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I think the Jaggermech needs to get shots on the Glass Spider so it can TAC a Gauss and take it out of the fight. Fire downrange at the Stone Rhino next, obv. edit: I'm just an dumbass observer, though, so feel free to ignore me.
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Aug 3, 2017 14:11
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Jagermom
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Aug 3, 2017 14:14
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Xarbala posted:Jagermom And the lobbying to get Jagermom and Dadlas in the same scenario begins!
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Aug 3, 2017 15:03
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6 is minimum range for the Ha Otoko, not the range up to which it can't fire so 1435 is threatened by it. RA Rx fucked around with this message at 15:31 on Aug 3, 2017 |
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Aug 3, 2017 15:17
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Mukaikubo posted:South Group KnoxZone posted:Yeah, I am a fan of engaging the Glass Spider this turn. It has been sitting comfy in its little trench for long enough. As for the Hunchback, it is a bit risky, but I think it could move into the forest at 1435 and engage. It will be out of LoS on the Summoner, inside minimum range on the Otoko, the Spider will probably shoot one of us, and the Epona will probably have an easier target to the north. First, regarding summoner - he's to far away for my lasers, so I can't shoot at it this turn if I back off. I could shoot him if I advance, but only with the AC - and at to-hit of 9 or 10. I don't think this is a very good option. However, it works both ways - I could give him LOS on the basis that he will have bad numbers ; 10 on LL, 12 on ML. Can risk it. But it's not him I'm worried about - it's the glass spider (calling it now : enemy MVP is either the glass spider, or the stone rhino) ; if I run forward, his to-hit will be 6 at best (gunnery 3+move mod 2 +1 cover). If I go to 1435 he will have me on 7 - still bad, but I don't have better ways to engage safely - and I think we're not going to banzai just yet. (But if we do go banzai, the HO is in my short range, giving me either 4 or 5 at shooting.) Now, regarding our quarry - while you two can give LOS only to the GS and an epona, I can't engage without the HO seeing me. And while the HO is harder to hit, he ain't got cover. And I'll have better chance with my lasers. Of course, we could split - you two go for the GS, while I poke at the HO a bit. RA Rx posted:6 is minimum range for the Ha Otoko, not the range up to which it can't fire so 1435 is threatened by it. We're aware, but it's still means he's shooting at 9 (gunnery 3+ran 2+target move 1+woods 1+min range 2). And I don't have other options to engage. Defiance Industries posted:This is a company where the Second Succession War book sat in Randall's computer for months because he couldn't be bothered to put it online ?????
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Aug 3, 2017 15:23
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What about 3 or 5 hexes along the road, hugging the plateu while running 5 hexes (1612) you'll get +3 total, leg cover, HO range denial and be closer to long range enemies next round, potentially making them back off (which means the angle of the defillade is extended, perhaps to the forest patches a few hexes back). Also, medium lasers would be at short range. A bit closer to the nasty Stone Rhino too, but Clanner honor and multiple enemies (and short pulses) so it should be fine? Also, like, elbow drop or a charge, but these clanners probably won't do anything like that. Altho maybe denying minimum range to the HO means someone more dangerous fires at Isoroku's Hunchback instead... Edit: Yeah, that Glass Spider is a pain, you're probably right. It'd be very bad if it considered the Hunchback its target. RA Rx fucked around with this message at 16:03 on Aug 3, 2017 |
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Aug 3, 2017 15:33
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RA Rx posted:What about 3 or 5 hexes along the road, hugging the plateu while running 5 hexes (1612) you'll get +3 total, leg cover, HO range denial and be closer to long range enemies next round, potentially making them back off (which means the angle of the defillade is extended, perhaps to the forest patches a few hexes back). 1. I did mentioned it, and I made the same math - and while I don't have problem with charging, so far we played it safe - and I think we're still not going big yet. So it's a not the first option. 2. Number-wise, I'm more safe from the stone rhino if I charge, but even if I stay back he need 12 to hit me. He also got the cavalry in his face, so I'm not worried about him. In which we have a conversation in edits: quote:
'course, none of us is happy about tanking a pair of high-velocity slugs right now. Gun Jam fucked around with this message at 16:24 on Aug 3, 2017 |
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Aug 3, 2017 15:56
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@Northern Flank Specifically, Battlemaster and 'Hata', have we decided on a course of action? Are you both continuing south while I cover your advance (I'll engage the Stone Rhino, on my terms, not his), or, are we rolling the dice to try and take him down? RA Rx posted:. . . CourValant is not SD and has done nothing wrong either out of game (which is what really matters, and what was mostly the problem with SD) or even in-game, he's done well. Thank You.
