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asdf32 posted:Perfect example of you not understanding what democracy is and taking it for granted because it sure isn't guaranteed that democracy is going to win. Right now it's loosing.  I remember you, I bought you that av but I see your red text has evolved
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Jul 20, 2017 23:45
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asdf32 posted:Lol nicaraguan democracy. gently caress you
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Jul 21, 2017 00:12
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this hosed up bill to crminalize boycotts agaisnt israel is as centrist as it gets. i bet you that most americans would hate this bill if they knew about it. its a very stupid argument made by a very stupid person
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Jul 21, 2017 01:51
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asdf32 posted:In practice the best democracy can do is compromise and in theory it rests on the idea that this is good. Without both its unsustainable. This only leads to Centrist Supremacy if you assume that one compromise that happened once is going to be what every compromise turns into. Some people saying "don't gulag anyone" while others are going "gulag all the kulaks forever" and they eventually settle on "gulag the bankers for 20 years" would also be a compromise, after all.
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Jul 21, 2017 01:57
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Jeb! Repetition posted:I agree in the sense that what we call centrism in America isn't. It's socially liberal and fiscally conservative. it's socially conservative fiscally conservative centrists only pretend to help anyone
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Jul 21, 2017 02:09
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MaxxBot posted:A majority also support fewer wars, legal weed, fewer giveaways to defense contractors and other big corporations. When the public and corporate lobbyists disagree on an issue the centrists take the lobbyist position basically every time. Bordiga was right all along
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Jul 21, 2017 02:12
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asdf32 i have a feeling that you're not going to win any converts itt
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Jul 21, 2017 02:23
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get that OUT of my face posted:asdf32 i have a feeling that you're not going to win any converts itt But only because centrism doesn't have good memes.
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Jul 21, 2017 02:30
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asdf32 posted:But only because centrism doesn't have good memes. 
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Jul 21, 2017 02:43
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asdf32 posted:But only because centrism doesn't have good memes.
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Jul 21, 2017 02:55
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get that OUT of my face posted:please tell me how you, a neoliberal, would solve these problems: tax credits and tax free HSAs
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Jul 21, 2017 03:26
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Memes Testing
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Jul 21, 2017 06:57
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Jul 21, 2017 06:59
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asdf32 posted:In practice the best democracy can do is compromise and in theory it rests on the idea that this is good. Without both its unsustainable. Compromise is finding a solution which everyone with power at the time of the agreement considers sufficient. It is produced by all parties competing to achieve their own goals and then accepting a resolution which they are satisfied is the best achievable outcome under the circumstances. It is not adjusting one's core principles to appease a hypothetical middle ground. This is the product of a political elite which seeks power for its own sake and/or the sake of secondary benefits rather than for the sake of realizing a set of goals of producing a beneficial result for society. asdf32 posted:But only because centrism doesn't have good memes. Memes express ideas which are already held by those who consume them; confusion in this regard is a sign that you are clueless. Hodgepodge has issued a correction as of 08:50 on Jul 21, 2017 |
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Jul 21, 2017 08:48
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The notion of centrism is also hosed up from the start. And in the US especially. If your dominant parties are fighting about if billionaires should pay 2 or 0 percent in taxes the centrist position of 1 percent is actually a right-wing one. edit German centrist in 1939: Let's kill half of all Jews. Hedenius has issued a correction as of 09:50 on Jul 21, 2017 |
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Jul 21, 2017 09:48
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get that OUT of my face posted:please tell me how you, a neoliberal, would solve these problems: Lmao problems?
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Jul 21, 2017 10:40
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Hedenius posted:The notion of centrism is also hosed up from the start. And in the US especially. If your dominant parties are fighting about if billionaires should pay 2 or 0 percent in taxes the centrist position of 1 percent is actually a right-wing one. My friend let me tell you about the Overton Window, and I'm not talking about Glenn Beck's "factional" bestseller
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Jul 21, 2017 11:10
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Hedenius posted:The notion of centrism is also hosed up from the start. And in the US especially. If your dominant parties are fighting about if billionaires should pay 2 or 0 percent in taxes the centrist position of 1 percent is actually a right-wing one. Rightist: "Let's throw people into camps" Leftist: "Let's throw different people into camps" idiot liberal centrist: "hurrr don't throw anyone in camps" *wet fart*
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Jul 21, 2017 11:14
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Fallen Hamprince posted:Rightist: "Let's throw people into camps" hamprince: what japanese 'people'?
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Jul 21, 2017 11:44
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Fallen Hamprince posted:Rightist: "Let's throw people into camps" ftfy
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Jul 21, 2017 11:46
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hell yeah mandatory summer camp
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Jul 21, 2017 11:51
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soviets: *put 7 million people in the gulag* america: hold my beer *put 7 million people in very profitable prisons* (not kidding, american incarceration rates hold pace with that of the soviets under stalin at their height, it's awesome) (not as efficient as the german system, mind you)
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Jul 21, 2017 11:58
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Hodgepodge posted:soviets: *put 7 million people in the gulag* centrists have to show they're tough on crime after all
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Jul 21, 2017 12:00
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logikv9 posted:hell yeah mandatory summer camp there ain't no party like a communist party 'cause a communist party is MANDATORY
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Jul 21, 2017 12:10
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Autism Sneaks posted:there ain't no party like a communist party 'cause a communist party is MANDATORY brave men and women died for your right to party, comrade 
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Jul 21, 2017 12:56
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Fallen Hamprince posted:Rightist: "Let's throw people into camps" What do you call a non voluntary private prison labor program if not a gulag.
