|
Brennanite posted:Saints names Lemme guess: French-Canadian.
|
#
?
Jun 5, 2017 15:22
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 30, 2024 16:39 |
|
|
My particular bugbear currently is Victorian/Edwardian Irish names. The women are all Elizabeth or Mary, the men are all James or John and the surnames are all really common ones like Byrne or Kennedy or Reilly.
|
|
#
?
Jun 5, 2017 15:41
|
|
|
HJB posted:You may want to look through the "Mayflower Families Through Five Generations" silver books for Richard Warren, if you can find them. The Mayflower Society sells them, but they're 40 bucks a pop. Otherwise, there's this if you can figure out how their loaning system works, and old Mayflower Descendants may help out as well. Thanks, will do
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2017 05:55
|
|
|
Oracle posted:Lemme guess: French-Canadian. Hey, there could be incestuous Catholic Francophones other places! Yeah, French-Canadian
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2017 05:59
|
|
|
Tbh It surprises me that yall can "identify" religion like from names like that. I mean I'm only recently beginning to notice certain name combinations that are more common in say north mainland Denmark as compared to south island Denmark. German names anywhere I'd only be able to say "south of here" p much I guess it's kindof the same in a way -- you all probably have a ton of various English type ancestors, and I have a ton of various small Danish village ancestors :p Carthag Tuek fucked around with this message at 07:43 on Jun 6, 2017 |
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2017 06:27
|
|
|
Powaqoatse posted:Tbh It surprises me that yall can "identify" religion like from names like that. I mean I'm only recently beginning to notice certain name combinations that are more common in say north mainland Denmark as compared to south island Denmark. German names anywhere I'd only be able to say "south of here" p much Certain flavors of Christianity have names associated with them that are like 'yep.' Irish names are gonna be Catholic in America like 80% of the time, because Irish Protestants weren't persecuted like the Catholics were so didn't have near as many reasons to up and leave. In Canada the mix may be more even because Canada was an English colony and the Irish made up a good chunk of British troops. Since Irish Catholics and Irish Protestants... didn't like each other much (to put it mildly) your ancestors are gonna be one or the other (I in fact have an ancestor that was disowned by his Irish-Protestant family for marrying a French-Canadian Catholic woman). You hear 'French' and 'Catholic' in the context of American genealogy and its gonna be French-Canadian because they've been here since the 1500s, in 1625 Cardinal Richeleiu suggested they make New France Catholic-only (and the king did) and they moved around quite a bit by using the river system in the U.S. and were also encouraged to have a shitton of kids by the French crown to outbreed the savages in the New World (no, seriously. Legislation rewarded families with 10 living children with an annual allowance of 300 livres; the sum went up to 400 livres for those with 12 or more. Later laws required parents to marry off their children by the age of 20 for boys and 16 for girls—or explain to a court why they didn’t. See, kids, its important to know your history when you're studying genealogy). Catholics have very specific naming conventions in that they have to be named after a saint (that's been relaxed a bit in modern times) and the Holy Family are the most popular ones (Joseph and Mary, John the Baptist is also a big'un, which is Jean-Baptiste in French, and can also be feminine as Jeanne-Baptiste! Fun times). The Catholic church also kept all its records in Latin, so if you're seeing Latin after the Protestant Reformation in your family records chances are they're Catholic. You see a guy with 'Wesley' in his name chances are he's gonna be a Methodist with English heritage, because it was founded by John Wesley who was English and preached all over England and Ireland. And of course each culture has its own naming conventions as you've learned and those cultures tend to be influenced greatly by one particular religion or another. Bavarians are by and large gonna be Catholic cuz history.
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2017 15:44
|
|
|
Dang that makes a lotta sense also in here we were all the same religioin anyway so the naming after ancestors was more inportant than kings & saints i guess..
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2017 15:56
|
|
|
And we haven't even gotten into dit names! Those are fun (and another marker of French-Canadianhood).
