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  • Locked thread
Young Freud
Nov 26, 2006

St. Dogbert posted:

Four words - Gasoline in Super Soakers.

Better idea, fill the lawn sprinklers with gasoline then program them to go off during the march.

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haveblue
Aug 15, 2005



Toilet Rascal

Avalanche posted:

I almost wish people would stop poking the loving hornet's nest with taking down statues or taking down crosses/ten commandments in courtrooms or whatever. Yea, that poo poo probably shouldn't be in those places, but it's more historical than anything and at least depicts the flawed beginnings of this country. Besides, what kind of rear end in a top hat complains about an 80 year old statue? Of all the problems and other poo poo going on in this country, tearing down a loving statue should be a pretty low priority. From a practical standpoint, it will probably cost the school a fuckton of money to deal with all the Nazi assholes congregating around the drat thing in addition to all of the construction costs to remove/replace it instead of just leaving it out in the cold to weather and slowly devolve into an unrecognizable hunk of stone/metal.

"Well, guess we can't clean out all of the jizz in the pipes from the male dorm room showers this year because the money set aside for that went to statue removal."

Coordinate the removals so they come down simultaneously in several different states. Turn all the Nazis into Buridan's assholes.

NmareBfly
Jul 16, 2004

I posted my food for USPOL Thanksgiving!


Avalanche posted:

but it's more historical than anything

Speaking for Lee Park specifically, the statue was erected in 1924 and has no relation to any particular historical event that happened near here. They just put up a statue of a general because that's what they wanted to put up -- just because it's been there for a while doesn't mean it's of historical value.

E: You also seem to think this statue has something direct to do with UVA. It does not.

Red Baron posted:

Did anyone even want to take down this statue? I thought this was another case of them just assuming Those Liberals would be there and so they showed up in numbers like last time.

Yep. It's been in the works for a while and is tied up in some legal wrangling -- war monuments are protected from removal by law, but this isn't a war monument so much as a monument featuring a guy that was in the war so it's not clear if it's covered.

Chef Boyardeez Nuts posted:

I feel like an effective counterprotest would have involved leis, a conga line and a limbo pole being constantly placed in front of thier column.


The recommended dress for counter-protesters includes clown outfits and tubas.

NmareBfly fucked around with this message at 14:44 on Aug 12, 2017

happyhippy
Feb 21, 2005

Playing games, watching movies, owning goons. 'sup
Pillbug
I am surprised the Confederate moment isn't just laughed at outright.
You have had 150+ years to 'rise again' and the best you could do is pretend cowboy and dress up your pick up trucks.

To give some credit Germany took less than 30 years to go from being beaten in one massive war (losing 4 million people) to nearly taking over the loving world.
The 'South shall rise again'?
150+ years and counting idiots.

C2C - 2.0
May 14, 2006

Dubs In The Key Of Life


Lipstick Apathy
https://twitter.com/_craigstanley/status/896349016929206272

Oh, it's going down!

mdemone
Mar 14, 2001

Avalanche posted:

I almost wish people would stop poking the loving hornet's nest with taking down statues or taking down crosses/ten commandments in courtrooms or whatever. Yea, that poo poo probably shouldn't be in those places, but it's more historical than anything and at least depicts the flawed beginnings of this country. Besides, what kind of rear end in a top hat complains about an 80 year old statue? Of all the problems and other poo poo going on in this country, tearing down a loving statue should be a pretty low priority. From a practical standpoint, it will probably cost the school a fuckton of money to deal with all the Nazi assholes congregating around the drat thing in addition to all of the construction costs to remove/replace it instead of just leaving it out in the cold to weather and slowly devolve into an unrecognizable hunk of stone/metal.

"Well, guess we can't clean out all of the jizz in the pipes from the male dorm room showers this year because the money set aside for that went to statue removal."

You're going to get enough poo poo for this post, so I'll just zoom in on the bolder part and say that these statues and monuments were not erected during the CW or Reconstruction, they were erected largely during the mid-20th century and into the civil rights era, and were always intended to be a power dynamic.

This is not historical preservation, this is revisionism at best, and intimidation at worst.