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Aug 4, 2017 20:40
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For the Battlemaster I still think the best course is to engage the Epona at knife range in 1017 and try to ping it's head off of the Stone Rhino. Alpha MLas/SLas and sword on Epona, PPCs on Rhino. With the Hatamoto-Chi assisting and maybe secondary targeting the Stone Rhino with his PPCs. Alternatively I can move to 0919 as suggested, no sword play but I can still unload on the Epona. I'm about 50/50 on either choice. Moving to 1017 would make me primary for the Stone Rhino which may give the Sagittarius some options next turn to engage it but it would also mean advancing a whole 4 hexes south. 0919 is probably the best move I have.
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Aug 5, 2017 02:27
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Jew it to it! posted:0919 is probably the best move I have. Can I talk you into moving to 0617, facing 0618? This sets you up to keep running south with the 'Hata' next turn, while still being able to shoot at the Epona (and contingency on the Stone Rhino); 'Sag' will jump to 0718 and shoot at the Epona (contingency on the Stone Rhino), which should hopefully make me the primary target while you make a break for it down south. If you are insistent on moving to 0919, 'Sag' will jump to 0818 and shoot at the Epona (contingency on the Stone Rhino), with the understanding that next turn, I'm running in for the long anticipated date with my Clanner admirer.
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Aug 5, 2017 03:44
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I can get to 0817 and assist from there. I can't fire everything due to heat, though. Do you want me to focus completely on the Epona or try to hit the Stone Rhino with one PPC? Either way the PPC is a long shot, I'm firing on 10 at either target.
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Aug 5, 2017 03:57
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Yakumo posted:I can get to 0817 and assist from there. I can't fire everything due to heat, though. Do you want me to focus completely on the Epona or try to hit the Stone Rhino with one PPC? Either way the PPC is a long shot, I'm firing on 10 at either target. I'd say fire at the Epona, contingency on the Stone Rhino. If we can take down the Vee, 'Sag' can duel/stalk the Stone Rhino relatively safely, and Hata' / 'Battlemaster can make that run down south with a relatively clear middle field.
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Aug 5, 2017 04:02
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CourValant posted:Can I talk you into moving to 0617, facing 0618? This sets you up to keep running south with the 'Hata' next turn, while still being able to shoot at the Epona (and contingency on the Stone Rhino); 'Sag' will jump to 0718 and shoot at the Epona (contingency on the Stone Rhino), which should hopefully make me the primary target while you make a break for it down south. I had considered 0617 facing 0718, however I believe that H5 would block LOS on the Stone Rhino so I wanted to try and hit both targets if possible. Its one advantage is that the following turn I could move to 1120 facing 1121 the following turn, and allowing me to send more fire down south. We could split the difference with the Battlemaster advancing to 0819/0820, torso twist and unload on Epona/Rhino secondary.
