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Guest2553
Aug 3, 2012


monster on a stick posted:

Maybe we can expand the thread to making fun of people who can't read

Well, illiteracy strongly correlates to innumeracy soooo
:goonsay:

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curufinor
Apr 4, 2016

by Smythe

monster on a stick posted:

Maybe we can expand the thread to making fun of people who can't read

we're at page 132
it's been like 3 months since the op

Hoodwinker
Nov 7, 2005

curufinor posted:

we're at page 132
it's been like 3 months since the op
And not a lot has changed, really.

Vox Nihili
May 28, 2008
Woooo doggy,this guy is looking worse and worse.

monster on a stick posted:

On life with a negative net worth (self.personalfinance)

submitted 2 hours ago by WhiteWaterLawyer

I have a significantly negative net worth, mostly from student loans on my professional degree.

I feel like common financial wisdom is to live like a monk until debt free. But is that really necessary?

I keep a detailed spreadsheet about my finances and projections range from depressing to great depending on the huge variable that is my income. The legal job market has been pretty bad the last few years and so far I've made less per year in the four years since law school than I did in the four years before it. Part of my debt is from definitely living beyond my means in that time; I had acclimated to a certain lifestyle before school and didn't downgrade it until recently when the reality of being a poor lawyer finally sank in.

Now I've finally gotten a job with a decent pay scale and a good workload, and I'm looking at my income increasing significantly. My income is finally "stable" on a draw salary and based on the trend so far it's looking like my income will be five figures monthly by early spring.

My plan is to aggressively attack debt, but I am also planning a few purchases that might seem indulgent. Is it necessarily wrong for me to spend some of my income on comfort while still in the early stages of debt elimination?

The planned indulgence is a custom RV that I will use as a mobile office and to promote my business. I travel a lot because of both work and my hobbies (whitewater and law) and an appropriate vehicle would make that travel a lot more comfortable, but is undeniably a big chunk of change. I view the purchase as part of my early retirement plan as I will definitely be spending much more time in it once I get to true financial independence. With the RV and conservative projections of my income (August has already blown past the conservative projections by almost double) I would reach my definition of retirement 11 years from now; without the RV I could do it in ten. The RV would delay the debt-free (except student loans which I am leaning toward staying on IBR with) timeline from 18 months to 2 years. I am comfortable with that tradeoff because while I am getting better at deferring gratification, I am tired of being poor.

Am I wrong to think like this, or is this an acceptable part of coming up with my own individual plan?

Income is projected in the range of $8k to $20k per month. It varies because it's all contingent fees and any given case has a 50-50-ish chance of winning or losing. The average fee on a win is $6k to the firm of which I keep $4k. I complete on average 2 cases a week. So assuming a conservative win rate of 50% (my actual win rate historically is around 70%) and a conservative pace of 1 case a week (my average so far at this firm has been 2 a week) a reasonable projection would be $8k per month.

8k/mo=96k/yr=~$58k/yr post-tax, $4800 a month post-tax.
Additional income $1050 a month government pension
Health care is covered by the VA
So net take home is $5850 a month average (but likely more than that).

Current debt situation:

Student loans around $160k, in IBR with current payments at $200 a month expected to jump to $1500 a month in 2020 (IBR is recalculated on tax returns every 2 years; it was just done this spring and the next recalculation will likely show the higher income)
Car $20k bal paying $550/mo (would be traded toward the van)
House $35k bal paying $320/mo
2 credit cards carrying balances since law school, $11,000, paying $300/mo
Non-debt monthly expenses total about $1100 a month:
$300 travel related (some reimbursed, some not)
$200 utilities
$200 insurance
$100 property taxes
$300 food

Interestingly I know that I could easily get by on just the military pension at this point if I wanted to simply by defaulting on my debts, of course I don't consider that an option and I prefer to work to live a slightly more comfortable life than one right on the poverty line. That helps me stay motivated, knowing I'm working not for survival but for a better life and to keep my promises.

So with the current job I could be applying up to $4750 per month to the debt without the van. I'm currently leaning toward financing the van and I'm plotting to spend around $700 a month on it, which leaves me $4000 a month to whack debt.
I've plotted my spreadsheet with $3000-$3500 per month going toward debt because I like to be conservative. I use a very simple sheet that just calculates interest and payment month-by-month, it's a pretty big table. At $3500 a month I'm debt-free except student loans and the van by the end of 2020, assuming I buy the van next May which is really the earliest time that I would feel safe doing it - I want to bank at least two full months income aside from debt payments before adding another major purchase.

