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How may films does Stan Lee have left in him before Disney puts his brain in a photorealistic CGI model?
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Jul 17, 2017 22:17
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Junior Jr. posted:How may films does Stan Lee have left in him before Disney puts his brain in a photorealistic CGI model? Once he dies it'd be cool if Disney kept up the traditional by CGI-ing him into future movies, like they did with The Force Awakens and Rogue One.
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Jul 17, 2017 22:20
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They should just recast. It's not like he's a particularly great actor. Imagine how good, I dunno, John Hurt would be as Stan Lee.
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Jul 17, 2017 22:24
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Cythereal posted:...You've never been around professional science and tech guys, have you? Tony wasn't trying to get Banner to hulk out, he was just loving with him and playing pranks on him. Pay attention to Banner's body language when Tony is messing with him versus when Cap is telling Tony to knock that poo poo off. Oh yeah, I see what you mean about body language, Banner absolutely thought it was funny as poo poo. But Tony had no idea what Banner's limits were at that point and is definitely the type of lunatic who takes a joke too far. 'We're Mad Scientists, you gotta own it'
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Jul 17, 2017 22:25
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RatHat posted:Once he dies it'd be cool if Disney kept up the traditional by CGI-ing him into future movies, like they did with The Force Awakens and Rogue One. How certain are we that this hasn't already happened?
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Jul 17, 2017 22:28
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Sir Kodiak posted:They should just recast. It's not like he's a particularly great actor. Imagine how good, I dunno, John Hurt would be as Stan Lee. I, uh, have some news for you...
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Jul 17, 2017 22:29
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CityMidnightJunky posted:Oh yeah, I see what you mean about body language, Banner absolutely thought it was funny as poo poo. But Tony had no idea what Banner's limits were at that point and is definitely the type of lunatic who takes a joke too far. 'We're Mad Scientists, you gotta own it' I kinda figured Banner would say something if he thought Tony was taking it too far.
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Jul 17, 2017 22:32
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Sir Kodiak posted:They should just recast. It's not like he's a particularly great actor. Imagine how good, I dunno, John Hurt would be as Stan Lee. You're kidding, right? It should be Alan Rickman in the role.
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Jul 17, 2017 22:33
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RatHat posted:It was a special arrow specifically designed(by Banner) to kill him if Hawkeye thought he'd transform and go out of control. Far from the dumbest thing in comics. Sure that's dumb, but at least in a comic book way, the dumbest thing I've seen lately is Nightwing getting killed by a stick. 
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Jul 17, 2017 22:37
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Junior Jr. posted:You're kidding, right? It should be Alan Rickman in the role. Martin Landau
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Jul 17, 2017 22:58
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Snowglobe of Doom posted:Nah that was totally down to mind control. Loki's plan was to get them all on the helicarrier and then unleash the Hulk on them, Black Widow tricks him into revealing his plan during his "mewling quim" speech but she was too late to stop Banner flipping out. Loki was subtly influencing them all to argue and fight among themselves knowing that it'd cause Banner to lose control. He Hulks out after the mind control is revealed, which makes it stop working. Everyone else immediately throws its effects off, Cap and Iron Man stop arguing, Thor stops mocking puny humans, etc. Then there's an explosion and that's when Hulk hulks out. It's not mind control, Banner just explicitly loses control. The sceptre doesn't even allow direct control, it just pushes more negative feelings to the surface. Sir Kodiak posted:And even if he did nobody would be hurt because he doesn't actually wild out and start murdering people just because he's the Hulk in the MCU. He doesn't hurt anyone because he fights Thor, who is functionally a god, in an area that everyone else already ran away from. He tears a VTOL apart a couple of minutes later. Hiding out in Calcutta is a really hosed up thing to do. You're a weapon of mass destruction, and you hide out in a dense city. You've totally got it under control, except that you don't. We've seen repeatedly that random incidents or the military finding him (kind of likely in a massive city) set him off. It's weird how folk here are going to justify a really weird, lovely bit of writing.
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Jul 17, 2017 23:20
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Have Aaron Paul get jacked and I bet he could be a cool Nightwing.
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Jul 17, 2017 23:26
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Martman posted:Have Aaron Paul get jacked and I bet he could be a cool Nightwing. He needs back, not jack.