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Aug 5, 2017 04:09
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Jew it to it! posted:I had considered 0617 facing 0718, however I believe that H5 would block LOS on the Stone Rhino so I wanted to try and hit both targets if possible. Its one advantage is that the following turn I could move to 1120 facing 1121 the following turn, and allowing me to send more fire down south. Unless I'm counting it wrong, you don't have the move to face 0718, only 0618. Also, I want to hide the Battlemaster from the Stone Rhino so you don't take any more damage. Jew it to it! posted:We could split the difference with the Battlemaster advancing to 0819/0820, torso twist and unload on Epona/Rhino secondary. 0819 is a rubble hex (unless PTN isn't using rough terrain), so it takes 2 hexes to enter, and you wouldn't have the move to turn and bring most of your weapons to bear on the Epona (you'd still be able to unload on the Stone Rhino though). Just out of curiosity, is there any reason why you'd want to push down the middle instead of doglegging to the west of the dropship? The terrain is clearer down that west side, you can move 'faster', and only have to fight through the Summoner to rendezvous with the Primary?
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Aug 5, 2017 04:22
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CourValant posted:Just out of curiosity, is there any reason why you'd want to push down the middle instead of doglegging to the west of the dropship? The terrain is clearer down that west side, you can move 'faster', and only have to fight through the Summoner to rendezvous with the Primary?
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Aug 5, 2017 04:51
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Ardlen posted:It looks like the Hunchback is moving east, so moving west away from the battle might not be the best idea. Moving south or southeast makes more sense. Indeed, now may be a good time for that North South coordination. @Southern Flank Would you prefer the Northern Elements try to punch through down the middle, or would you be interested in coming back around the west side for the rendezvous? Guess the question is would you prefer to withdraw and do more hiding around the H6 tank, or keep pushing out East and take down the remaining OPFOR?
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Aug 5, 2017 05:08
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Mauler could accomplish the secondary objective, with some luck against three enemy units. The Epona is damaged. The Gargoyle is damaged, with legs that can take 1-2 kicks, with an MP of 3, it can be outmaneuvered for kicks. If the Balius is alone it might just leave, granting a secondary objective, if it stays its short range armaments can possibly be outmaneuvered (bit tight in the docks though), or it might also fail a kick duel given it's a quad, unless the Mauler is too damaged. --- The H6 tank has become a potential future risk sadly, so southern group is moving out somewhat this round. Is there a Google Doc with order planning? I could make a map of stated intents. Someone did that in the Nergal Reactor mission I played when I asked. Hmm, also note noone has missed orders so far this mission IIRC, that's actually rare. RA Rx fucked around with this message at 06:13 on Aug 5, 2017 |
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Aug 5, 2017 05:42
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RA Rx posted:Mauler could accomplish the secondary objective, with some luck against three enemy units. I've made a (terrible) Google doc for orders and a map showing movement for the northern lance so far. They can be accessed below: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1w5wn-Oe7Uov7eFlSJFJPIQRANqzG8OxH2RXbIo-nYsw/edit?usp=sharing https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8xkHBgwALZ8OS1wdWR5ODV0QU0/view?usp=sharing Ninurta fucked around with this message at 06:58 on Aug 5, 2017 |
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Aug 5, 2017 06:43
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Jew it to it! posted:https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1w5wn-Oe7Uov7eFlSJFJPIQRANqzG8OxH2RXbIo-nYsw/edit#gid=0 Says I need to request access?
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Aug 5, 2017 06:52
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CourValant posted:Says I need to request access? Try now, phoneposting so it may not have added the correct link the first time.
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Aug 5, 2017 06:59
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Jew it to it! posted:Try now, phoneposting so it may not have added the correct link the first time. I'm in, it worked, thanks. If we're pushing down the center, then 'Sag' will support as previously discussed; jumping to 0818, facing 0918, shooting at the Epona (contingency on the Stone Rhino). Captain Dupont will say on the lance frequency, "Your Majesty, looks like its finally time to get serious."
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Aug 5, 2017 07:20
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Southern Crew: My tentative plan is to run to 0633 and shoot at the Glass Spider. Maybe if we pressure it enough it will be forced to abandon its position (or the Jager just murders it, either way). If you guys want to do something else I will roll with it, but I am gonna be out of town for the entire day so I won't be around for any discussion.
