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Eh, I'm of the opinion that states should largely be turned into infrastructure, planning, and coordination rules. (And also that Melbourne and Victoria should be two seperate parliaments)
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Jul 14, 2017 09:52
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NPR Journalizard posted:gently caress off bigis its been plainly explained a bunch of times, if you are too stupid to realise who the mistake happened, you should just go kill yourself. Has it?
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Jul 14, 2017 10:00
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bigis posted:Lol how do you not know if you hold citizenship of another country. I agree.
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Jul 14, 2017 10:03
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if that petition is any indication then he probably knew about it 3 years ago and didn't take it seriously enough
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Jul 14, 2017 10:07
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Three years ago was the middle of Obama Birther mocking, he probably would've assumed shitstirring.
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Jul 14, 2017 10:09
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starkebn posted:if that petition is any indication then he probably knew about it 3 years ago and didn't take it seriously enough I think paying attention to internet petitions that don't even get a dozen signatures is a poor precedent to set, even if they occasionally end up being correct.
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Jul 14, 2017 10:10
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Hobo Erotica posted:I guess my Question is are we better served by having 9 departments of roads / transport, health, education, police, etc, or would just the 1 be more efficient. Basically, if state governments run something then generally it'll be more reactive to local need, and if the federal government run something then it'll be more standardised across the country and it'll have more money behind it; either isn't a bad option depending, though obviously there are some areas where it makes sense for one side or the other to have power (eg local infrastructure and planning for state government, health and education for the feds). The big issues come up where responsibility is shared. Then it's a free for all between nine parties where the feds have all the money but the states have all the power to actually implement whatever the federal government wants to do. These sorts of negotiations take months if not years, and at the end you get a 10 page document where the states get a small amount of money for a vaguely defined purpose and by the way you need to start over again in three years time. This is all governed by the constitution which isn't bad as constitutions go but it's clearly a document of its time and has a huge amount of holes. For example, in education: the federal government has complete and utter control over higher education, states basically get no say at all. On the other hand, states hold the majority of power in vocational education (this doesn't stop the feds trying to muscle in on the action through for example VET FEE-HELP, which was rorted insanely hard and was a complete failure of a program). This is a pet peeve of mine because it's an insurmountable barrier to creating a joined up tertiary education system the likes of which you see in Europe (for example, Germany's system is pretty top class), so there's this idiotic tug of war between vocational education and university education that serves noone. Meanwhile, responsibility of schooling is shared between governments, but by virtue of funding agreements states have the power in public schools and the federal government has the power in private schools. Theoretically it forces the states and federal government to come to a compromise that benefits both the individual states and the country as a whole, but in reality it's a complete clusterfuck.
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Jul 14, 2017 10:13
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starkebn posted:if that petition is any indication then he probably knew about it 3 years ago and didn't take it seriously enough What difference would it have made? Resign 3 years ago? Bb joey give me a minute
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Jul 14, 2017 10:16
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Auspol August - in reality it's a complete clusterfuck
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Jul 14, 2017 10:16
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Hobo Erotica posted:What difference would it have made? Resign 3 years ago? If the Greens knew 3 years ago or had reason to suspect and check (discounting the fact that they should have done their goddamn due diligence when he first ran), he shouldn't have run in the most recent election. Which makes it ignorance (bad, for a party billing itself as the 'credible alternative') or they knew and figured revealing it was more damaging and he was their best election prospect. (worse. Way worse.)
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Jul 14, 2017 10:19
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Hobo Erotica posted:What difference would it have made? Resign 3 years ago? or check, and get legal advice before someone had his balls in a vice?
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Jul 14, 2017 10:23
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Mattjpwns posted:If the Greens knew 3 years ago or had reason to suspect and check (discounting the fact that they should have done their goddamn due diligence when he first ran), he shouldn't have run in the most recent election. Which makes it ignorance (bad, for a party billing itself as the 'credible alternative') or they knew and figured revealing it was more damaging and he was their best election prospect. (worse. Way worse.) And now, someone else in the Greens has used it to lever him out, right after they tried to isolate Rhiannon and kill off democracy in the party. A closet Tory is proving that change from within can work after all!
