Korea Thread: Fumbling to take a bite of kimchi

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > Korea Thread: Fumbling to take a bite of kimchi

chitoryu12: Apr 24, 2014

Farmer Crack-rear end posted:

"Launch on warning" is really more of a thing when you're seeing dozens or more missiles coming at you, and waiting to confirm you're being nuked before retaliating could mean losing the ability to retaliate. One or a handful of missiles coming from North Korea probably isn't going to trigger that kind of response (from the US, anyway) because even if they're all nuclear warheads, the US will still have thousands of warheads at their disposal with which to retaliate, and retaliating before the nukes hit won't make any difference as to how many Americans get killed.

That said, launching missiles like that with conventional warheads and hitting targets with them would still be the end for North Korea's leadership, because even absent a strong military response from the US, I really can't imagine China and Russia tolerating that level of recklessness.

The big problem that's happened is that North Korea has already stated that they're planning an attack on Guam. If they fire a "warning shot" that ends up in or near Guam, there's no reasonable way to tell if it was just more bluffing by lobbing crap into the sea or if they legitimately attempted to nuke US territory and hosed up until you analyze the site further.

# ? Aug 11, 2017 19:12

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# ? Jun 3, 2024 08:44

Ynglaur: Oct 9, 2013; The Malta Conference, anyone?

Paradoxish posted:

I explained why this is further up in that post:

North Korea's actions are rational in the context of a nuclear power that's testing its limits against the United States. They are specifically not saying that they will launch an unprovoked attack on the US, SK, or Japan. The problem is that the US government isn't sending any clear "this far is too far" signals, and both Mattis and Tillerson are effectively contradicting Trump's own statements.

The risk here isn't that nuclear war suddenly happens out of nowhere, it's that KJU interprets the ambiguous statements from different parts of the US government to mean that some kind of strike against the NK nuclear program is imminent. Trump actually has the ability to carry out that kind of attack without ending the United States, which is a luxury that Kim Jong-un doesn't have. It's a mistake to assume that this is any sort of symmetrical crisis or that Trump and Kim Jong-un's statements should be judged on the same terms.

Thanks for the response, and good point. DPRK is certainly a rational actor. My concern is that the information flow could become very distorted by the time it reaches decision makers such that, to th e outside, they appear irrational.

# ? Aug 11, 2017 19:16

maskenfreiheit: Dec 30, 2004

probably should just glass them either way. seuol is dead city walking, might as well minimize American casualties.

# ? Aug 11, 2017 19:38

Mozi: Apr 4, 2004; Forms change so fast
Time is moving past
Memory is smoke
Gonna get wider when I die; Nap Ghost

Seoul long, and thanks for all the fish.

# ? Aug 11, 2017 19:41

Lote: Aug 5, 2001; Place your bets

On one hand, nuclear war is bad. On the other hand, buddae jjigae is gonna come back bigly.

That stuff is relatively hard to find these days.

# ? Aug 11, 2017 19:48

CAPS LOCK BROKEN: Feb 1, 2006; by Fluffdaddy

Calibanibal posted:

give me 20 SEALs and i could take care of NK in a single night tbqh

I'm sure 20 military trained crackers would have no problems at all infiltrating a homogenous corean hermit kingdom

# ? Aug 11, 2017 19:59

mediadave: Sep 8, 2011

chitoryu12 posted:

The big problem that's happened is that North Korea has already stated that they're planning an attack on Guam. If they fire a "warning shot" that ends up in or near Guam, there's no reasonable way to tell if it was just more bluffing by lobbing crap into the sea or if they legitimately attempted to nuke US territory and hosed up until you analyze the site further.

Woah, lets just be clear at least in this thread. North Korea hasn't stated that they're planning an attack on Guam. They've specifically stated that they're planning a 'demonstration', where the missiles will land 30-40km away from Guam. They've also given themselves an out (Kim has not yet ordered the demonstration, it's directly linked to B1 overflights of Korea.)

