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Rhesus Pieces posted:Yeah, willful ignorance combined with extreme selfishness and spite. The thought of paying for some stranger's hospital bill enrages them, especially if they make the lazy assumption that most medical expenses are due to individual irresponsibility. But there are way less people who say they don't want to provide coverage. Many more just can't understand the implications of that.
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Jul 19, 2017 23:54
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jivjov posted:Uhhhh, so how does he want the roads paid for? Good will and free asphalt? make mexico pay for it
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Jul 19, 2017 23:56
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Rhesus Pieces posted:Yeah, willful ignorance combined with extreme selfishness and spite. The thought of paying for some stranger's hospital bill enrages them, especially if they make the lazy assumption that most medical expenses are due to individual irresponsibility. I've seen people who benefit from the ACA, whether they realize it or not, bitch about it. My cousin comes to mind: yeah, I get that your insurance is expensive and it pisses you off, but what kind of coverage do you think you're going to get for your autistic son when you're self-employed, the mandate is repealed, and pre-existing conditions cost a mint to insure? He was also wont to blame Obama for, among other things, Florida state regulations that bothered him. I'm just an ignorant Canadian, but would I be correct in saying that the President is not responsible for state-level regulations  ?His wife was surprised that Trump was anti-abortion, among other things. Some people are just really, really fuckin' ignorant. They don't pay attention to things, and they fail to reason with the information they do have to draw sensible conclusions.
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Jul 20, 2017 00:12
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Part of me is disappointed the republican health care bill is dying...I was hoping if it passed, the loving ghouls that voted for it would get removed from office, and the pendulum swings back the other way and single payer pushes through. But if the bill dies, I think the outrage will die and most republicans will hold their seats. Am I wrong? :/
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Jul 20, 2017 00:26
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WHY BONER NOW posted:Part of me is disappointed the republican health care bill is dying...I was hoping if it passed, the loving ghouls that voted for it would get removed from office, and the pendulum swings back the other way and single payer pushes through. But if the bill dies, I think the outrage will die and most republicans will hold their seats. Am I wrong? :/ I sympathize. Part of me thinks that the memory of a pre-Civil Rights, pre-New Deal America is so distant that the American people take their welfare for granted and will never get more liberal until people really suffer under a GOP/Libertarian paradise. At the same time, letting people die from lack of medical care due to lack of insurance is wrong and we should fight it, so I'm glad when the GOP fails (even if it feels like they'll just end up winning in the long term). You can still push for single payer as long as you're prepared for a long fight.
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Jul 20, 2017 00:37
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It's not dead. I mean, it's on life support and would certainly have hit its lifetime maximum if Obamacare hadn't done away with those, but it's not dead. They're really going all out to try to get something through.
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Jul 20, 2017 00:38
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DAD LOST MY IPOD posted:It's not dead. I mean, it's on life support and would certainly have hit its lifetime maximum if Obamacare hadn't done away with those, but it's not dead. They're really going all out to try to get something through. This is my fear that's been growing a bit since yesterday. What if this is the house scenario all over again? We all relax, think it's over, but, then, they blitzkreig us out of nowhere and get it through when people aren't prepared to yell at their politcians? What if they turn one of them when our backs are turned? What if they wait till the focus shifts then do it? What if it's all a clam before they vote it in on the voting day? That they decided it best to just keep quiet this time, play dead, and then vote their evil conscience when it comes to the floor?
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Jul 20, 2017 00:42
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WHY BONER NOW posted:Part of me is disappointed the republican health care bill is dying...I was hoping if it passed, the loving ghouls that voted for it would get removed from office, and the pendulum swings back the other way and single payer pushes through. But if the bill dies, I think the outrage will die and most republicans will hold their seats. Am I wrong? :/ You are wrong because this way tens of thousands of people won't die.
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Jul 20, 2017 00:45
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you can relax when the reconciliation instructions expire at the end of September and maybe not even then
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Jul 20, 2017 00:54
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Dead Reckoning posted:You already can just not go to the doctor/hospital, so people can't actually opt out of purchasing under your model, which is the only reason people want to be able to opt out of benefits. Which is fine, if that's what you are in favor of, but you need to own that and stop pretending that people can opt out. Everyone eventually goes on Medicare, everyone, and it's the most popular program in America. It's interesting that no one bothers to argue against single payer on cost, or coverage, or outcome, or any other substantial metric because it is indisputably superior in every way. So the only argument deployed is "but what if I don't like it anyway."