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Jul 14, 2017 10:25
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NTRabbit posted:And now, someone else in the Greens has used it to lever him out, right after they tried to isolate Rhiannon and kill off democracy in the party. so that's the gossip? this is interparty conflict?
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Jul 14, 2017 10:26
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starkebn posted:so that's the gossip? this is interparty conflict? I'm not a member, I just assume it to be the case since neither major party benefits as the seat stays Green, so they wouldn't have bothered.
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Jul 14, 2017 10:28
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Benefit from the Greens not having their top talent though.
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Jul 14, 2017 10:33
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NTRabbit posted:I'm not a member, I just assume it to be the case since neither major party benefits as the seat stays Green, so they wouldn't have bothered. apart from the fact that just making the Greens look more dysfunctional does damage no matter what, and Scott is one of the most well known and well liked Greens parliamentarians there is
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Jul 14, 2017 10:33
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It reflects badly on the Greens, there are lots of people and organisations that could have been behind it. Sue vs Hill wasn't an intraparty conspiracy, it was a constituent (and another candidate) who brought the case. Same with the birther stuff about Abbott, although it never got that far.
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Jul 14, 2017 10:35
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Jul 14, 2017 10:38
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I absolutely loving loathe Tony Abbott, but the timing and slam of this document drop is the most impressive thing he (to be fair, probably his office) have done.
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Jul 14, 2017 10:56
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I'm the missing date below the signature.
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Jul 14, 2017 10:57
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Mattjpwns posted:I absolutely loving loathe Tony Abbott, but the timing and slam of this document drop is the most impressive thing he (to be fair, probably his office) have done. He's been holding on to it for 2.5 years.
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Jul 14, 2017 10:58
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UrbanLabyrinth posted:He's been holding on to it for 2.5 years. To be fair keeping a "well gently caress you" document close to your chest until a good time comes around is a pro move.
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Jul 14, 2017 10:59
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UrbanLabyrinth posted:He's been holding on to it for 2.5 years. Wouldn't surprise me, to be honest. The "birther" movement was a super useful distraction for a floundering government. Why would you shut that poo poo down unless you absolutely had to? e: the date! You weren't just making a guess at a time period. Tony has never owned anyone this hard. Mattjpwns fucked around with this message at 11:08 on Jul 14, 2017 |
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Jul 14, 2017 11:01
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DancingShade posted:I'm the missing date below the signature. Top right hand coroner, just under "our ref".
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Jul 14, 2017 11:02
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Hobo Erotica posted:Bb joey give me a minute i absolutely refuse to give you even a second more of my time goonsire!!!
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Jul 14, 2017 11:02
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full annexation of new zealand now
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Jul 14, 2017 11:10
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Box of Bunnies posted:full annexation of new zealand now what if Ludlam was NZ's "Manchurian Candidate"? makes u think
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Jul 14, 2017 11:13
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The future of Australia is even more sheep.
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Jul 14, 2017 11:19
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BBJoey posted:Basically, if state governments run something then generally it'll be more reactive to local need, and if the federal government run something then it'll be more standardised across the country and it'll have more money behind it; either isn't a bad option depending, though obviously there are some areas where it makes sense for one side or the other to have power (eg local infrastructure and planning for state government, health and education for the feds). Sorry kids are in bed now. But yeah, pretty much. Thanks for a good post. For me it's just an unnecessary extra level of bureaucracy. If we didn't have states, we wouldn't invent them. They're a relic from pre-federation. Like you say, it was a document of its time. Move things like planning laws down to local level (where a lot of them already are), move things like education and health up to the federal level, and you're left with not much which is best executed at a state level. Maybe things like highways, but even then, it'd be better managed by a central government with suitably specific regional departments. The constant battle for funding is just exhausting, as is the shifting of blame and responsibility. That tug of war just consumes so much time and energy. Really the only argument I see in favour of states is "not having all your eggs in one basket", but I don't think its worth it, because so many baskets just creates more problems.