Eeyo
Aug 29, 2004

Avalanche posted:

I almost wish people would stop poking the loving hornet's nest with taking down statues or taking down crosses/ten commandments in courtrooms or whatever. Yea, that poo poo probably shouldn't be in those places, but it's more historical than anything and at least depicts the flawed beginnings of this country. Besides, what kind of rear end in a top hat complains about an 80 year old statue? Of all the problems and other poo poo going on in this country, tearing down a loving statue should be a pretty low priority. From a practical standpoint, it will probably cost the school a fuckton of money to deal with all the Nazi assholes congregating around the drat thing in addition to all of the construction costs to remove/replace it instead of just leaving it out in the cold to weather and slowly devolve into an unrecognizable hunk of stone/metal.

"Well, guess we can't clean out all of the jizz in the pipes from the male dorm room showers this year because the money set aside for that went to statue removal."

They're monuments to white supremacy - not a rememberance of the cost of the war on our nation. We should have memorials to that part of our history, but they need to not memorialize the the figures who helped defend the institution of slavery.

It really speaks volumes that literal nazis (literally saluting, using nazi slogans, marching not unlike nazis) feel threatened by this and came out to protest. That should be a sign that these statues aren't about a rememberence of the war or a celebration of culture but about white supremacy. Their presence and their actions make this explicit.

treasured8elief
Jul 25, 2011

Salad Prong

Red Baron posted:

Did anyone even want to take down this statue? I thought this was another case of them just assuming Those Liberals would be there and so they showed up in numbers like last time.
The city council voted to remove the Lee statue in April.

Slate - How Charlottesville, Virginia’s Confederate statues helped decimate the city’s historically successful black communities. posted:

In June a resolution to rename Charlottesville’s two Confederate parks was passed by the Charlottesville City Council unanimously. Lee Park, the home of a controversial Robert E. Lee statue that the council previously voted to remove, will become Emancipation Park, and Jackson Park, the home of a statue of Stonewall Jackson, will become Justice Park. Meanwhile, locals are working on ways to counteract a Ku Klux Klan rally, proposed for July 8, and an alt-right March on Charlottesville headed by Richard Spencer, proposed for Aug. 12, at the site of the Lee statue’s eventual removal.

On May 13, University of Virginia alum and alt-right activist Spencer led a nighttime rally in Lee Park in protest of the council’s plan to remove the statue. This protest brought national attention to the battle between local activists and the outside alt-right and white nationalist forces whose actions drew comparisons to the Klan.

What has been missing from this fight, though, is the specific history of Charlottesville’s Confederate statues is intimately tied to Charlottesville’s city planning projects and its persistent displacement of black residents, The statues of Jackson and Lee not only symbolize the violence of the ongoing displacements of gentrification; they also initiated and facilitated these changes when they were first put up. Strategically erecting these symbols of the Confederacy at the edges of or atop black and nonwhite immigrant communities provided Charlottesville’s white elite with a means of physically buttressing their ever-fragile hold of white supremacy.

Lee’s statue was unveiled before thousands of attendees on May 21, 1924, during a two-day gathering of the Sons of the Confederacy at which the city also saw KKK agitation. With the University of Virginia President Edwin Alderman giving the statue’s dedication before several Confederate memorial groups, the ceremony represented a partnership between the state university and national organizations of the Confederacy in the monumentalization of the Lost Cause.

While mob violence occurred relatively infrequently in the Shenandoah Valley, lynchings elsewhere in Virginia and the rest of the country were often a reaction to black economic success that counteracted white supremacist theories. Charlottesville’s thriving black neighborhood, Vinegar Hill, was a prime example of one of these successful communities. The Lee statue, which was erected just a few blocks from Vinegar Hill, sent an obvious message to residents: Public space, public institutions, and public success are not for you.

The Jackson statue, meanwhile, was dedicated in Charlottesville’s Court Square in 1921 during the year’s reunion of the Confederate Veterans and the Daughters of the Confederacy. Depicting Jackson riding his horse into battle, the monument was unveiled from underneath a massive Confederate flag with 5,000 Confederate-nostalgic revelers looking on.

This monument to Jackson lies atop what was once a majority-black area known as McKee Row. In 1914, the Albemarle County Board of Supervisors confiscated the land from its black residents and granted it to the city. The city justified its action by noting its concern about the “rowdy” activity from McKee Row interfering with the Levy Opera showgoers. It also cited concern regarding the presence of young, presumably white, men “slumming” through the McKee Row neighborhood.