At that point there would still be about half of the van balance left along with most of the student loan balances... the destruction of those does look a little less optimistic. My spreadsheet is showing it all the way out to 2027 if I stay at $3500 a month all the way out and never increase it. My current thought it to start saving when I get down to just student loans, given the uncertainty about their future - specifically, whenever I do stop working, I could put them back into IBR and stop making payments on them, which makes me question the wisdom of devoting great resources to paying them down. I'm curious what leanfire's take on that approach is. I'm kinda planning to just start saving aggressively while still making the minimums on the student loans, depending on what the payment rate is under IBR at that time; it's possible that my income spikes high enough that I don't get any discount from IBR at all anymore.

This is also where I get into uncomfortable territory with projections. I don't like counting on increases. This is the first time I've ever included a "raise" in my budget and the only reason I'm even thinking like this is that the money is already on the "accounts receivable" ledger at a rate far in excess of my wildest expectations. I earned (my share) $6500 this week. I don't expect that to be a typical week at all, but if it were I'd be able to attack debt at a rate of over $10,000 a month. Realistically I have to call that an overambitious goal; I don't have the personal capacity to sustain such a pace without hiring an assistant which I guess would probably cost me at least $35,000 a year, but even after that I'd still be doubling my current projections to attack debt. I don't want to "get my hopes up" by even running the numbers in that scenario.

You are all probably right that I should hold off on such a large purchase, especially financing it. However I am pretty sure that this is something important to me and I don't mind working a little extra for it. I will probably explore alternative approaches to find the most prudent way to accomplish my actual goal. I spend a lot of time in /r/vandwellers reading their ideas and the like, there's a little bit of overlap between these two subs but clearly not that much. One key difference I have with most vandwellers is that I have a "serious" job I have to get back to by Tuesday of most weekends, so I don't have the option of buying a 20 year old rustbucket for $1500 and just hoping that I'm not too far from a mechanic when the transmission goes. I actually need the reliability of a new/er vehicle regardless of whether it's my current station wagon or my future van.

EIDE Van Hagar
Dec 8, 2000

Beep Boop
Would be fun to have a 4wd sprinter van done up like a Paris to Dakar rally vehicle for camping though.

greazeball
Feb 4, 2003



/r/vandwellers

:barf:

Enfys
Feb 17, 2013

The ocean is calling and I must go

He's planning on trading in his car, so he's just going to rock up to the office and to court in his van-home I guess?

If he had much self-insight, he would realise that his massive over the top detailed justification on why buying an RV is perfectly great and in line with his early retirement plans despite his large debt load is just a new avenue for his previous spending problem. You don't go from living beyond your means and carrying consumer debt since law school to a van-dwelling early retirement guru overnight. He likes spending money, but now he's tracking his expenses and not spending money the way he used to. He's looking to scratch that spending money instant gratification itch by making a massive purchase and justifying as some kind of 180 lifestyle change.

Cognitive dissonance 101: he wants to save money to retire early but also has a habit of spending money. Justify spending money with crazy rambling magic numbers and presto, spending a huge amount of money doesn't conflict with his desire to save and retire early.

Leon Trotsky 2012
Aug 27, 2009

YOU CAN TRUST ME!*


*Israeli Government-affiliated poster

Enfys posted:

He's planning on trading in his car, so he's just going to rock up to the office and to court in his van-home I guess?

If he had much self-insight, he would realise that his massive over the top detailed justification on why buying an RV is perfectly great and in line with his early retirement plans despite his large debt load is just a new avenue for his previous spending problem. You don't go from living beyond your means and carrying consumer debt since law school to a van-dwelling early retirement guru overnight. He likes spending money, but now he's tracking his expenses and not spending money the way he used to. He's looking to scratch that spending money instant gratification itch by making a massive purchase and justifying as some kind of 180 lifestyle change.

Cognitive dissonance 101: he wants to save money to retire early but also has a habit of spending money. Justify spending money with crazy rambling magic numbers and presto, spending a huge amount of money doesn't conflict with his desire to save and retire early.

Slo-Mo syndrome.

Dik Hz
Feb 22, 2004

Fun with Science

Enfys posted:

He's planning on trading in his car, so he's just going to rock up to the office and to court in his van-home I guess?
Most clients are probably going to be put off by an attorney that lives out of a van. Also, I think the firm would be less than happy to find an RV/van advertising one of their attorneys in their parking lot every day.

