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Danny Glands posted:We spend too much time bickering about the true religion that we ignore the French dogs at our door or the Moroccan vultures in the new world. Our foes anticipate the weakness conflict from within will cause. If the pillars of our house do not stand as one, the structure becomes naught but rubble. That's just it: the pillars of our house cannot stand if they are all angled in different directions! If we don't unite, we will be easy pickings for the vultures. Let there be no more bickering. Let us rejoin the one true religion, enforce its unity across our nation, and march forward as one to fend them off.
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Aug 11, 2017 01:09
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A house built of many stones held together by the mortar of a common Andalusian identity is stronger still, though. Don't try to tears stones from our walls in a misguided pursuit of unity, let us rather celebrate our diversity and the strength it lends us.
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Aug 11, 2017 01:18
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Crazycryodude posted:A house built of many stones held together by the mortar of a common Andalusian identity is stronger still, though. Don't try to tears stones from our walls in a misguided pursuit of unity, let us rather celebrate our diversity and the strength it lends us. Unity and diversity are antonyms. Thus there can be no true common Andalusi identity unless it really is held in common. One people, one faith, united. There is our identity!
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Aug 11, 2017 01:21
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AJ_Impy posted:Unity and diversity are antonyms. Thus there can be no true common Andalusi identity unless it really is held in common. One people, one faith, united. There is our identity! When did we actually have one unified faith? We've had Sunni, Satanism, and far-heretical sultans already, and I don't think the religious Ulema really ever had proper control or strength for a while now...Humanism and Dhimmi have been a part of Al-Andalusian identity for decades now, too. The majority of the Ulema just sided with an insane, divisive sultan and brought upon a civil war for the hope of more power/religious unity and got crushed. (And anyways, Shiism is totally the true faith  )...Like, if our interest is to stop revolts of our Dhimmi, maybe we should go for the plans and tools that help further our objective rather than needlessly antagonizing the Sultan, minority groups, and the other majlis factions? Trying to be the religious purity faction just gets us further relegated to "those annoying zealots" and gets us...what, exactly? That's a serious question, what do we gain from trying to have religious purity and forcing Sunnism? Edit: We're in a war with France, probably going to try to bloody Morocco in the near future, and have to deal with our colonies being consistently outmatched by other powers. Let's worry about a common Andalusian identity when we can at least be able to keep foreign powers from eyeing us as a entree every decade 
devildragon777 fucked around with this message at 05:33 on Aug 11, 2017 |
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Aug 11, 2017 05:25
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Dance Officer posted:If I remember it correctly, you lose cores when rebels secede. You actually keep cores if rebels secede, assuming you had the provinces as full cores and not territories. You lose cores when forced to release a nation in a peace deal.
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Aug 11, 2017 05:34
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 Check out my political cartoon that only ghosts can see 
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Aug 11, 2017 15:42
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Flavius Belisarius posted:
I didn't know Bob Gorrell was a ghost.
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Aug 11, 2017 16:00
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Ralepozozaxe posted:I didn't know Bob Gorrell was a ghost. 
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Aug 11, 2017 16:59
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Flavius Belisarius posted:
 Wow! Such a biting and insightful commentary on Merchant League policies.
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Aug 11, 2017 17:23
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devildragon777 posted:When did we actually have one unified faith? We've had Sunni, Satanism, and far-heretical sultans already, and I don't think the religious Ulema really ever had proper control or strength for a while now...Humanism and Dhimmi have been a part of Al-Andalusian identity for decades now, too. The majority of the Ulema just sided with an insane, divisive sultan and brought upon a civil war for the hope of more power/religious unity and got crushed. (And anyways, Shiism is totally the true faith Agreed wholeheartedly. Let's ensure we're all unified in faith at home so we can face all these external threats without getting torn to shreds. This 'common Andalusian identity' thing was mainly a rhetorical trick of the merchants anyway. One thing, though: A sizable proportion of the Ulama, faithful Sunni to a man, sided against the insane, divisive Sultan, fought in the civil war for religious unity and crushed the insane one and his Dhimmi followers. They acceded to the current lineage of Sultans, but did not forsake their faith. It goes both ways: As much as people might want to scapegoat the Ulama, it is an undeniable fact they were well represented on the winning side, and the memory of those that were will not be tarnished by politically expedient revisionism.
