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CommieGIR posted:Is it just me, or is using the phrase 'Identity Politics' a Right Wing stand in for Whataboutism?
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Aug 16, 2017 13:39
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CommieGIR posted:Is it just me, or is using the phrase 'Identity Politics' a Right Wing stand in for Whataboutism? To repeat this: the right wing wants Identity Politics. They just want White Identity Politics.
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Aug 16, 2017 13:40
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Gandhi liked violent resistance. "I do believe that, where there is only a choice between cowardice and violence, I would advise violence... I would rather have India resort to arms in order to defend her honour than that she should, in a cowardly manner, become or remain a helpless witness to her own dishonor." "I want both the Hindus and Mussalmans to cultivate the cool courage to die without killing. But if one has not that courage, I want him to cultivate the art of killing and being killed rather than, in a cowardly manner, flee from danger. For the latter, in spite of his flight, does commit mental himsa. He flees because he has not the courage to be killed in the act of killing. My method of nonviolence can never lead toloss of strength, but it alone will make it possible, if the nation wills it, to offer disciplined and concerted violence in time of danger. My creed of nonviolence is an extremely active force. It has no room for cowardice or even weakness. There is hope for a violent man to be some day non-violent, but there is none for a coward. I have, therefore, said more than once....that, if we do not know how to defend ourselves, our women and our places of worship by the force of suffering, i.e., nonviolence, we must, if we are men, be at least able to defend all these by fighting. No matter how weak a person is in body, if it is a shame to flee, he will stand his ground and die at his post. This would be nonviolence and bravery. No matter how weak he is, he will use what strength he has in inflicting injury on his opponent, and die in the attempt. This is bravery, but not nonviolence. If, when his duty is to face danger, he flees, it is cowardice. In the first case, the man will have love or charity in him. In the second and third cases, there would be a dislike or distrust and fear. My nonviolence does admit of people, who cannot or will not be nonviolent, holding and making effective use of arms. Let me repeat for the thousandth time that nonviolence is of the strongest, not of the weak. To run away from danger, instead of facing it, is to deny one's faith in man and God, even one's own self. It were better for one to drown oneself than live to declare such bankruptcy of faith." "I have been repeating over and over again that he who cannot protect himself or his nearest and dearest or their honour by non-violently facing death may and ought to do so by violently dealing with the oppressor. He who can do neither of the two is a burden. He has no business to be the head of a family. He must either hide himself, or must rest content to live for ever in helplessness and be prepared to crawl like a worm at the bidding of a bully."
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Aug 16, 2017 13:41
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Cingulate posted:On a scale of "Goebbels propaganda victory" to "the US military crushes all resistance", how did street fighting work last time? pretty well actually https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Cable_Street
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Aug 16, 2017 13:41
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coyo7e posted:How did this all happen while The Daily Show is on hiatus? It's been a long (2 year) hiatus. #comebackjohn
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Aug 16, 2017 13:45
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radmonger posted:MLK, Mandela, and Ghandhi all offered their opponents a feasible thing that they could do which would avoid conflict. "First, I must confess that over the past few years I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's great stumbling block in his stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Counciler or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to "order" than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says: "I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I cannot agree with your methods of direct action"; who paternalistically believes he can set the timetable for another man's freedom; who lives by a mythical concept of time and who constantly advises the Negro to wait for a "more convenient season." Shallow understanding from people of good will is more frustrating than absolute misunderstanding from people of ill will. Lukewarm acceptance is much more bewildering than outright rejection." - MLK
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Aug 16, 2017 13:46
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I wonder if there's a practical/trustworthy way to set up a fund to pay legal fees and fines for anyone who's charged with vandalism for tearing down a Confederate statue. Not necessarily specific, after-the-fact GoFundMes, but a standing fund to be like, "Hey, if you tear down a Confederate statue, that's vandalism and you'll probably be charged, but we got your back, wink wink."
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Aug 16, 2017 13:46
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https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/897799882802704385
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Aug 16, 2017 13:46
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botany posted:To repeat this: the right wing wants Identity Politics. They just want White Identity Politics. Hieronymous Alloy posted:pretty well actually
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Aug 16, 2017 13:47
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Harrow posted:I wonder if there's a practical/trustworthy way to set up a fund to pay legal fees and fines for anyone who's charged with vandalism for tearing down a Confederate statue. Not necessarily specific, after-the-fact GoFundMes, but a standing fund to be like, "Hey, if you tear down a Confederate statue, that's vandalism and you'll probably be charged, but we got your back, wink wink." What the hell, if it's an act of mass civil disobedience like that the entire mob ought to be chipping in. That's what safety in numbers is supposed to be about, right? You can feel safe doing this illegal or dangerous thing because we've all got your back.