# ? Aug 11, 2017 21:56

fishmech: Jul 16, 2006; by VideoGames; Salad Prong

mediadave posted:

Woah, lets just be clear at least in this thread. North Korea hasn't stated that they're planning an attack on Guam. They've specifically stated that they're planning a 'demonstration', where the missiles will land 30-40km away from Guam. They've also given themselves an out (Kim has not yet ordered the demonstration, it's directly linked to B1 overflights of Korea.)

So, they're attacking Guam.

Oh yeah man, I'm not attacking Pyongyang I'm just going to demonstrate I can put a warhead within 30-40km of it, chill out!

# ? Aug 11, 2017 22:05

Owlofcreamcheese: May 22, 2005; Can't post for 9 years!; Buglord

mediadave posted:

Woah, lets just be clear at least in this thread. North Korea hasn't stated that they're planning an attack on Guam. They've specifically stated that they're planning a 'demonstration', where the missiles will land 30-40km away from Guam. They've also given themselves an out (Kim has not yet ordered the demonstration, it's directly linked to B1 overflights of Korea.)

also everyone should read the actual statement north korea made because it is very hilarious re: trump

Pyongyang, August 10 (KCNA) � General Kim Rak Gyom, commander of the Korean People�s Army, released the following statement on August 9:

As already clarified, the Strategic Force of the KPA is seriously examining the plan for an enveloping strike at Guam through simultaneous fire of four Hwasong-12 intermediate-range strategic ballistic rockets in order to interdict the enemy forces on the major military bases on Guam and to Signal a crucial warning to the US

On Tuesday, the KPA Strategic Force is a statement of its spokesman fully warned against the US on its all-round sanctions on the DPRK and moves to maximize military threats to it. But the US president at a golf link again let out a load of nonsense about �fire and fury,� failing to grasp the on-going grave situation. This is extremely difficult to obtain.

It seems that he has not yet understood the statement.

Sound dialogue is not possible with such a bereft of reason and only absolute force can work on him. This is the judgment made by the KPA Strategic Force.

The military action of the KPA will take about an effective remedy for restraining the frantic moves of the US in the southern part of the peninsula and its vicinity.

The Hwasong artillerymen of the KPA Strategic Force are replete with a strong determination to fully demonstrate once again the invincible might of the force, which has been developed into a nuclear force of the Workers� Party of Korea and the world�s strongest strike service, through the Planned enveloping strike targeting the US imperialist bases of aggression.

The Strategic Force is also considering considering the opening of the historic enveloping fire at Guam, a practical action targeting the US bases of aggression.

This unprecedented step is to give you a strong confidence in certain victory and courage to the Korean people and help them witness the wretched plight of the US imperialists.

The Hwasong-12 rockets to be launched by the KPA will cross the sky above Shimane, Hiroshima and Koichi Prefectures of Japan. They will fly 3 356.7 km for 1 065 seconds and hit the waters 30 to 40 km away from Guam.

The KPA Strategic Force will finally complete the plan until mid August and report it to the commander-in-chief of the DPRK nuclear force and wait for his order.

We keep closely watching the speech and behavior of the US.

# ? Aug 11, 2017 22:09

mediadave: Sep 8, 2011

fishmech posted:

Oh yeah man, I'm not attacking Pyongyang I'm just going to demonstrate I can put a warhead within 30-40km of it, chill out!

Exactly, yes, when American bombers overfly Korea near the border they're demonstrating that they can attack North Korea if they so choose.

(I'm not saying this is a good idea for North Korea, it's probably a very bad idea with Trump in charge, but whatever it is, it isn't an attack.)

mediadave fucked around with this message at 22:31 on Aug 11, 2017

# ? Aug 11, 2017 22:28

fishmech: Jul 16, 2006; by VideoGames; Salad Prong

mediadave posted:

Exactly, yes, when American bombers overfly Korea near the border they're demonstrating that they can attack North Korea if they so choose.

(I'm not saying this is a good idea for North Korea, it's probably a very bad idea with Trump in charge, but whatever it is, it isn't an attack.)

Blowing a bomb up within 30 kilometers of a major US military base is attacking the US. If they just wanted to show off they can shoot the missile, they could go target some empty chunk of ocean that's easily hundreds of miles from anywhere. Especially since it's likely their targeting isn't too good, and they could easily land much closer.