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Aug 11, 2017 18:00
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What a way to learn that I've died.
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Aug 11, 2017 19:09
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Flavius Belisarius posted:
Another classic!
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Aug 11, 2017 19:50
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AJ_Impy posted:That's just it: the pillars of our house cannot stand if they are all angled in different directions! If we don't unite, we will be easy pickings for the vultures. Let there be no more bickering. Let us rejoin the one true religion, enforce its unity across our nation, and march forward as one to fend them off. You do realise that the Prophet (peace be upon him) himself spoke of the concept of Dhimmi himself at a time when the faith was still fighting for its very existence? The fact you have apparently decided your mediocre, at best, judgement somehow is superior to his is proof enough of your hypocrisy. We have come away from the greatest catastrophe our nation ever faced, and you would foster more division! But perhaps, you are right. We cannot afford to be blindly tolerant. We should not regard tolerance as a matter of absolutism; rather, as a peace treaty with our fellow citizens. Those who break it must be crushed, but should not needlessly tar entire groups of peoples with one brush. Or else the enitre Ulemas would be executed for your rhetoric. Does that seem fair?
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Aug 11, 2017 21:19
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Yvonmukluk posted:You do realise that the Prophet (peace be upon him) himself spoke of the concept of Dhimmi himself at a time when the faith was still fighting for its very existence? The fact you have apparently decided your mediocre, at best, judgement somehow is superior to his is proof enough of your hypocrisy. The Dhimmi contract is the payment of taxes for the protection of the state. When the so-called Dhimmis deliberately rebel against that state, forcefully oppose that protection, and do not pay their dues, they can no longer be said to be subject to the contract, eschewing the protections the Prophet (peace be unto him) laid down, Thus, it is not we who have stripped the Dhimmi status from them, but they who have stripped it from themselves when they sided with the Mad Sultan and his wicked ways. They raise themselves up in opposition to the true faith, thus the grace and magnanimity of the true faith towards them cannot be realised. They have rejected the Koran and chosen the sword.
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Aug 11, 2017 21:28
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AJ_Impy posted:Agreed wholeheartedly. Let's ensure we're all unified in faith at home so we can face all these external threats without getting torn to shreds. This 'common Andalusian identity' thing was mainly a rhetorical trick of the merchants anyway. ...That's the exact opposite of what I was saying though? We don't need to be unified in faith, or really try to force it; Fighing off external powers is of much more immediacy, if nothing else. AJ_Impy posted:One thing, though: A sizable proportion of the Ulama, faithful Sunni to a man, sided against the insane, divisive Sultan, fought in the civil war for religious unity and crushed the insane one and his Dhimmi followers. They acceded to the current lineage of Sultans, but did not forsake their faith. It goes both ways: As much as people might want to scapegoat the Ulama, it is an undeniable fact they were well represented on the winning side, and the memory of those that were will not be tarnished by politically expedient revisionism. ...I'm not sure the two of us represented the sizable proportion of the Ulema, but okay. devildragon777 fucked around with this message at 22:00 on Aug 11, 2017 |
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Aug 11, 2017 21:54
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devildragon777 posted:...I'm not sure the two of us represented the sizable proportion of the Ulema, but okay. The Ulama was split half and half between those who sided with the mad sultan and those who did not. We and our silent brethren represent fully half the prewar faction.
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Aug 11, 2017 22:16
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Can we move past the terrible Memri TV talking points?
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Aug 11, 2017 22:38
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Sheikh Vali of the Vali dynasty has been ruling over the Vali Sheikhdom since time immemorial, I tell you! May he rule evermore! edit:btw, retaking portugal may be slightly harder than anticipated hashashash fucked around with this message at 23:25 on Aug 11, 2017 |
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Aug 11, 2017 23:19
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And it's that kind of consistency that's made them so successful! If only the Jizrunids had realized this secret earlier, the Mediterranean and Caribbean would've been ours for centuries!
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Aug 11, 2017 23:22
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Hashim posted:edit:btw, retaking portugal may be slightly harder than anticipated Oh boy.
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Aug 12, 2017 00:00
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Alliance with Morocco? My money's on alliance with Morocco. E: Or the Celts.
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Aug 12, 2017 00:08
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The Celts are Defender of the Faith. I'll try and wait it out, but if they've still got it in a few years, I'll have to declare war anyways.
