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OwlFancier posted:Or at least paint the faces and then stick the rest on mannequins. Dude. Mannequins don't just grow on trees.
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Aug 3, 2017 21:25
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https://arstechnica.com/science/2017/08/evidence-that-humans-had-farms-30000-years-earlier-than-previously-thought/ I've always thought we're going to find out urbanized civilization is much older than we believe it to be, I'm glad to see research being done and some preliminary evidence in that direction.
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Aug 4, 2017 05:03
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Grand Fromage posted:https://arstechnica.com/science/2017/08/evidence-that-humans-had-farms-30000-years-earlier-than-previously-thought/ Yeah, agriculture in the New World has always baffled me. It seemed to have arisen independently of but almost simultaneously with Old World agriculture. The coincidence was a bit too remarkable and has stuck in my craw. The notion that basic agricultural skills were widespread and were brought with them to the New World makes a lot more sense.
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Aug 4, 2017 05:16
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Deteriorata posted:Yeah, agriculture in the New World has always baffled me. It seemed to have arisen independently of but almost simultaneously with Old World agriculture. The coincidence was a bit too remarkable and has stuck in my craw. The explanation I've seen floated for the timing is that simply was when the climate had changed enough to make farming work, and that would have been a global phenomenon. But that would also fit with the idea that people already had the idea of agriculture from the tropics and were able to apply it to newly arable lands in places like the Fertile Crescent.
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Aug 4, 2017 06:15
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HEY GAIL posted:Everhard Kockman Mods, name change please.
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Aug 4, 2017 06:25
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Dalael posted:Saw this today. Thought some of you may be interested to read about it and who knows, maybe one of you has the required expertise/knowledge to assist. poo poo, the one time studying ancient Chinese would have gotten me more money than studying modern Chinese. Surprised they got so much translated, even common characters are extremely different from the oracle bone script. Kind of interested in how the process works, these are old enough the radicals might not have been standardized yet and in modern Chinese, you typically use two characters when writing words down, and the meaning of a character changed dramatically based on context.
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Aug 4, 2017 06:41
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Here's some racists being dumb about the ancient world. https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2017/06/19/classicist-finds-herself-target-online-threats-after-article-ancient-statues https://www.the-tls.co.uk/roman-britain-black-white/
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Aug 4, 2017 08:31
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Grand Fromage posted:https://arstechnica.com/science/2017/08/evidence-that-humans-had-farms-30000-years-earlier-than-previously-thought/ I wouldn't be surprised if stuff like Gobekli Tepe turns out to be an example of a highly developed religion similar to later known pantheons surrounding the agricultural cycle. Like sure you would have had people worshipping stuff in hopes of a good hunt where nobody gets trampled or in hopes of finding good food on forage, but once you set down roots and start growing stuff and domesticating animals you have a lot more things to pray for and start thanking various figures for.
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Aug 4, 2017 11:16
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Grand Fromage posted:Here's some racists being dumb about the ancient world. quote:While today’s scholars have accepted this as fact, she said, the general public is another story. Part of the problem is that most museums and art history textbooks continue to contain “a predominantly neon white display of skin tone when it comes to classical statues and sarcophagi.” Huh. You know, I never made that kind of connection, that the white statues meant the person depicted was supposed to be white.
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Aug 4, 2017 11:47
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Kassad posted:Huh. You know, I never made that kind of connection, that the white statues meant the person depicted was supposed to be white.
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Aug 4, 2017 11:55
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Kassad posted:Huh. You know, I never made that kind of connection, that the white statues meant the person depicted was supposed to be white.  (Scipio Africanus) and  (Lucius Junius Brutus, the guy who killed the last Roman king) would probably blow their dang minds. Sometimes you just make the statues with the material you feel is most artistically appropriate. Then of course you paint it a bunch of wild-rear end colors and in a thousand years some screwball goes around knocking the dicks off all your statues with a hammer and chisel. e: Also that bronze head of Augustus that got lopped off its body by raiders and buried under a staircase in Sudan: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mero%C3%AB_Head FAUXTON fucked around with this message at 12:00 on Aug 4, 2017 |
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Aug 4, 2017 11:58
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HEY GAIL posted:i think the idea goes back to Winckelmann, and whether we know it or not we still live in the world he made. Bond's original article about this is certainly enlightening, yes.