Do you think North Korea would like it if we shot a missile that blew up 30 kilometers short of Pyongyang?

# ? Aug 11, 2017 22:37

maskenfreiheit: Dec 30, 2004

fishmech posted:

Blowing a bomb up within 30 kilometers of a major US military base is attacking the US. If they just wanted to show off they can shoot the missile, they could go target some empty chunk of ocean that's easily hundreds of miles from anywhere. Especially since it's likely their targeting isn't too good, and they could easily land much closer.

Do you think North Korea would like it if we shot a missile that blew up 30 kilometers short of Pyongyang?

as much as i love to dunk on nk, two can play the "i'm not touching you game"

we fly b2s extremely close to their borders, they shoot off missles extremely close to our borders - both are totally-legal-but-dickish moves in the "i'm not touching you" olympics, played out in international waters the world over every day

# ? Aug 11, 2017 22:40

Gnumonic: Dec 11, 2005; Maybe you thought I was the Packard Goose?

Why do so many people here assume that if (for some reason) we were going to launch a nuclear attack on North Korea that we'd use ICBMs? Presumably the people who run our military would also want to minimize the risk of Russia or China misinterpreting our launch as directed against them (and presumably they have a better idea of how accurate Russian or Chinese radar systems are than we do). I assume that a scenario like that is one of the main reasons we bothered to design stealth bombers, right?

# ? Aug 11, 2017 22:46

fishmech: Jul 16, 2006; by VideoGames; Salad Prong

maskenfreiheit posted:

as much as i love to dunk on nk, two can play the "i'm not touching you game"

we fly b2s extremely close to their borders, they shoot off missles extremely close to our borders - both are totally-legal-but-dickish moves in the "i'm not touching you" olympics, played out in international waters the world over every day

The B2s aren't actually bombing when they fly by. Launching a missile is the same as actually bombing.

# ? Aug 11, 2017 22:51

Calibanibal: Aug 25, 2015

im pretty sure stealth bombers dont just poo poo a brickbomb out the back like in dr.strangelove. its still a missile in the end

# ? Aug 11, 2017 22:54

Gnumonic: Dec 11, 2005; Maybe you thought I was the Packard Goose?

Calibanibal posted:

im pretty sure stealth bombers dont just poo poo a brickbomb out the back like in dr.strangelove. its still a missile in the end

Looks like a regular falls-from-the-sky bomb to me. I don't even think we have nuclear-tipped non-ballistic missiles. (Nuclear cruise missiles are banned by treaty at least, but I think the Russians have a few anyway).

# ? Aug 11, 2017 22:59

Owlofcreamcheese: May 22, 2005; Can't post for 9 years!; Buglord

Gnumonic posted:

Why do so many people here assume that if (for some reason) we were going to launch a nuclear attack on North Korea that we'd use ICBMs? Presumably the people who run our military would also want to minimize the risk of Russia or China misinterpreting our launch as directed against them (and presumably they have a better idea of how accurate Russian or Chinese radar systems are than we do). I assume that a scenario like that is one of the main reasons we bothered to design stealth bombers, right?

I think the idea is that bad things happen when tensions escalate and russia isn't going to just randomly think we are side swiping them for no reason, but that some series of events that start small on some tuesday morning have all gone crazy by tuesday night.

Like korea fires towards guam, the us fires from a ship and china says "I don't like that ship being there firing stuff, move it" and trump says "no" then keeps it there then china moves ships to move our ships and we fire warning shots then russia condemns this and demands we get out of one of the places it always demands we get out of then trump is on a hot mic calling china "dirty chinkys" the north korea masses troops at the border, then the us launches a missile then north korea maybe launches a missile but it's unclear if it launched and china is screaming at the us to get the ships out of the south china sea and the us is moving more and more ships in and china is making aggressive moves. So the US launches something that might be a missile or an interceptor and it might be going to north korea and it might be going hit the chinese ships.And then china has 30 seconds to decide and press a button that either starts world war III or doesn't.

Not like, some pure calm thing where the US calls china and everyone has a good clear talk then they shoot a thing. Some crazy day that ends up with life coming at you fast.

