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There was a conscious effort on the part of goons to promote the idea of Slenderman as a real thing to see if the internet could create a new monster archetype. There was a spirit of collective experimentation on the internet at the time (and on the SA forums in particular) and no one really knew how far things could be taken or what the potential downsides actually were. It was all hypothetical. So there was this idea on the forums at the time to put out high-quality Slenderman material to see if we could get the concept of Slenderman as a monster archetype to catch hold- things like Marble Hornets were in part motivated by this collective curiosity/spirit of experimentally pushing the boundaries. steinrokkan posted:Slenderman is such a generic figure (tall, vaguely menacing, contemporary, yet with no distinguishing features) that if anything it's surprising that the name Slenderman took off and there aren't people online ranting that Slenderman is just a false flag operation to discredit their real encounters with the identical Beaver Hill Phantom / Maple Alley Stalker / Churchhall Underpass Spirit from the 1970s. If you could show the forums at the time what Slenderman has become there is no loving way they would believe you- Slenderman's spread as an accepted concept has far exceeded even the wildest assed speculation by promoters of the idea back then. Edit: At the time that portions of the community (mostly GBS 1.0) were actively pushing Slenderman as a concept there were multiple mentally ill goons who were banned for going on rants that the forums were unleashing/creating a tulpa. It was enough of a thing that there were even parody accounts centered around accusing Goons of unleashing tulpas for everything else we were doing at the time. I am just remarking on the irony of the facts of the situation. (I was not a participant myself and was a semi-infrequent lurker of the Slendemran thread itself- I mostly stayed out of the conversations about whether or not Slenderman could catch on because I was already treading thin ice with my attempts to promote UFO conspiracies in GBS.) It has been a fascinating experience for me to watch the whole thing slowly develop and unfold over time, as well as watch the community amnesia set in about just precisely how Slenderman managed to slip out of the forums. (He didn't do it on his own, there was a sustained push by a faction of goons.) Prester Jane fucked around with this message at 19:15 on Jul 24, 2017 |
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Jul 24, 2017 18:52
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fishmech posted:The "belief" in Slenderman took more than that though. All he ever did in the original photoshops was just sit around in the picture and look menacing yet not interact with anyone or anything. Slenderman's entire "mythos" is a cheap rip-off of Yahtzee's Tall Man in Trilby's Notes.
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Jul 24, 2017 19:03
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Yea but Yahtzee sucks. But what I was getting at is current internet mystery, horror and other weirdness that is created to entertain people in the future may be the source of Conspiracy Theories. Ancient Aliens exists because some french guy thought Lovecraft was writing was real and wrote Morning of the Magicians which tried to tie weird history and archeological mysteries into mystical stuff, with some fun Esoteric Nazism thrown in. Although most serious scholars of National Socialism believe that the mystical aspects of Nazism was limited to a few within the SS's upper echelons. That goes on to to feed Von Dannikan and then we get Georgio and Childress talking about how its impossible for people to cut stone without lasers and there's no air Egyptian temples. Like someone may see Poppy and not understand its a character and an performance and really believe there is some pop singer that is controlled by some shadow Illuminati group for some purpose and create an entire mythos surrounding it that goes on to influence people who have never even heard of her. Or think there really was some mysterious tv show called Candle Cove that was involved with murdered and missing children and that becomes a thing; half remembered TV shows were connected to something more sinister. Like that dumb Shazaam theory. I swear in 10 years History will be running shows about the Mandala Effect, talking to people who remember things differently than they do, trying to suggest they're from an alternative world.
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Jul 25, 2017 05:56
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twistedmentat posted:Yea but Yahtzee sucks. quote:Like someone may see Poppy and not understand its a character and an performance and really believe there is some pop singer that is controlled by some shadow Illuminati group for some purpose and create an entire mythos surrounding it that goes on to influence people who have never even heard of her.
