne warlock are considered to be Skorne warbeasts, not Minion warbeasts. For every full 20 points of units in this army, you can add one Skorne command attachment or small-based Skorne solo to the army free of cost. Free command attachments do not count toward the total number of units in the army when calculating this bonus. Paingiver models gain Sacrificial Pawn [Minion warrior model]. (When a model with Sacrificial Pawn [Minion warrior model] is directly hit by an enemy ranged attack, you can have one friendly, non-incorporeal Minion warrior model within 3˝ of it directly hit instead. That model is automatically hit and suffers all damage and effects.) One Paingiver Bloodrunner unit in this army gains Ambush. (You can choose not to deploy a unit with Ambush at the start of the game. If it is not deployed normally, you can put it into play at the end of any of your Control Phases after your first turn. When you do, choose any table edge except the back of your opponent’s deployment zone. Place the unit with Ambush completely within 3˝ of the chosen table edge.)
|
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2017 21:48
|
|
|
I vaguely recall some from PP talking about how themes would be open to everyone to contrast them with MK2 themes, but I could be wrong. I've gotten more suspicious of PP press since I re-read the MK3 minions announcement, which is all about how great it is going to be to play pigs and gators together in one list.
counterspin fucked around with this message at 21:54 on Jul 11, 2017 |
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2017 21:51
|
|
|
Rage mixing with pig and skorne beasts seems insane. Is arc node for those warlocks really good? Also gives access to that reach Animus and primal
|
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2017 22:07
|
|
|
counterspin posted:I vaguely recall some from PP talking about how themes would be open to everyone to contrast them with MK2 themes, but I could be wrong. I've gotten more suspicious of PP press since I re-read the MK3 minions announcement, which is all about how great it is going to be to play pigs and gators together in one list. Circle, Ret, Mercs, minions, and Skorne all have themes that restrict casters. Like, Kingmaker was the very first MK3 theme announced and it's very restricted on casters. I belive all they said is that it wouldn't ever be one caster per theme.
|
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2017 22:11
|
|
|
SHY NUDIST GRRL posted:Rage mixing with pig and skorne beasts seems insane. Is arc node for those warlocks really good? Also gives access to that reach Animus and primal Reach animus isn't quite as good as Rush in general but it depends on the situation. Primal also isn't a huge deal but being able to give a bronzeback or whatever +7 strength is insane.
|
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2017 22:17
|
|
|
CaptCommy posted:Circle, Ret, Mercs, minions, and Skorne all have themes that restrict casters. Like, Kingmaker was the very first MK3 theme announced and it's very restricted on casters. I belive all they said is that it wouldn't ever be one caster per theme. I love that their response to people being worried about mercenaries and minions includes an announcement that minions is now a Skorne theme list. counterspin fucked around with this message at 23:40 on Jul 11, 2017 |
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2017 22:19
|
|
|
S.J. posted:Reach animus isn't quite as good as Rush in general but it depends on the situation. Primal also isn't a huge deal but being able to give a bronzeback or whatever +7 strength is insane. You can go +8 if you *really* need to with Naresh's feat. Honestly, this theme seems like what I needed to make the Rhinodon spam list playable. Take a Wrastler for rage, and start trading your 12 point value beasts that have a knockdown rider on their tail. A P+S 22 and 2 P+S 21s will make a serious dent in something. And best part is that you have like 6+ of them, and only need to worry about buffing the ones that are charging in to mess stuff up. Also, arc nodes if needed are neat, though I think the main use is Mortality or Pursuit with the 5 casters available for the theme. I could also see a pile of War Hogs, since they seem to go well with Naresh and can swing even higher with Rage, Aggression Dial, Enrage, and Feat. +10 Damage is probably not needed, but it would make sure that you absolutely annihilate an enemy heavy jack.
|
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2017 22:59
|
|
|
It kind of makes sense for Skorne, but I fully understand why the Minions Facebook group is currently vomiting blood over this and the general theme force announcement on mercs/minions.
|
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2017 23:29
|
|
|
PP is in a tough position because at the tail end of Mk2 the factions were really starting to creak under the weight of model bloat. For fiscal reasons they have to continue churning out new releases but it's absolutely destructive to balance. The solution they seem to have decided on is to move in the direction of splitting things into sub-factions through the use of theme lists. Right now we're in the middle of a very awkward transition but I think the fundamental direction is sound. A lot of the current frustration stems from the fact that they have been trying to keep up their release schedule on top of stepping up balancing efforts and releasing new themes. So stuff gets pushed out that is of varying quality. CID seems to be helping improve this. I suspect the big picture will look a lot better in a year or two, if they can survive the transition without alienating players too much.
|
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2017 23:45
|
|
|
rkajdi posted:Honestly, this theme seems like what I needed to make the Rhinodon spam list playable. Take a Wrastler for rage, and start trading your 12 point value beasts that have a 7knockdown rider on their tail. Wow that's so broken, nerf this sick filth. *Puts Amon on the table*
|
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2017 23:56
|
|
|
AttackBacon posted:
Everything you mention is super on point, but this bit in particular is the stuff I'm worried might become an issue
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2017 00:01
|
|
|
Alpha Phoenix posted:Wow that's so broken, nerf this sick filth. The knockdown doesn't work on him, but then again, you're getting hits at PS 21 or 22 including three initials. My point was why set up a buff to a bronzeback or gladiator when smaller beasts buffed highly will still trade well. You're not into the value jack level, but you're also not far from it. I don't think anything can handle the 10 marauders list in skorne, but this might give you a bit of a chance. I'm thinking you can fit maybe 6 Rhinodons in plus the Wrastler who you commit last. The leaves room for a max unit of PGBH and maybe a second one or some solos. I'm not saying it's the best thing in the world, but it doesn't seem awful either.