# ? Aug 11, 2017 23:11

Grouchio: Aug 31, 2014

In Which Trump Grows a Brain.

quote:

President Trump on Friday sought to calm frayed nerves over his war of words with North Korea, saying �hopefully it will all work out.�

Trump spoke after meeting with Secretary of State Rex Tillerson, national security adviser H.R. McMaster and U.S. Ambassador to the United Nations Nikki Haley at his New Jersey golf club.

The president said he wants a peaceful solution to the nuclear standoff with North Korean leader Kim Jong Un.

He said he would be speaking Friday night with Chinese President Xi Jinping to discuss the situation.

Oh thank god.

# ? Aug 11, 2017 23:26

sout: Apr 24, 2014

Hopefully it will all work out, but all that matters is Trump had fun

# ? Aug 11, 2017 23:27

suck my woke dick: Oct 10, 2012; I CANNOT EJACULATE WITHOUT SEEING NATIVE AMERICANS BRUTALISED!

Put this cum-loving slave on ignore immediately!

Grouchio posted:

In Which Trump Grows a Brain.

Oh thank god.

~presidential~

Though I still want to see a cage match between Trump and Kim the Fatter.

# ? Aug 11, 2017 23:31

ugh its Troika: May 2, 2009; by FactsAreUseless

blowfish posted:

~presidential~

Though I still want to see a cage match between Trump and Kim the Fatter.

having actual wrestling experience, Trump would win :getin:

# ? Aug 11, 2017 23:42

Fojar38: Sep 2, 2011; Sorry I meant to say I hope that the police use maximum force and kill or maim a bunch of innocent people, thus paving a way for a proletarian uprising and socialist utopia

also here's a stupid take
---------------------------->

Grouchio posted:

In Which Trump Grows a Brain.

Oh thank god.

Today Trump became the President

# ? Aug 11, 2017 23:52

Burt Sexual: Jan 26, 2006; by Jeffrey of YOSPOS; Switchblade Switcharoo

Fojar38 posted:

Today Trump became the President

And lost the totality of little credibility he had since being elected, meeting with the g20, trying to get legislation passed, etc etc

We are a laughing stock, accept it and move on.

# ? Aug 12, 2017 00:24

Fojar38: Sep 2, 2011; Sorry I meant to say I hope that the police use maximum force and kill or maim a bunch of innocent people, thus paving a way for a proletarian uprising and socialist utopia

also here's a stupid take
---------------------------->

According to Associated Press back channel diplomacy is still happening and has been for months.

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_NORTH_KOREA_QUIET_DIPLOMACY_ASOL-?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2017-08-11-18-56-16

quote:

WASHINGTON (AP) -- Beyond the bluster, the Trump administration has been quietly engaged in back channel diplomacy with North Korea for several months, addressing Americans imprisoned in the communist country and deteriorating relations between the long-time foes, The Associated Press has learned.

It had been known the two sides had discussions to secure the June release of an American university student. But it wasn't known until now that the contacts have continued, or that they have broached matters other than U.S. detainees.

People familiar with the contacts say the interactions have done nothing thus far to quell tensions over North Korea's nuclear weapons and missile advances, which are now fueling fears of military confrontation. But they say the behind-the-scenes discussions could still be a foundation for more serious negotiation, including on North Korea's nuclear weapons, should President Donald Trump and North Korean leader Kim Jong Un put aside the bellicose rhetoric of recent days and endorse a dialogue.

Trump refused to discuss the diplomatic contacts. "We don't want to talk about progress, we don't want to talk about back channels," Trump told reporters Friday.

The diplomatic contacts are occurring regularly between Joseph Yun, the U.S. envoy for North Korea policy, and Pak Song Il, a senior North Korean diplomat at the country's U.N. mission, according to U.S. officials and others briefed on the process. They weren't authorized to discuss the confidential exchanges and spoke on condition of anonymity.

Officials call it the "New York channel." Yun is the only U.S. diplomat in contact with any North Korean counterpart. The communications largely serve as a way to exchange messages, allowing Washington and Pyongyang to relay information.