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Aug 5, 2017 10:56
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If the Naginata goes west and the Hunchback goes east then Isoroku will be two rounds from anyone else and facing two mechs and potentially a tank, if they break Zell. Assuming the Jager doesn't fight the Summoner this round it will probably fire on the southern storage tank. Linking up again will probably be suicide as a third round of fire will be likely to explode the tank and greatly damage or kill the mechs next to it. Of course, on the off-chance a second round of fire destroys it the linking up west or east would cost either the Hunchback and the mission or the Naginata, but the writing seems to indicate it has a bit to go. RA Rx fucked around with this message at 13:56 on Aug 5, 2017 |
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Aug 5, 2017 12:20
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Right, so unless we banzai, I'm going to 1435, and shoot either the spider or the HO - no special preference.KnoxZone posted:Southern Crew: My tentative plan is to run to 0633 and shoot at the Glass Spider. Maybe if we pressure it enough it will be forced to abandon its position (or the Jager just murders it, either way). If you guys want to do something else I will roll with it, but I am gonna be out of town for the entire day so I won't be around for any discussion. So - focus fire on the Glass spider?
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Aug 5, 2017 12:52
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Gun Jam posted:Right, so unless we banzai, I'm going to 1435, and shoot either the spider or the HO - no special preference. My orders were to move to move to 0434 and fire at the Glass Spider. Again if you move out there, you are in view of a very large number of enemies and there is no realistic way either of the other two southern mechs can get to you to support you. If you go down then it is a failed mission, remember. We are all slow and putting yourself eight hexes and a large solid building away from your supports is a painful decision, even though I understand you want to get some more hits in. You can only turn around to face NE, meaning that you will realistically not be able to retreat back to us if and when you get pressed. (From 1435 facing 1535, the best you can do is either to get to 1234 facing SE if you back up, or 1135 facing 1035 and showing your rear to anyone chasing you. It is an extremely, extremely high risk move. It is your move, but I want to be sure you understand the implications. Given your move, it may be a better idea for me to not fire at all, and instead sprint down to 0635 so at least I can sprint to 1035 next turn and hope to offer myself as a sacrificial lamb with no good firing arcs on anyone next turn.
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Aug 5, 2017 13:48
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RA Rx posted:Mauler could accomplish the secondary objective, with some luck against three enemy units. That's the hope at this point. I'm planning to stick where I am and unload into the Balius this turn. Hopefully the dice will be kind to me!
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Aug 5, 2017 13:56
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Here's hoping for a quick leg TAC! Setting fire to the smoke might also be helpful, depending on the size of the cloud (if it's just the neighboring hexes that puts the mechs too close to the storage tank). Probably either the Naginata or the Hunchback should follow the other. RA Rx fucked around with this message at 16:43 on Aug 5, 2017 |
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Aug 5, 2017 14:09
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Mukaikubo posted:My orders were to move to move to 0434 and fire at the Glass Spider. Well, there is a way - Naginata to 1234. Problem is, we're just changing who's the one left alone from me to you. And regarding the risk - I know, but the only way it will be safer for me to engage is after they will take casualties - we can't assume they will decide to close the distance. And finding a spot to hide under and staying there 'till the noise stops is not very fun - I prefer to take a calculated risk then just resigning myself to be useless escort target. I mean, what are my other options? Go to 1035 or 0935 and keep hiding until something? Calculated, because the Glass spider got better shots on both of you than me, and the HO+Epona Shoots me at 9. I'm not out of it yet. Also, re - you going 0635 - I think it's better to just shoot em.
