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Arcsquad12 posted:So the protomolecule is basically an alien bio weapon/terraformer/teleporter, I take it? Target an earth like planet, wipe out its population and then use its biomass plus radiation to build a giant fuckoff Stargate to their central hub? I don't get the impression its creators saw it as a weapon at all. I don't think that all of the alien tech we see is exactly "Protomolecule," either, but it's hard to tell where to draw that line. The only concrete thing we know is that it's a gate builder. Maybe it would've gone all grey goo on ancient Earth, or maybe it would've just used as much biomass as it needed and then launched to place the gate. In either case, we don't know anything about the aliens themselves, so we don't know whether what the Protomolecule does to planets would constitute terraforming for them; that might be some other device's job.
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May 26, 2017 18:54
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The protomolecule is just an alien method of FTL travel. It builds a gate. That's it. It's not a weapon, nor even a terraforming device. Slap some of this goo on a rock and sling it towards a planet orbiting another star and let it do its thing, and sooner or later there will be a new star system to explore from your hub station. I like how terrifying and hostile the protomolecule seemed when it was in fact such a totally neutral thing.
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May 26, 2017 19:03
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Arcsquad12 posted:So the protomolecule is basically an alien bio weapon/terraformer/teleporter, I take it? Target an earth like planet, wipe out its population and then use its biomass plus radiation to build a giant fuckoff Stargate to their central hub? Abaddon's Gate posted:It killed humans, therefore it was a weapon. But radiation killed humans, and a medical X-ray machine wasn’t intended as a weapon. Holden was starting to feel like they were all monkeys playing with a microwave. Push a button, a light comes on inside, so it’s a light. Push a different button and stick your hand inside, it burns you, so it’s a weapon. Learn to open and close the door, it’s a place to hide things. Never grasping what it actually did, and maybe not even having the framework necessary to figure it out. No monkey ever reheated a frozen burrito.
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May 26, 2017 19:04
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I legit can't tell if that's the best paragraph ever written, or the worst one. It's definitely one of the two, though
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May 26, 2017 19:12
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Well I'm just going off of the spoilers in the thread and how far into Caliban's War I am. I also finished season 2, which I thought was really well done overall, though I did notice some distinct changes. For one thin Nguyen is pretty much absent and his role and Erinwright's seem to have been condensed into one, and a few scenes are shifted around. But I really like the show's expansion on certain subjects like the availability of the protomolecule to all three factions, or turning Amos into a more overt but still well meaning sociopath. Best scene was Alex chilling on the Roci slinging back beers in zero g.
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May 26, 2017 21:54
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The protomolecule is a metaphor for the plants/animals/microbiota that Europeans brought to the New World that made the place more habitable for them but hosed over all the natives.
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May 26, 2017 22:49
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Platystemon posted:The protomolecule is a metaphor for the plants/animals/microbiota that Europeans brought to the New World that made the place more habitable for them but hosed over all the natives. Alex: "Didn't all those natives die, though, Holden?"
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May 26, 2017 22:57
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Eiba posted:The protomolecule is just an alien method of FTL travel. It builds a gate. That's it. It's not a weapon, nor even a terraforming device. That's what the one particular piece of PM humans encountered was intended for, but it seems a bit silly to think that's its the only thing the aliens used it for. If it can build an interstellar gate, it can probably build just about anything you want it to.
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May 31, 2017 11:22
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Zartosht posted:That's what the one particular piece of PM humans encountered was intended for, but it seems a bit silly to think that's its the only thing the aliens used it for. If it can build an interstellar gate, it can probably build just about anything you want it to.
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May 31, 2017 11:53
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Eiba posted:I thought "The Protomolecule" was specifically the gunk found on Phoebe, which really only had one purpose. There's all sorts of other protomolecule-creator tech that humanity has encountered by now, but I don't remember if they call any of that stuff "protomolecule," You're right, Protomolecule is specifically the Phoebe stuff. On the other hand, the aliens presumably used the same technology to build other things. It's like a 3D printer we don't know how to give new model files.