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Jul 20, 2017 01:08
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Brony Car posted:At the same time, letting people die from lack of medical care due to lack of insurance is wrong and we should fight it, so I'm glad when the GOP fails (even if it feels like they'll just end up winning in the long term). Yeah, in the end I agree with this and I do hope it dies, but playing devil's advocate, let's say it pulls through reconciliation... Shimrra Jamaane posted:You are wrong because this way tens of thousands of people won't die. In the short run, but are there numbers for how many people die without single payer vs GOP healthcare?
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Jul 20, 2017 01:15
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VitalSigns posted:Everyone eventually goes on Medicare, everyone, and it's the most popular program in America. And in Canada, for the most part, the same can be said. There's a vanishingly small portion of people who would do away with public healthcare -- the "extreme right" position in Canada is "what if we allowed some private doctors/hospitals?" Like, the only real point of debate is "should rich people be able to purchase healthcare privately?" and I've seen no proposal for US healthcare that would in any way forbid that.
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Jul 20, 2017 01:15
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McCain's got a brain tumor
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Jul 20, 2017 01:15
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jivjov posted:McCain's got a brain tumor That explains the Comey hearing. Seriously, though, that's not good. I don't care for him as a politician, but no one "deserves" a brain tumor.
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Jul 20, 2017 01:16
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Rhesus Pieces posted:Yeah, willful ignorance combined with extreme selfishness and spite. The thought of paying for some stranger's hospital bill enrages them, especially if they make the lazy assumption that most medical expenses are due to individual irresponsibility. Lifestyle intervention is, uh, super important though on both an individual level and on a public health level. Personal responsibility does play a large role in your health. jivjov posted:McCain's got a brain tumor This is deeply concerning, if true.
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Jul 20, 2017 01:27
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I am deeply disturbed at how happy I am that McCain is going to finally die. It is very concerning.
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Jul 20, 2017 01:27
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The Phlegmatist posted:This is deeply concerning, if true. Source (one of many)
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Jul 20, 2017 01:28
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WHY BONER NOW posted:Part of me is disappointed the republican health care bill is dying...I was hoping if it passed, the loving ghouls that voted for it would get removed from office, and the pendulum swings back the other way and single payer pushes through. But if the bill dies, I think the outrage will die and most republicans will hold their seats. Am I wrong? :/ You are wrong. Accelerationism never works. Most likely we'd lose Obamacare, get no single payer, and *some* republicans would lose their seats. Outrage is never going to push through single payer. Life simply doesn't work that way. Moving the Overton window to the right never "wakes people up" - it simply makes left wing solutions even more unthinkable.
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Jul 20, 2017 02:59
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VitalSigns posted:I am deeply disturbed at how happy I am that McCain is going to finally die. It is very concerning. McCain has been one of the better republican critics of trump and right now only republicans matter.
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Jul 20, 2017 03:12
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asdf32 posted:McCain has been one of the better republican critics of trump and right now only republicans matter. McCain voted to confirm every single one of Trump's appointments and has also voted lockstep with his proposed legislation.
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Jul 20, 2017 03:17
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asdf32 posted:McCain has been one of the better republican critics of trump and right now only republicans matter. Critics mean nothing. McCain has voted for trump's agenda all the way through. He's as bad an enabler as any of them and he's also one of the biggest voices calling for war with Iran. My only hope is he dies sometime after the reconciliation instructions expire so they can't appoint a replacement in time to force this poo poo through.
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Jul 20, 2017 03:17
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asdf32 posted:McCain has been one of the better republican critics of trump and right now only republicans matter. in the spirit of his criticisms of trump, I am Deeply Concerned about his brain cancer, but will still vote for it killing him painfully
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Jul 20, 2017 03:19
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Ze Pollack posted:in the spirit of his criticisms of trump, I am Deeply Concerned about his brain cancer, but will still vote for it killing him painfully He is also the one that gave the Piss Tape Dossier to the FBI.
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Jul 20, 2017 03:24
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:McCain voted to confirm every single one of Trump's appointments and has also voted lockstep with his proposed legislation. First forget appointments, that's the last battle worth fighting. Second such is life that what I said is literally true. McCain was a better than average republican and his death isn't actually good.
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Jul 20, 2017 03:26
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Nobody's death from brain cancer is good, you grognards. Jesus.