Also, I wanted to say that a 70% win rate in contested proceedings is bullshit. Either the firm is giving him softballs to get him started, he's cherry picking cases, or he's just gotten lucky so far. Cherry picking only works when the economy is good. So no matter what, he's due for a correction. Also, if the true rate is 50-50 like he claims, then he could just as easily go 30% win rate for a sustained period due to variance and low sample size. Binomial probability says that if he does 2 cases a week for 10 years, there's a better than 90% chance he'll have a month with no income in that time period.

Ghost Leviathan
Mar 2, 2017

Exploration is ill-advised.
Could own it, be The Wandering Attorney, going where'er the cases are and loyally following your client all the way to DC if necessary.

Sic Semper Goon
Mar 1, 2015

Eu tu?

:zaurg:

Switchblade Switcharoo

Inescapable Duck posted:

Could own it, be The Wandering Attorney, going where'er the cases are and loyally following your client all the way to DC if necessary.

Worked for this guy:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Lincoln_Lawyer_(film)

(Yes, I know it's fictional.)

Krispy Wafer
Jul 26, 2002

I shouted out "Free the exposed 67"
But they stood on my hair and told me I was fat

Grimey Drawer
[quote="“Inescapable Duck”" post="“475087913”"]
Could own it, be The Wandering Attorney, going where’er the cases are and loyally following your client all the way to DC if necessary.
[/quote]

Lawyers need a gimmick or a catchy phrase. We’ve got one who calls himself the ‘bald lawyer’. Like that’s his whole advertising campaign is ‘Call the Bald Lawyer!’ We’ve got another one whose billboards show him with tattoos, a Black sidesick, and a hot woman.

Van Lawyer! Call now. Yo hablo Españo.

Leon Trotsky 2012
Aug 27, 2009

YOU CAN TRUST ME!*


*Israeli Government-affiliated poster
I am Ronin (Esq.)

I have no master.

Except your case! Call 1-800-HURT-JOB

EIDE Van Hagar
Dec 8, 2000

Beep Boop
People still hire this guy in austin, in spite of his billboard.



Living in a van would only be like the 4th weirdest attorney I can think of.

BENGHAZI 2
Oct 13, 2007

by Cyrano4747
I'm Jim THE HAMMER Shapiro! I cannot rip out the hearts of those whove harmed you! I cannot hand you their severed heads! I can run them over in my van slash house though!

Those middle two lines are actually things he said in commercials. Jim THE HAMMER Shapiro and his phone number are burned into my brain forever

monster on a stick
Apr 29, 2013
Jim THE HAMMER Shapiro sounds like he defends ME, not the evil blah blah blah

https://www.reddit.com/r/personalfinance/comments/6rwzyk/just_lost_around_60k_which_is_now_worth_100k_due/ posted:

Just lost around 60k which is now worth 100k due to inflation of the stock

Ok so the other day i lost some 60k usd gambling like a loving idiot,

I told 2 of my friends to invest in a crypto and i sold that to try recoop my loses and now that share has nearly doubled, so basically to buy back there crypto its around 40k the rest is mine which i dont really care about because i deserve it i just need a plan to get back those shares and if i should tell them or not

Just to clarify, he convinced two friends to invest in crypto, then used that money to gamble, which he promptly lost. Then the crypto ended up doing well so now he owes his friends money he doesn't have.

Subjunctive
Sep 12, 2006

✨sparkle and shine✨

monster on a stick posted:

convinced two friends to invest in crypto, then used that money to gamble

Seems like he kept up his end of the bargain.

monster on a stick
Apr 29, 2013

Subjunctive posted:

Seems like he kept up his end of the bargain.

I don't see why he doesn't just go tell his friends "look at all the money you made, now get your friends/family to send me money to invest in bitcoin" then use that money to pay his friends back.

Power of Pecota
Aug 4, 2007

Goodness no, now that wouldn't do at all!

BENGHAZI 2 posted:

I'm Jim THE HAMMER Shapiro! I cannot rip out the hearts of those whove harmed you! I cannot hand you their severed heads! I can run them over in my van slash house though!