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Jul 17, 2017 23:27
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Snowman_McK posted:He Hulks out after the mind control is revealed, which makes it stop working. Everyone else immediately throws its effects off, Cap and Iron Man stop arguing, Thor stops mocking puny humans, etc. Then there's an explosion and that's when Hulk hulks out. It's not mind control, Banner just explicitly loses control. The sceptre doesn't even allow direct control, it just pushes more negative feelings to the surface. So Loki purposefully gets himself caught with a mind-controlling scepter, with the stated intention of releasing the Hulk, and does, in fact, influence Banner's mind with the scepter, with the Hulk shortly thereafter emerging. But that last step is just a coincidence?
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Jul 17, 2017 23:58
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wyoming posted:Sure that's dumb, but at least in a comic book way, the dumbest thing I've seen lately is Nightwing getting killed by a stick. I always lmao when any story uses the Biblical "Moses didn't kill him!!!!!!! He just hit him but he happened to land on a rock in the exact way required to cause instant death!!!!"
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Jul 18, 2017 00:04
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Sir Kodiak posted:So Loki purposefully gets himself caught with a mind-controlling scepter, with the stated intention of releasing the Hulk, and does, in fact, influence Banner's mind with the scepter, with the Hulk shortly thereafter emerging. But that last step is just a coincidence? Except it's not the scepter that sets him off. It's quite explicitly an explosion. That is the literal sequence of events in the movie. This is consistent with the 'he spit it out' story. When Banner is in physical danger, he hulks out. He doesn't have control. Or, rather, it's entirely possible for things to happen that are not in his control that set it off. In a huge city, this things are more likely (getting hit by a bus, getting mugged, the government finding him, as they keep doing, and will keep doing as he hangs out around millions of people, many of whom will have cameras) and the consequences are much higher in a crowded, dense city. This is not a complicated idea. Also, Loki is a wrong idiot who is outsmarted and/or beaten up by every member of the Avengers at some point in the movie. Even if his plot had worked as it was supposed to, it's like a child's fan fiction version of the Joker's plot in TDK. As it is, it's more him shooting an arrow then painting a bullseye. EDIT: poo poo, even if you assume that he is in control and it was just the scepter, that still means he lives in a world that can overcome his control. It wouldn't be much of a consolation for some family squashed by him during a mind control rampage through downtown Calcutta. "Well, sure, my family was killed when he hulked out in the middle of a large, dense city, but it was mind control, so I can't really hold it against him." Snowman_McK fucked around with this message at 00:15 on Jul 18, 2017 |
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Jul 18, 2017 00:04
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Snowman_McK posted:Except it's not the scepter that sets him off. It's quite explicitly an explosion. That is the literal sequence of events in the movie. This is consistent with the 'he spit it out' story. When Banner is in physical danger, he hulks out. He doesn't have control. Or, rather, it's entirely possible for things to happen that are not in his control that set it off. In a huge city, this things are more likely (getting hit by a bus, getting mugged, the government finding him, as they keep doing, and will keep doing as he hangs out around millions of people, many of whom will have cameras) and the consequences are much higher in a crowded, dense city. This is not a complicated idea. There's no implication in the attempted-suicide story that the Hulk caused any damage. All we're told is that he emerged. This is consistent with his portrayal in the MCU. In the solo movie, he gets suddenly gassed by the military: no problem, he's under control while transformed. He fights the Abomination in Harlem, nobody gets hurt, he's actually protecting people. Tony's shocking him, he's fighting in Manhattan, he's under control whether transformed or not. Age of Ultron, he gets shoved off a cliff, jumps back up, smirks, goes about saving civilians. There's two scenes in the whole franchise where the Hulk tries to hurt people who aren't explicit enemy combatants. In Age of Ultron, it's inarguably mind control. So you're left with the scene in The Avengers, in which the primary antagonist planned for him to transform and go wild thanks to mind control and then that happens, right after the scene where he's shown to have been influenced by the spear. Yes, the explosion is part of what pushed him over the edge. But how he behaves afterwards is thanks to the spear. The alternative is inconsistent with everything else we've seen about the character. Snowman_McK posted:EDIT: poo poo, even if you assume that he is in control and it was just the scepter, that still means he lives in a world that can overcome his control. It wouldn't be much of a consolation for some family squashed by him during a mind control rampage through downtown Calcutta. "Well, sure, my family was killed when he hulked out in the middle of a large, dense city, but it was mind control, so I can't really hold it against him." Which was how I got into this, with the point that this applies to every superhero. The only reason Tony didn't do the same thing at the end of the movie is fortuitous placement of the arc reactor. They're all walking WMDs.