Oracle fucked around with this message at 19:24 on Jun 6, 2017 |
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2017 19:19
|
|
|
Speaking of names, I'm having a hell of a time right now wrestling with one family who cannot seem to keep their names straight. Bechmanns that turn into Pechmanns and back again, children who are born with one name and die with another (I've got more than one Elise that became a Lizzie when they died in childhood), a father whose name can't stay put (Georg? Louis? Ludwig?), two surviving children whose names don't match their birth certificates at all (a Johanne becoming a Lucy/Louisa, a Henrietta becoming a Laura), and one child whose entire name seems to change when their mother remarried (the aforementioned Johanne, who apparently doesn't even remember her real father, judging by her continued claims to the contrary; though, to be fair, he may have died 6 months before she was born) It doesn't help that this is all happening around the 1880s in New York City when one of the surnames involved is super common, so between the missing 1890 census and a lot of mid-decade deaths, it's all quite infuriating and makes it hell to be certain of anything. About the only thing that's helped me keep my sanity is that at least the surnames, census records and birthdays (sometimes not even years are right!) seem to help pull it together at all. Hell, just yesterday I got a marriage record in the mail that finally helped to prove that the 1900 census record of Johanne/Louisa is actually her, and it still managed to give me a curve ball in the form of a poorly legible bride's mother's maiden name that doesn't match anything I've ever seen before. And yet the bride's mother's mother is almost certainly living with them in that 1900 census record, so even that garbled mother's surname isn't a huge block. It's just one more thing I can't yet explain away. (At least it explained the claim that this husband was born in Delaware in the 1900 and 1910 censuses: apparently the informant had taken the husband's birth COUNTY for his birth state. God, what a mess.) Given that this family is second generation German immigrants, it's probably a case of saints names, at least for the given names, but it's obnoxious when you aren't working with christening records that might help actually piece it together.
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2017 20:45
|
|
|
Yeah in those cases her full name was probably JOhanne Luisa blah blah and Lucy as the nickname/Americanized version, or Georg Louis LUdwig was the guy's full name and he just went by whatever at the time/person wrote down the last name they heard ecause gently caress it, its 1880s New York. Note that you can find state censuses online at Ancestry and familysearch that are half-years (1895 I think was one?) that may shed some light.
|
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2017 21:18
|
|
|
Yeah the 1892 census was some circumstantial evidence that helped to link the family a bit closer together, even though most of the people in question had died by that point. It still managed to help confirm that Johanne/Louisa/Lucy was linked to both the grandmother and father I thought she was. Unfortunately, the one before that is 1875, which would be perfect as it's right in the middle of these problematic Bechmann records, except that the Manhattan records I'd need no longer exist.  EDIT: Fortunately, as I've said previously, the records are slowly coming together in spite of these hurdles. I found the probable "Lizzie" death records, last week, for example. When I get around to requesting those from New York and cross-referencing them with any info Green-Wood Cemetery still has (where most of these people were buried), it might just give me pointers to which church might have the christening records that will sort this out once and for all. ComradeCosmobot fucked around with this message at 22:03 on Jun 6, 2017 |
|
#
?
Jun 6, 2017 21:30
|
|
|
I dunno if you know this already but Reclaim the Records just won a court case to put the index of deaths in New York State online and made them available on Friday:quote:The genealogy community received great news from Reclaim the Records this morning – they have obtained images of the New York State death index from 1880–1956, and are in the process up uploading them online at Internet Archive.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2017 15:47
|
|
|
There's another DNA Sale at Ancestry, 20% off, woo! Expect FTDNA to follow suit cuz Father's Day hoosier daddy. Edit: Yup, here's FTDNA's offer. 20% there too.
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2017 16:16
|
|
|
Oracle posted:There's another DNA Sale at Ancestry, 20% off, woo! Expect FTDNA to follow suit cuz Father's Day hoosier daddy. My mother did this test and is waiting on the results. She has suspicion of some Ashkenazim admixture somewhere in the Scandanavian past because of her grandfather having a disorder otherwise rare except in that community. vOv
|
|
#
?
Jun 7, 2017 20:25
|
|
|
Finished transcribing ~80 headcounts for so-called "extra taxes" levied in my hometown 1610–58. Usually there was only 1 or 2 extra tax per year, but sometimes up to 5   It's pretty much necessary to check and compare every single list, cause they appear to be based on who could pay for that given tax. Sometimes only the manor and the mill (top two short sections respectively) were taxed, sometimes only the fishermen (long bottom section). I guess those who couldn't pay would pay later, but I'm not sure where that would be written or if anything like that is even preserved. I've seen some royal remissions of owed taxes but not nearly enough to account for the variations in the lists. They seem to generally be written in the same order each year, probably based on the cadasters. Though there are some strange inconsistensies still, sometimes the yearly cadasters list people who have obviously died/left and their house is lived in by someone else who pays taxes/yearly land fees in their own name. Anyway so far it's gotten my longest line back to a man who must have been born ~1588 at the latest as he is paying taxes at least from 1613. Not sure exactly what the law was then, but the 1683 law states age of majority as 25 for men (but they could start a family at 20 if permitted by parents), and it was afaik an update and codification of earlier practice. Carthag Tuek fucked around with this message at 00:56 on Jun 15, 2017 |
|
#
?