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Jul 25, 2017 13:53
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dwarf74 posted:Hell yeah, man. Have you been listening to the Archy Fantasies podcast? They go deep into the (rather surprising, IMO) ties between Lovecraft, Theosophy, Ancient Aliens, and other bad archaeology. I listened to a few episodes, but there was a point where they just spend the whole episode complaining that proper surveys were not done rather than talking about the crazy theories people had and the evidence that they presenting. Basically, once Ken Fader wasn't on all the time it stopped being interesting. Honestly, I prefer Monstertalk, which is far less technical. It has an amazing episode about the Satanic Panic surrounding D&D and what the reality about the kid who's parents claimed he killed himself due to D&D. They also have an episode about Tulpas that specifically talks about SomethingAwful and Slenderman. And of course, which always makes me think its some white supremacist theory, because of course they'd want Mandela to die in prison rather than over see the end of a world they wish was still around. Though when you think about it, a lot of Conspiracies are about White People being deprived of their power. Ancient Aliens at its core is about how non-whites aren't smart enough to pile rocks on top of each other or figure out how to farm without aliens.
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Jul 25, 2017 18:19
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twistedmentat posted:I listened to a few episodes, but there was a point where they just spend the whole episode complaining that proper surveys were not done rather than talking about the crazy theories people had and the evidence that they presenting. Basically, once Ken Fader wasn't on all the time it stopped being interesting. Honestly, I prefer Monstertalk, which is far less technical. It has an amazing episode about the Satanic Panic surrounding D&D and what the reality about the kid who's parents claimed he killed himself due to D&D. They also have an episode about Tulpas that specifically talks about SomethingAwful and Slenderman. Don't forget to mention that the aliens are white nords
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Jul 25, 2017 18:27
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Nobody ever says that the Parthenon, Roman Colosseum, or Cathedral of Notre Dame were built by aliens unless they're being snarky.
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Jul 25, 2017 18:30
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The entire Ancient Aliens thing, at its core in modern culture, is about Von Daniken wanting to drive more tourist traffic to places he'd bought rights to sell transport tickets and hotel rooms nearby, to boost his own tourism business. Worked out great for him, and whenever he wanted to boost business to other places he could sell tourism, it'd suddenly show up in a next book about more ancient aliens and such.
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Jul 25, 2017 19:48
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The Von Däniken books are really fun if you don't take them seriously. Also Däniken suggested plenty of structures comparable or even less complex than the Colosseum were made by aliens, or using alien technology, like the Iron Pillar of Delhi, which, as the name suggests, is just a pillar of iron.
steinrokkan fucked around with this message at 20:02 on Jul 25, 2017 |
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Jul 25, 2017 19:59
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steinrokkan posted:The Von Däniken books are really fun if you don't take them seriously. Also Däniken suggested plenty of structures comparable or even less complex than the Colosseum were made by aliens, or using alien technology, like the Iron Pillar of Delhi, which, as the name suggests, is just a pillar of iron. But it hasn't rusted, that means ALIENS!!! Fried Watermelon posted:Don't forget to mention that the aliens are white nords Of course "the legends said people with white skin taught us not to eat poo poo and stick our hands in the fire!" The it seems only Modern World stuff is influanced by aliens, the Nazis, Stealth aircraft and so on.
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Jul 25, 2017 21:08
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Stonehenge is a frequent source of "aliens built this!" Conspiracy too though.
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Jul 25, 2017 21:11
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Can someone help refute this 9/11 truther documentary. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IYUYya6bPGw&t=109s
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Jul 25, 2017 22:51
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Toothy McBeard posted:Can someone help refute this 9/11 truther documentary. Yeah, cut contact with anyone needs that poo poo debunked.
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Jul 25, 2017 23:08
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Baronjutter posted:Yeah, cut contact with anyone needs that poo poo debunked. what makes you say that?
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Jul 25, 2017 23:13
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Toothy McBeard posted:what makes you say that? Goons are bad at maintaining human relationships and give bad advice.
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Jul 25, 2017 23:38
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Just to check, you guys are still suspicious of 9/11 but just avoiding falling into outright koookery yeah? Like, nobody here is naive enough to accept the official story as told, correct?
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Jul 25, 2017 23:39
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oh god
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Jul 25, 2017 23:41
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So tell us who did 9/11; space lasers, controlled demolition, or just Jews?
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Jul 25, 2017 23:46
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Robotnik Nudes posted:Just to check, you guys are still suspicious of 9/11 but just avoiding falling into outright koookery yeah? Like, nobody here is naive enough to accept the official story as told, correct? Oh we of course realize that the official story of 9-11 is bunk. (We just like to make fun of the obvious nutballs like the guys who think the towers were melted with space lasers) Around here in this thread we all have our own little pet theories about what probably happened and love to share them. Would you be willing to share yours? 
