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Shitenshi posted:Going through the original TT on CN, I will never understand why the haters think this thing is some kind of sacred cow that absolutely cannot be made fun of. I don't think it's that so much as the disappointment of fans who liked the serious storylines of the original show and found out the sequel series was superpowered Seinfeld.
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Aug 9, 2017 17:39
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Bobbin Threadbare posted:I don't think it's that so much as the disappointment of fans who liked the serious storylines of the original show and found out the sequel series was superpowered Seinfeld. ttg actually has a black person though.
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Aug 9, 2017 17:50
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Bobbin Threadbare posted:I don't think it's that so much as the disappointment of fans who liked the serious storylines of the original show and found out the sequel series was superpowered Seinfeld. From what I've seen of the original it's good enough, but anyone who thinks this is high art, or who likes any of the good shows of today and still thinks this is the hottest poo poo ever that absolutely cannot be made fun of, is delusional. Shitenshi fucked around with this message at 18:57 on Aug 9, 2017 |
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Aug 9, 2017 17:54
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People get really weird about media they consumed during their formative years.
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Aug 9, 2017 18:12
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PhazonLink posted:The first season also has Robin hitting way above his power level. He got hit with a classic case of Power Creep, the same force that lets Batman hang around with Superman without being completely worthless. SlothfulCobra posted:People get really weird about media they consumed during their formative years. See also: Transformers fans TwoPair fucked around with this message at 18:49 on Aug 9, 2017 |
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Aug 9, 2017 18:46
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SlothfulCobra posted:People get really weird about media they consumed during their formative years. Especial when stuff like that episode where Slade came back from the dead and gave Raven a bad touch birthday gift. ew.
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Aug 9, 2017 20:20
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Yvonmukluk posted:Am I the only one who basically subconsciously inserted The Batman as the prequel to Teen Titans? They had very similar art styles, after all. When Batman made a cameo in the tie-in comic, he did resemble that version from what we saw of him. Same, also having Legion of Superheroes be in the far future of their joint setting and that they're in a loose multiverse of their own with certain other shows with similar art styles Inescapable Duck posted:Same here, it sort of made sense, though probably got weird in later seasons when The Batman introduced its own Batgirl and Robin. Not really, heck the only real contradictory point between the two shows is that both have a version of Killer Moth, and I long ago came up with a good head canon to explain that; they're brothers, and one of them "borrowed" the gimmick from the other
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Aug 9, 2017 20:39
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Trebuchet King posted:ttg actually has a black person though. ... was Cyborg white in the original? I seem to remember him being black there too, and they even did stuff with it a couple times. 
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Aug 9, 2017 21:02
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LORD OF BOOTY posted:... was Cyborg white in the original? I seem to remember him being black there too, and they even did stuff with it a couple times. no, he's comparing ttg to seinfeld.
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Aug 9, 2017 21:12
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yeah it was a seinfeld joke.
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Aug 9, 2017 21:29
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I was disappointed initially at TTG re: how it relates to the original Teen Titans, but as time went on I just made peace with the fact that it's bad on its own.Gaunab posted:Robin being insecure having no powers makes more sense than having him hit way above his level because you can't think of any way to make him useful in fights. That's the thing, the original show didn't have Robin doing that because they couldn't "think of a way to make him useful", they did that because they just didn't CARE. They weren't concerned with things like power scaling and whether or not Robin should be the weakest member of the team. There's interviews with the people working on the show way back when that basically cover this. The whole "guy who has super powers is the team's albatross" is also such a rote and overdone cliche that's been overdone to the point that it's become one of the most useless and shallow jokes you can do. And like, even then, a show like Darkwing Duck still managed to do it better than TTG did years ago, on a character who despite also having a huge ego and insecurity over his self image and lack of powers like what TTG tries to do with Robin constantly, managed to make him sympathetic and someone you could root for. In a way, stuff like that highlights the problem with TTG in the end. Even a show like Seinfeld makes you somehow want to root for the protagonists, even though the show's ultimate punchline is that all four of these people are awful and you never should have in the first place. TTG never gets you to root for any of the people onscreen, except for maybe the worm who never talks, and it constantly hammers in the punch line that all five of these kids are the worst to the point you never want to see them succeed in spite of it. They're all just loud and terrible, and even if the premise is something original, like "Titans verses a literal pyramid scheme" or "they get into an insurance racket", it just ends up coming off like the same story because all the characters do is repeat the formula of them being loud and terrible until either their selfishness or their idiocy bites them in the rear end. It's the same problem with modern Spongebob episodes, if you think about it. And that stuff is still successful despite all this and run into the ground like TTG is.
