terrible programmers: my god, it's full of chars

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Hunter2 Thompson: Feb 3, 2005; Ramrod XTreme

cmake does seem to work magic but I wish there were better guides / tutorials on how to actually use it effectively for all but the most basic projects.

The docs are pretty good at describing the individual parts of cmake and what the are supposed to do, but they fail (to me, a terrible programmer) at effectively describing the gestalt of cmake, like what's the bigger picture maaaan?

I guess I should check out llvm as an example of a real-life cmake project

# ? Aug 11, 2017 23:39

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# ? May 26, 2024 16:57

a witch: Jan 12, 2017

MALE SHOEGAZE posted:

i need a new project, what's a fun low level / systems programming thing i can implement

maybe ill try to do stuff with cgroups / namespaces

I learned rust by doing a minimal png encoder, from DEFLATE up

# ? Aug 11, 2017 23:42

Ellie Crabcakes: Feb 1, 2008; Stop emailing my boyfriend Gay Crungus

Powerful Two-Hander posted:

doesn't work for me, im just getting some kind of overflow on the socket

This should emit a warning, but in the transition from horseboners.js, the routing syntax has changed. :: is no longer valid when chaining endpoints. I know, I know, significant whitespace and all, but there should be a tab between them. Why, I'm not sure.

So unless you want your scripts to die, please widen your colons before using mrhands.js

# ? Aug 11, 2017 23:47

Slurps Mad Rips: Jan 25, 2009; Bwaltow!

meatpotato posted:

cmake does seem to work magic but I wish there were better guides / tutorials on how to actually use it effectively for all but the most basic projects.

The docs are pretty good at describing the individual parts of cmake and what the are supposed to do, but they fail (to me, a terrible programmer) at effectively describing the gestalt of cmake, like what's the bigger picture maaaan?

I guess I should check out llvm as an example of a real-life cmake project

their docs have gotten better. it used to be one massive html web page, with no way of knowing what was added or removed between versions

cmake is loving garbage and so are all the other build systems. meson is the least terrible but makes a bunch of bad decisions in its own right.

the best part is i get to rip all these build systems a new one in a talk im giving at CppCon this year

# ? Aug 12, 2017 00:50

Lutha Mahtin: Oct 10, 2010; Your brokebrain sin is absolved...go and shitpost no more!

the build system google pushes for android (gradle) is written in groovy. recently, they changed the way they distribute the android support libraries, which are how you can backport newer features to run on old/walmart anroids. previously you got it through the android SDK downloader, but now you get it by adding some text to your gradle build files. the text for the server URL is

code:


allprojects {
    repositories {
        jcenter()
        maven {
            url "https://maven.google.com"
        }
    }
}

# ? Aug 12, 2017 00:54

Shaggar: Apr 26, 2006

gradle is so bad

# ? Aug 12, 2017 00:55

akadajet: Sep 14, 2003

Shaggar posted:

gradle is so bad

whoa. shaggar was right about something

# ? Aug 12, 2017 01:15

Mao Zedong Thot: Oct 16, 2008

akadajet posted:

whoa. shaggar was right about something

this is countered by his assertion that groovy is good (well and everything ever)

# ? Aug 12, 2017 01:26

DONT THREAD ON ME: Oct 1, 2002; by Nyc_Tattoo; Floss Finder

VOTE YES ON 69 posted:

this is countered by his assertion that groovy is good (well and everything ever)

yeah, i'd rather be caught mowing down bicyclists in my car than programming groovy

# ? Aug 12, 2017 01:32

akadajet: Sep 14, 2003

MALE SHOEGAZE posted:

yeah, i'd rather be caught mowing down bicyclists in my car than programming groovy

that is, i wouldn't want to do either

# ? Aug 12, 2017 01:35

DONT THREAD ON ME: Oct 1, 2002; by Nyc_Tattoo; Floss Finder

what is going on with these kubernetes tutorials, i thought kubernetes was state of the art but this is like a reactive corporate training module: https://kubernetes.io/docs/tutorials/kubernetes-basics/cluster-interactive/