Those middle two lines are actually things he said in commercials. Jim THE HAMMER Shapiro and his phone number are burned into my brain forever

Holy poo poo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q5hn8bhEpMY

curufinor
Apr 4, 2016

by Smythe
how are you even supposed to say SFYL if the marks know you, hmm

Foma
Oct 1, 2004
Hello, My name is Lip Synch. Right now, I'm making a post that is anti-bush or something Micheal Moore would be proud of because I and the rest of my team lefty friends (koba1t included) need something to circle jerk to.

got nothing on Texas
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HL3MxAH-kDI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lj7uW1c42YY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GmZiqwRnwtM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zJCH1gk3D8s

Mr. World
May 6, 2007
Working undercover for the man . . .

C.H.O.M.E posted:

People still hire this guy in austin, in spite of his billboard.



Living in a van would only be like the 4th weirdest attorney I can think of.

Not only is Komie not that great an attorney, his band is also pretty terrible.

Ashcans
Jan 2, 2006

Let's do the space-time warp again!

That's why he still has his day job.

BENGHAZI 2
Oct 13, 2007

by Cyrano4747

Yeah he was apparently regional as gently caress so only kids who grew up in the 90s in like Syracuse or buffalo know about him but he was a TREASURE

LLCoolJD
Dec 8, 2007

Musk threatens the inorganic promotion of left-wing ideology that had been taking place on the platform

Block me for being an unironic DeSantis fan, too!

C.H.O.M.E posted:

People still hire this guy in austin, in spite of his billboard.



Battlefield Earth sucked.

Hot Dog Day #91
Jun 19, 2003

Just going to point out that a 70% win rate in contested cases is actually low, assuming these are PI contingency fee cases. You cherry pick every single case and you seek 99% of them at a level that makes you money. PI lawyers aren't doing it to fight the man, they're doing it to make money. Moral victories don't pay the bills.

Shame Boy
Mar 2, 2010

BENGHAZI 2 posted:

Yeah he was apparently regional as gently caress so only kids who grew up in the 90s in like Syracuse or buffalo know about him but he was a TREASURE

I had family in Rochester and visited all the time and don't remember seeing this guy and now I feel ripped off because he's something :allears:

EIDE Van Hagar
Dec 8, 2000

Beep Boop

Mr. World posted:

Not only is Komie not that great an attorney, his band is also pretty terrible.

Which venue do I need to go to to see this band

SpelledBackwards
Jan 7, 2001

I found this image on the Internet, perhaps you've heard of it? It's been around for a while I hear.

ate all the Oreos posted:

I had family in Rochester and visited all the time and don't remember seeing this guy and now I feel ripped off because he's something :allears:

HAVE YOU OR A LOVED ONE BEEN PREVIOUSLY RIPPED OFF IN YOUR CHILDHOOD? CALL JIM "THE HAMMER" SHAPIRO TODAY!

BENGHAZI 2
Oct 13, 2007

by Cyrano4747

SpelledBackwards posted:

HAVE YOU OR A LOVED ONE BEEN PREVIOUSLY RIPPED OFF IN YOUR CHILDHOOD? CALL JIM "THE HAMMER" SHAPIRO TODAY!

He no longer practices law in new York, he may in Florida still but iirc he just writes books now

Dik Hz
Feb 22, 2004

Fun with Science

Hot Dog Day #91 posted:

Just going to point out that a 70% win rate in contested cases is actually low, assuming these are PI contingency fee cases. You cherry pick every single case and you seek 99% of them at a level that makes you money. PI lawyers aren't doing it to fight the man, they're doing it to make money. Moral victories don't pay the bills.
If your win rate is 70% and you only settle one case a week, you're not taking enough cases. All PI clients shop around a ton. I'm not sure that dude is PI, though.

Vargatron
Apr 19, 2008

MRAZZLE DAZZLE


C.H.O.M.E posted:

People still hire this guy in austin, in spite of his billboard.



Living in a van would only be like the 4th weirdest attorney I can think of.

When did Rob Zombie start practicing law?

Devian666
Aug 20, 2008

Take some advice Chris.

Fun Shoe
BWM, stupid with money and national news bad with money.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/95482996/hamilton-couple-hit-with-50000-bill-from-finance-company

quote:

The large home in rural Tamahere, on the outskirts of Hamilton, was repossessed by FM Custodians Ltd in August 2015, while the occupiers - Robert Hoani Clifford Cribb and Karen Lynne Stevens - were in Europe. Cribb and Stevens failed to give FM Custodians an address to shift their house full of furniture to, so FM Custodians packed it up into five containers and stored it with a local removal company. Eighteen months later, when Cribb and Stevens sprung their possessions from Allied Pickford, they refused to pay the $50,000-plus for the removal and storage costs.