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Aug 9, 2017 21:49
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TFRazorsaw posted:I was disappointed initially at TTG re: how it relates to the original Teen Titans, but as time went on I just made peace with the fact that it's bad on its own. Are you secretly Mr.Enter?
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Aug 9, 2017 22:04
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I have no idea who that is.
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Aug 9, 2017 22:16
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The show constantly makes you root for Cyborg, Starfire and Raven. They have wants and goals that are actually good and even heroic (Cyborg's dream of being a legit hero in the JL, Starfire constantly trying to make Everyone happy and Raven's demonic issues she sometimes works on). BB and Robin are more often than not the Always Sunny Dennis, but the rest of the gang's still operating on Mac and Charley rules where they're well intended even if they're asses often.
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Aug 9, 2017 22:19
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TFRazorsaw posted:I was disappointed initially at TTG re: how it relates to the original Teen Titans, but as time went on I just made peace with the fact that it's bad on its own.
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Aug 9, 2017 22:22
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Shitenshi posted:It's a parody show. So is one of the shows I compared it to. That's not really an excuse. ArmyOfMidgets posted:The show constantly makes you root for Cyborg, Starfire and Raven. They have wants and goals that are actually good and even heroic (Cyborg's dream of being a legit hero in the JL, Starfire constantly trying to make Everyone happy and Raven's demonic issues she sometimes works on). BB and Robin are more often than not the Always Sunny Dennis, but the rest of the gang's still operating on Mac and Charley rules where they're well intended even if they're asses often. It... sometimes makes an effort with those characters? I mean, the show sometimes decides it needs a straight man who isn't being awful, but I don't know if it makes them likable, especially if someone like Cyborg can just as easily go from what you described to forcing his friends to eat meat filled with metal shavings. There's no real consistent benchmark for anyone on the show because they're constantly swapping in and out of what it wants to say about them. To go with the comparison I made earlier, modern Spongebob still has episodes where Mr. Krabs gets tries to get played sympathetically. That doesn't mean the show does a good job of making him likable. Nodosaur fucked around with this message at 22:35 on Aug 9, 2017 |
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Aug 9, 2017 22:33
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TFRazorsaw posted:So is one of the shows I compared it to. That's not really an excuse. I mean, it's like bitching that the kids on South Park are little assholes, for gently caress's sakes. Shitenshi fucked around with this message at 23:02 on Aug 9, 2017 |
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Aug 9, 2017 22:52
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Shitenshi posted:No, if you seriously begin by saying that you're disappointed how different this show is from the original, then actually complain about how characterization in a cartoon with exaggerated superdeformed character designs and everyone deliberately acting like goofy as hell caricatures of a serious show, you're probably gonna have a bad time. If you'll actually read my post, you'll notice I said that that its differences from the previous show are no longer a priority for me. The only point in comparing them anymore is pointing out instances where the original, which has parodic elements of its own, may or may not do things better - not a "this is the superior adaptation" case. Nodosaur fucked around with this message at 23:03 on Aug 9, 2017 |
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Aug 9, 2017 23:00
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I hope they have an episode of TTG just like the finale of Seinfeld where they all get thrown in jail for just mocking a dude getting mugged.
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Aug 9, 2017 23:26
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I'm pretty sure they've had a number of episodes where they've met a bad end because they were the ones actually being the assholes already.
