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Heellll yeah. Chaoschess
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Jul 15, 2017 17:17
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Suspect Bucket posted:Heellll yeah. Chaoschess I can feel their panic from here. We have this.
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Jul 15, 2017 17:48
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HerpicleOmnicron5 posted:I can feel their panic from here. We have this. Herp-derp, shut up. Just shut up, right now.
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Jul 15, 2017 18:45
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Okay then I'll be entirely honest, I'm kinda regretting Pawn C6. I'm panicking. The ship is sinking, team unity has fallen apart, and frankly our chances of victory are piss poor to say the least. We've lost a pawn and gained nothing, and are about to lose another pawn and gain nothing except maybe another pawn.
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Jul 15, 2017 19:28
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Go beyond the impossible and kick reason to the curb! That's how Team Black rolls!
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Jul 15, 2017 19:28
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Suspect Bucket posted:Go beyond the impossible and kick reason to the curb! That's how Team Black rolls! This is a good
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Jul 15, 2017 19:30
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HerpicleOmnicron5 posted:Okay then I'll be entirely honest, I'm kinda regretting Pawn C6. I'm panicking. The ship is sinking, team unity has fallen apart, and frankly our chances of victory are piss poor to say the least. We've lost a pawn and gained nothing, and are about to lose another pawn and gain nothing except maybe another pawn. Well, my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle.
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Jul 15, 2017 20:01
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 1.e4 d5 2.exd5 Nf6 3.d4 Bg4 4.Bb5+ c6 5.dxc6 You have 24 hours to decide on a move.
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Jul 15, 2017 21:58
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Ha HA! They have fallen so quickly into our cleverly disguised trap!
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Jul 15, 2017 22:04
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Alright, bishop for a queen is a drat good trade, let's do it. And then after we kill the queen we get rid of the pawn? If it takes the pawn on the right then our rook is kinda screwed. And our king is back in check.
Crosspeice fucked around with this message at 22:25 on Jul 15, 2017 |
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Jul 15, 2017 22:20
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uh, goons? 5. ...Bxd1 6. c7+
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Jul 15, 2017 22:25
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gently caress 5. ...Bxd1 6. c7+ Qd7 7. c8Q++ OK this is playable we aren't dead but holy poo poo we could've very easily just walked into checkmate right there. StupidSexyMothman fucked around with this message at 22:29 on Jul 15, 2017 |
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Jul 15, 2017 22:26
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Okay, now that I've wrapped my head round it, we go cx6, cause if that pawn moves our rook is at risk and we're in check again, meaning we have to move our knight. Sure they might take our bishop with their queen, but we've got our knight to take their queen. We can do that move whenever, so let's deal with the bottom right of the board before we take their queen. Hold up, they can just move their knight to block the bishop, so what are we doing about that? Take the queen now and lose our rook and have their pawn promote? If we move the knight out of the way, then we can get rid of the new promoted queen with our queen, so I think if we want their queen, we'll have to do some trades. So Yeah, changing my vote to BxQ5. Always gotta think everything out before you post. Crosspeice fucked around with this message at 22:36 on Jul 15, 2017 |
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Jul 15, 2017 22:31
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Covski posted:
Alright. Showtime. So here's the deal, folks. Our next move now has to be Nxc6. We move the knight up to capture the pawn and block the bishop. Why? Notice the structure on d corridor now. Moving the knight up will result in either: they capture the knight or they turtle their bishop back to e2 to protect their queen. If they capture the knight, we take the bishop and then we are all set for prelimming our attack down d corridor. White WILL then either go f3 or Ne2. They have to. It's the only sensible thing to do if they want to protect the queen. If they don't, we take the queen. If they do, I have a plan for both. If they turtle back to Be2, however, we stack up with h5 or attack with knight d4, supported by queen, second bishop and our f6 knight. We'd dominate the board and they would be turtled and helpless, at that point it's