Jun 15, 2017 00:49
|
|
|
Well poo poo.quote:On September 1, 2017, FamilySearch will discontinue its microfilm distribution services. (The last day to order microfilm will be on August 31, 2017.)
|
|
#
?
Jun 26, 2017 04:37
|
|
|
Oracle posted:Well poo poo. I must say I've been pleased at what HAS been made available online, so far (I was pleasantly surprised when I first discovered that the Suffolk County, Massachusetts probate records were already digitized), but it sure seems like there's a long way to go still. I'm sorta in the same boat with Archion and some Czech land records. They're obviously hard at work digitizing them, but I'm still waiting for the ones I really need to actually show up online (of what I'm looking for, Archion so far hasn't uploaded anything the FHL microfilms didn't already cover, or the regional church isn't part of Archion in the first place  )
|
|
#
?
Jun 26, 2017 17:04
|
|
|
And now for some good news (well for Roots Magic and Ancestry users): The RootsMagic Update that synchs your Ancestry tree records is finally loving here!!! quote:RootsMagic’s TreeShare for Ancestry will let you move data between your RootsMagic files on your computers and your personal Ancestry online trees. You can transfer people, events, notes, source citations, and even pictures between the two systems. RootsMagic is a nice, cheap but kinda ugly and barebones looking family tree software that has a bit of a learning curve but once you get into it gets really really useful. It was already integrated with myheritage and familyfinder.org but ancestry.com was the great white whale, especially after FTM was discontinued (it is of course being revived). Some day I will get five minutes where the world isn't making GBS threads on me to play with this upgrade.
|
|
#
?
Jun 30, 2017 04:29
|
|
|
Speaking of genealogy software, while GRAMPS has been largely satisfactory for tracking my research, I've been doing some digging around lately for something that can help provide a decent web presentation of my findings and haven't really been all that happy with what I've come across. I'm not especially interested in the "global family tree" models of Geni, WikiTree and the like, but I do rather like a bit in how they present their data, especially the wiki-influenced sites that can mix structured data with unstructured text. I've gotten the impression there aren't really many good solutions for standalone sites that hit the same level of flexibility, but I'd be interested to hear what you all have looked into for presentation (heck, even if that's more about actual paper publication than anything else)
|
|
#
?
Jun 30, 2017 05:40
|
|
|
What's the point of your presentation? Are you wanting to share with family? Are you doing some kind of research project where you have to show off your findings? What's more important to you the data itself or presenting it prettily?
|
|
#
?
Jun 30, 2017 15:26
|
|
|
My father wants to research his family tree, and as the person in his life who is Good At The Internet I have been conscripted to help. So far this has proved to be loving impossible. Here's what we have going for us: -My dad has a good memory for family history -His father kept a journal with some records of births/deaths in it Here are the setbacks: -As far as anyone can tell we have been Turkish farmers for a few hundred years with no links to nobility and thus few online resources -The Baltic wars happened and everything got messed up forever, leading to a loss of official records from his village -Everything is in Turkish, which I can't read -Everything before 1920 is in old Turkish, which my father can't read -No one had a surname before ~1930 Are there any resources out there for non-European genealogy research? Do we just suck it up and go to Turkey to dig through old documents?
|
|
#
?
Jun 30, 2017 16:08
|
|
|
Oracle posted:What's the point of your presentation? Are you wanting to share with family? Are you doing some kind of research project where you have to show off your findings? What's more important to you the data itself or presenting it prettily? It's mostly about sharing with family, so "pretty" is more important than the data, which is one of the reasons I've been more drawn to the narrative-like wikis than anything else. I like citations myself, but I kinda doubt the family would care as much about them as I do. On top of that, the topic of a "Flickr, but for family photos" has come up more than once in conversations with my folks given how many scans of family photos I have. Of course that is far enough out there that I suspect a "viable" solution would have to be self-hosted so that I could build that feature into it manually, as I doubt that there is anything quite like that. EDIT: That's not to say that sharing the data isn't an important secondary goal, but as you rightly imply, that might be better served by other means than a website. ComradeCosmobot fucked around with this message at 16:22 on Jun 30, 2017 |
|
#
?