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Jul 14, 2017 11:35
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Les Affaires posted:Top right hand coroner, just under "our ref". Yeah I saw it, I'm just surprised anyone who signs official correspondence doesn't date their signature. You know, in writing. That's like day one. Otherwise you can do some pretty crazy stuff with e-sigs.
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Jul 14, 2017 11:42
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NPR Journalizard posted:gently caress off bigis its been plainly explained a bunch of times, if you are too stupid to realise who the mistake happened, you should just go kill yourself. Nice meltdown
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Jul 14, 2017 11:45
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Mattjpwns posted:Yeah, I think I'm done with helping out the Greens until they get their poo poo together. This is just loving embarassing PolSci 101 stuff. you wimp
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Jul 14, 2017 12:17
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Lol at people being convinced by Tony's fake Citizenship Revocation.
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Jul 14, 2017 12:19
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NTRabbit posted:I'm not a member, I just assume it to be the case since neither major party benefits as the seat stays Green, so they wouldn't have bothered. Yeah, please don't piss conspiracy theories around as facts when about a third of the thread are actual members and probably DO have access to insider information, because people are liable to believe it, and spread it around. This was almost certainly the libs, as he's been a massive thorn in their side for a full decade, and regularly pisses all over Brandis and company in Estimates. He would have been a massive threat if he actually had any leadership aspirations at all. He was a huge assett to the party, and didn't gently caress around with factional poo poo.
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Jul 14, 2017 12:27
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https://twitter.com/SharriMarkson/status/885811234464948224
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Jul 14, 2017 12:32
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bigis posted:Nice meltdown If you think that's a melt down by auspol standards you are even stupider than first thought
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Jul 14, 2017 12:37
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quote:If the court determines Senator Ludlam’s election was ineligible, as anticipated, the Department of Finance and Senate will calculate the debt of the salaries, benefits, travel allowance, staff and office costs he has received during the time in Parliament. This is at least $1.6 million in base salary alone. If it doesn't get waived then I would not be impressed, Bob Day was able to walk away.
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Jul 14, 2017 12:49
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BBJoey posted:Basically, if state governments run something then generally it'll be more reactive to local need, and if the federal government run something then it'll be more standardised across the country and it'll have more money behind it; either isn't a bad option depending, though obviously there are some areas where it makes sense for one side or the other to have power (eg local infrastructure and planning for state government, health and education for the feds). When your state is a third of the country (WA by area, NSW by population), how reactive to local needs could it really be? The needs of regional NSW are different to the needs of Sydney, but the state will weigh those needs very differently. If you want a government responding to local needs wouldn't splitting the states into regional bodies (constituting the relevant councils) be a better compromise? A low population region is going to have to fight for funding regardless of whether it is with a state or federal government. The bigger question is how much work and planning is being duplicated between government levels. If you take the state government away, the local and federal governments will have to massively increase in size to cover work performed by the state. On that basis I suspect the state is fairly efficient for the functions it performs.
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Jul 14, 2017 12:49
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Why the gently caress do I bother keeping up with auspol. There's always more and it's always worse. gently caress the state of this stupid country.
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Jul 14, 2017 12:51
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Tokamak posted:The bigger question is how much work and planning is being duplicated between government levels. If you take the state government away, the local and federal governments will have to massively increase in size to cover work performed by the state. On that basis I suspect the state is fairly efficient for the functions it performs. On the other hand, how much duplication and waste exists by having to run all the overhead of seven different health departments and hospital networks, or similarly for education, instead of one. And organisationally the better divider for those would probably be Metro Health and Rural Health, rather than states. MikeJF fucked around with this message at 12:59 on Jul 14, 2017 |
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Jul 14, 2017 12:53
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