just a question of how do we break them. If they move the bishop anywhere else than e2, we take the queen and ruin their game. If they gently caress up badly enough, we might try and tempt them to move d4 pawn. If they do, and they haven't blocked e2 (which by the way is an incredibly important tile for us right now), that's instant mate and we win. For now, white can now gently caress up in a number of ways which screws them. We can gently caress up in a few ways too, but we're now limiting white's options so much that we can begin predicting their moves with a good amount of certainty. That's our most likely path to victory. We do NEED Nxc6 to do this though. If we exchange, we're still in good shape, because we don't need that knight for the attack. If they don't, we have a free piece and an incredibly strong position on the board. Either way, we clear b8 up for an immediate queen side castling, which brings our rook in line for an attack down d corridor, a move I suspect they are not expecting. Now, if we go pawn to c6, they won't want to trade a bishop for that and will most likely camp, threatening our flank or turtle back. The turtle is harder to break with our knight now trapped behind our pawn line, and remember, in chess every extra move we have to pay to move a piece out that isn't doing something useful is handing our opponent the opportunity for victory. If, as previously suggested, we go queen to d5 they will go Nc3 and both block and support their bishop, and we have to waste a move getting the queen back to do anything useful with her the rest of the game. Obviously, this is probably too costly. It's Nxc6, people. We have a chance to push them on the defensive and keep them there, but it requires guts and a willingness to trade pieces. No guts, no glory.
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Jul 15, 2017 22:31
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Bishop to D1. Take the queen.
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Jul 15, 2017 22:32
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oldskool posted:gently caress What? Do you mean Bxf7? What game are you playing? chitoryu12 posted:Bishop to D1. Take the queen. No. No no no no no no no. We lose our entire offense, they take the pawn at b7, then we are in check and are forced to move, they take our rook and get a free queen BEHIND OUR LINES DO NOT DO THIS GODDAMNIT
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Jul 15, 2017 22:38
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Nice piece of fish posted:What? Do you mean Bxf7? What game are you playing? Forgive it for being upside down compared to ours: 
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Jul 15, 2017 22:44
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oldskool posted:Forgive it for being upside down compared to ours: Okay, yes, but they can't do that. We'd have advance warning by a move and just move the knight, which lets the rook take it. But yes, this is another reason for why suiciding our bishop isn't the right move, we MUST get rid of that pawn. We don't have a choice about this one.
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Jul 15, 2017 22:47
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Crosspeice posted:Okay, now that I've wrapped my head round it, we go cx6, cause if that pawn moves our rook is at risk and we're in check again, meaning we have to move our knight. Sure they might take our bishop with their queen, but we've got our knight to take their queen. We can do that move whenever, so let's deal with the bottom right of the board before we take their queen. Bad trade. We sacrifice a superior threatening position on the board for a queen while losing a bishop, a pawn and a rook. We lose d corridor and castling can no longer give us a direct threat to d corridor. We essentially annihilate our entire offense to take their queen. E: People, take some time to digest and think before you vote. I've been mulling this for hours. Pretty much: c6 is a move we can make, but it hobbles us. To preserve our offense and take away a piece more important to them than us, Nxc6 is the way to go. Whatever they choose after that, we have several possibilites. Any kind of monkeycheese move now can obliterate our position, and we lose the game. E2: Also, to adress the point about the knight (Ne2?), I know about that. It's a turtling tactic where they can castle after that. The thing is, we're poised to break that castle, and they pretty much cede the center to us in that case, because then we break out the queen. And she gives no fucks when supported by a knight, a bishop and soon thereafter a rook. Nice piece of fish fucked around with this message at 22:57 on Jul 15, 2017 |
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Jul 15, 2017 22:49
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I stand with fish. Nxc6.
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Jul 15, 2017 22:52
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Nxc6 is the only viable path.
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Jul 15, 2017 22:53
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Honest question: what's stopping cx6 from being viable?