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Aug 16, 2017 13:47
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People propagate the idea that MLK, Ghandi, or whoever were all fanatically obsessed with non-violence not because they want to raise up those guys but because it makes their oppressors look better. When the tale about the civil rights movement is "well MLK asked nicely and white America gave black people civil rights (also Malcolm X was a bad guy)" that's to say that white people are totally nice and didn't realize how rude they were being with the slavery and kkk and all and just needed to be told in a calm and sensible manner that the people they were oppressing had human rights which needed to be respected.
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Aug 16, 2017 13:48
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It's the same button that orders him a diet coke
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Aug 16, 2017 13:49
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Data Graham posted:What the hell, if it's an act of mass civil disobedience like that the entire mob ought to be chipping in. That's what safety in numbers is supposed to be about, right? You can feel safe doing this illegal or dangerous thing because we've all got your back. Ideally, yes, though I'm sure people will still be charged, and what I'd rather do is passively encourage people to continue tearing down statues because, if they're one of the unlucky ones, they won't have to go begging for money to pay lawyer fees and fines.
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Aug 16, 2017 13:50
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Not the best distraction I've seen but hey, the garbagefucks at FOX News will gobble it up.
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Aug 16, 2017 13:50
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withak posted:So Fox did a segment on Amazon this morning? WaPo has been skewering him and it's owned by Jeff Bezos.
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Aug 16, 2017 13:50
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Radish posted:People propagate the idea that MLK, Ghandi, or whoever were all fanatically obsessed with non-violence not because they want to raise up those guys but because it makes their oppressors look better. When the tale about the civil rights movement is "well MLK asked nicely and white America gave black people civil rights (also Malcolm X was a bad guy)" that's to say that white people are totally nice and didn't realize how rude they were being with the slavery and kkk and all and just needed to be told in a calm and sensible manner that the people they were oppressing had human rights which needed to be respected. Well, you can, you should just be pointing a shitload of guns at them while you do it.
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Aug 16, 2017 13:50
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Piell posted:"First, I must confess that over the past few years I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's great stumbling block in his stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Counciler or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to "order" than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says: "I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I cannot agree with your methods of direct action"; who paternalistically believes he can set the timetable for another man's freedom; who lives by a mythical concept of time and who constantly advises the Negro to wait for a "more convenient season." Shallow understanding from people of good will is more frustrating than absolute misunderstanding from people of ill will. Lukewarm acceptance is much more bewildering than outright rejection." - MLK You act as if there just two options: taking it quietly, or their blood on the streets. MLK demonstrated there was a 3rd option: winning. Radish posted:People propagate the idea that MLK, Ghandi, or whoever were all fanatically obsessed with non-violence not because they want to raise up those guys but because it makes their oppressors look better. When the tale about the civil rights movement is "well MLK asked nicely and white America gave black people civil rights (also Malcolm X was a bad guy)" that's to say that white people are totally nice and didn't realize how rude they were being with the slavery and kkk and all and just needed to be told in a calm and sensible manner that the people they were oppressing had human rights which needed to be respected.
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Aug 16, 2017 13:51
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Gandhi said a lot of things, and you are being very selective in your quoting.ghandi posted:I do believe that, where there is only a choice between cowardice and violence, I would advise violence... I would rather have India resort to arms in order to defend her honour than that she should, in a cowardly manner, become or remain a helpless witness to her own dishonor. Anyway, again I must emphasise. There's some element of truth in the idea that nonviolence gains its power from the threat of violence. But it also gains its legitimacy from it distancing itself from violent actors even if they have similar goals. It makes no sense to demand everyone agree punching is good, no more than it does to demand MLK agree with Malcom X. Malcom X was certainly not stupid enough to waste his energies on MLK in that way.
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Aug 16, 2017 13:52
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:It doesn't look like pepsi is actually even ON the council.
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Aug 16, 2017 13:52
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Most of Trump's press conference was just the usual rightwing taking points. I actually thought the craziest part was when he mentioned his winery. In what world does that go there?
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Aug 16, 2017 13:54
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Mr Interweb posted:Dammit, Judd Apatow, don't make me like you: At what point did everyone get together and decide to act as though each CEO stepping down from a meaningless panel they do nothing on was a body blow to Trump?
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Aug 16, 2017 13:54
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Tweeting this after siding with unabashed white supremacy is super harrowing.
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Aug 16, 2017 13:54
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Rotacixe posted:Normally this level of discord with the CIC would be grounds for immediate dismissal. It is a strange place to be in. I hope he doesn't do permanent damage to the presidential institution and civilian control over the military before this is over. The only time in my life I've prayed for a military coup
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Aug 16, 2017 13:54
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Noxville posted:At what point did everyone get together and decide to act as though each CEO stepping down from a meaningless panel they do nothing on was a body blow to Trump? The moment Trump got pissed about it
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Aug 16, 2017 13:55
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Noxville posted:At what point did everyone get together and decide to act as though each CEO stepping down from a meaningless panel they do nothing on was a body blow to Trump? Probably when the first guy did it and Trump started pantshitting over twitter about. We're dealing with a manbaby president, so trivial poo poo like this actually does matter.