# ? Aug 12, 2017 01:41

DONT THREAD ON ME: Oct 1, 2002; by Nyc_Tattoo; Floss Finder

i built my parents a website 6 or 7 years ago when i was learning this poo poo. it's basically a CMS for video with streaming capabilities and the ability to "share" links to private videos hosted on the CMS.

anyhow, they want me to do some work on it, and i havent touched this thing in 5 years. so tonight i'm assessing the situation.

discoveries so far:

-- i made a git archive of master and it was over 1gb because I'd been checking videos into git
-- I'm not going to tell you the permissions on the application tree, because frankly, i'm embarrassed
-- application is running on sqlite, which is probably just fine at this scale, but still funny
-- took me like an hour to log into the box because i'd turned off AllowRootLogin and Password based auth in ssh, and also blocked all ssh traffic except for whitelisted IPs, so I guess i did something right
-- the application is hosted out of /Volumes/CMS/cms, I guess I must have originally hosted the thing on my dad's mac?

Apparently hosting a web app out of /Volumes didn't make selinux very happy:

code:

$ sestatus
SELinux status:                 disabled

I haven't started looking at the code yet. I'm very excited to see how i implemented the secret-link based video sharing, I'm sure it's rock solid.

# ? Aug 12, 2017 01:56

DONT THREAD ON ME: Oct 1, 2002; by Nyc_Tattoo; Floss Finder

ok this is just stupid:
http://docs.diesel.rs/diesel/macro.infer_table_from_schema.html

# ? Aug 12, 2017 02:24

CPColin: Sep 9, 2003; Big ol' smile.

My first full week of my new job was 90% Scrum training and we had the instructor for one last day today, during which people who knew more (read: anything) about what was going on asked him about various TFS and Visual Studio stuff. I asked how the team currently pushes database changes and, as I expected, somebody said they have to do it by hand, probably while the build server churns.

Then the instructor showed off SQL Server Data Tools, which, get this, can import your current database schema and store it in your project so you can check it into source control! It even diffs the schemas between environments and writes the script for you that makes them match! What a dream come true!

He called it "the best thing Microsoft does that nobody knows about."

# ? Aug 12, 2017 02:40

Shaggar: Apr 26, 2006

VOTE YES ON 69 posted:

this is countered by his assertion that groovy is good (well and everything ever)

groovy is better than python ruby or javascript

# ? Aug 12, 2017 02:41

Workaday Wizard: Oct 23, 2009; by Pragmatica

hobbesmaster posted:

http://developer.mbed.org

the online ide uses the keil compiler. there is also a light edition of uvision that's free for the smallest m0s

why wait for hackers to steal your not-yet-patented ip when you can upload it to the cloud directly :pram:

# ? Aug 12, 2017 02:41

pokeyman: Nov 26, 2006; That elephant ate my entire platoon.

Shaggar posted:

groovy is better than python ruby or javascript

because it�s by far the least popular and so does less total damage than the others?

# ? Aug 12, 2017 02:51

akadajet: Sep 14, 2003

Shaggar posted:

groovy is better than python ruby or javascript

it's probably on par with ruby, at best. python and javascript are real programming languages used for real stuff.

# ? Aug 12, 2017 02:58

hobbesmaster: Jan 28, 2008

Shinku ABOOKEN posted:

why wait for hackers to steal your not-yet-patented ip when you can upload it to the cloud directly

that ship sailed years and years ago

# ? Aug 12, 2017 03:02

DONT THREAD ON ME: Oct 1, 2002; by Nyc_Tattoo; Floss Finder

back when i tried to learn groovy half of the links in the documentation were broken

# ? Aug 12, 2017 03:02

Ellie Crabcakes: Feb 1, 2008; Stop emailing my boyfriend Gay Crungus

Does JRuby/Jython/JWhatever compile to JVM bytecode or is there an embedded interpreter? I was a little less clear on that as to the point of them in the first place, save the entirely obvious one.

