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Maybe I'll look for 1080 TI's on black Friday this year, since Vega is a hot, wet squeaker so far.
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Aug 24, 2017 18:22
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kirtar posted:No, the problem is that people speculate based on limited and often vague information. Yes, but this time the speculators are the reviewers themselves who appear to have been lied to. Though technically unproven, a few retailers leaked that AMD's pricing to them was higher than "MSRP". AMD's own statement essentially confirmed bullshit was going on by way of Not-Saying-Anything. Forcing people to buy into "bundles" that just simply cost more money is a pretty good indication that MSRP doesn't exist. Also it doesn't help that their track record for about 3 years now is total dogshit. But yes, its all speculation based on vague and certainly contradictory information (even if some of direct contradictions stems from AMD) , so you are not wrong. I wish you luck buying a $400 Vega 56
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Aug 24, 2017 18:31
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1gnoirents posted:I wish you luck buying a $400 Vega 56 In my Radeon fanfiction, AMD was being honest about building up stock before putting Vega on sale, except they were talking about just Vega 56, and also they'll have enough supply to meet demand and keep the price low. Or maybe AMD realized that they can gently caress up as bad as they want and it will hardly matter because miners will buy out everything anyway.
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Aug 24, 2017 18:42
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The reality of it to me is we really are talking pushing the envelope of technology that didn't exist before. That probably isnt easy, and you cant win them all. And I bet a slippery slope is many times more devastating in that scenario, which they started falling down on a while ago.
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Aug 24, 2017 19:00
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1gnoirents posted:The reality of it to me is we really are talking pushing the envelope of technology that didn't exist before. That probably isnt easy, and you cant win them all. And I bet a slippery slope is many times more devastating in that scenario, which they started falling down on a while ago. Turns out my envelope was full of confetti. Good prank AMD 😁
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Aug 24, 2017 19:05
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Maxwell Adams posted:Or maybe AMD realized that they can gently caress up as bad as they want and it will hardly matter because miners will buy out everything anyway. Khorne fucked around with this message at 20:23 on Aug 24, 2017 |
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Aug 24, 2017 20:04
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I've been an Intel fanboy, I guess. I owned a K6-2 and it was a good processor held back by a poor choice in motherboards (VIA architecture), but I bought a P3 while tech magazines were certain CPUID was going to be used to spy on you and then two P4s (both the early "gently caress overclockers" edition and the later Hyperthreading gemeration). When AMD introduced Athlon I basically never touched their CPUs again. I immediately got on Conroe and an Intel reference motherboard and used that until it was way too old. Now I'm on Ivy Bridge and a Z77 mobo still and still doing fine for now but I do less CPU intensive tasks than I did in 2005. Today I'll use Intel either until Apple stops Hackintosh or it becomes a worse choice for that. I hear you can do it with Ryzen now but the number of extra hoops are such that I'd rather just throw money at the problem. It helps that Intel is no longer trying to follow the model of late 70s and early 80s IBM, and that the IBM-like things that they did in the 90s and won't let go of (like going from 486 to Pentium just so you can trademark the name) are things that the industry adjusted to and likewise Intel is less lovely about. That said, I don't think "fanboys" love court cases; I was an Apple fanboy forever but the Apple/MS court case was dumb and and especially the subsequent Apple/Samsung court case is the worst horseshit I've seen from a tech company in years. I would posit, based on the K6-2 MMX lawsuit, that if 1997's Intel was exactly as it was today that they would be suing AMD right now for using the numbers 3/5/7 to differentiate their CPUs.
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Aug 24, 2017 20:30
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This under voltage thing is great. Running at 880 @ 1900 clock. Dropped ~5-8 C on some kind of buttcoin to benchmark it (which I know is ultra unrealistic because that test does not give a flip about memory transfer rates. Uploading numbers to the matrix instead of megatextures ) but it has been running overnight without breaking anything. Craptacular! posted:I was an Apple fanboy forever but the Apple/MS court case was dumb and and especially the subsequent Apple/Samsung court case is the worst horseshit I've seen from a tech company in years. Please tell me you got anywhere close to our high school I LOVE APPLE dude where he wore a trenchcoat with I<3IMAC because that machine was just released that year.
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Aug 24, 2017 20:42
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Craptacular! posted:I've been an Intel fanboy, I guess. I owned a K6-2 and it was a good processor held back by a poor choice in motherboards (VIA architecture), but I bought a P3 while tech magazines were certain CPUID was going to be used to spy on you and then two P4s (both the early "gently caress overclockers" edition and the later Hyperthreading gemeration). When AMD introduced Athlon I basically never touched their CPUs again. I immediately got on Conroe and an Intel reference motherboard and used that until it was way too old. Now I'm on Ivy Bridge and a Z77 mobo still and still doing fine for now but I do less CPU intensive tasks than I did in 2005. It's kinda funny that you disavowed AMD exactly when they had their "Golden Era".