Drowned out by the furor over Trump's warning to North Korea of "fire and fury like the world has never seen," Secretary of State Rex Tillerson has expressed a willingness to entertain negotiations. His condition: Pyongyang stopping tests of missiles that can now potentially reach the U.S. mainland.

Tillerson has even hinted at an ongoing back channel. "We have other means of communication open to them, to certainly hear from them if they have a desire to want to talk," he said at an Asian security meeting in the Philippines this week.

The interactions could point to a level of pragmatism in the Trump administration's approach to the North Korean threat, despite the president's dire warnings.

On Friday, he tweeted: "Military solutions are now fully in place, locked and loaded, should North Korea act unwisely." But on Thursday, he said, "we'll always consider negotiations," even if they haven't worked in the last quarter-century.

The contacts suggest Pyongyang, too, may be open to a negotiation even as it talks of launching missiles near the U.S. territory of Guam. The North regularly threatens nuclear strikes on the United States and its allies.

The State Department and the White House declined to comment on Yun's diplomacy. A diplomat at North Korea's U.N. mission only confirmed use of diplomatic channel up to the release of U.S. college student Otto Warmbier two months ago.

Trump, in some ways, has been more flexible in his approach to North Korea than President Barack Obama. While variations of the New York channel have been used on-and-off for years by past administrations, there were no discussions over the last seven months of Obama's presidency after Pyongyang broke them off in anger over U.S. sanctions imposed on its leader, Kim. Obama made little effort to reopen lines of communication.

The contacts quickly restarted after Trump's inauguration, other people familiar with the discussions say.

"Contrary to the public vitriol of the moment, the North Koreans were willing to reopen the New York channel following the election of President Trump and his administration signaled an openness to engage and 'talk about talks,'" said Keith Luse, executive director of the National Committee on North Korea, a U.S.-based group that promotes U.S.-North Korean engagement.

"However, the massive trust deficit in Pyongyang and in Washington toward each other has impeded the confidence-building process necessary to have constructive dialogue," he said.

The early U.S. focus was on securing the release of several Americans held in North Korea.

They included Warmbier, who was imprisoned for stealing a propaganda poster and only allowed to return to the U.S. in June - in an unconscious state. He died days later. Yun traveled on the widely publicized mission to Pyongyang to bring Warmbier home.

Despite outrage in the U.S. with Warmbier's treatment and sharp condemnation by Trump, the U.S.-North Korean interactions in New York continued.

Yun and his counterpart have discussed the other Americans still being held. They include Kim Hak Song, a university employee detained in May accused of unspecified "hostile" acts; Tony Kim, a teacher at the same school, accused of trying to overthrow the government; and Kim Dong Chul, sentenced last year to a decade in prison with hard labor for supposed espionage.

But the American and North Korean diplomats also have discussed the overall U.S.-North Korean relationship. The two countries have no diplomatic ties and are still enemies, having only reached an armistice - not a peace treaty - to end the 1950-1953 Korean War. Twenty-eight thousand U.S. troops are still stationed in South Korea.

In its own convoluted way, North Korea has indicated openness to talks in recent weeks, even as it has accelerated the tempo of weapons tests.

On July 4, after the North test-launched an intercontinental ballistic missile that could potentially strike the continental U.S., leader Kim added a new caveat to his refusal to negotiate over its nukes or missiles. Instead of a blanket rejection, he ruled out such concessions "unless the U.S. hostile policy and nuclear threat to the DPRK are definitely terminated."

That message has been repeated by other North Korean officials, without greater specification. Nor have they offered an indication as to whether Pyongyang would accept denuclearization as the goal of talks.

Still, advocates for diplomacy, including some voices in the U.S. government, view the addendum as a potential opening.

"North Korea is assessing its options," said Suzanne DiMaggio, a senior fellow at the New America think tank who participated in unofficial talks with North Korean officials in Oslo in May, where Yun also met with the North Koreans. "They recognize that at some point they have to return to the table to address what's becoming a crisis. That's what they are weighing right now: the timing of engagement."

Any negotiation would face huge skepticism in Washington given North Korea's long record of broken promises. The last serious U.S.-North Korea negotiations collapsed in 2012 when Pyongyang launched a long-range rocket that derailed an agreement of a North Korean nuclear freeze in exchange for U.S. food aid.