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Jul 21, 2017 14:12
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Larry Parrish posted:What do you call a non voluntary private prison labor program if not a gulag. centrism!
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Jul 21, 2017 14:19
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get that OUT of my face posted:please tell me how you, a neoliberal, would solve these problems: My quick answers Tax rich -> free public universities Tax rich -> healthcare See the others Tax rich -> fund more better infrastructure/research jobs
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Jul 21, 2017 15:45
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taxing the rich is a social democratic platform, comrade
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Jul 21, 2017 16:10
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It's cool that the self-appointed centrist actually left of center.
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Jul 21, 2017 16:58
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1. Tax the rich 2. Blow the money in poorly designed programs staffed by ridiculously paid private grifters. 3. Brutally and insanely crush any left wing ideas that you find vaguely threatening (all of them) 4. ??? 5. Flail helplessly when a Republican with a gram of charisma delivers stunning and totally unexpected electoral defeat. Begin pushing for war before the last vote is counted.
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Jul 21, 2017 17:10
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:It's cool that the self-appointed centrist actually left of center. Haha like I haven't been called a centrist neoliberal liberal shill in this thread and a million others. Centrism isn't actually defined which makes it even more lol you guys waste your breath attacking people best defined for not swearing allegiance to one ideology or another. The result is that anti-centristism means more than centrism.
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Jul 21, 2017 17:31
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asdf32 posted:That or any democracy depends on a functioning center. This is only trivially true in the sense that some sort of "center" will always exist relative to the current left and right, but it's transparently obvious that when people criticize centrists they're referring to the ideology that happens to currently be considered the centrist.
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Jul 21, 2017 17:33
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Ytlaya posted:This is only trivially true in the sense that some sort of "center" will always exist relative to the current left and right, but it's transparently obvious that when people criticize centrists they're referring to the ideology that happens to currently be considered the centrist. No, they're attacking the legitimacy of compromise and opposition at a fundamental level. Wanting the country to move far left isn't the same as being an anti-democracy ideolog but these people silly enough to attack "centrism" out themselves as exacty that. Quick reminder how peter called out Nicaraguan democracy. It's guaranteed he'd support the slow erosion of democracy that represents at every step of the way because that's what ideological anti-compromise purity is. The tea party is the same thing and we're watching the logical result of its success in office right now. A leftist tea party comprised of these people would be identical.
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Jul 21, 2017 17:43
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asdf32 posted:Haha like I haven't been called a centrist neoliberal liberal shill in this thread and a million others. yeah centrism is defined. hillary refers to herself as a centrist, so hillary is centrist. macron also refers to himself as a centrist, and he loves kings and monarchy so you can see the definition of centrist is "deceptive right wing snake"
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Jul 21, 2017 17:44
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asdf32 posted:No, they're attacking the legitimacy of compromise and opposition at a fundamental level. What kind of compromise do you want to make with Donald Trump exactly?
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Jul 21, 2017 17:51
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asdf32 posted:No, they're attacking the legitimacy of compromise and opposition at a fundamental level. Wanting the country to move far left isn't the same as being an anti-democracy ideolog but these people silly enough to attack "centrism" out themselves as exacty that. A citizen's job is not to compromise with ideological opponents. That is a politician's job. All citizens need to do is advocate for what they actually want (and, I would argue, make the pragmatic decision in the voting booth). Arguments about compromise seem to make the implicit assumption that the people criticizing a politician aren't willing to vote for him/her because of that, and while that's sometimes true it isn't always the case (in fact, it's usually not the case). If a citizen wants single payer (just as an example), it is in their interests to criticize politicians who don't support it. Voting is a separate issue where it makes sense to make the pragmatic choice (since, in America, it's guaranteed that either a Democrat or Republican will win), and I can understand criticizing people who don't do that. But expressing opinions is something completely different, and there is literally no point to a citizen compromising the views they choose to express. If anything, politicians won't move in the direction they want unless there's a significant outspoken demand from their constituency for them to do so.
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Jul 21, 2017 17:53
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asdf32 posted:Haha like I haven't been called a centrist neoliberal liberal shill in this thread and a million others. Words are defined by their intersubjective use; pretending you don't understand what is meant by 'centrist' is acting as if you are suddenly incapable of communication in the language you are speaking.
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Jul 21, 2017 17:55
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FuriousxGeorge posted:What kind of compromise do you want to make with Donald Trump exactly? Only banning some muslims
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Jul 21, 2017 18:07
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Only taking healthcare away from 10m people
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Jul 21, 2017 18:07
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