Jun 30, 2017 16:18
|
|
|
bomrek posted:Are there any resources out there for non-European genealogy research? Familysearch is always the best first place to start. The language barrier can be a pain but is not insurmountable. If I can learn to tease out certain names and words in Sutterlin you can do the same for Ottoman Turkish (luckily a lot of records just repeat the same phrases or words over and over and you tend to get good at figuring them out, unluckily most are handwritten and there's jargon and abbreviations involved). As for the surname bit, that might be less of a problem than you think: quote:Naming customs in Turkey present a problem for family history research. Until the twentieth century, most Turks had no surnames. They followed the Islamic custom of using one name, given at birth, relying on a patronymic or a word indicating some special attribute for more precise identification. In most registers only given names and patronymic are given. In 1934, the new regime issued an edict requiring that all Turks take family names. Here is a nice beginner's guide to researching Ottoman Empire records. There's a preview of ebook on google books that might also be helpful to you. Chances are you will eventually need to either contract someone in Turkey to do your research for you or go there yourself, but there are more resources online than I thought there'd be when I started looking. Oracle fucked around with this message at 17:03 on Jun 30, 2017 |
|
#
?
Jun 30, 2017 16:33
|
|
|
ComradeCosmobot posted:It's mostly about sharing with family, so "pretty" is more important than the data, which is one of the reasons I've been more drawn to the narrative-like wikis than anything else. I like citations myself, but I kinda doubt the family would care as much about them as I do. I do like MyHeritage's layout and they do well with pictures (better than ancestry in my opinion) and a tree is free up to I think about 1500 individuals. To get around that just chop up your family tree into different branches and have multiple trees. If you find you really like their format you can subscribe and host your tree in the cloud with them and then you've got unlimited members per tree and they back up all your work, which is really nice. Its also got formatting for telling stories and keeping track of various bits of data, and you can import gedcom files. You can also set the tree private so only those you choose to invite can view and/or edit it. They include free Family Tree Builder software to synch your data on your PC with the online site including pictures, which is nice. You can also upload videos, which is new and I haven't used it yet. Ancestry's trees are also free to create up to a certain number of individuals, the layout is nice, they offer a kind of AI like Family Story feature that puts your data in a readable format (so and so was born on <date> at <place> and came to America in <date>. They married at <place> when they were <age> years old' etc etc. They also have the option to be made private and allow invite-only viewing or editing (via email address). Look at both of those and see if either appeals to you. They are the big two right now, pretty much. Familysearch.org is free but anyone can mess with your tree drat tree and the format isn't the greatest. I do not put data up there, though its a great place to do research.
|
|
#
?
Jun 30, 2017 16:44
|
|
|
You are a scholar and a saint. Time to dive into the stacks~
|
|
#
?
Jul 2, 2017 02:26
|
|
|
No problem. You may also want to check out my introductory post in the African-American Genealogy thread over in TGRS for general guidelines and advice on how to start researching. A lot of it is broadly applicable.
|
|
#
?
Jul 3, 2017 07:12
|
|
|
Ooh ooh ooh Ancestry DNA on sale to Prime members for only 69 bucks and free shipping! This is as low as it gets y'all, jump on it if you can.
|
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2017 18:59
|
|
|
Nice. My parents did that, and got some interesting results on the low end of the distribution, with some Persian genes on my mom's side and North African on my dad's, despite our being distinctly northern Europeans for all of recorded history. Viking traders ranged far and wide, and so did Roman soldiers.
|
|
#
?
Jul 12, 2017 20:00
|
|
|
Writing up a short piece on the known descendants of the first priest of my hometown (mentioned 1576, died 1585), using the stuff I've found in the land records. So far I have 3 generations (~1645), and some tenuous connections to other descendants. My hope is it will be possible to find a line that goes into the 1700s as it will likely then be possible to extend into current time.
|
|
#
?
Jul 13, 2017 09:14
|
|
|
I was clearing a bunch of papers left over from last year's project and finished off some stuff I meant to make:: (Open in a new window and delete the H near the end of the URLs for full size)  Rygate & Fletcher's survey, 1888.  Modern Sydney with all the places. The red lines are former roads that were destroyed during a slum clearance in the 1920s. Shows how great the City of Sydney Archives is, they have fantastic map coverage of the old city. Rygate & Fletcher's survey assessed buildings on the south central side of the city for insurance purposes, following on from other surveys in previous decades. The addresses were mostly found from Sand's Postal directory, also from the archives.
|
|
#
?
Jul 18, 2017 00:26
|
|
|
That's a really cool way to do that. I did something similar to old Dublin to see that one of my potential ancestors lived like 300m from his possible wife.
|
|
#
?
Jul 18, 2017 16:37
|
|
|
Nice work Jaguars! Old maps like that really give a sense of where your ancestors lived and definitely help spice it up for sharing with relatives 
|
|
#
?
Jul 18, 2017 20:59
|
|
|
Btw, I use LaTeX for typesetting my genealogical research & the genealogytree package is super neat!
|
|
#
?
