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stone cold posted:it's not even a right here lol exactly!!! nazis are a clear and present danger! their rhetoric is intended to cause lawless action, and does! so why are people trying to pretend that's protected speech? it's not protected speech when it comes to black people. white people get unbelievable benefit of the doubt though. we're supposed to believe these people honestly, earnestly hope and advocate for a racially pure america, but will not use violence to achieve that? or that their rhetoric won't inspire others to violence? 
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Aug 13, 2017 08:42
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Boris Galerkin posted:This is what I was talking about yesterday for fucks sake. gently caress this "I disagree with them but will allow them to say it" bullshit. gently caress you and gently caress everybody who thinks that. Sorry the Nazis should be allowed freely protest because if they murder in a moment of uncontrollable white rage they will be place in a cage and maybe convicted of said murder.
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Aug 13, 2017 08:42
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muon posted:I believe you'll find the constitution quite clear where their powers lie on this point then. You have the right to a platform, you don't have the right to any specific platform.
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Aug 13, 2017 08:43
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CommissarMega posted:I admit, I teared up a little at this. Good on Chuck for saving that kid, and thank God they're both relatively all right. Alive, at least. The point at which a completely peaceful resolution was possible has more or less passed, too many Narrativists have achieved a sufficiently high level of Compaction for their to not be violence. The questions at this point are really 1.)how much violence will there be? and 2.)how far will the violence spread spread? While a peaceful solution is always preferab le there are times when man is forcedd to fight for his svurival and this is unfortunately one of those times. So on that front I feel that the physical confrontation that Antifa is offering up is the best possible answer under the present circumstances. (there are certainly better theoretical responses but those also require theoretical conditions that do not translate to our present situation). There are longer-term soluitions that involve changing how the left markets itself and creates its narratives and I am working at present on a podcast centered around those ideas, but for now physical confrontation of the Alt-Right wherever and whenever they assemble is in my view the best (currently) possible response.
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Aug 13, 2017 08:43
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The problem with taking away free speech from Nazis is how do you know who to punch if they don't say anything?
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Aug 13, 2017 08:43
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Condiv posted:exactly!!! nazis are a clear and present danger! their rhetoric is intended to cause lawless action, and does! so why are people trying to pretend that's protected speech? get this, society and institutions are stacked to go easy on white supremacists
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Aug 13, 2017 08:43
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Push El Burrito posted:The problem with taking away free speech from Nazis is how do you know who to punch if they don't say anything? Look for the ((( ))) when they speak.
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Aug 13, 2017 08:43
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muon posted:Please do not advocate for limiting other people's 1st Amendment rights. Thank you. who's advocating that the government should curtail their speech? e: ps - freedom of speech is poo poo anyhow
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Aug 13, 2017 08:44
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just punch everyone and let god sort em out
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Aug 13, 2017 08:44
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Gort posted:I'm sure this is a great comfort to the dead and wounded. Maybe something should have been done to prevent it getting to the point where twenty good people are getting mowed down by hateful shitstains. I agree. The Charlottesville PD were woefully incompetent and should be held to account. Sadly they won't be.
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Aug 13, 2017 08:45
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is muon not aware that there are in fact existing legal limits on freedom of speech
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Aug 13, 2017 08:45
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JawKnee posted:who's advocating that the government should curtail their speech? Uh, I am. If you're a Nazi, I think the government should be able to curtail your speech. Like we did in the 1940s. It worked really well, I guess we just need a booster shot.
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Aug 13, 2017 08:45
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stone cold posted:is muon not aware that there are in fact existing legal limits on freedom of speech 100% no
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Aug 13, 2017 08:46
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Red Baron posted:Uh, I am. If you're a Nazi, I think the government should be able to curtail your speech. Like we did in the 1940s. It worked really well, I guess we just need a booster shot. fair enough though I think you're pissing in the wind with your current government
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Aug 13, 2017 08:46
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stone cold posted:is muon not aware that there are in fact existing legal limits on freedom of speech I guess I didn't expect such pushback on a view I share with the ACLU.
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Aug 13, 2017 08:46
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muon posted:I guess I didn't expect such pushback on a view I share with the ACLU. is the ACLU always right?
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Aug 13, 2017 08:47
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gently caress the aclu
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Aug 13, 2017 08:47
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stone cold posted:is muon not aware that there are in fact existing legal limits on freedom of speech paracaidas apparently isn't either, since he believes that nazi rhetoric doesn't fall under the legal definition of incitement to violence meanwhile the government does believe black panther rhetoric is incitment to violence when read from a book by a black inmate
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Aug 13, 2017 08:47
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JawKnee posted:fair enough though I think you're pissing in the wind with your current government Well, yeah, I just think it should be within their power to do so in the case of the blindingly obvious.
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Aug 13, 2017 08:47
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This needs some sort of trump branding. "MAGA"
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Aug 13, 2017 08:48
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muon posted:I guess I didn't expect such pushback on a view I share with the ACLU. it's because the ACLU is wrong. 
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Aug 13, 2017 08:48
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muon posted:I guess I didn't expect such pushback on a view I share with the ACLU. buddy, imminent lawless action has been a thing since brandenburg slander and libel child porn none of these are protected speech i don't think the ACLU defends child porn lol
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Aug 13, 2017 08:48
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im not going to say the counter protesters did or did not do anything but they sure as hell do a good job of signal boosting the alt-right people's message thanks to the extra media attention they draw (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Aug 13, 2017 08:48
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Jippa posted:This needs some sort of trump branding. "MAGA" just need to juxtapose it with that flagpole wielding nazi from the 50's or whenever taking a swing at a guy
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Aug 13, 2017 08:49
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Snazzy Frocks posted:im not going to say the counter protesters did or did not do anything but they sure as hell do a good job of signal boosting the alt-right people's message thanks to the extra media attention they draw lol e: I'm not going to say whether I took a poo poo earlier or not but FAAAAAAAAART
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Aug 13, 2017 08:49
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Keep in mind that most of these people consider BLM a domestic terrorist group because protests might inconvenience drivers but what happened in Charlottesville is protected speech.