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Jul 20, 2017 03:31
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I'm sad that man is mortal. If only McCain could live eternally, forever voting to kill the poor
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Jul 20, 2017 03:32
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KillHour posted:Nobody's death from brain cancer is good, you grognards. Jesus. https://twitter.com/jessica_roy/sta...2970%23lastpost
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Jul 20, 2017 03:51
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Yes John McCain is a piece of poo poo, no, being a piece of poo poo should not entitle him to a slow and agonizing death. I don't have the emotional energy to spend actually feeling sorry for McCain, but gently caress off if you want to be the sort of person who cheers human suffering just because it happens to the right person.
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Jul 20, 2017 03:57
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Excuse me, cheering for people to die of illness and injury is only okay when you do it in a polite respectable white collar way, by wearing a suit and passing legislation to kill all the people you can, millions and millions of them, for profit.
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Jul 20, 2017 03:57
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Spiritus Nox posted:Yes John McCain is a piece of poo poo, no, being a piece of poo poo should not entitle him to a slow and agonizing death. Maybe he should move!
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Jul 20, 2017 03:59
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VitalSigns posted:Excuse me, cheering for people to die of illness and injury is only okay when you do it in a polite respectable white collar way, by wearing a suit and passing legislation to kill all the people you can, millions and millions of them, for profit. Actually that is lovely too
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Jul 20, 2017 04:00
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I will be glad when McCain ceases to be of any political consequence, because he's a man in a position of power with poo poo opinions who is actively promoting the deterioration of the United States and its citizens. I will not, however, take any particular pleasure in his illness or death beyond that, because he's fundamentally a human being, and I've come to believe it's simply not right to take pleasure in another's illness or death, no matter what they've done. This is no different than when a bunch of ghoulish cocksuckers were dancing on Calle Ocho when Castro died. Yeah, he did a lot of bad poo poo, but, as with McCain, I believe he did what he thought was right. Though I believe both of them were wrong and wrought terrible harm upon people in between periods of decency, I cannot believe they were so bad as to deserve to suffer and die for it without empathy. Maybe one man in a half billion is so terrible as to deserve that.
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Jul 20, 2017 04:22
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Spiritus Nox posted:Actually that is lovely too How do you feel about the death of bin Laden? McCain supports legislation that would kill 20,000 Americans a year on average, which in bin Laden terms is doing a 9/11 on America roughly every 8 weeks, forever. But McCain is plotting it in a suit and tie, behind a desk, whereas bin Laden plotted in a turban from a camp in the mountains. Therefore it's impolite to hope the former dies before he can carry out mass murder, whereas the death of the latter can be morally pursued after-the-fact with huge cross-party bipartisan agreement and nationwide celebrations when it comes to pass. VitalSigns fucked around with this message at 05:02 on Jul 20, 2017 |
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Jul 20, 2017 04:59
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https://twitter.com/imwiththoughts/status/887885048782798849
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Jul 20, 2017 05:01
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VitalSigns posted:How do you feel about the death of bin Laden? I wasn't particularly happy about that, either, thanks. I didn't feel bad for him then and I don't feel bad for McCain now, but cheering for their demise is loving gross and if I'm going to impotently dream at them I might as well impotently dream that they stay alive and stop being lovely people.
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Jul 20, 2017 05:17
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asdf32 posted:Large amounts of people just don't understand insurance or life in general. If you're a healthy working person you're going to subsidize healthcare for other people no matter what. It doesn't really matter whether it's taxes or premiums. Hate to have to quote you again but when you're right you're right: https://twitter.com/rob_flaherty/status/887883529891192835
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Jul 20, 2017 05:30
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Spiritus Nox posted:I wasn't particularly happy about that, either, thanks. I didn't feel bad for him then and I don't feel bad for McCain now, but cheering for their demise is loving gross and if I'm going to impotently dream at them I might as well impotently dream that they stay alive and stop being lovely people. Fair enough, it's consistent anyway
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Jul 20, 2017 05:38
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asdf32 posted:First forget appointments, that's the last battle worth fighting. Second such is life that what I said is literally true. McCain was a better than average republican and his death isn't actually good. Better than average meaning one single vote against party since January.
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Jul 20, 2017 05:40
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asdf32 posted:First forget appointments, that's the last battle worth fighting. Second such is life that what I said is literally true. McCain was a better than average republican and his death isn't actually good. Two Arizona Senate seats up for reelection in 2018 is potentially very, very good.
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Jul 20, 2017 05:58
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Rhesus Pieces posted:Hate to have to quote you again but when you're right you're right: Love my $12 a year insurance.
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Jul 20, 2017 06:03
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