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Aug 16, 2017 13:55
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Democrazy posted:Most of Trump's press conference was just the usual rightwing taking points. I actually thought the craziest part was when he mentioned his winery. In what world does that go there? Trump is like if a Right Wing email forward gain sentience and got elected President. The problem for the GOP is they typically leave that poo poo for their AM radio and TV personalities while letting the more overtly racist points percolate on social media. The fact that their idiot leader is too dumb to not use code words or wink instead of straight up calling nazis the good guys is what caught them flat footed. Reagan and Trump aren't that different except in ability to speak to the press (at least 1980 Reagan). COOL CORN posted:Tweeting this after siding with unabashed white supremacy is super harrowing. By 2020 the SPLC will have announced a Presidential campaign slogan is hate speech.
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Aug 16, 2017 13:56
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A bold new policy initiative. Let's give Trump a chance on this one
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Aug 16, 2017 13:57
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Noxville posted:At what point did everyone get together and decide to act as though each CEO stepping down from a meaningless panel they do nothing on was a body blow to Trump? Because he's the Dealmaker and the Business Expert. He can't successfully lead a group of wealthy, willing CEOs and it makes him look weak and incompetent.
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Aug 16, 2017 13:57
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COOL CORN posted:Tweeting this after siding with unabashed white supremacy is super harrowing. Only getting more appropriate by the day: http://prettyfakes.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/11/Cap%20v%20Cap%203.JPG
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Aug 16, 2017 13:57
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I was incredibly busy yesterday and only heard bits and pieces of the "Alt-Left" thing, despite the fact I work in a newsroom. I'm sincerely not sure what the gently caress is going to happen with this guy. I feel like THIS matters, and it's leading to something even worse. A Chernobyl meltdown on camera or in front of reputable sources. God help us.
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Aug 16, 2017 13:58
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How many loving hosts does Fox & Friends have? I swear I've seen like 6 different people this week. There's always that old blond guy. But everyone else seems to change. It must confuse Donny so.
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Aug 16, 2017 13:58
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Piell posted:"First, I must confess that over the past few years I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's great stumbling block in his stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Counciler or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to "order" than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says: "I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I cannot agree with your methods of direct action"; who paternalistically believes he can set the timetable for another man's freedom; who lives by a mythical concept of time and who constantly advises the Negro to wait for a "more convenient season." Shallow understanding from people of good will is more frustrating than absolute misunderstanding from people of ill will. Lukewarm acceptance is much more bewildering than outright rejection." - MLK sometimes I wonder if people can read
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Aug 16, 2017 14:00
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Krispy Kareem posted:How many loving hosts does Fox & Friends have? I swear I've seen like 6 different people this week. I think he may already be too senile to notice
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Aug 16, 2017 14:00
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radmonger posted:MLK...Ghandhi all offered their opponents a feasible thing that they could do which would avoid conflict. The primary reason that MLK and Ghandi used nonviolence was because it gained sympathy for their cause, not because they didn't expect conflict. MLK especially used it as method of getting international condemnation of Jim Crow. quote:Mandela The ANC had a military wing. Mandela was in prison from 1962-1990 for being a member of MK. quote:The leaders of the IRA, Tamil Tigers and PLO did not. Most of heir heirs would now admit that was a strategic failure. The IRA was the reason why the Irish Free State exists.
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Aug 16, 2017 14:02
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https://twitter.com/MuseumMichael/status/897597323605417985
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Aug 16, 2017 14:03
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I'm sure he's doing this every time he needs a pick-me-up when he's feeling down. He knows his base loves this chant and he's really just interested in seeing his Twitter numbers go up.
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Aug 16, 2017 14:04
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"member since 2017" The ACLU has one job and they do it. It isn't the only important job.
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Aug 16, 2017 14:04
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:"member since 2017" They don't defend the second amendment because of the excuse that the NRA does it for them. But they can't stop defending white supremacists with the excuse that they control the executive branch of the US government?
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Aug 16, 2017 14:05
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The mythologising of the Battle of Cable Street is a joke. In so far as it had an effect, it would be leading the government to ban such marches and uniforms with the Public Order Act of 1936. The key ingredient is to have a government that is hostile to such breaches of order. After similar fights under a government sympathetic to the far right in Germany, you had no such success.
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Aug 16, 2017 14:06
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Fangz posted:Gandhi said a lot of things, and you are being very selective in your quoting. "Gandhi, MLK etc only pretended to win via nonviolent resistance, in reality they were all 'punch the nazi 24/7'" is a terrible meme.
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Aug 16, 2017 14:06
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