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Jul 18, 2017 00:22
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Sir Kodiak posted:There's no implication in the attempted-suicide story that the Hulk caused any damage. All we're told is that he emerged. This is consistent with his portrayal in the MCU. In the solo movie, he gets suddenly gassed by the military: no problem, he's under control while transformed. He fights the Abomination in Harlem, nobody gets hurt, he's actually protecting people. Tony's shocking him, he's fighting in Manhattan, he's under control whether transformed or not. Age of Ultron, he gets shoved off a cliff, jumps back up, smirks, goes about saving civilians. You're about one post away from bringing up that stupid panel where it turns out he calculates the trajectory of rubble. The hulk emerging can wreck a building. The hulk moving can flatten one. When he's defending himself against the Specops team in Rio in the solo movie, he wrecks a factory floor just by running. It's written so that it happens at night, when the factory is empty. What if it wasn't? What if it was as crowded as the neighbourhood in Calcutta? The Hulk doesn't have to target something to destroy it. That's the nature of the character. They've had to write and construct really convoluted scenarios so that he doesn't kill thousands of people by accident every time he transforms. Think about a scene near the end of Avengers. One of the big snake things is near a building full of office workers. The camera swings around and the Hulk is charging the window from inside. Miraculously, every panicked office worker stays out of the way of the long run up he takes. What if they hadn't? He didn't mean to, but if he bumped one of them, that person would be pulped. The Hulk's mass and speed would require absolute control, which he plainly doesn't have. Even in fights, he's a clumsy, improvising brawler who does not think about the effect on the world his actions have. That's not a flaw, it's the nature of the character. quote:There's two scenes in the whole franchise where the Hulk tries to hurt people who aren't explicit enemy combatants. In Age of Ultron, it's inarguably mind control. So you're left with the scene in The Avengers, in which the primary antagonist planned for him to transform and go wild thanks to mind control and then that happens, right after the scene where he's shown to have been influenced by the spear. quote:But how he behaves afterwards is thanks to the spear. The alternative is inconsistent with everything else we've seen about the character. quote:Which was how I got into this, with the point that this applies to every superhero. The only reason Tony didn't do the same thing at the end of the movie is fortuitous placement of the arc reactor. They're all walking WMDs. Snowman_McK fucked around with this message at 00:51 on Jul 18, 2017 |
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Jul 18, 2017 00:39
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It occurred to me the other day that if you measure an actor's success by the money that the films they've appeared in have made, Stan Lee must be by far the most successful actor in history.
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Jul 18, 2017 00:48
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Snowman_McK posted:The Spear that, by this point, is affecting no one else. Everyone else snaps out of it the minute they notice its effects. Banner is, according to you, the only one still affected, even though no one else is. Banner was the explicit, stated target of the mind control. He had the closest contact with the spear. It's not surprising it would affect him the strongest, or that its influence would express itself in his Hulk form. Much of your post was dedicated to demonstrating how toothless the MCU has made the Hulk. I agree with this! But it's what they did and it's silly to ignore it. I would prefer that the Hulk be innately dangerous to bring out, but he's not that in the MCU, and I'm not going to pretend that's not the case just because it would better fit my preferences for the character. With the MCU, they try to walk a line between having the classic scenes of Hulk rampaging wildly, and wanting Hulk to be a hero rather than an insane monster that's sometimes useful. So they have him rampage, but excuse it with mind control. Like, yes, that stupid rubble trajectory poo poo. I'm not saying it's good. But it's silly to pretend that Marvel didn't publish it, and isn't perfectly capable of incorporating the same sort of thinking in their movies.