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Aug 9, 2017 23:31
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Come to think of it, Robin still has all the positive qualities he had in the original Teen Titans, the training to be the best, the leadership skills, the intelligence, the determination, it's just that all of those are cast in a negative light because he's pulling the whole gung-ho routine when the rest of team are lazy goofs and don't want to go through the effort of superhero-ing. Just because there are a few episodes where he tries to get actual superpowers in his lust for power doesn't change that. You want Robin not being just some lame-o with no powers? Here. times quadruple. The only thing wrong with TTG is the disproportionate amount of airtime.
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Aug 9, 2017 23:45
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TTG Robin's problem is that he's Squidward in a universe where they never made Band Geeks.
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Aug 9, 2017 23:52
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TFRazorsaw posted:If you'll actually read my post, you'll notice I said that that its differences from the previous show are no longer a priority for me. The only point in comparing them anymore is pointing out instances where the original, which has parodic elements of its own, may or may not do things better - not a "this is the superior adaptation" case.
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Aug 10, 2017 00:02
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SlothfulCobra posted:Come to think of it, Robin still has all the positive qualities he had in the original Teen Titans, the training to be the best, the leadership skills, the intelligence, the determination, it's just that all of those are cast in a negative light because he's pulling the whole gung-ho routine when the rest of team are lazy goofs and don't want to go through the effort of superhero-ing. Just because there are a few episodes where he tries to get actual superpowers in his lust for power doesn't change that. Honestly, I feel like it goes beyond that and into "they realized that people who act like TT Robin does are emotionally abusive and terrible leaders, and they didn't want to continue implying that that was okay", which is why the other four members of the team are pretty much good-natured comedy takes on their original personalities, while Robin has gone all the way into being basically evil.
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Aug 10, 2017 00:14
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Shitenshi posted:No seriously dude, if you can't honestly get a kick out of it when comedy shows make the characters act like assholes and idiots (and they already look goofy as hell so ridiculous behavior goes with the territory), then holy poo poo. It's like you're ranting about Loony Tunes or South Park. I thought the problem was that I was comparing it to the old show? Like, I have no problems with the characters being assholes. I said that Seinfeld worked despite every single one of its main characters is an awful human being. The aforementioned Darkwing Duck has its protagonist as a rampant egotist who routinely refuses to listen to the people around him in contrast to its sympathetic moments. It's not they're assholes, it's that you don't root for them. South Park, for all its potential flaws, routinely tricks its audience into rooting for a repugnant little fat turd who has proven time and time again he's never going to improve, and somehow it manages to be hilarious. Hell, you root for Wile E. Coyote even though he's the villain of the shorts. TTG's problem isn't that its leads are awful. It's problem isn't that it's absurd. Its problem is that it takes the comedic approach of swinging a bag of hammers for absolutely every aspect of it. Robin doesn't appear sympathetic, he just comes out screaming about whatever petulant issue he has before he and the show browbeat everyone into paying attention to him. He doesn't have to actually be sympathetic, he just has to seem that way. Instead, every time he's on screen is a case of "ugh, this guy". quote:Honestly, I feel like it goes beyond that and into "they realized that people who act like TT Robin does are emotionally abusive and terrible leaders, and they didn't want to continue implying that that was okay", which is why the other four members of the team are pretty much good-natured comedy takes on their original personalities, while Robin has gone all the way into being basically evil. ... okay, what the actual gently caress? Are we seriously claiming that the Robin on the original Teen Titans cartoon was abusive? Like, let's set Teen Titans Go aside here. He had moments where he let his obsession with the mission drive him to some bad territory, but he was never someone who abused his teammates. This was a guy who came out and told Starfire she had a place on the team and that she was irreplaceable after her sister made her feel insecure. The guy who carried Raven on his back out of hell and told her she was a hero after she lost her memories. Are we seriously talking about the same character? Nodosaur fucked around with this message at 00:26 on Aug 10, 2017 |
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Aug 10, 2017 00:21
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TFRazorsaw posted:I thought the problem was that I was comparing it to the old show? quote:South Park, for all its potential flaws, routinely tricks its audience into rooting for a repugnant little fat turd who has proven time and time again he's never going to improve, and somehow it manages to be hilarious.