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May 31, 2017 13:31
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Arcsquad12 posted:So the protomolecule is basically an alien bio weapon/terraformer/teleporter, I take it? Target an earth like planet, wipe out its population and then use its biomass plus radiation to build a giant fuckoff Stargate to their central hub? Pretty much; however, while it isn't said I get the impression it isn't meant to be used as a weapon on complicated biomes, sentient creatures, or civilizations. When it was originally shot at earth the life on Earth was no more complicated than some multicellular organisms in a sea of bacteria. Platystemon posted:The protomolecule is a metaphor for the plants/animals/microbiota that Europeans brought to the New World that made the place more habitable for them but hosed over all the natives. That was a two way street. Probably 2/3rds of the grains you eat (and tobacco) are new World plants. ZombieLenin fucked around with this message at 16:21 on May 31, 2017 |
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May 31, 2017 16:17
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ZombieLenin posted:That was a two way street. Probably 2/3rds of the grains you eat (and tobacco) are new World plants. Syphilis is what killed the PM creators. 
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Jun 1, 2017 11:03
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Jesus christ, stay away from the James a Corey twitter account unless you love Twitter threads about Donald Trump and politics. I just wanted to see what kind of stuff they post about the Expanse universe, god drat
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Jun 26, 2017 21:29
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ROFLburger posted:Jesus christ, stay away from the James a Corey twitter account unless you love Twitter threads about Donald Trump and politics. I just wanted to see what kind of stuff they post about the Expanse universe, god drat You would think they would keep that twitter account to their literary work but nope.. gotta throw in some poo poo too.
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Jun 27, 2017 00:55
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yeah, its really dumb how some tiwtters are so politics focused. should have personal accounts to do poltiics imo
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Jun 30, 2017 11:11
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Baloogan posted:yeah, its really dumb how some tiwtters are so politics focused. should have personal accounts to do poltiics imo From a marketing point of view, sure; however, ideology and thus politics attaches itself to everything. So even the act of saving politics for personal twitter accounts is, in and of itself, a political act.
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Jul 23, 2017 16:51
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So has anyone else read Strange Dogs? It is a really interesting if short window on to what has been going on on the other side of the gate. I enjoyed it, though i was disappointed that it was so short. It read a lot like a prologue to a novel, i hope l we have some more from the family in the book.
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Jul 23, 2017 16:59
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I thought it was fascinating, yeah. I know these books aren't really meant to be about weird ancient alien stuff, but it's great whenever they delve into that stuff. I was surprised to find it was --SUPER mild spoilers here-- set eight years after colonisation. Guess we're getting a time-skip for PR.
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Jul 27, 2017 01:27
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Does it ever come up in the books how strong earthers can be in .3G environments? Now clearly after spending extended time in lower gravity there will be side effects, but I'm wondering if the books ever present some John carter of Mars levels of strength disparity.
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Jul 30, 2017 07:03
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I think it came up in a Bobbie chapter early on when she was walking around earth and thinking that all the training for a Martian invasion was bullshit because they'd all just be exhausted despite the growth hormones and junk.
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Jul 30, 2017 09:30
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Der Luftwaffle posted:I think it came up in a Bobbie chapter early on when she was walking around earth and thinking that all the training for a Martian invasion was bullshit because they'd all just be exhausted despite the growth hormones and junk. That's not it, she was talking (thinking) about the existential horror she experienced going outside. The point was the 1+G training was nothing more that a security blanket that tricked Martian soldiers into at least considering fighting.
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Jul 30, 2017 12:11
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So I just finished book 3. One thing I don't understand, assuming it wasn't just hand-waving (which I am leaning towards being the likely explanation) is the guns working after the "blue sphere" "security center" in the Hub slowed everything down because "anything faster than a fastball is a threat" parameters set by the Martians grenade launchers when they were shooting at Holden. So how exactly are we back on the ship and having raging gun battles with assault rifles and sniper rifles and poo poo that very obviously travel faster than a fastball?