Jul 19, 2017 16:18
|
|
|
An article on the surprises that may come with "recreational genomics": https://www.washingtonpost.com/clas...m=.4a280d7f68ae
|
|
#
?
Jul 30, 2017 20:28
|
|
|
Bilirubin posted:An article on the surprises that may come with "recreational genomics": https://www.washingtonpost.com/clas...m=.4a280d7f68ae Thanks for sharing, that's really interesting! When I did my Ancestry test it came back about 50% "British", 30% "Irish" and 20% "Western European" which is basically what I expected as the paper trail shows my ancestors to be all English, Irish or Welsh so far. Still, I'm doing research and combing through old Parish records I often find myself wondering how different my biological family tree may be to the one based on the "official" records, even if it's not quite as drastic as that example.
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2017 00:26
|
|
|
One of the things you (and everyone else, including Ancestrys' loving ad department) need to realize is that that poo poo is by and large guesswork based on limited samples of current populations of said countries that have lived in the same spot back to at least their great-grandparents. So British, Irish, Scottish, Swedish, Western and Eastern European are to a great extent pretty drat interchangeable because of all the genetic drift from the various invasions, emi/immigration, wars etc etc. People got around a LOT back in the day, a lot more than people realize. I go into it more in my DNA post in the African-American Genealogy thread here but 'Western European' is probably as close to accurate as most people are going to get without a paper trail to back it up (never mind countries like France flat out banned DNA testing for recreational purposes).
|
|
#
?
Aug 1, 2017 04:31
|
|
|
Oracle posted:I go into it more in my DNA post in the African-American Genealogy thread here but 'Western European' is probably as close to accurate as most people are going to get without a paper trail to back it up (never mind countries like France flat out banned DNA testing for recreational purposes). Thanks, that's a really interesting post. I'm definitely aware that W. Europeans are pretty much a hodgepodge, as you say, I'm not taking my whatever percentage of "Western European" DNA to mean granny slept with a Frenchman or anything like that. I've just upgraded to the Y37 test on FTDNA as my surname is really common and we can only get back to about 1800 on my paternal line before we hit a brick wall. I did the 12 and found my haplogroup was basically the most common one in Western Europe so I'm hoping narrowing it down a more specific segment will yield some results and if not then I'll just have to resign myself to having no clue where my particular instance of my surname came from.
|
|
#
?
Aug 2, 2017 14:00
|
|
|
Yeah Y-DNA testing is only as useful as the population that's tested that matches you. Sometimes you get lucky and some family line has tested a bajillion people and has extensive documentation and some retired professor or other that's dedicated his or her life to their hobby and is awesome at it. Join the family groups if you find a match. Check out some of those links in that post as to how you can use DNA to try and narrow down MCRAs. Its painstaking, time consuming work but it can bear fruit, especially if you upload to gedmatch/myheritage/anywhere that'll take your DNA and search for matches (ancestry has the biggest database so is the most likely place to find matches but they STILL don't have a drat chromosome matching tool so they're kind of useless for people who want to get into chromosome mapping to find matches).
|
|
#
?
Aug 2, 2017 15:13
|
|
|
Oh hey, speaking of the Y37 test... FTDNA Friends and Family sale is on! 20% off all tests including Y37, ancestry and mtDNA!
|
|
#
?
Aug 2, 2017 16:42
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 30, 2024 16:39 |
|
|
Oracle posted:One of the things you (and everyone else, including Ancestrys' loving ad department) need to realize is that that poo poo is by and large guesswork based on limited samples of current populations of said countries that have lived in the same spot back to at least their great-grandparents. So British, Irish, Scottish, Swedish, Western and Eastern European are to a great extent pretty drat interchangeable because of all the genetic drift from the various invasions, emi/immigration, wars etc etc. People got around a LOT back in the day, a lot more than people realize. I go into it more in my DNA post in the African-American Genealogy thread here but 'Western European' is probably as close to accurate as most people are going to get without a paper trail to back it up (never mind countries like France flat out banned DNA testing for recreational purposes). I had to explain this to my mother when she got my father's results back. "I expected to see more English!" she said, and I pointed out that 1) it was 13 generations ago and a lot of admixture is to be expected in the time since, 2) if her tree is right that "English" lineage were actually Norman, and thus back to the large percentage of Scandanavian haplotypes, and 3) northern Europe is a huge generic mixing bowl with plenty of gene flow in all directions. She had never heard of the Danelaw, for instance. Well, teachable moments Speaking of haplotypes, is there a site that lists which markers are being used for these various tests?
|
|
#
?
Aug 4, 2017 22:00
|
|