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Aug 13, 2017 08:50
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imagine that the words "Kill <name of you, the reader>" are painted tastefully onto a canvas and mounted in your local library, is that protected free speech? There will be a tiny disclaimer at the bottom saying "this is not actionable speech. do not kill <name>." and another note saying "we at the library do not endorse any views of artists on display." just to make it certain that this is only about pure expression and exchange of ideas. Would you feel safe about this happening in your town, to you? Is there any benefit to public welfare in allowing it to happen? Okay now imagine it says kill blacks and the library is mainstream news sites or college campuses allowing that message to spread. Rodatose fucked around with this message at 08:52 on Aug 13, 2017 |
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Aug 13, 2017 08:50
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Snazzy Frocks posted:im not going to say the counter protesters did or did not do anything but they sure as hell do a good job of signal boosting the alt-right people's message thanks to the extra media attention they draw this is one of the dumbest arguments there is "if we pretend the nazis don't exist, they'll go away!!"
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Aug 13, 2017 08:50
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Snazzy Frocks posted:im not going to say the counter protesters did or did not do anything but they sure as hell do a good job of signal boosting the alt-right people's message thanks to the extra media attention they draw I mean for gently caress's sake Hillary was saying the alt-right were hate groups who were a serious problem Trump was making worse last year and everyone poo poo on her for it and said she was distracting people from the real issues. For all the poo poo you can talk about her campaign she was loving right on the money on that count.
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Aug 13, 2017 08:51
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Condiv posted:paracaidas apparently isn't either, since he believes that nazi rhetoric doesn't fall under the legal definition of incitement to violence see: stone cold posted:get this, society and institutions are stacked to go easy on white supremacists
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Aug 13, 2017 08:51
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Snazzy Frocks posted:im not going to say the counter protesters did or did not do anything but they sure as hell do a good job of signal boosting the alt-right people's message thanks to the extra media attention they draw Look at this idiot. Look at him.
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Aug 13, 2017 08:51
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Snazzy Frocks posted:im not going to say the counter protesters did or did not do anything but they sure as hell do a good job of signal boosting the alt-right people's message thanks to the extra media attention they draw yes, opposition should just stay home and not show themselves for fear of 'boosting the signal' of the people they are opposing. clearly racism still exists because the million man march just gave it too much attention.
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Aug 13, 2017 08:52
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Lightning Knight posted:Everyone back the gently caress up and lol at the fact that post 1945 Germany has a way better track record on dealing with Nazis than the United States does. Let's not fawn over post WW2 Germany too much; quite a bit of the West German government and Bundeswehr had been eagerly killing allied forces the decade prior to their creation. And then you have your modern day German Nazis that just use flags and imagery not specified under the hate speech laws (like the Imperial German flag as well as the old Stars and Bars). The Germans could definitely be punching more Nazis than they are currently.
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Aug 13, 2017 08:52
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empty whippet box posted:yes, opposition should just stay home and not show themselves for fear of 'boosting the signal' of the people they are opposing. clearly racism still exists because the million man march just gave it too much attention. the most effective protests are the ones nobody sees or hears-snazzy frocks, probably
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Aug 13, 2017 08:52
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aug 12 was a huge victory for the alt-right, they killed a woman and now everybody thinks they are v. cool and mucho friendly
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Aug 13, 2017 08:52
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Condiv posted:We're supposed to believe these people honestly, earnestly hope and advocate for a racially pure america, but will not use violence to achieve that? or that their rhetoric won't inspire others to violence? "I just put the gun in his hands. Not my problem if he shot the guy or not, he must have a mental disorder"
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Aug 13, 2017 08:53
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Snazzy Frocks posted:im not going to say the counter protesters did or did not do anything but they sure as hell do a good job of signal boosting the alt-right people's message thanks to the extra media attention they draw I too am an 8 year old who believes that Nazis are like the monster under my bed, if I don't think about them and no one brings they'll just go away! BadOptics posted:Let's not fawn over post WW2 Germany too much; quite a bit of the West German government and Bundeswehr had been eagerly killing allied forces the decade prior to their creation. And then you have your modern day German Nazis that just use flags and imagery not specified under the hate speech laws (like the Imperial German flag as well as the old Stars and Bars). The Germans could definitely be punching more Nazis than they are currently. I said better than the United States, not good. I mean for gently caress's sake though the country that gave us Nazis handles Nazis better than a country that fought the Nazis
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Aug 13, 2017 08:53
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Calibanibal posted:aug 12 was a huge victory for the alt-right, they killed a woman and now everybody thinks they are v. cool and mucho friendly I heard all the girls at the bars want that d
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Aug 13, 2017 08:53
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stone cold posted:see: yep
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Aug 13, 2017 08:53
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BadOptics posted:Let's not fawn over post WW2 Germany too much; quite a bit of the West German government and Bundeswehr had been eagerly killing allied forces the decade prior to their creation. And then you have your modern day German Nazis that just use flags and imagery not specified under the hate speech laws (like the Imperial German flag as well as the old Stars and Bars). The Germans could definitely be punching more Nazis than they are currently. Their methods are definitely a start though, and better than these morons masturbating about how great Nazi speech is
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Aug 13, 2017 08:54
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