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Aug 4, 2017 12:03
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FAUXTON posted:
Only slightly related, but I think it's pretty loving cool that Romans traditionally had beards until Africanus came along, and after he became the savior of Rome the fashion became to shave for like the next 300 years. My mental image of Roman men is always of clean-shaven guys, and that's pretty much down to one guy (I think?) making it popular.
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Aug 4, 2017 13:12
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Hey guys, just as a quick thing but what is the name of the guy who does the really good History of Rome podcast?
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Aug 4, 2017 13:28
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Mike Duncan probs
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Aug 4, 2017 13:34
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Jerusalem posted:Only slightly related, but I think it's pretty loving cool that Romans traditionally had beards until Africanus came along, and after he became the savior of Rome the fashion became to shave for like the next 300 years. His long hair did not catch on though, cause that was just too much.
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Aug 4, 2017 13:43
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Josef bugman posted:Hey guys, just as a quick thing but what is the name of the guy who does the really good History of Rome podcast? Phobophilia posted:Mike Duncan probs Depends on if you mean past History of Rome podcast - in which case yes, Mike Duncan, currently doing Revolutions and with a book on pre-order about Rome now: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01N9ZJXZJ/ref=dp-kindle-redirect?_encoding=UTF8&btkr=1 - or the current Fall of Rome podcast - in which case, Patrick Wyman: https://fallofromepodcast.wordpress.com/
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Aug 4, 2017 15:21
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WoodrowSkillson posted:His long hair did not catch on though, cause that was just too much. I'm positive this is the REAL reason why he left Rome and basically put,"gently caress you Rome you ungrateful assholes" on his tombstone
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Aug 4, 2017 15:27
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I ran across a pretty well-made podcast called Tides of History. It seems to be similar to, say, Extra History but with a way better speaker and a deeper look at broader topics. I.e. instead of an event or entity, the guy's going over the birth of the state as a sociopolitical concept (as separate from, say, a kingdom)
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Aug 4, 2017 15:56
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FAUXTON posted:I ran across a pretty well-made podcast called Tides of History. It seems to be similar to, say, Extra History but with a way better speaker and a deeper look at broader topics. I.e. instead of an event or entity, the guy's going over the birth of the state as a sociopolitical concept (as separate from, say, a kingdom) That's Patrick Wyman - Tides of History is a spinoff or sequel to his Fall of Rome series. https://fallofromepodcast.wordpress.com/
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Aug 4, 2017 16:21
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Ugh it's just so horribly perfect that a famous economist chose to wade in against Mary Beard like he had any loving business arguing the history of Roman Britain with a Roman Britain expert. And he had the gall to say "I have more citations than you."
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Aug 4, 2017 17:17
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calling taleb a "famous economist" seems a bit generous imo
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Aug 4, 2017 17:44
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Non-historians seem to have a hard time imagining what a well-researched academic like Beard would know that the general public doesn't. Like, we understand that there are people who know more about mathematics or physics than you learn in high school, but the concept of knowing more about Roman history than a particularly curious freshman is a stumbling block.
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Aug 4, 2017 18:29
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Kellsterik posted:Non-historians seem to have a hard time imagining what a well-researched academic like Beard would know that the general public doesn't. Like, we understand that there are people who know more about mathematics or physics than you learn in high school, but the concept of knowing more about Roman history than a particularly curious freshman is a stumbling block. It's a classic Dunning-Kruger effect. Real historians know that everything is really complicated, that there's interrelated stuff going on simultaneously in multiple places, all influencing each other in unobvious ways - while an outsider thinks in terms of linear stories. They don't know enough to know how ignorant they are.