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Aug 12, 2017 00:09
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See, I knew I should have put a few more caveats and escape clauses in that act. At least this means the war with France went okay! Probably!
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Aug 12, 2017 00:17
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As long as the ai is dumb and tries to land armies piece meal, we should be able to hold our ground, and Portugal will be defenseless anyway. Right? Right? oh dear
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Aug 12, 2017 00:29
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Oh my, how completely unexpected.
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Aug 12, 2017 01:03
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Remember how faithful Sunni, Jizrunid Palermo was
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Aug 12, 2017 01:05
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Rodyle posted:Remember how faithful Sunni, Jizrunid Palermo was Or our eternal friends in Morocco
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Aug 12, 2017 01:13
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Nevermind, i misread a post
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Aug 12, 2017 02:20
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Proposed names for Vali's Victoria 2 parties: Conservatives: Valians Reactionaries: Ultra-Valians Liberals: Valites Anarcho-Liberals: Ultra-Valites Socialists: Valiots Communists: Ultra-Valiots Fascists: Vali Vali Vali
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Aug 12, 2017 03:07
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Prediction: we get Portugal back, but see quarter of our colonies burned to the ground.
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Aug 12, 2017 03:22
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Snipee posted:Prediction: we get Portugal back, but see quarter of our colonies burned to the ground. let's be honest if people are still going to the colonies then they know what they're in for
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Aug 12, 2017 04:02
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Agean90 posted:let's be honest if people are still going to the colonies then they know what they're in for Castration. The answer is always castration. The only question is what's the question.
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Aug 12, 2017 06:38
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TildeATH posted:Castration. The answer is always castration. How do you cure lung cancer?
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Aug 12, 2017 10:21
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Agean90 posted:let's be honest if people are still going to the colonies then they know what they're in for this raises a good point, why would anybody want to go to the colonies? it seems like that's a good way to get murdered and your home burned down every few years. each of our colonsy should consist of like 3 Guys.
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Aug 12, 2017 15:55
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Ikasuhito posted:this raises a good point, why would anybody want to go to the colonies? it seems like that's a good way to get murdered and your home burned down every few years. each of our colonsy should consist of like 3 Guys. When our ex-Grand Vizier demanded to be made the king of Ibriz, I was wondering why anyone would want that
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Aug 12, 2017 16:07
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Ikasuhito posted:this raises a good point, why would anybody want to go to the colonies? it seems like that's a good way to get murdered and your home burned down every few years. each of our colonsy should consist of like 3 Guys. You kidding, right? I mean, have you seen our homeland recently? First the many wars under Utman III, then the greatest civil war in European history the Fitna during which we were invaded once again, and now finally the reign of Al-Mushin when we were once again invaded and had our asses collectively handed to us until our northern enemy got dogpiled by its many neighbours. Sure, the colonies get their fair share of warfare and invasions, but by large they're significantly better off there than in wartorn Iberia.
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Aug 12, 2017 16:35
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Luhood posted:You kidding, right? I mean, have you seen our homeland recently? First the many wars under Utman III, then the greatest civil war in European history the Fitna during which we were invaded once again, and now finally the reign of Al-Mushin when we were once again invaded and had our asses collectively handed to us until our northern enemy got dogpiled by its many neighbours. You know, I'm thinking all those Moroccan colonies are full of Andalusi refugees
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Aug 12, 2017 16:40
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I'm pretty sure the people going to the colonies are religious and ethnic groups looking to escape discrimination. Also lots of Africans as slaves. Considering Muslim powers are colonizers, the Atlantic slave trade must have started in earnest way earlier than OTL.
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Aug 12, 2017 17:27
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Dance Officer posted:I'm pretty sure the people going to the colonies are religious and ethnic groups looking to escape discrimination. Also lots of Africans as slaves. Considering Muslim powers are colonizers, the Atlantic slave trade must have started in earnest way earlier than OTL. Why take slaves from Africa, when there's a whole continent of infidels to the north?
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Aug 12, 2017 17:35
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AJ_Impy posted:Why take slaves from Africa, when there's a whole continent of infidels to the north? Tropical diseases would be one obvious answer. I want to imagine a more humane slavery in this timeline because the Arabs weren't as brutal as the European in OTL.
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Aug 12, 2017 18:24
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