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Aug 5, 2017 14:36
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Kickass Harpsichord posted:That's the hope at this point. I'm planning to stick where I am and unload into the Balius this turn. Hopefully the dice will be kind to me! OR AAAAA! Real Muenster fucked around with this message at 14:49 on Aug 5, 2017 |
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Aug 5, 2017 14:42
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AAAAA! Real Muenster posted:Wouldnt that subject you to a staggering amount of firepower from the Balius and give you terrible Minimum Range penalties? You could walk backwards to 0908 to get out of range of the Balius's Heavy Small Lasers and reduce your Minimum Range penalties for your Light ACs and give him a movement mod to hit you. Oh and pray that the honor Zell... Yeah, I'm just not in a great position, and I'm going to take some punishment no matter what I do. I had considered withdrawing, but then it's very easy for the OpFor to surround me on the following turns and exposes me to the Gargoyle's fire as well. At least I out-weight and out-kick the Balius, and also, because of the new minimum range rules in effect, I suffer decreased penalties to hit due to minimum range. We'll see what happens.
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Aug 5, 2017 16:49
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Kickass Harpsichord posted:Yeah, I'm just not in a great position, and I'm going to take some punishment no matter what I do. I had considered withdrawing, but then it's very easy for the OpFor to surround me on the following turns and exposes me to the Gargoyle's fire as well. At least I out-weight and out-kick the Balius, and also, because of the new minimum range rules in effect, I suffer decreased penalties to hit due to minimum range. We'll see what happens.
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Aug 5, 2017 16:51
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[madden mode: ON] "Now, now right now Al, I'll tell you what: you can really tell how frustrated the defense is, and it's kinda a thing you can feel in the stands, too. When you've got an offense that's running a real patient game, eating up the clock, you're gonna force mistakes and take the crowd out of the game. Sometimes though the opposite happens and they get a little rowdy. Either way, uh, the offense still needs to keep executing in order to take advantage here, and there's a couple ways they can do that." "I do, uh, I really want to mention how brave that Mauler is playing right now, that's some real, gutsy, old-time football right there. Sometimes to win games, guys have got to sacrifice their bodies and let other players make the big plays, and that's what he's doing right now. I think he's got more options than he thinks he does - he's lookin' for that big block, but maybe if he backs off into that little gap in the berm it gives him room to set up a one-on-one block with someone next turn. The longer he can tie up those three up north, keep them from getting back into the play, the better off the rest of the team is. When you can keep one guy blocking three guys for a long time, well, that opens up a lot of holes, I'll tell you that much." "The rushing attack is starting to get going, which is always good to see, that's really how you have to set up your offense to win in the National Football League. If you can't run the ball at all, it makes it harder to get the passing game going. I think it is gonna be real key to choose positioning and firing well right now, at this late in the game, every shot and every number counts. It's the little things when you execute - walking instead of jumping so your shots land better, target prioritization, that kind of thing - that's what separates the playmakers from everyone else. There's a couple nasty units in the way, you got that big middle linebacker there, and you got a little waterbug corner, he's one of the best in the business, but all they gotta do is get through them." "Down south, they need to just find ways to take some safe shots downfield with pass protection, while also buying time. There are a lot of ways to do that, not all of them are great, but they're there; it's just a matter of keeping their playmakers fresh for the fourth quarter and not taking any bad injuries." "You know, Al, sometimes in situations like this, especially with the defense disorganized, some coaches might like to go with some kind of trick play. That Hunchback does have some spots where if he fakes a fumble and goes prone, no one would be able to shoot him because of that raised platform. Then he can pop back up with the ball and either pull something sneaky next turn or hide again if the defense lets it happen. It'd be, uh, kind of like that one they do in the NCAA sometimes, a Fumblerooski. I don't know if it's their best bet or not, but it could buy them the extra time they need." [madden mode: OFF]
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Aug 5, 2017 18:20
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Gun Jam posted:Right, so unless we banzai, I'm going to 1435, and shoot either the spider or the HO - no special preference. Gun Jam posted:. . . finding a spot to hide under and staying there 'till the noise stops is not very fun - I prefer to take a calculated risk then just resigning myself to be useless escort target. I mean, what are my other options? Please don't run out into the middle of the OPFOR? I know its not 'fun', however, as others have said, if you get destroyed, that's mission failure. So really, you're the most important unit on the field; please don't think of yourself as a 'useless' escort target. You have to survive; 'The King must not risk himself in Battle'. Have you considered trading places with the Naginata, then heading back over to the H12 next for more LOS hi-jinx? Stay close to your escorts, let them take the risks; your lance-mates seem to be very willing to do so. And, the Northern Elements are only a few turns away from fully engaging in the South, help us to engage. Kickass Harpsichord posted:Yeah, I'm just not in a great position, and I'm going to take some punishment no matter what I do. I had considered withdrawing, but then it's very easy for the OpFor to surround me on the following turns and exposes me to the Gargoyle's fire as well. Like this idea; isolate and take them on 1 vs. 1. Kickass Harpsichord posted:At least I out-weight and out-kick the Balius, and also, because of the new minimum range rules in effect, I suffer decreased penalties to hit due to minimum range. We'll see what happens. I think the Mauler is more capable then we might think in CQB, minimum range and all (that kick's gonna be great); my money's on the Mauler over the Balius. Fraction Jackson posted:. . . It's the little things when you execute - walking instead of jumping so your shots land better . . . I know Coach, I know; sometimes its the only way I can get the facing right though.