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Jul 30, 2017 21:34
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Nigulus Rex posted:So I just finished book 3. One thing I don't understand, assuming it wasn't just hand-waving (which I am leaning towards being the likely explanation) is the guns working after the "blue sphere" "security center" in the Hub slowed everything down because "anything faster than a fastball is a threat" parameters set by the Martians grenade launchers when they were shooting at Holden. The security system only looks at objects exposed to space or inside the station itself, it doesn't worry about stuff below the skin of a ship (so bullets are allowed) or below the skin of a human or spacesuit (so fast biological functions are allowed).
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Jul 30, 2017 22:28
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Number Ten Cocks posted:The security system only looks at objects exposed to space or inside the station itself, it doesn't worry about stuff below the skin of a ship (so bullets are allowed) or below the skin of a human or spacesuit (so fast biological functions are allowed). This is the same reason it's so catastrophic when the speed limit adjusts the second time.
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Jul 30, 2017 22:33
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Nigulus Rex posted:So I just finished book 3. One thing I don't understand, assuming it wasn't just hand-waving (which I am leaning towards being the likely explanation) is the guns working after the "blue sphere" "security center" in the Hub slowed everything down because "anything faster than a fastball is a threat" parameters set by the Martians grenade launchers when they were shooting at Holden. The slow zone only effects the outer shell of the vessels. This is also why everyone inside the ships is seriously hosed up by the sudden deceleration.
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Jul 30, 2017 22:35
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PriorMarcus posted:The slow zone only effects the outer shell of the vessels. This is also why everyone inside the ships is seriously hosed up by the sudden deceleration. The situation doesn't hold up on close inspection. Like most SF/F its best just to accept ~magic or new technology~ as a narrative device.
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Jul 31, 2017 12:57
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Collateral posted:The situation doesn't hold up on close inspection. Like most SF/F its best just to accept ~magic or new technology~ as a narrative device. Was there something specific they messed up? They seemed to apply the rule consistently.
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Jul 31, 2017 14:04
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wellwhoopdedooo posted:That's not it, she was talking (thinking) about the existential horror she experienced going outside. The point was the 1+G training was nothing more that a security blanket that tricked Martian soldiers into at least considering fighting. I distinctly recall her thinking that one part of this is that the Martian 1G training was distinctly inadequate preparation for any sort of prolonged combat at 1G with UN soldiers who grew up in, and live in, 1G constantly. The other part was the enormity of "outside;" which is pretty much the only part of that "scene" that made it into the TV show. Importantly, when that scene made it to the TV show, it completely lost the context of comparing the inadequacy of Mars military preparation for combat in 1G; however, I would probably argue that the subtext of the scene from the novels was captured pretty drat well on the television show--the overwhelming nature of Earth for those who had never lived there, even for those "trained" for it, was the most important facet of the scene. ZombieLenin fucked around with this message at 14:45 on Jul 31, 2017 |
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Jul 31, 2017 14:38
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There was also the comment that Earth has the manpower and resources to annihilate any ground force willing to set foot on the surface.
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Jul 31, 2017 15:54
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Toast Museum posted:Was there something specific they messed up? They seemed to apply the rule consistently. I need to reread it but they change velocity instantly, like in zero time (t=0). I could be wrong about that though. Even if t>0 then the potential energy of the inside of the ships is going to greater than the shell that was stopped, those ships were designed to have the stress placed around the engine housing, not the hull, which would have buttressing from the inside. The inside of the ship would either rip through the hull or if the force is applied equally to the hull at all times the impact would release the kinetic energy and simply explode. Every hard object inside the ship would act like a railgun slug. Not to mention people aren't exactly hard objects. I don't have the numbers at hand, so I could be wrong. I usually am 
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Jul 31, 2017 16:38
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Collateral posted:Every hard object inside the ship would act like a railgun slug. I don’t remember what the numbers were for the change (if they were even given), but if some of the passengers survived the velocity change, the walls can definitely survive flying paperweights. It’s not railgun velocity. As for the inside of the ship ripping through the hull, I think the whole structure of the ship was stopped as a complete unit—skin, ribs, reactor, floors, everything that’s nailed down. Yeah, that’s kind of like magic, but so is everything else prototech is capable of.