To emphasize its punitive role vis-à-vis the black community, the statue itself was built over the former location of the Charlottesville jail. Panoptic and stern, the statue’s function was made clear in its position proximal to the former location of a whipping post.

Throughout the 20th century, the city of Charlottesville has precipitated multiple waves of urban renewal or gentrification. As James Baldwin put it, these sorts of efforts were actually more like “Negro removal.” The planning projects displaced black residents not only from their homes and communities, but from their businesses, their sources of wealth, and their proximity to institutions of socio-political power.

Installing Confederate monuments helped to facilitate and buttress these displacements both physically—by razing and demarcating the borders of black neighborhoods—and ideologically—by marking areas of political and financial power as part of the ideology of the Lost Cause. In the decades after the erection of the Lee statue, the best-known casualty in Charlottesville was Vinegar Hill.

A vibrant black neighborhood and business district effectively connecting the downtown mall to the University of Virginia, it was marked as “blighted” and completely razed in an urban renewal project in the mid-1960s. Its sole civic memorial is a small plaque at knee-height, obscured by potted vegetation, at the west end of the downtown mall shopping district. Its message, “Today Vinegar Hill is just a memory,” is a mere salve, while the Lee and Jackson statues are perpetual wounds.

The ongoing whitelash against removal of the Confederate statues doesn’t necessarily reflect the strength of white supremacy today. It is rather a sign of its enormous fragility. It is a sign that those who seek justice can win. Perhaps not all at once and almost certainly not once and for all. Recognizing not just the historic symbolism of these statues, but also their practical effects is a good first step.

happyhippy
Feb 21, 2005

Playing games, watching movies, owning goons. 'sup
Pillbug

The small cock brigade has arrived!

HappyHippo
Nov 19, 2003
Do you have an Air Miles Card?
https://twitter.com/AndyBCampbell/status/896353431597797377

Hollismason
Jun 30, 2007
An alright dude.
If you've never had a argument with someone who believes that Lee was a honorable man and that Lincoln in fact was the racists then consider yourself blessed because I have had to argue with a family member who believes that exact thing.

Red Baron
Mar 9, 2007
no lube anal fan

Someone is going to get shot. Even odds for anyone right now.

Tatsuta Age
Apr 21, 2005

so good at being in trouble


Have any GOP pols other than hatch condemned all this poo poo yet?

CAPS LOCK BROKEN
Feb 1, 2006

by Fluffdaddy

Tatsuta Age posted:

Have any GOP pols other than hatch condemned all this poo poo yet?

lol why condemn your base?

Endorph
Jul 22, 2009

Tatsuta Age posted:

Have any GOP pols other than hatch condemned all this poo poo yet?

theyre too busy wishing they could be there

Avalanche
Feb 2, 2007

tentative8e8op posted:

The city council voted to remove the Lee statue in April.In June a resolution to rename Charlottesville’s two Confederate parks was passed by the Charlottesville City Council unanimously. Lee Park, the home of a controversial Robert E. Lee statue that the council previously voted to remove, will become Emancipation Park, and Jackson Park, the home of a statue of Stonewall Jackson, will become Justice Park. Meanwhile, locals are working on ways to counteract a Ku Klux Klan rally, proposed for July 8, and an alt-right March on Charlottesville headed by Richard Spencer, proposed for Aug. 12, at the site of the Lee statue’s eventual removal.

On May 13, University of Virginia alum and alt-right activist Spencer led a nighttime rally in Lee Park in protest of the council’s plan to remove the statue. This protest brought national attention to the battle between local activists and the outside alt-right and white nationalist forces whose actions drew comparisons to the Klan.

What has been missing from this fight, though, is the specific history of Charlottesville’s Confederate statues is intimately tied to Charlottesville’s city planning projects and its persistent displacement of black residents, The statues of Jackson and Lee not only symbolize the violence of the ongoing displacements of gentrification; they also initiated and facilitated these changes when they were first put up. Strategically erecting these symbols of the Confederacy at the edges of or atop black and nonwhite immigrant communities provided Charlottesville’s white elite with a means of physically buttressing their ever-fragile hold of white supremacy.