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Aug 5, 2017 18:53
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Mukaikubo posted:If you go down then it is a failed mission No it isn't. It's not even a failed objective. This mission's objectives do not hinge on the survival of any particular `Mech or Mechwarrior. Edit: I have to kill the entire southern lance to render that objective unwinnable, and you still have the refinery objective. I won't tell you what percentage of damaged buildings results in a failure there, but I will say I don't have to take potshots at every building on the map. The one that looks like Aku is probably safe. PoptartsNinja fucked around with this message at 19:05 on Aug 5, 2017 |
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Aug 5, 2017 18:57
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PoptartsNinja posted:No it isn't. It's not even a failed objective. This mission's objectives do not hinge on the survival of any particular `Mech or Mechwarrior. That definitely changes some things. (I definitely interpreted it as Isoroku himself and not just his lance.) That opens up a lot more options for the South lance if they want 'em, although trying not to sell the HBK too cheaply is probably still a good idea.
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Aug 5, 2017 19:14
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Little do you know the real reason your dropship left is it's now off flying around to pick up speed so it can come in low and slam into the ground so it slides along and snowplows through every building that's an objective on the map. The pilot has been hitting the bottle pretty hard lately, but Hanse is too much of a nice guy to fire him.
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Aug 5, 2017 19:41
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PoptartsNinja posted:No it isn't. It's not even a failed objective. This mission's objectives do not hinge on the survival of any particular `Mech or Mechwarrior. Feeling way less guilty now. Orders in - 1435, giving glass spider a broadside.
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Aug 5, 2017 21:27
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Gun Jam posted:Feeling way less guilty now. If there's ever a mission where it's vital that a single unit survive, that unit will be an NPC so nobody can get mad at anyone but me for kamikaze-charging it into the enemy.
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Aug 5, 2017 22:03
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CourValant posted:I'm in, it worked, thanks. If we're pushing down the center, then 'Sag' will support as previously discussed; jumping to 0818, facing 0918, shooting at the Epona (contingency on the Stone Rhino). You can do that same move with run MP if you want better shots. You'll also have better shots against you but I believe PTN said he's not going to tend to focus fire so up to you if it's worth it. Hatamoto-Chi will be moving to 0817, firing on the Epona with contingency for the Stone Rhino.
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Aug 5, 2017 22:24
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Fraction Jackson posted:That definitely changes some things. (I definitely interpreted it as Isoroku himself and not just his lance.) That opens up a lot more options for the South lance if they want 'em, although trying not to sell the HBK too cheaply is probably still a good idea. Aside from PTN never hanging a mission's outcome on a single player, consider this: a desperate broadcast of BattleRoms of Hanse Davion and Isoroku Kurita standing back-to-back against the Clans, on Luthien, defiant to the last. Now what message would that send to the slowly integrating military forces of the DracSun alliance? Also would be one hell of a political vote I think.
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Aug 5, 2017 23:07
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