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Jul 15, 2017 23:02
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Yeah, now that I've thought about it for more than 10 minutes, getting rid of like 6 of our pieces to get their queen might not be the best of ideas. Hmm, maybe I shouldn't have said I'm a 6... Anyway, we could take their queen right now, but they can so easily ignore it, move the pawn and put us in check. This will force us to move our knight to block, they take our rook and they promote it to queen or something, I'm not 100% on how promoting works when they basically still have all their good stuff. However, with the knight moved, our queen can just kill it, but now it's stuck behind a knight and a pawn and is basically useless. They're then free to retreat their bishop and we lose a pincer. If we kill the pawn with our pawn, then they can move their knight to block our bishop meaning if we take it, they can either kill with the queen, putting it on the board, or with a pawn, a pretty easy trade. We'll have to move our bishop back one space forcing them to keep the knight in place to save their queen. Thankfully if they do that, our pawn can take their bishop no problem, since they'll be protecting their queen. We can also take the pawn with our knight. This frees up our rook, we can easily move the queen elsewhere to castle, but if they take the knight with the bishop, then we have to take the bishop with the pawn, since we'll be back in check. Then they can move the knight to block our bishop from the queen. Regardless of what happens, they'll be moving the knight to block our bishop and if we take the pawn with the knight, we'll lose the knight and take their bishop, but get our rook and castle more available. Or if we take the pawn with our pawn, we only lose a pawn, we can take our knight out to kill the bishop and still free up our rook and the castling. What they might do is ignore their bishop, let it get taken by our pawn and stopping our knight from moving out and freeing up strategies. So it's a tough call. Crosspeice fucked around with this message at 23:30 on Jul 15, 2017 |
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Jul 15, 2017 23:07
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Talow posted:Honest question: what's stopping cx6 from being viable? It's viable, but it puts our pawn in the way of our knight. That's not the end of the world, but it means that either our b8 knight is relatively useless or we have to spend 2+ moves to get it somewhere useful later in the game and generally there are better things to be done with 2+ moves than getting a knight unstuck from its home base. Basically if we're willing to concede that the b8 knight is going to be useless for most of the game by moving the pawn in its way, we may as well move the knight instead & either it gets captured (no loss, we were conceding it anyway) or White goes on the defensive and we've gained significantly in positioning with a knight at c6 instead of a pawn.
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Jul 15, 2017 23:08
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^^ Exactly, you're getting it. No imagine a white king side's castle after Ne2. What happens when we Qd5? Notice the position of the knight. We can stack up and move in either way. But I'm really hoping for f3. Talow posted:Honest question: what's stopping cx6 from being viable? Honest answer, we then have to move our knight to a6 to use it, which essentially traps it there the rest of the fight, because we have exactly zero spare moves to use it. Which means we can't queen side castle (the king moves to c8 and the rook moves to d8 once we're rid of all the pieces and move the queen out down d corridor). Queen side castle cost us a single move but does some important stuff, and we want that option if we need it. What I'm hoping will happen is bishop takes the knight. Then we take the bishop with our pawn. Then white either goes f3 or Ne2. I have plans for both. If white doesn't, we take the queen. Either way, white is boxed in and useless and we will rule the center. E: We're Blitzkrieg, they are Poland. That's the tl;dr. And in Blitzkrieg, you slow down, you die. E2: And yes, in this metaphor we are the baddies but sometimes the baddies win. Nice piece of fish fucked around with this message at 23:24 on Jul 15, 2017 |
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Jul 15, 2017 23:08
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I'll agree with Nxc6. Seems the only viable path.
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Jul 15, 2017 23:25
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Why not bxc6? That seems pretty reasonable to use the pawn before the knight, and even if the bishop takes the pawn, we take the bishop with the knight.