Lee’s statue was unveiled before thousands of attendees on May 21, 1924, during a two-day gathering of the Sons of the Confederacy at which the city also saw KKK agitation. With the University of Virginia President Edwin Alderman giving the statue’s dedication before several Confederate memorial groups, the ceremony represented a partnership between the state university and national organizations of the Confederacy in the monumentalization of the Lost Cause.

While mob violence occurred relatively infrequently in the Shenandoah Valley, lynchings elsewhere in Virginia and the rest of the country were often a reaction to black economic success that counteracted white supremacist theories. Charlottesville’s thriving black neighborhood, Vinegar Hill, was a prime example of one of these successful communities. The Lee statue, which was erected just a few blocks from Vinegar Hill, sent an obvious message to residents: Public space, public institutions, and public success are not for you.

The Jackson statue, meanwhile, was dedicated in Charlottesville’s Court Square in 1921 during the year’s reunion of the Confederate Veterans and the Daughters of the Confederacy. Depicting Jackson riding his horse into battle, the monument was unveiled from underneath a massive Confederate flag with 5,000 Confederate-nostalgic revelers looking on.

This monument to Jackson lies atop what was once a majority-black area known as McKee Row. In 1914, the Albemarle County Board of Supervisors confiscated the land from its black residents and granted it to the city. The city justified its action by noting its concern about the “rowdy” activity from McKee Row interfering with the Levy Opera showgoers. It also cited concern regarding the presence of young, presumably white, men “slumming” through the McKee Row neighborhood.

To emphasize its punitive role vis-à-vis the black community, the statue itself was built over the former location of the Charlottesville jail. Panoptic and stern, the statue’s function was made clear in its position proximal to the former location of a whipping post.

Throughout the 20th century, the city of Charlottesville has precipitated multiple waves of urban renewal or gentrification. As James Baldwin put it, these sorts of efforts were actually more like “Negro removal.” The planning projects displaced black residents not only from their homes and communities, but from their businesses, their sources of wealth, and their proximity to institutions of socio-political power.

Installing Confederate monuments helped to facilitate and buttress these displacements both physically—by razing and demarcating the borders of black neighborhoods—and ideologically—by marking areas of political and financial power as part of the ideology of the Lost Cause. In the decades after the erection of the Lee statue, the best-known casualty in Charlottesville was Vinegar Hill.

A vibrant black neighborhood and business district effectively connecting the downtown mall to the University of Virginia, it was marked as “blighted” and completely razed in an urban renewal project in the mid-1960s. Its sole civic memorial is a small plaque at knee-height, obscured by potted vegetation, at the west end of the downtown mall shopping district. Its message, “Today Vinegar Hill is just a memory,” is a mere salve, while the Lee and Jackson statues are perpetual wounds.

The ongoing whitelash against removal of the Confederate statues doesn’t necessarily reflect the strength of white supremacy today. It is rather a sign of its enormous fragility. It is a sign that those who seek justice can win. Perhaps not all at once and almost certainly not once and for all. Recognizing not just the historic symbolism of these statues, but also their practical effects is a good first step.

Yea, ok tear the fucker down then.

Dr. VooDoo
May 4, 2006


AlternateNu posted:

The first thing I thought after looking at the photos of the Nazi rally was: "I want to fill a super soaker with kerosene and spray them with it."

Does this make me a bad person? :ohdear:

No. The only good Nazi is a dead Nazi. We determined this 70 years ago and it's still true today

Bucky Fullminster
Apr 13, 2007


It is the start of the Handmaids tale

Bucky Fullminster fucked around with this message at 15:04 on Aug 12, 2017

namaste friends
Sep 18, 2004

by Smythe

He's carrying at least two flashlights

HappyHippo
Nov 19, 2003
Do you have an Air Miles Card?

Tatsuta Age posted:

Have any GOP pols other than hatch condemned all this poo poo yet?

https://twitter.com/EdWGillespie/status/896347392563453956

maskenfreiheit
Dec 30, 2004

Red Baron posted:

Someone is going to get shot. Even odds for anyone right now.

prediction: at some point in the next 6 months, we're going to have a Kent State style incident - only it'll be peaceful protesters being shot by some fat nazi rather than the National Guard

Boris Galerkin
Dec 17, 2011

I don't understand why I can't harass people online. Seriously, somebody please explain why I shouldn't be allowed to stalk others on social media!

namaste faggots posted:

He's carrying at least two flashlights

People get reeeeeeaaaaallly into their flashlightstorches.