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Aug 10, 2017 00:29
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quote:Goes hand in hand. No, they really don't have anything to do with each other, because the original Teen Titans is only sometimes a parody and it never attempts to portray unsympathetic comedy protagonists. quote:I have never once found Cartman to ever look truthful or rooted for him. That's definitely not an expected response to someone bringing up South Park but, uh...wow mang. I think you're taking the "rooting for" thing too literally. Like, the entire premise of "Scott Tenorman Must Die" is that Cartman is trying and failing to get one over on this bully, and then pulling the wool out from under you by revealing he's completely terrible. Whether it's schadenfreude at how he keeps "failing", or wanting the stupid bully to get what's coming to him, there's an effort to asset Cartman as the protagonist and follow along with his story. The whole premise doesn't work unless you get invested in what he's doing. And then the "joke" is that what he was doing was monstrous and terrifying. In comparison, TTG Robin and the rest of his cast are just loud and tiresome.
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Aug 10, 2017 00:34
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TFRazorsaw posted:No, they really don't have anything to do with each other, because the original Teen Titans is only sometimes a parody and it never attempts to portray unsympathetic comedy protagonists. quote:I think you're taking the "rooting for" thing too literally. I think Cartman was terrible from being an rear end in a top hat to his friends, not to mention being a stupid racist, misogynist anti-Semite. Don't need that episode to find out anything you didn't already know about him. quote:Whether it's schadenfreude at how he keeps "failing", or wanting the stupid bully to get what's coming to him, there's an effort to asset Cartman as the protagonist and follow along with his story. The whole premise doesn't work unless you get invested in what he's doing.
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Aug 10, 2017 00:46
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If you're going to insist that the crux of what I'm saying is that I'm arguing Cartman is a good person you should totally be friends with, and that what I'm saying isn't trying to break down how black comedy and abrasive comedy protagonists are supposed to work, I don't really think I have anything more to say.
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Aug 10, 2017 00:50
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I think we can all agree that Batman: The Brave and the Bold was the best DC comics cartoon in the last decade.
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Aug 10, 2017 00:54
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I'll cop to that.
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Aug 10, 2017 00:56
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one of TTG's showrunners also wrote for brave and the bold
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Aug 10, 2017 01:01
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SlothfulCobra posted:People get really weird about media they consumed during their formative years. I dunno, I loved Transformers and GI-Joe when I was a kid, but as an adult I can acknowledge what a trash fire both of those shows were.
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Aug 10, 2017 01:11
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Shitenshi posted:I mean, it's like bitching that the kids on South Park are little assholes, for gently caress's sakes. Shitenshi posted:It's like you're ranting about Loony Tunes or South Park. I'm not sure this is the rhetorical grand slam you think it is.
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Aug 10, 2017 01:49
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TFRazorsaw posted:No, they really don't have anything to do with each other, because the original Teen Titans is only sometimes a parody and it never attempts to portray unsympathetic comedy protagonists. Honestly I always felt that episode was a terrible mistake
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Aug 10, 2017 01:55
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drrockso20 posted:Honestly I always felt that episode was a terrible mistake I actually don't care for the show or the episode too much anymore, I just felt it was relevant to explain why it works in terms of comedic structure considering someone mentioned South Park. There's a quite bit of other issues associated with it.
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Aug 10, 2017 03:01
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The best part of the original teen titans cartoon was when Robin threw himself down the stairs because he fight clubbed deathstroke into his mind
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Aug 10, 2017 03:11
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The funniest thing about Teen Titans Go is that its the only thing DC animation can do right these days. Like hell, you guys can't even do the easiest thing ever and pull out a new batman and CN sure as poo poo won't let Justice League Action see the light of day outside of one short 27 minutes out of a Saturday Morning.
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Aug 10, 2017 04:30
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TFRazorsaw posted:If you're going to insist that the crux of what I'm saying is that I'm arguing Cartman is a good person you should totally be friends with, and that what I'm saying isn't trying to break down how black comedy and abrasive comedy protagonists are supposed to work, I don't really think I have anything more to say.
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Aug 10, 2017 05:05
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Quest For Glory II posted:The best part of the original teen titans cartoon was when Robin threw himself down the stairs because he fight clubbed deathstroke into his mind This but unironically.
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Aug 10, 2017 05:21
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