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Jul 15, 2017 23:35
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Snorb posted:Why not bxc6? That seems pretty reasonable to use the pawn before the knight, and even if the bishop takes the pawn, we take the bishop with the knight. Sure, but then why would white sacrifice their bishop? Better to turtle back home, and now our knight is stuck. Mind you, there are options even without the knight, but it's cautious. Furthermore, white must be trying to anticipate our moves and this move is less likely what they are expecting. Now, if white wasn't guaranteed to go Be2, I'd agree with you. We could then try and do something about d corridor using the pawn. But we've sacrificed a lot for the initiative, and I'm of a mind to get white on the back foot and keep them there. And if you're thinking white goes Ba4 to keep threatening us, I remind you: We take their queen then. We force white down a narrow road, with the fewest possible options. Honestly, if it comes down to it, white needs that bishop more than we need our knight. And even if we exchange our pawns remain useful. Nice piece of fish fucked around with this message at 23:44 on Jul 15, 2017 |
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Jul 15, 2017 23:39
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By the way, for an idea how good I am at chess, I just did the final chess player in the Order of the Phoenix game, who get increasingly difficult AI as they progress - the first and second I beat on my own, but for the third and final I had to use a move calculator and basically let a Chess computer win for me. Basically I am just good enough to beat a crappy AI 
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Jul 15, 2017 23:44
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BioEnchanted posted:By the way, for an idea how good I am at chess, I just did the final chess player in the Order of the Phoenix game, who get increasingly difficult AI as they progress - the first and second I beat on my own, but for the third and final I had to use a move calculator and basically let a Chess computer win for me. Basically I am just good enough to beat a crappy AI I'm trying to compensate for my lack of formal chess knowledge with having watched a ton of chess championships and essentially playing eleventy billion games with myself to explore all the different options. I have a laundry list of mistake moves by white now which may cost them the game, so I want to give them the opportunity to do them. It's going to get real loving exciting if white doesn't take our knight. If they do, we should for damned sure queen side castle after we start rolling our offense out.
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Jul 15, 2017 23:50
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Nxc6
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Jul 16, 2017 00:06
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Get that knight in there! Take it hard, take it quick! Nxc6
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Jul 16, 2017 00:08
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I want their queen, but I agree that it'd be too costly to take it now. Nxc6.
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Jul 16, 2017 00:40
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Nxc6 is a fantastic move and I absolutely vote for it. The most likely response is going to be f3 to threaten our bishop in kind, but that's OK.
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Jul 16, 2017 01:19
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Nxc6 to avoid an embarrassing early checkmate!
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Jul 16, 2017 01:32
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Nice piece of fish posted:-Snip- Alright, fair enough. Nxc6
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Jul 16, 2017 03:16
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Nxc6 just to be sure we have a majority.
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Jul 16, 2017 06:57
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Calling the vote for Nxc6 with 12 votes. (10 needed for majority)
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Jul 16, 2017 12:12
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 1.e4 d5 2.exd5 Nf6 3.d4 Bg4 4.Bb5+ c6 5.dxc6 Nxc6 White has 24 hours to decide on a move.
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Jul 16, 2017 12:32
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| # ? May 20, 2024 14:35 |
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Covski posted:
Good. Now, the two obvious moves for white are either bishop takes the knight and checks (Bxc6+), whereupon we have to take it with b pawn, and then we plan our assault (because then white will have to go for f3 or Be2), or white turtles at e2. In the latter case, we can either move our bishop back to f5 to preserve that line of attack, preventing one of the two moves available to white queen, or we can go Qd7, where we can support our bishop - AND open up our queen side castle (which defensively looks very good if they don't take our knight on c6) - AND maintain our queen on d corridor - AND stack our rook behind our queen on d corridor - AND not block our attack with f bishop, which is only an e6 away. At that point, white is in horrible shape, though, and I can't imagine them letting us get away with such a magnificent offensive structure. However, it really only takes a few bad moves for white, and we lock down the board. So far, so good.
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Jul 16, 2017 16:18
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