"The defendants chose not to provide a delivery address for 18 months and cannot now complain that the extensive costs incurred by the plaintiff were not properly incurred," Justice Mark Woolford said in his ruling.

Although Cribb, a former New Zealand snooker player, organised his snooker table, golf cart and ride-on mower to be returned to him, five container loads of the couple's possessions remained at removal company Allied Pickfords' storage facility. The couple said their possessions would not have caused any harm remaining at the Tamahere property, at least until the house was sold. They also argued that the costs should have been deducted from the proceeds of the sale, but Justice Woolford said in his ruling that there had been no surplus from the 2016 mortgagee sale.

Cribb bought the house in 2000. His company Kamai Palms Golf Resort Ltd was the subject of bankruptcy proceedings and ordered into liquidation by the High Court in 2010, owing lenders $11 million, and the New Zealand Inland Revenue some $NZ174,000 in unpaid taxes.

When you're $11m in the hole why worry about another $51k?

BogDew
Jun 14, 2006

E:\FILES>quickfli clown.fli
I wonder if the Commonwealth Bank counts. A scandal is brewing where a in 2012 they released ATMs that could do large cash deposits and despite warnings this soon had become the outlet of choice for money laundering.

Additionally despite fail-safes that flag anything over $10,000, the bank appears to have let things slide by not reporting irregularities to investors. Such as multiple deposits under 10k.

It's been estimated 8 billion has deposited without any investigation from the bank.

They are sitting on theoretical fines of nearly one billion.

BogDew fucked around with this message at 05:22 on Aug 7, 2017

Dillbag
Mar 4, 2007

Click here to join Lem Lee in the Hell Of Being Cut To Pieces
Nap Ghost

WebDog posted:

I wonder if the Commonwealth Bank counts. A scandal is brewing where a in 2012 they released ATMs that could do large cash deposits and despite warnings this soon had become the outlet of choice for money laundering.

Additionally despite fail-safes that flag anything over $10,000, the bank appears to have let things slide by not reporting irregularities to investors. Such as multiple deposits under 10k.

It's been estimated 8 billion has deposited without any investigation from the bank.

They are sitting on theoretical fines of nearly one billion.

*trillion

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-08-07/cba-ceo-says-mistakes-were-made,-but-he-wont-be-standing-down/8780270

Shame Boy
Mar 2, 2010


I was going to say I wasn't even aware that there were 8 trillion physical dollars in existence but then I realized they're just pretend australian dollars you meant the fines not the amount laundered

Ghost Leviathan
Mar 2, 2017

Exploration is ill-advised.

Dik Hz posted:

If your win rate is 70% and you only settle one case a week, you're not taking enough cases. All PI clients shop around a ton. I'm not sure that dude is PI, though.

Ace Attorney lied to me. (Though they are specialists in criminal defense. Also, the teenage stage magician is the one paying most of the bills)

Doesn't the USA have a huge glut of lawyers?

hailthefish
Oct 24, 2010


:thermidor:

Weatherman
Jul 30, 2003

WARBLEKLONK

Seriously this. Or at least jail time in regular old prison, not white collar prison.

There are no consequences for failure for either the banks (as a corporate entity) or the people who run them. Oh I made $4 million a year as CEO for the last five years and I get a $40 million severance if I leave for any reason up to and exceeding "ran the place into the loving ground"? Boo hoo hoo, whatever will I do with the rest of my life and my golden yachts.

Put some actualy consequences into white-collar crime and we might start making progress as a society again. They gently caress people up over minor drug possession or "stole a hundred dollars from a store", but leech a million times that from society as a whole and you get on the Who's Who list.

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Not a Children
Oct 9, 2012

Don't need a holster if you never stop shooting.

Weatherman posted:

Seriously this. Or at least jail time in regular old prison, not white collar prison.

There are no consequences for failure for either the banks (as a corporate entity) or the people who run them. Oh I made $4 million a year as CEO for the last five years and I get a $40 million severance if I leave for any reason up to and exceeding "ran the place into the loving ground"? Boo hoo hoo, whatever will I do with the rest of my life and my golden yachts.

Put some actualy consequences into white-collar crime and we might start making progress as a society again. They gently caress people up over minor drug possession or "stole a hundred dollars from a store", but leech a million times that from society as a whole and you get on the Who's Who list.

It will never happen. Systems of wealth exist to preserve the wealth and the people that have it.

The only way to go to jail if you're rich is to kill or steal from another rich person.

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