Red Baron
Mar 9, 2007
no lube anal fan

Dr. VooDoo posted:

No. The only good Nazi is a dead Nazi. We determined this 70 years ago and it's still true today

I still have some people I considered extremely liberal telling me that punching Nazis is not the answer. It's not even a pacifism thing, it's some high-minded "they can sayyyyyy ittt" as if we did not stage a surprise landing of 156,000 troops and team up with Russia to sandwich the fuckers between the unstoppable force of America and the unconquerable rock that is Russia. Even if you aren't a stalwart student of history every single loving depiction of Nazis is unabashedly evil, how could you possibly throw your hat in their ring. THEY ALREADY LOST!

maskenfreiheit posted:

prediction: at some point in the next 6 months, we're going to have a Kent State style incident - only it'll be peaceful protesters being shot by some fat nazi rather than the National Guard

My money is on a protest nearby to a Nativity scene and the shooter will say they thought the godless AntiFa was trying to desecrate Jesus. It will turn out the person was simply trying to film/photo from a safe distance. Rather than crystallizing the situation for everyone, it instead adds a layer of Religion to the current tension. Next round begins.

Red Baron fucked around with this message at 15:10 on Aug 12, 2017

Dr. VooDoo
May 4, 2006


maskenfreiheit posted:

prediction: at some point in the next 6 months, we're going to have a Kent State style incident - only it'll be peaceful protesters being shot by some fat nazi rather than the National Guard

Well if that happens it will be some crazy lone wolf whose reasons and motives will truly never be known :suicide:

Red Baron posted:

I still have some people I considered extremely liberal telling me that punching Nazis is not the answer. It's not even a pacifism thing, it's some high-minded "they can sayyyyyy ittt" as if we did not stage a surprise landing of 156,000 troops and team up with Russia to sandwich the fuckers between the unstoppable force of America and the unconquerable rock that is Russia. Even if you aren't a stalwart student of history every single loving depiction of Nazis is unabashedly evil, how could you possibly throw your hat in their ring. THEY ALREADY LOST!

They're under the impression that Nazis and fascists are like any typical political stance so they deserve their say. They don't understand the fascist doesn't argue and debate in good faith, that their only true rhetoric is violence and death, and that they grow like an infection in a political system until they have the strength to destroy and replace it with the oppression and desolation they dream of. Until they realize that liberals will always pat themselves on the back for taking "The High Road" by letting fascists spew their hate to show how much better they are for believing in the human rights that the fascist seeks to utterly destroy with contempt.

TLDR; gently caress hand wringing liberals, death to fascists

Dr. VooDoo fucked around with this message at 15:15 on Aug 12, 2017

Sloober
Apr 1, 2011

Red Baron posted:

I still have some people I considered extremely liberal telling me that punching Nazis is not the answer. It's not even a pacifism thing, it's some high-minded "they can sayyyyyy ittt" as if we did not stage a surprise landing of 156,000 troops and team up with Russia to sandwich the fuckers between the unstoppable force of America and the unconquerable rock that is Russia. Even if you aren't a stalwart student of history every single loving depiction of Nazis is unabashedly evil, how could you possibly throw your hat in their ring. THEY ALREADY LOST!


My money is on a protest nearby to a Nativity scene and the shooter will say they thought the godless AntiFa was trying to desecrate Jesus. It will turn out the person was simply trying to film/photo from a safe distance. Rather than crystallizing the situation for everyone, it instead adds a layer of Religion to the current tension. Next round begins.

Ask them what the solution they think will work is


Because its not going to work, these people are afraid of the changing world and the thought of being 'equal' with any one other person that isn't white. I don't think you can reach them with any particular language.

hanales
Nov 3, 2013
Is there a thread that will be tracking the charlottesville stuff?

Mr Ice Cream Glove
Apr 22, 2007

quote:

Chanting “White lives matter!” “You will not replace us!” and “Jews will not replace us!” several hundred white nationalists and white supremacists carrying torches marched in a parade through the University of Virginia campus Friday night.