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Jul 31, 2017 18:13
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Dr. Benway posted:There was also the comment that Earth has the manpower and resources to annihilate any ground force willing to set foot on the surface. Taking over an entire planet without bombing it to dust seems pretty much impossible. Even if you don't count martians and belters having trouble in the gravity well, and assume Earth's military all fall over and die, you still have to deal with billions of potential insurgents.
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Jul 31, 2017 18:15
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A straight up ground war would be nearly as suicidal for the belt and Mars against earth as a rock throwing space war.
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Jul 31, 2017 18:21
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Platystemon posted:I don’t remember what the numbers were for the change (if they were even given), but if some of the passengers survived the velocity change, the walls can definitely survive flying paperweights. It’s not railgun velocity.
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Jul 31, 2017 18:22
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ZombieLenin posted:Sure, okay. But again you are taking about people migrating because of economic conditions to a boom economy. These people, by in large, were migrating to developed cities in the United States where they new a large number of industrial jobs were available. From pages ago but my thought on this is that the younger generation (the ones all leaving Mars) don't have the same inspiration/motivation with regards to the Mars terraforming project like the older people do and from their perspective it's "live in a shithouse underground colony for my entire life and maybe my grandkids can go outside or move to a pristine Earth-like planet we can have all to ourselves right now." Plus a lot of the emigrants are described as having barely taped together ships pulled out of mothballs so idk if you're right that they are mostly well off middle-classes. e: ZombieLenin posted:Yep, that's huge. You could crew a Seawolf class attack submarine with people you pulled out of the Nigerian navy, but I wouldn't expect it to last long in combat, even if they were given a crash course on how to operate it and its systems. Sorry for digging up some old posts but hey the thread moves slowly - There are probably many belters with some kind of naval experience (just look at Holden or Alex). Second, the belters have been living on and operating space ships for their entire lives. They understand how ships work, they understand how to deal with high-G bursts, etc. They might not be as good at operating the weapons systems but they don't seem too complicated really given that the ship computers work out the firing solutions for you. I think of it less like pulling some 3rd world people onto a modern submarine and more like the pirates that the navy was fighting back in the 1600/1700s, except somebody gave the pirates a bunch of frigates and ships of the line. COMRADES fucked around with this message at 19:14 on Jul 31, 2017 |
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Jul 31, 2017 18:47
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Are the novellas and short stories available in print or are they only e books?
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Aug 6, 2017 22:34
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Arcsquad12 posted:Are the novellas and short stories available in print or are they only e books? Drive (which is like six pages long) was available in print as convention swag, but that’s about it. Here’s a five‐year‐old comment from Abraham saying maybe eventually they’ll be bound together in a collection.
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Aug 6, 2017 22:42
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Finished calibans war. Not as overall good as leviathan wakes and I think it spends a bit too long hitting certain plot points but I enjoyed it. Finale felt rushed but the denouement was well done to wrap things up. Bobbie is great and avasarala may as well be renamed queen bitch of the universe. I did find the Martians willingly giving holden a crapload of munitions and a gatling gun a bit of a stretch even if chrisjen and Bobbie negotiated an alliance.
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Aug 8, 2017 06:21
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I had the same thought about Caliban's War that you do, except that actually avasarala owns
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Aug 25, 2017 21:50
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Oh don't get me wrong, avasarala owns, but man she is a mean bastard when she wants to be.
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Aug 25, 2017 21:55
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