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Jul 25, 2017 23:48
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Prester Jane posted:Oh we of course realize that the official story of 9-11 is bunk. (We just like to make fun of the obvious nutballs like the guys who think the towers were melted with space lasers) Around here in this thread we all have our own little pet theories about what probably happened and love to share them. Would you be willing to share yours? honestly, I am just trying to find the problems with the logic of those people. It's stupid but I want to know how . This is the video that a close family member linked and I am trying to help them recognize why they are acting foolish. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IYUYya6bPGw&t=109s
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Jul 25, 2017 23:53
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Toothy McBeard posted:what makes you say that? Crazy annoying people are not good to have in your life. Conspiracy nuts and truthers aren't really swayed by logic or evidence, it's like asking to debunk the bible to stop grandma from being christian. I have a friend who believes in ghosts, god, and paranormal stuff. He's a perfectly fine guy and he's quickly realized everyone mocks him if he brings those things up so it's fine, he knows better to start talking about how demonic possession is a real danger and there's a bunch of books you should't read because magic is real. Nah, he keeps that poo poo to him self. We had another friend who got into generic "conspiracy" poo poo and at first it was just sort of funny and we'd mock him but unlike the other guy, he wouldn't take the hint and would actually try to defend his idiotic views and get really argumentative and then email you a ton of "evidence" and youtube links, it became so wrapped up in his identity he couldn't drop it and was all he'd talk about. That's the sort of person you cut out of your life. A lot of goons fall into the whole "nerd social fallacies" thing where you just gotta accept everyone and ditching weirdos is like totally bullying or ideological purity or something. Nah, don't hang around with losers. Family can be a different kettle of fish of course, and if someone's just starting down that path sometimes you can nip it in the bud.
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Jul 25, 2017 23:54
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Prester Jane posted:Oh we of course realize that the official story of 9-11 is bunk. (We just like to make fun of the obvious nutballs like the guys who think the towers were melted with space lasers) Around here in this thread we all have our own little pet theories about what probably happened and love to share them. Would you be willing to share yours? Of course friend. Actually I don't have one. I have a hard time believing a couple huge fuckoff planes hitting the towers WOULDNT bring them down. I buy the science. It's more the motivation part that makes me wonder. Could have been a false flag. Could be what they say. I have zero trouble believing that Bush Crew, murderers of tens of thousands for business reasons, WOULDNT do something like that. I don't know. I generally take the position that Bush probably didn't do 9/11, unless I've been drinking, in which case I think Bush might not have done 9/11.
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Jul 25, 2017 23:57
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Baronjutter posted:Crazy annoying people are not good to have in your life. Conspiracy nuts and truthers aren't really swayed by logic or evidence, it's like asking to debunk the bible to stop grandma from being christian. I have a friend who believes in ghosts, god, and paranormal stuff. He's a perfectly fine guy and he's quickly realized everyone mocks him if he brings those things up so it's fine, he knows better to start talking about how demonic possession is a real danger and there's a bunch of books you should't read because magic is real. Nah, he keeps that poo poo to him self. We had another friend who got into generic "conspiracy" poo poo and at first it was just sort of funny and we'd mock him but unlike the other guy, he wouldn't take the hint and would actually try to defend his idiotic views and get really argumentative and then email you a ton of "evidence" and youtube links, it became so wrapped up in his identity he couldn't drop it and was all he'd talk about. That's the sort of person you cut out of your life. Perhaps the person who posted it has other good qualities and their kookery is one of the foibles of an otherwise good and/or fun person they like hanging out with.