North Korea's weapons program has developed significantly since then. As a result, its price in any such negotiation is now likely to be far higher. At a minimum, Pyongyang would renew its long-standing demands for an end to joint U.S.-South Korean military exercises - which are set to resume this month - and an eventual peace treaty with Washington.

To date, the Trump administration has heavily concentrated its diplomatic energy on cranking up international pressure on North Korea's government, in particular pressing China to lean on its wayward ally. Last weekend, the U.N. adopted its strongest economic sanctions on Pyongyang.

Trump has been widely accused of injecting a new element of unpredictability and even chaos into U.S. policy toward North Korea, especially with his tweets and proclamations this week. It's unclear what effect they may have on the back channel contacts being maintained by Yun.

# ? Aug 12, 2017 00:33

Burt Sexual: Jan 26, 2006; by Jeffrey of YOSPOS; Switchblade Switcharoo

Fojar38 posted:

According to Associated Press back channel diplomacy is still happening and has been for months.

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_NORTH_KOREA_QUIET_DIPLOMACY_ASOL-?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2017-08-11-18-56-16

What a weak presidense. That's been tried for decades according to trump/rush.

# ? Aug 12, 2017 01:08

symphoniccacophony: Mar 20, 2009

Grouchio posted:

In Which Trump Grows a Brain.

Oh thank god.

who could have thunk? King bullshitter was all barks and no bites

# ? Aug 12, 2017 01:25

Fojar38: Sep 2, 2011; Sorry I meant to say I hope that the police use maximum force and kill or maim a bunch of innocent people, thus paving a way for a proletarian uprising and socialist utopia

also here's a stupid take
---------------------------->

symphoniccacophony posted:

who could have thunk? King bullshitter was all barks and no bites

Less than twenty four hours ago everyone was panicking that he was going to start a war, now we're critical because it looks like he won't?

# ? Aug 12, 2017 01:28

Grouchio: Aug 31, 2014

Fojar38 posted:

Less than twenty four hours ago everyone was panicking that he was going to start a war, now we're critical because it looks like he won't?

We are a pathetically fickle species.

# ? Aug 12, 2017 01:31

maskenfreiheit: Dec 30, 2004

Fojar38 posted:

Less than twenty four hours ago everyone was panicking that he was going to start a war, now we're critical because it looks like he won't?

Already bought all this iodine might as well do it

# ? Aug 12, 2017 01:34

Fojar38: Sep 2, 2011; Sorry I meant to say I hope that the police use maximum force and kill or maim a bunch of innocent people, thus paving a way for a proletarian uprising and socialist utopia

also here's a stupid take
---------------------------->

Bulletin of Atomic Scientists published an analysis of North Korea's July missile tests and are very skeptical of North Korea's and the media's claims.

Full article with all the technical details of the analysis here:

http://thebulletin.org/north-korea%E2%80%99s-%E2%80%9Cnot-quite%E2%80%9D-icbm-can%E2%80%99t-hit-lower-48-states11012

Conclusion:

quote:

General conclusions�for now. Our general conclusions from intensive study of a wide variety of data relating to the two rockets that North Korea launched in July:

The Hwasong-14 does not currently constitute a nuclear threat to the lower 48 states of the United States.
The flight tests on July 4 and 28 were a carefully choreographed deception by North Korea to create a false impression that the Hwasong-14 is a near-ICBM that poses a nuclear threat to the continental US.
The Hwasong-14 tested on July 4 and 28 may not even be able to deliver a North Korean atomic bomb to Anchorage, Alaska.
Although it is clear that North Korea is not capable of manufacturing sophisticated rocket components, their skill and ingenuity in using Soviet rocket motor components has grown very substantially. This is not good news for the long run.

# ? Aug 12, 2017 02:12

The Iron Rose: May 12, 2012; Cat Army

Fojar38 posted:

Bulletin of Atomic Scientists published an analysis of North Korea's July missile tests and are very skeptical of North Korea's and the media's claims.