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2017 00:17
|
|
|
Honestly I'm thinking a bunch of Rhinodons under Naaresh with a Rage caddy are going to tear rear end through Marauder spam. Those marauders are swinging for negative damage (rhinodons being anywhere from arm 18 to arm 23) whereas the Rhinodons can go up to pow 23/22/22, with free charges. Lamentation craps on Harkevich real, real bad. Maybe add a scarab pack or two as an annoying screen and you're gold.
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2017 02:38
|
|
|
They just seem dedicated to building the bike while it is in motion. Sr2017 and this new theme/subtraction thing are going to define mk3 but they should have planned for them better. There was a golden chance to ditch themes for subfactions that they've now missed.
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2017 02:43
|
|
|
rkajdi posted:You're not into the value jack level, but you're also not far from it. This was my point, you spend all that planning and work lining up buff chains to hit the average power level of slapping down a bunch of crusaders and saying go. Not saying it won't work, just thinking about the cost/work to reward ratio.
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2017 03:26
|
|
|
Re: Naaresh Rhinodon spam Naaresh has battle group: pain response so you don't even need your PGBH in b2b for free charges. Edit: And I am just realizing that swamp horrors and wrastlers with Morg1 are gonna be terrifying. Abused and enraged wrastler with rush threatens 13" with a pow 21 initial and 2 pow 20 initials, and free charge on living models. Swamp horror with same 13" range (12" with beak) for 3 pow 16 chain weapon attacks and a pow 20 beak if within 12". waah fucked around with this message at 04:01 on Jul 12, 2017 |
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2017 03:50
|
|
|
On a slightly lesser note, you can take a splatter boar for lucky shot for titan canoneers or the mamoth, though I suppose they'd usually want to use snipe.
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2017 07:03
|
|
|
waah posted:Swamp horror with same 13" range (12" with beak) for 3 pow 16 chain weapon attacks and a pow 20 beak if within 12". 13" is fine for the beak attack, the tentacles have Pull so it'll be in range unless the target can't be pushed.
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2017 08:21
|
|
|
I think attackbacon has it right. Certainly said it better than I've been trying to. These growing pains are getting to be a problem, everyone in my group is annoyed with the state of themes
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2017 12:07
|
|
|
For me the frustrating part is mostly that the first waves of balance errata after 3e came out did a good job and it looked like with a few more of those they could get the whole range into a pretty good state - the top and bottom 5% of options in each faction were pretty universally agreed. But then themes started popping up to muddy the water. Kickymonks needed a nerf and paladins needed a buff but instead they're both officially not intended to be played until they figure out how to fill out a theme that suits each of them. I'm really hoping Northkin aren't a sign that the not-in-theme models are intended to be shelved until they decide to release the rest of a subfaction to go with them.
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2017 13:16
|
|
|
Yeah, the reason I've stopped playing as much in mk3 is because non of pp's choices make any sense to me. Like maybe they have some big plan they're working towards, but like, at this point, if they came out tomorrow and said "high shields are finally getting a change!" I genuinely wouldn't bat an eyelid if it was that they were losing combined ranged attack and were now a cryx unit instead. Nor would I be surprised if their speed was increased a point, like, it could just be anything. And that's kind of exhausting.
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2017 16:10
|
|
|
So I ran Zaal2 last night and it was like finding an old friend. An old friend with freakishly hot dice that managed to piss off my opponent to the point I felt awful, but still. Fellow Skorne players, who do you think I should pair with Zaal2 for a tournament in August? War Room Army Skorne - Zaal2 Evo 4 Theme: No Theme Selected 75 / 75 Army Zaal, The Ancestral Advocate - WB: +29 - Cyclops Shaman - PC: 8 (Battlegroup Points Used: 8) - Cyclops Shaman - PC: 8 (Battlegroup Points Used: 8) - Cyclops Raider - PC: 9 (Battlegroup Points Used: 9) - Cyclops Raider - PC: 9 (Battlegroup Points Used: 4) Ancestral Guardian - PC: 5 Hakaar the Destroyer - PC: 7 Void Spirit - PC: 4 Immortals - Leader & 9 Grunts: 15 - Extoller Advocate - PC: 4 Immortals - Leader & 9 Grunts: 15 - Extoller Advocate - PC: 4 Paingiver Beast Handlers - Leader & 3 Grunts: 5 Praetorian Karax - Leader & 9 Grunts: 11
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2017 17:45
|
|
|
I would go with something fast an beast heavy, like actuap heavies. I'd pair it with x2 but I'm biased for him.