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Jul 26, 2017 00:04
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Toothy McBeard posted:honestly, I am just trying to find the problems with the logic of those people. It's stupid but I want to know how . nobody is going to watch and debunk an hour long video but the most sensible conspiracy theory is controlled demolition. we're going to ignore hologram missiles and space lasers. the controlled demolition theory says that the towers were brought down by explosives. there's really no evidence in favor of this except for: -thermite/thermate nodules were found in the wreckage. the simplest debunking is that these nodules are also known as rust -the towers fell "faster than free fall speed". the simplest debunking is that they did not, and also the physics of large objects like a building collapsing are not intuitive and would not behave according to 'common sense' -plumes of smoke came from the towers immediately before the floors collapsed. the simplest debunking is that this is not how controlled demolition works (all charges go off at once, or in a specific sequence, certainly not floor by floor downwards) and the plumes are air compressing by the collapsing building, like an accordion here are some massive holes in the controlled demolition theory -if explosives were used, why did the conspirators need to crash two jet liners into the buildings? wouldn't that have been enough? (truthers dispute this but again, the behavior of large objects and naive physics etc.) -it takes days if not weeks to prepare a building for demolition. you can't just plant explosives or strew duffle bags about like an action movie. there's a substantial amount of construction involved -why did nobody out of tens of thousands of potential witnessess say anything at all about the building being prepped for demolition? read this for more info, trutherism is a dead conspiracy theory in that there is no more possible room for it to grow (like moon landing theories) so there are comprehensive rebuttals all over the web https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Trade_Center_controlled_demolition_conspiracy_theories you're not going to convince a conspiracy theorist they are wrong. they are advocating an irrational position, so rational arguments will not work against them. all you can do is make fun of them until they learn to stop talking to you about this weird belief, or just in general
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Jul 26, 2017 00:04
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Robotnik Nudes posted:Of course friend. Actually I don't have one. I have a hard time believing a couple huge fuckoff planes hitting the towers WOULDNT bring them down. I buy the science. It's more the motivation part that makes me wonder. Could have been a false flag. Could be what they say. I have zero trouble believing that Bush Crew, murderers of tens of thousands for business reasons, WOULDNT do something like that. I don't know. How would no evidence have come out after nearly 16 years? How many people would need to be paid off or assassinated to keep the plot quiet?
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Jul 26, 2017 00:05
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Robotnik Nudes posted:Perhaps the person who posted it has other good qualities and their kookery is one of the foibles of an otherwise good and/or fun person they like hanging out with. conspiracy theorists can be decent if they learn to be quiet about their weird and annoying ideas they can also be super evangelical and horribly obnoxious, just like christians, except where a christian probably is more interested in your eternal salvation than being a smug bastard who insists on forcing you to accept their beliefs, the conspiracy theorist is always definitely the latter whether they know it or not chitoryu12 posted:How would no evidence have come out after nearly 16 years? How many people would need to be paid off or assassinated to keep the plot quiet? loving $hillary kkklinton 
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Jul 26, 2017 00:07
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Also what's the huge global strategic advantage we gained by having our president mastermind a catastrophic false flag operation on our own soil? Whee perpetual quagmires in Afghanistan and Iraq, gas isn't cheaper for any reasons related to Middle East oil, and Russia fuckin owns the White House. Brilliant
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Jul 26, 2017 00:10
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chitoryu12 posted:How would no evidence have come out after nearly 16 years? How many people would need to be paid off or assassinated to keep the plot quiet? Nice thing about shutting up guys who fly planes into buildings while they're still on them is they do all the work for you. I'm personally fond of the idea it was part of some other CIA operation that, in true CIA fashion, they completely bungled and it ended up getting way out of hand. Also the idea that "it takes so many people! You'd have to pay them off or kill them!" Isn't really an objection, just an observation. Cause our government would never just disappear or bribe anybody.
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Jul 26, 2017 00:10
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Data Graham posted:Also what's the huge global strategic advantage we gained by having our president mastermind a catastrophic false flag operation on our own soil? Whee perpetual quagmires in Afghanistan and Iraq, gas isn't cheaper for any reasons related to Middle East oil, and Russia fuckin owns the White House. Brilliant It's been pretty profitable for a lot of business buddies of people in power, Conspiracy or now. What's the advantage? Money.