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Jul 18, 2017 01:04
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Like yeah that goofy number of casualties that daredevil shows, that's in the low 100s, that amount alone should be from when Thor and Hulk took down that single space whale
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Jul 18, 2017 01:08
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Sir Kodiak posted:Banner was the explicit, stated target of the mind control. He had the closest contact with the spear. Yet, the mind control explicitly doesn't work. Everyone just shakes it off, instantly. Cap does it between two sentences. Sir Kodiak posted:But it's what they did and it's silly to ignore it. I'm not ignoring. I'm noticing that a character who is a living weapon of destruction, who loses control regularly, and even when he doesn't, causes massive destruction just by escaping, hides out, explicitly, in one of the densest cities on the planet. Instead of, like, anywhere else in the world. The Mongolian plain, a jungle, a small village or town, a less massive city (one that isn't in the top 20 for density, for instance) They explicitly state that he is in Calcutta, surrounded by people. That's hosed up, and the many words you've written excusing this decision shows why they got away with it. Snowman_McK fucked around with this message at 01:13 on Jul 18, 2017 |
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Jul 18, 2017 01:10
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I'm pretty sure the Hulk's demeanour is tied to Banner's state of mind when he changes.
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Jul 18, 2017 01:10
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Snowman_McK posted:I'm not ignoring. I'm noticing that a character who is a living weapon of destruction, who loses control regularly, and even when he doesn't, causes massive destruction just by escaping, hides out, explicitly, in one of the densest cities on the planet. Instead of, like, anywhere else in the world. The Mongolian plain, a jungle, a small village or town, a less massive city. They explicitly state that he is in Calcutta. That's hosed up, and the many words you've written excusing this decision shows why they got away with it. He's lost control three times in the MCU: during the opening credit sequence for The Incredible Hulk, which is his first transformation; in The Avengers thanks to mind control; and in Age of Ultron thanks to mind control. That's not "regularly". They "got away with it" because your argument for why it's bad doesn't hold up, as the words I've written demonstrate.
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Jul 18, 2017 01:14
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I want Crimson Dynamo to be the next Iron Man and/or Captain America villain. Lets make him a cosmonaut who was lost in some kind of inter dimensional experiment. He returns to find out that not only has the Soviet Union collapsed, the world is turning into an hyper-capitalist dystopia. So he decides to do something about it. I'd steal a bit from MGS's The Fury for style. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQ08RfswLkQ
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Jul 18, 2017 01:20
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MonsieurChoc posted:I want Crimson Dynamo to be the next Iron Man and/or Captain America villain. Lets make him a cosmonaut who was lost in some kind of inter dimensional experiment. He returns to find out that not only has the Soviet Union collapsed, the world is turning into an hyper-capitalist dystopia. So he decides to do something about it. Crimson Dynamo was basically in Iron Man 2.
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Jul 18, 2017 01:24
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Brazilianpeanutwar posted:If Antman goes really small and crawls into the hulks ear then does the whole "biggening" thing (I don't loving know) would hulk explode or does he just have antman pouring out of his ears and nose and bumhole? Well, in Old Man Logan, Hulk literally eats Logan, who then bursts forth and splits Hulk in half from the inside out. Marvel Studios should just do this with Ant-Man.
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Jul 18, 2017 01:28
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Timby posted:Well, in Old Man Logan, Hulk literally eats Logan, who then bursts forth and splits Hulk in half from the inside out. Logan is owned by Fox, so Ant-Man will have to eat someone else. The Wasp also gets eaten in the comics, right?
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Jul 18, 2017 01:30
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Sir Kodiak posted:He's lost control three times in the MCU: during the opening credit sequence for The Incredible Hulk, which is his first transformation; in The Avengers thanks to mind control; and in Age of Ultron thanks to mind control. That's not "regularly". They "got away with it" because your argument for why it's bad doesn't hold up, as the words I've written demonstrate. For gently caress's sake, the mind control in the Avengers doesn't even loving work. It doesn't even mind control anyone. It makes them more argumentative, and only a bit more than before. And they stop the second they realise. It essentially has the same effect as a bad time in traffic. If that's enough for him to take a persistant attempt at killing an ally, what happens when a bus runs him over? Or he gets mugged? poo poo, just him transforming after getting hit in traffic would probably have a body count in the dozens. He transforms and takes out those who mugged him, and his backswing takes out the neighbouring house. Also, unless he changes back immediately, he's going to start moving. And when he moves, everything falls down. And in a massive, dense city, there's a lot more that can fall down. That's to say nothing of the inevitable response. He hulks out in the middle of Calcutta, how long before the police or military responds? The hulk doesn't back down when confronted. He'll either fight back, and people will die, or he'll start running (through a crowded, dense, large city, which is the thing you keep not getting) and people will die. Even if he doesn't, even if he's in control, he's in relative control. He still a full tonne of really quick super strength. Look at what he does when he's under control (the university, New York) and then look what he does when he isn't. It still looks like a bomb hit it in both cases because, by his very nature, he is not discriminating. It's like you're willfully not getting it at this point. It's a really hosed up thing to show him hiding in a crowded city, because they show, in the loving movie, that his control has its limits. They showed, in his solo movie, that people are very interested in hunting him down, and when they do, he inevitably transforms. Snowman_McK fucked around with this message at 01:35 on Jul 18, 2017 |
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Jul 18, 2017 01:33
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Snowman_McK posted:For gently caress's sake, the mind control in the Avengers doesn't even loving work. It doesn't even mind control anyone. Hawkeye and Selvig would disagree. And, again, I'm assuming the lack of consequences the MCU repeatedly shows for the Hulk doing his thing (when he isn't mind controlled). Like it or not, it's the world we're shown.