# ? Aug 12, 2017 03:41

JewKiller 3000: Nov 28, 2006; by Lowtax

groovy isn't better than anything, but maven is absolutely better than gradle, this is not up for debate

# ? Aug 12, 2017 03:52

Mao Zedong Thot: Oct 16, 2008

John Big Booty posted:

Does JRuby/Jython/JWhatever compile to JVM bytecode or is there an embedded interpreter? I was a little less clear on that as to the point of them in the first place, save the entirely obvious one.

to bytecode

the point being you can write a language less horrible than java, and use the jvm (offer not valid for jruby, or groovy)

# ? Aug 12, 2017 04:11

Luigi Thirty: Apr 30, 2006; Emergency confection port.

it works, high resolution graphics

(in black and white)

# ? Aug 12, 2017 04:21

Workaday Wizard: Oct 23, 2009; by Pragmatica

Luigi Thirty posted:

it works, high resolution graphics

(in black and white)

i love the emulator name ❤️

# ? Aug 12, 2017 04:23

Arcteryx Anarchist: Sep 15, 2007; Fun Shoe

MALE SHOEGAZE posted:

back when i tried to learn groovy half of the links in the documentation were broken

groovy and grails have had a rough ownership history and im feeling like they're probably on the way out

like I remember the old website when I was tasked to play with it a bit as an intern when it was pretty new, a bit from when it was picked up by springsource, and boy howdy has it been a wild ride

quote:

After the Java Community Process (JCP) standardization effort began, the version numbering changed, and a version called "1.0" was released on January 2, 2007. After various betas and release candidates numbered 1.1, on December 7, 2007, Groovy 1.1 Final was released and immediately renumbered as Groovy 1.5 to reflect the many changes made.

In 2007, Groovy won the first prize at JAX 2007 innovation award. In 2008, Grails, a Groovy web framework, won the second prize at JAX 2008 innovation award.

In November 2008, SpringSource acquired the Groovy and Grails company (G2One). In August 2009 VMWare acquired SpringSource.

In April 2012, after eight years of inactivity, the Spec Lead changed the status of JSR 241 to dormant.

Strachan had left the project silently a year before the Groovy 1.0 release in 2007. In Oct 2016, Strachan stated "I still love groovy (jenkins pipelines are so groovy!), java, go, typescript and kotlin".

On July 2, 2012, Groovy 2.0 was released, which, among other new features, added static compiling and static type checking.

When the Pivotal Software joint venture was spun-off by EMC Corporation (EMC) and VMware in April 2013, Groovy and Grails formed part of its product portfolio. Pivotal ceased sponsoring Groovy and Grails from April 2015. That same month, Groovy changed its governance structure from a Codehaus repository to a Project Management Committee (PMC) in the Apache Software Foundation via its incubator. Groovy graduated from Apache's incubator and became a top-level project in November 2015

# ? Aug 12, 2017 04:30

The MUMPSorceress: Jan 6, 2012; ^SHTPSTS; Gary’s Answer

JewKiller 3000 posted:

groovy isn't better than anything, but maven is absolutely better than gradle, this is not up for debate

# ? Aug 12, 2017 04:42

gonadic io: Feb 16, 2011; >>=

Doom Mathematic posted:

no oxford comma

# ? Aug 12, 2017 08:18

Soricidus: Oct 21, 2010; freedom-hating statist shill

I want to like jython but it has absolutely horrible performance (particularly startup time) and doesn't really integrate with java all that well

and the "it's python! everybody knows python!" factor is shrinking rapidly as the python everybody knows is increasingly python 3

# ? Aug 12, 2017 10:26

NihilCredo: Jun 6, 2011; iram omni possibili modo preme:
plus una illa te diffamabit, quam multæ virtutes commendabunt

if you want jvm + dynamic typing is there any reason not to go with clojure

my limited understanding is that lisps with their macro are the closest thing to a legit reason for dynamic typing that exists

plus there's some sexy tools in the clojure ecosystem, e.g. datomic

# ? Aug 12, 2017 10:37

Workaday Wizard: Oct 23, 2009; by Pragmatica

NihilCredo posted:

(datomic (e.g. (ecosystem, (clojure (the (in (tools (sexy (some (there's (plus (exists (that (typing (dynamic (for (reason (legit (a (to (thing (closest (the (are (macro (their (with (lisps (that (is (understanding (limited (my (clojure (with (go (to (not (reason (any (there (is (typing (dynamic (+ (jvm (want (you (if ))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

i don't know

# ? Aug 12, 2017 14:42

Lutha Mahtin: Oct 10, 2010; Your brokebrain sin is absolved...go and shitpost no more!

im the ))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

# ? Aug 12, 2017 15:14

Shaggar: Apr 26, 2006

pokeyman posted:

because it�s by far the least popular and so does less total damage than the others?

yeah but more importantly you can write straight up java and ignore the groovy stuff so if those 4 are your choices groovy is the obvious winner.