Full article with all the technical details of the analysis here:

http://thebulletin.org/north-korea%E2%80%99s-%E2%80%9Cnot-quite%E2%80%9D-icbm-can%E2%80%99t-hit-lower-48-states11012

Conclusion:

Lol this is authored by Ted "There was no chemical attack in Syria/the rebels did it!" Postol. It's already been debunked to some extent in the Airpower thread in TFR.

# ? Aug 12, 2017 02:18

Fojar38: Sep 2, 2011; Sorry I meant to say I hope that the police use maximum force and kill or maim a bunch of innocent people, thus paving a way for a proletarian uprising and socialist utopia

also here's a stupid take
---------------------------->

The Iron Rose posted:

Lol this is authored by Ted "There was no chemical attack in Syria/the rebels did it!" Postol. It's already been debunked to some extent in the Airpower thread in TFR.

Didn't know that. Thought Bulletin of Atomic Scientists was more credible than that.

# ? Aug 12, 2017 02:19

maskenfreiheit: Dec 30, 2004

Fojar38 posted:

Bulletin of Atomic Scientists published an analysis of North Korea's July missile tests and are very skeptical of North Korea's and the media's claims.

Full article with all the technical details of the analysis here:

http://thebulletin.org/north-korea%E2%80%99s-%E2%80%9Cnot-quite%E2%80%9D-icbm-can%E2%80%99t-hit-lower-48-states11012

Conclusion:

I mean, it's pretty indisputable they can level Seoul or Tokyo though.

# ? Aug 12, 2017 02:30

Charliegrs: Aug 10, 2009

Burt Sexual posted:

And lost the totality of little credibility he had since being elected, meeting with the g20, trying to get legislation passed, etc etc

We are a laughing stock, accept it and move on.

I don't think you understand the "Today Trump became president" meme

# ? Aug 12, 2017 04:35

symphoniccacophony: Mar 20, 2009

Fojar38 posted:

Less than twenty four hours ago everyone was panicking that he was going to start a war, now we're critical because it looks like he won't?

Everyone? Thought it was mostly the Americans.

# ? Aug 12, 2017 05:16

Burt Sexual: Jan 26, 2006; by Jeffrey of YOSPOS; Switchblade Switcharoo

Charliegrs posted:

I don't think you understand the "Today Trump became president" meme

Today I learn memes!

# ? Aug 12, 2017 05:28

Telephones: Apr 28, 2013

Grouchio posted:

In Which Trump Grows a Brain.

Oh thank god.

This is a nice resolution to a hosed up week. Ahhh...

# ? Aug 12, 2017 06:04

Paradoxish: Dec 19, 2003; Will you stop going crazy in there?

Grouchio posted:

In Which Trump Grows a Brain.

Oh thank god.

quote:

�Hopefully it will all work out,� he said. �Nobody loves a peaceful solution more than President Trump, that I can tell you � But we will see what happens. We think that lots of good things could happen, and we could also have a bad solution.�

But Trump also made it clear he is not backing down from his threats against Kim. Asked if the U.S. will go to war with North Korea, the president cryptically responded, �I think you know the answer to that.�

Asking Trump questions is a fascinating exercise in futility.

# ? Aug 12, 2017 06:11

Fojar38: Sep 2, 2011; Sorry I meant to say I hope that the police use maximum force and kill or maim a bunch of innocent people, thus paving a way for a proletarian uprising and socialist utopia

also here's a stupid take
---------------------------->

The answer everyone knows is "maybe"

"Are we going to war y/n" is like a textbook gotcha question

# ? Aug 12, 2017 06:42

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ? Jun 3, 2024 08:44

Paradoxish: Dec 19, 2003; Will you stop going crazy in there?

You get that the words of people in leadership positions actually matter, right? All three of these statements have essentially the same content:

I don't know, I haven't decided.
Maybe.
We'd prefer a peaceful solution, but we're keeping all options on the table.

But they convey drastically different messages. You can't just translate Trump's nonsense into something that a reasonable human being would say and then pretend that you've actually cracked the code and deciphered his true intentions.

# ? Aug 12, 2017 06:56

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > Korea Thread: Fumbling to take a bite of kimchi

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