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Jul 18, 2017 01:36
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Cythereal posted:Crimson Dynamo was basically in Iron Man 2. So?
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Jul 18, 2017 01:36
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Sir Kodiak posted:Hawkeye and Selvig would disagree. That's expressly a different thing. That is actual mind control. It even manifests physically in the eyes. Everyone else just gets a bit snarkier with each other. I know it's the world we're shown, and I'm criticising it, because it's a really loving stupid thing to have the Hulk, a character who is unimaginably powerful, destructive and dangerous even when merely acting defensively or escaping, hide out in a giant, crowded city full of brown people. Twice. Even though, the first time, it backfires horribly. Snowman_McK fucked around with this message at 01:43 on Jul 18, 2017 |
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Jul 18, 2017 01:40
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Memba dat movie where Hawk-guy was mind controlled 4 like five seconds by Low-key. I think science-guy was mind controlled for a sec to Edit: Beaten
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Jul 18, 2017 01:40
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Snowman_McK posted:That's expressly a different thing. That is actual mind control. It even manifests physically in the eyes. Everyone else just gets a bit snarkier with each other. Everyone else gets snarkier with each other. Banner goes on an extended angry rant in which he grabs a weapon. The movie shows us that he's more strongly influenced. Which makes sense, he was the explicit target. I get criticizing the world we're shown. I'm saying that, given that world, Banner's decision isn't irresponsible. His excuse for living in a densely populated city is that he isn't actually dangerous to bystanders as the Hulk, which is repeatedly borne out.
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Jul 18, 2017 01:44
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Sir Kodiak posted:Everyone else gets snarkier with each other. Banner goes on an extended angry rant in which he grabs a weapon. And there's absolutely no risk of anything else in the world getting him that upset. Upset enough to go on a rant. Especially not in a large city. There's definitely no risk of two guys, for instance, deciding they don't like him and mugging him one night, for instance (two Brazilian guys, maybe). Or a military team (perhaps lead, inexpicably, by a British guy) finding him and shooting him, for instance. No risk of him transforming anywhere except an actual combat zone. Sir Kodiak posted:Banner's decision isn't irresponsible. His excuse for living in a densely populated city is that he isn't actually dangerous to bystanders as the Hulk, which is repeatedly borne out. Unless Banner, the character, knows that he's in a PG-13 movie where he'll never accidentally pulp a civilian, and that the military forces who always find him (as they do both times he hides out in a massive, third world city) will either be nice or make sure they evacuate civilians first (or they just vanish) it's actually pretty irresponsible. Especially when he could live anywhere else in the loving world. The disaster porn that results when he transforms is a major set piece of several of these movies, how are you not getting this? I mean, the explicit point and symbolism of him hiding in Calcutta is him going off the grid. Yet, instead of going somewhere off the grid, he goes to massive, crowded cities full of people that don't look like him. It's a loving stupid decision on every level. People have cameras and the internet in those cities, people will find him (as they do, both times). And when they do, he will transform. And when he does, the city turns into a warzone. Even if he can control his own transformation (which is shown to have its limits) he can't control what inevitably happens when he's found. As we are shown over and over again. They could have written in to be in the Indian countryside, the Brazilian jungle. Anywhere, but they chose the middle of a huge city, and that is a weird decision both for the character and for the writer. Snowman_McK fucked around with this message at 01:59 on Jul 18, 2017 |
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Jul 18, 2017 01:52
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Snowman_McK posted:And there's absolutely no risk of anything else in the world getting him that upset. Upset enough to go on a rant. Especially not in a large city. There's definitely no risk of two guys, for instance, deciding they don't like him and mugging him one night, for instance (two Brazilian guys, maybe). Or a military team (perhaps lead, inexpicably, by a British guy) finding him and shooting him, for instance. No risk of him transforming anywhere except an actual combat zone Well, exactly. He gets ambushed by the military in The Incredible Hulk and the only person hurt is Tim Roth, who not only attacks him, but actually runs up to him and engages him in a fistfight. The Hulk has killed the least people on-screen of any of the Avengers. We get disaster porn during Thor's fight in London, during Cap's battle in DC, etc., but you're only asking the Hulk to go live away from people.