# ? Aug 12, 2017 15:15

Workaday Wizard: Oct 23, 2009; by Pragmatica

kotlin would be even better since it's literally java with some sugar. not a brand new thing.

# ? Aug 12, 2017 15:30

Notorious b.s.d.: Jan 25, 2003; by Reene

tef posted:

um the implementation doesn't matter or the technical skills, it's if you know the right people to ask for money

then it goes a little something like

slide 1. the problem

a bunch of stuff on one side is talking to a bunch of stuff, but it is a mess, oh no

and not everything talks to everything else

slide 2. the dream

now they all talk to one point, represented as a cloud

slide 3. the pitch

same as slide 2, but the startup logo is on the cloud, and you explain why you have some magic ingredient that your competitors don't have, and maybe some whacky sub-plot that won't work long term but might attract a bunch of press and attention your way

and the buyouts aren't that much unless you're a high-status company in the first place, companies will pay more for user base, maybe adoption is harder than hiring

so like

slide 1: people need to get from place to place but take all of these different things
slide 2: what if they could take one thing for every journey, ad-hoc
slide 3: uber logo

slide 1: developers struggle to put software into production, and there is a lot of amazon lock in
slide 2: what if they could use one tool to handle ci, cd and ensure local and production environments run the same, and maybe not use amazon
slide 3: docker logo

you aren't selling investors a technology, you're selling them a market you plan to control

you sell the technology to tech journalists

i'm glad tef is back

edit: because this is a rly good post

Notorious b.s.d. fucked around with this message at 16:04 on Aug 12, 2017

# ? Aug 12, 2017 16:01

Notorious b.s.d.: Jan 25, 2003; by Reene

NihilCredo posted:

if you want jvm + dynamic typing is there any reason not to go with clojure

my limited understanding is that lisps with their macro are the closest thing to a legit reason for dynamic typing that exists

plus there's some sexy tools in the clojure ecosystem, e.g. datomic

clojure is horrendously slow and the type system is useless. it's "dynamic" in the sense that python is dynamic: you can't express any useful ideas or enforce any program invariants with the type system.

if you wanted an interactive language with more flexible types than java, you probably wanted scala.

added bonus: scala actually has users

# ? Aug 12, 2017 16:02

Notorious b.s.d.: Jan 25, 2003; by Reene

Shaggar posted:

groovy is better than python ruby or javascript

javascript is built into java now

you can write js that calls directly into java apis :getin:

# ? Aug 12, 2017 16:03

carry on then: Jul 10, 2010; by VideoGames
(and can't post for 10 years!)

considering the amount of people who think developing for multiple platforms is intractable unless you use javascript, i'm surprised it took this long for that to happen

# ? Aug 12, 2017 16:05

Notorious b.s.d.: Jan 25, 2003; by Reene

carry on then posted:

considering the amount of people who think developing for multiple platforms is intractable unless you use javascript, i'm surprised it took this long for that to happen

js implementations using the javax.script APIs have been kicking around for a long time, but they were 3rd party (e.g. mozilla rhino)

java 8 (2014) added js as one of the default things that comes with java, so now every java is guaranteed to also have a javascript engine sitting right there

# ? Aug 12, 2017 16:08

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# ? May 26, 2024 16:57

brap: Aug 23, 2004; Grimey Drawer

if I were starting a personal project for some jvm thing today I would probably pick kotlin

# ? Aug 12, 2017 16:45

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Serious Hardware/Software Crap > YOSPOS > terrible programmers: my god, it's full of chars

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