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Jul 26, 2017 00:11
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Robotnik Nudes posted:Also the idea that "it takes so many people! You'd have to pay them off or kill them!" Isn't really an objection, just an observation. Cause our government would never just disappear or bribe anybody. our government is ridiculously bad at keeping poo poo under wraps tho. we even know about all the crazy LSD/psychic soldier experiments from the 1960's. and like every coup ever pulled off. we know that the CIA funded death squads in nicaragua. that's the kind of thing you need to keep quiet about forever. it's more likely the stuff they've managed to keep secret is real mundane compared to the stuff that's been revealed most if not all 9/11 trutherism was weirdo left opposition to george bush the second, who seemed like a lot more of a cunning terrible mastermind in 2000 than he does today
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Jul 26, 2017 00:12
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Robotnik Nudes posted:I have zero trouble believing that Bush Crew, murderers of tens of thousands for business reasons, WOULDNT do something like that. I don't know. "Seems like something they'd do" has to be the weakest rear end excuse I've ever heard.
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Jul 26, 2017 00:15
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Republicans trying to make a buck off a disaster isn't a conspiracy, its a core tenant of their beliefs. Bush did 9/11 because his government was only slightly less useless than Trumps and his AG was more interested in avoiding getting boners from statues than looking into serious threats. boner confessor posted:our government is ridiculously bad at keeping poo poo under wraps tho. we even know about all the crazy LSD/psychic soldier experiments from the 1960's. and like every coup ever pulled off. we know that the CIA funded death squads in nicaragua. that's the kind of thing you need to keep quiet about forever. it's more likely the stuff they've managed to keep secret is real mundane compared to the stuff that's been revealed They can't even cover up a blowjob.
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Jul 26, 2017 00:18
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Robotnik Nudes posted:It's been pretty profitable for a lot of business buddies of people in power, Conspiracy or now. And this all went according to plan you say. Companies with sound business plans and profitable products have to hit every target in the roadmap and get lucky in order to succeed. NASA has to have every variable accounted for just to get a rocket into orbit. And you're saying someone sat in a room and said "I know! Let's knock down the World Trade Center and kill thousands of civilians! I know there's a dozen different ways the national mood can go in the aftermath and who knows how the operation itself will go! Maybe we'll take out the pentagon and the capitol too, maybe not, who knows! But surely we can count on all the pieces lining up in just such a way that the mysterious dark powers we represent will get the opportunity to sign some lucrative defense and security contracts in whatever countries we manage to find ourselves in after a couple of years"
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Jul 26, 2017 00:18
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boner confessor posted:our government is ridiculously bad at keeping poo poo under wraps tho. we even know about all the crazy LSD/psychic soldier experiments from the 1960's. and like every coup ever pulled off. we know that the CIA funded death squads in nicaragua. that's the kind of thing you need to keep quiet about forever. it's more likely the stuff they've managed to keep secret is real mundane compared to the stuff that's been revealed You only know about the ones you hear about. Like I said I don't know but I trust the US Government about as much as I'd trust any other international terrorist organization, so I'm sure they're lying about something. It seems as unlikely that they're telling the whole truth as it does that Jewish laser holograms did a co trolled demolition at the behest of the reptilians.
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Jul 26, 2017 00:18
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There's easier ways to earn 15% is what I'm saying
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Jul 26, 2017 00:19
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Data Graham posted:And this all went according to plan you say. No, I actually said I am fond of an idea where it went disastrously not according to plan.
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Jul 26, 2017 00:19
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Data Graham posted:There's easier ways to earn 15% is what I'm saying Whoever said they were smart? You don't have to be smart to bribe and/or disappear people. The idea that doing a 9/11 requires a shadow network of masterminds is absurd. All it took apparently was 19 dudes who just waltzed past security with box cutters. If it was that easy for them then it wouldn't be too hard for anybody else.
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Jul 26, 2017 00:21
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If you were part of a CIA op to cause a minor terror attack in order to rule up popular support for a war and things backfired and you accidentally steered some extremists into doing a 9/11 would you admit to it? Edit: I'm saying there's a lot more possibilities between The Official Story and Jet Fuel Can't Melt Steel Beams and I don't really have any opinion on what the truth is, except that I'm pretty sure the US Government isn't a much more reliable source than Infowars. Robotnik Nudes fucked around with this message at 00:26 on Jul 26, 2017 |
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Jul 26, 2017 00:24
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This has all been very informative. Thank you.
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Jul 26, 2017 00:25
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If you buy that it's 19 dudes with box cutters, how is that functionally different from accepting the "official story"?
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Jul 26, 2017 00:26
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