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Jul 18, 2017 01:59
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Snowman_McK posted:And there's absolutely no risk of anything else in the world getting him that upset. Upset enough to go on a rant. Especially not in a large city. There's definitely no risk of two guys, for instance, deciding they don't like him and mugging him one night, for instance (two Brazilian guys, maybe). Or a military team (perhaps lead, inexpicably, by a British guy) finding him and shooting him, for instance. No risk of him transforming anywhere except an actual combat zone. Do you think all potentially dangerous people should live outside society?
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Jul 18, 2017 02:02
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I get the feeling that by the time The Avengers rolls around Banner 1)believes himself to have his Hulk problem relatively in hand (as was implied by the ending of The Incredible Hulk) and 2)feels compelled to help people as much as he can in order to atone for the damage he's done as the Hulk, hence acting as an unlicensed physician in the slums of Calcutta. Being there would allow him to aid a lot of people while still remaining relatively off the beaten path.
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Jul 18, 2017 02:02
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Sir Kodiak posted:Well, exactly. He gets ambushed by the military in The Incredible Hulk and the only person hurt is Tim Roth, who not only attacks him, but actually runs up to him and engages him in a fistfight. The Hulk has killed the least people on-screen of any of the Avengers. We get disaster porn during Thor's fight in London, during Cap's battle in DC, etc, but you're only asking the Hulk to go live in the jungle or whatever. Thor isn't personally the direct cause of that destruction. He was sporting enough to leave it to the bad guys. Thor also wasn't hiding out in London at the beginning of the movie. He was living in Asgard, surrounded by people with comparable powers. He also doesn't black out and go on rampages if he has a bad day. Ah yes, the crowded university's hundreds of students mysteriously vanishing between shots, kind of like the aliens managing to miss every civilian in New York. Do you think all those Indian people would have had time to evacuate if Banner gets hit by a bus, or cornered by another spec ops team? One that wasn't trying to bring him in peacefully? When he doesn't kill people by accident, it's by luck. It's long stretches of empty street in otherwise crowded cities for him to tumble down or charge along (like the seemingly endless street him and Abomination start in, where they charge each other and smash each other around without ever bumping into anyone. He's not going out of his way to avoid people, people simply aren't where he is. The only real answer is that Banner knows he's in a PG-13 movie.
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Jul 18, 2017 02:06
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UmOk posted:Do you think all potentially dangerous people should live outside society? If there was a real life analogue to Bruce Banner, I think it would be pretty hosed up if he thought the middle of Calcutta was a good place for him to hang out. Since that's more or less like an alcoholic (albeit a recovered one) living in a bottle shop, completely surrounded by things that are likely to cause a relapse. Also, Banner isn't 'potentially' dangerous. He is dangerous. This is shown over and over. Phylodox posted:I get the feeling that by the time The Avengers rolls around Banner 1)believes himself to have his Hulk problem relatively in hand (as was implied by the ending of The Incredible Hulk) and 2)feels compelled to help people as much as he can in order to atone for the damage he's done as the Hulk, hence acting as an unlicensed physician in the slums of Calcutta. Being there would allow him to aid a lot of people while still remaining relatively off the beaten path. Right up until he hulks out, runs away, running over a bunch of houses in the process. Snowman_McK fucked around with this message at 02:12 on Jul 18, 2017 |
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Jul 18, 2017 02:08
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