The fast-paced march was made up almost exclusively of men in their 20s and 30s, though there were some who looked to be in their mid-teens. Beginning a little after 9:30 p.m., the march lasted 15 to 20 minutes before ending in skirmishes when the marchers were met by a small group of counterprotesters at the base of a statue of Thomas Jefferson, the university’s founder.

https://twitter.com/JoeHeim/status/896193233826525189

DaveWoo
Aug 14, 2004

Fun Shoe
You know what the real problem is, though:

https://mobile.twitter.com/NicoSGonzalez/status/896375107437735936

CAPS LOCK BROKEN
Feb 1, 2006

by Fluffdaddy

Dr. VooDoo posted:



They're under the impression that Nazis and fascists are like any typical political stance so they deserve their say. They don't understand the fascist doesn't argue and debate in good faith, that their only true rhetoric is violence and death, and that they grow like an infection in a political system until they have the strength to destroy and replace it with the oppression and desolation they dream of. Until they realize that liberals will always pat themselves on the back for taking "The High Road" by letting fascists spew their hate to show how much better they are for believing in the human rights that the fascist seeks to utterly destroy with contempt.

TLDR; gently caress hand wringing liberals, death to fascists

Maybe they do realize that and deep down inside don't really find nazism and fascism to be that unacceptable.

Whenever this country used to criticize the nazis for poo poo they did in the 30s before WWII they would point back and claim their policies were fully in line with American public policy (eugenics, sterilization of disabled people etc.)

Boon
Jun 21, 2005

by R. Guyovich
Timely.

I watched Gone With the Wind last night with my girl and I couldn't help but wish the worst on all characters at all times. I loving hate Confederates and the southern culture in general.

Almost cheered when Sherman arrived to Atlanta.

Koalas March
May 21, 2007



hanales posted:

Is there a thread that will be tracking the charlottesville stuff?

https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3830027

Mr Ice Cream Glove
Apr 22, 2007



namaste friends
Sep 18, 2004

by Smythe
Let's kick off this racial holy war

coyo7e
Aug 23, 2007

by zen death robot

Relentlessboredomm posted:

Jfc. What moron would throw a fit over a loving Robert E Lee statue under the age of 80? As an actual southerner from a southern family, it's absurd the general of the traitors gets treated with such deference even up to today much less right after he helped assist in the killing of thousands.
Most Southerners..?

Lee has been mythologized to an absolutely ludicrous extent. Most of the heaviest revisionism seems to have happened after 1960 for some odd reason.

There Bias Two
Jan 13, 2009
I'm not a good person


How many of them do you think would die of heart attacks and strokes after an hour of intense activity?

Lightning Lord
Feb 21, 2013

$200 a day, plus expenses

Well we're certainly not talking about Russia or the healthcare failure now are we

Red Baron
Mar 9, 2007
no lube anal fan

Peven Stan posted:

Maybe they do realize that and deep down inside don't really find nazism and fascism to be that unacceptable.

Whenever this country used to criticize the nazis for poo poo they did in the 30s before WWII they would point back and claim their policies were fully in line with American public policy (eugenics, sterilization of disabled people etc.)

For at least one of them I can tell they're hoping for some kind of enlightened outcome. I tried to say you can't reason with the unreasonable but, hey, I understand the desire to hope for better solutions that magically make people unfuck their ideas. Showing off an actual Nazi rally happening right the gently caress now has definitely gotten some traction this morning, maybe they'll hit the point where it comes into focus.

NmareBfly
Jul 16, 2004

I posted my food for USPOL Thanksgiving!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hWwoS0XeF9o

Here's a C'ville livestream.

NmareBfly fucked around with this message at 15:33 on Aug 12, 2017

Boon
Jun 21, 2005

by R. Guyovich

Lightning Lord posted:

Well we're certainly not talking about Russia or the healthcare failure now are we

Hmmm I think you'll find that enraged camel will be along shortly to tell you to 'gently caress right off'

Boon fucked around with this message at 15:36 on Aug 12, 2017

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Lightning Lord
Feb 21, 2013

$200 a day, plus expenses

Red Baron posted:

For at least one of them I can tell they're hoping for some kind of enlightened outcome. I tried to say you can't reason with the unreasonable but, hey, I understand the desire to hope for better solutions that magically make people unfuck their ideas. Showing off an actual Nazi rally happening right the gently caress now has definitely gotten some traction this morning, maybe they'll hit the point where it comes into focus.

The thing is, what is there to do when the cops are basically on their side?

  • Locked thread