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2017 19:22
|
|
|
waah posted:So I ran Zaal2 last night and it was like finding an old friend. I run a rather similar list (less beasts and no karax or void spirit , but max slingers and a second guardian) and have had lots of success with it. I think my beasts were Shaman, pair of Basilisks, and an agonizer, but I like your load out. Extra range for spell assassination is key from Craft Talisman. It's a list that trades incredibly well, since you immediately punish turns where you lose Immortals or cheap units with punishing turn from Zaal or a Guardian under Aura of Power. For pairing, I'd think a fast heavy list. So Xerxis2 fast Titans would be interesting, but I could also see Zaadesh2, Morghoul1, or Makeda3.
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2017 19:48
|
|
|
A local runs a similar triple immortals list to horrifying effectiveness.
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2017 21:08
|
|
|
SHY NUDIST GRRL posted:Rage mixing with pig and skorne beasts seems insane. Is arc node for those warlocks really good? Also gives access to that reach Animus and primal Only Xekaar really needs the arc node. But he really needs an arc node. DEF 15, ARM 14, three offensive spells on his card, no defensive tech. He also loves the DEF 12 of Minion heavies; this makes what is currently far and away the worst Skorne warlock (and possibly the worst warlock in the game) very playable. Morghoul1 who's probably our third warlock also gets what he needs to play the game he wants to but isn't quite good enough to - pumping lights to hit like heavies. Primal's just what the doctor ordered. And neither other Morghoul quite gets what they want from the theme so it's not overpowering there. (The Reach animus is rarely as useful as Rush)
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2017 21:35
|
|
|
neonchameleon posted:(The Reach animus is rarely as useful as Rush) People seem excited for a 2" reach Fan of Shadows and dagger on Morg2 for some reason. Dunno how good it is, but there you go. Although this does bring up a question. Swamp Horror has Impervious Flesh, so when it suffers a damage roll, one die less is rolled against it. Does that interact with Morg1's Maltreatment?
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2017 21:47
|
|
|
It'll take a d3 since thats what Maltreatment does.
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2017 22:03
|
|
|
Pyrolocutus posted:People seem excited for a 2" reach Fan of Shadows and dagger on Morg2 for some reason. Dunno how good it is, but there you go. Nah, you'll still take the d3. 
|
|
#
?
Jul 13, 2017 03:33
|
|
|
Thanks for the feed back guys. I have a soft spot for Mak3 so I think i will use her as a pairing. Or Zaadesh 2, but i need to paint him.
|
|
#
?
Jul 13, 2017 03:35
|
|
|
I haven't kept up since after the MK3 release. Stopped playing due to life circumstances, but able to again. What is new and good (or bad), since after the release of MK3? How is the state of the game overall right now?
|
|
#
?
Jul 13, 2017 04:14
|
|
|
Mugaaz posted:I haven't kept up since after the MK3 release. Stopped playing due to life circumstances, but able to again. What is new and good (or bad), since after the release of MK3? How is the state of the game overall right now? It is the best of times, it is the worst of times. What faction do you main? Better to answer that than anything else.
|
|
#
?
Jul 13, 2017 05:03
|
|
|
S.J. posted:Nah, you'll still take the d3. Llaelese AND pirate theme force in the coming months? 
|
|
#
?
Jul 13, 2017 05:50
|
|
|
Mugaaz posted:I haven't kept up since after the MK3 release. Stopped playing due to life circumstances, but able to again. What is new and good (or bad), since after the release of MK3? How is the state of the game overall right now? Honestly pretty good. Updates have happened amd I maintain its better than the end of mk2 being ruled by a handful of casters an lists. As for what is good an bad casters like Amon are good, Skorne is good again. Cryx has playability now. On the downside some casters are under powered. Theme lists are making or breaking the game but its under CiD so they can an will adjust things. That is my take away.
|
|
#
?
Jul 13, 2017 06:10
|
|
|
For_Great_Justice posted:Honestly pretty good. Updates have happened amd I maintain its better than the end of mk2 being ruled by a handful of casters an lists. Yeah, that's about where I am. But I'm also playing Skorne, who've been sitting on the other side of the theme equation for awhile. It meant that you were playing at a points deficit, but you have a lot of variability and honestly the faction feels more full than ever. And I like what has been done with their new theme-- it's much more about different options than free cards, though I guess you could also play it for them if you wanted to.
|
|
#
?
Jul 13, 2017 12:29
|
|
|
Also, here's a spitball idea that I came up with in the car on the way to work: Maybe Acolytes of Pain could work for Morghoul 2 & 3, just not as the beast heavy version that the others use. Lots of Minions, some ambushing Bloodrunners, and some nice free solos to buff both. I guess you also could use Sac Pawn to protect your casters from shooting, but Stealth tends to do that well already.
|
|
#
?
Jul 13, 2017 13:47
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 6, 2024 05:12 |
|
|
Morghoul 2. Pop blind on their caster, shoot with 1/2 units of preying brigands, close with 1/2 primaled Archidons.
|
|
#
?
Jul 13, 2017 13:49
|
|