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Aug 4, 2017 18:35
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That's all true but in this case it just comes down to NNT being a jackass, he does this all the time with all kinds of fields
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Aug 4, 2017 18:39
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Hey Antiquity thread! I've got a question about coinage. Every roman/greek coin that I see seems beat to hell and not really round, like these: Is that the result of a thousand years of wear or were they just generally struck kind of irregularly? They're not even round! (quoting post below so I know where I was when I stopped reading in order and asked a question, please disregard)
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Aug 4, 2017 18:48
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The abnormal shape is mostly due to the fact that they were hand struck. They weren't punched out mechanically like we do now. You might also get what was known of as "clipping" where people would file of the edges of the coins. Imagine if you could shave half a cent of silver off a dime, spend the dime, and then grab your pile of silver shavings and cash that out as well. This is why later coinage started to have designs very close to the edge or, better yet, designs on the rim itself to make it obvious if a coin had been clipped.
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Aug 4, 2017 18:51
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It's a combination of wear and tear, clipping/shaving, and ancient mints not being perfect. As long as the weight was correct and the alloy was the correct purity (assuming you're in a state with exact standards for that) that was what mattered.
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Aug 4, 2017 18:51
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Cyrano4747 posted:This is why later coinage started to have designs very close to the edge or, better yet, designs on the rim itself to make it obvious if a coin had been clipped. This is why some coins like quarters have those ridges on the edge. I believe the Romans invented that but it may have been Greeks. Obviously for modern coins it's just decorative.
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Aug 4, 2017 18:53
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I believe for modern coins they're meant to be an aid for the visually-impaired as well.
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Aug 4, 2017 18:54
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i wanna make money off debasing some currency
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Aug 4, 2017 19:07
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HEY GAIL posted:i wanna make money off debasing some currency Let me guess, step two is investing in Bohemian real estate?
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Aug 4, 2017 19:13
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Jerusalem posted:Only slightly related, but I think it's pretty loving cool that Romans traditionally had beards until Africanus came along, and after he became the savior of Rome the fashion became to shave for like the next 300 years. Until one man brought it back - Romans became beardos again under Hadrian 
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Aug 4, 2017 19:18
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xthetenth posted:Let me guess, step two is investing in Bohemian real estate?
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Aug 4, 2017 19:21
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xthetenth posted:Let me guess, step two is investing in Bohemian real estate? We're in the ancient history thread, so I'm pretty sure step 2 is "debase it some more because we don't have the historical examples to understand inflation"
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Aug 4, 2017 19:28
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I'm sure they understood what inflation was. Political expediency trumped good sense time and time again tho.
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Aug 4, 2017 19:30
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I really liked reading The Black Swan. Seeing Taleb act this way is a big dissapointment.
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Aug 4, 2017 19:34
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Can someone give more info about this bit of Aurelian's reign? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aurelian#Felicissimus.27_rebellion_and_coinage_reform The revolt seems to have been caused by the fact that the mint workers, and Felicissimus first, were accustomed to stealing the silver for the coins and producing coins of inferior quality. Aurelian wanted to eliminate this, and put Felicissimus on trial.
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Aug 4, 2017 19:39
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euphronius posted:I'm sure they understood what inflation was. I'm reading a book about the early modern period right now and it repeatedly claims that the influx of spanish silver driving up prices was an unexpected consequence to people at the time (though they figured it out rapidly once it happened, but with the wrong economic explanation for why more silver = higher prices). Debased currency is a different form of inflation than an influx of wealth though, and one with a much much clearer cause and effect so I wouldn't be surprised if that one was much better understood.
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Aug 4, 2017 19:45
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euphronius posted:I'm sure they understood what inflation was. rulers had no clue about inflation for a startlingly long time. the intuitiveness of how money behaves to us is because we live under capitalism and the flow of money is very fast now, so its dynamics are more easily observed. they understood why debasing coinage was bad by framing it in terms of loss of precious metal content, and still did it anyway for political reasons, sure. but the idea that more currency could be bad in and of itself? not so much
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Aug 4, 2017 20:04
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