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Aug 24, 2017 21:55
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EVIL Gibson posted:Please tell me you got anywhere close to our high school I LOVE APPLE dude where he wore a trenchcoat with I<3IMAC because that machine was just released that year. No. My dad's college friend bought a Mac dealer and my dad moved from HP to run his repair department. This meant occasionally we had really cool computers at home over the weekend for free, it meant I knew far more about how to optimize the system than the people trying to run the computers at school, and it means I have a few t-shirts and tchotchkes from Apple service seminars. I tried to understand PCs around the time of DOS 6/Win 3.1, and I did own a 486 but IRQ issues and the shittiness of DUN pre-98 made it never my primary platform until USB happened. This meant on most BBSes I was the Mac guy hearing how great Doom was but never really allowed to understand why. We abandoned Mac at home around System 8, by which point the store was sold to someone else and everyone left. Craptacular! fucked around with this message at 22:06 on Aug 24, 2017 |
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Aug 24, 2017 22:04
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SourKraut posted:It's kinda funny that you disavowed AMD exactly when they had their "Golden Era". Isn't that also about the time Intel put out lovely processors and started their illegal rebate program to shove AMD out of the market?
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Aug 24, 2017 22:08
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It's dedication to a cause buying multiple p4's over Athlons.
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Aug 24, 2017 22:30
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AMD chipsets were still a shitshow during their golden era. That should have all been in-house and not doing so caused a lot of headaches and kept corporate adoption low.
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Aug 24, 2017 22:30
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SourKraut posted:It's kinda funny that you disavowed AMD exactly when they had their "Golden Era". I always wanted Intel because marketing, but not only was Intel more expensive but Quake II added 3DNow instructions. I watched a few games like Ubisoft's "Pod" that were coded around MMX, and basically AMD had a chip with MMX instructions plus their own secret sauce that John Carmack adopted in his newest engine, so why not buy AMD? The reason I left AMD is because of the motherboard, which was an Asus with a VIA chipset. VIA joined early Rage era ATI on my "do but buy under any circumstances" list after that mobo. My understanding is that Nvidia stepped in and created nForce and saved millions from having to live in a VIA wasteland, with AMD+Nvidia being the fabled "green team" for a few years. GRINDCORE MEGGIDO posted:It's dedication to a cause buying multiple p4's over Athlons. Every young man has that moment where they want to root for the empire. Some express it by voting Republican, I did it by buying P4s. Craptacular! fucked around with this message at 22:38 on Aug 24, 2017 |
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Aug 24, 2017 22:33
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The best combo was NVidia NForce chipset boards with AMD cpus. Loved my old NForce/Opteron combo.
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Aug 24, 2017 22:33
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Craptacular! posted:
You can blame Jobs and the rest of the exec board for not letting you experience DOOM. They paid gaming mags to not bring up or review any Mac games that came out because they we're trying to market it as a business machine and not a thing for games. Then when they tried to get into games was when they found Bungie and MS, who were looking for a killer app for their console system , hit two problems with one aquisition. Your whole IRQ conflicts I remember well where I didn't use a mouse until windows 95 because me and my dad could never figure out how to get a mouse working while keeping our soundblaster working (really dumb but there was no internet). This is why Gateway was so drat popular because you could get a preconfigured system that might be slow with lots of tech support cruft in it, but it worked out of the box. Now we are here where everything is basically plug and play and only if you are really interested in enthusiast level do you not need to worry about doing something horrible to your psu without either physical (psu connections to motherboard )or smart safeguards (over clocking your gpu from 1500Mhz to 3Ghz just makes your drivers crash and not bring on the smell of magic blue smoke) preventing you from loving something up.
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Aug 24, 2017 22:38
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Enos Cabell posted:The best combo was NVidia NForce chipset boards with AMD cpus. Loved my old NForce/Opteron combo. I had a dual-NIC nForce board with one of the Barton core XPs overclocked like crazy with what was essentially a giant boulder of copper in one of the most obnoxiously loud and heavy Thermaltake cases around when I was in high school. Nearly 60 pounds when fully assembled.
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Aug 24, 2017 22:48
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BangersInMyKnickers posted:AMD chipsets were still a shitshow during their golden era. That should have all been in-house and not doing so caused a lot of headaches and kept corporate adoption low. This is exactly why I refused to use or sell their piece of poo poo systems. No matter how much faster than Intel they were, you could not rely on them. Yes I am sure there were special snowflakes but overall, gently caress AMD chipsets(back then)
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Aug 24, 2017 22:54
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I had a P4 but it was because I did not know much about PCs back then and it was my first one from Dell.
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Aug 24, 2017 22:58
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EVIL Gibson posted:You can blame Jobs and the rest of the exec board for not letting you experience DOOM. They paid gaming mags to not bring up or review any Mac games that came out because they we're trying to market it as a business machine and not a thing for games. Wasn't Jobs at NeXT in the Doom time frame?
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Aug 24, 2017 23:01
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How to underclock a 1080ti? Afterburner doesn't let me go below 0 overclock.
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Aug 24, 2017 23:12
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Jago posted:How to underclock a 1080ti? Afterburner doesn't let me go below 0 overclock. Press Ctrl + F. Its not the most user friendly thing and as far as I could tell after you have a baseline set you really do have to manually drag each dot on the graph. Hold shift on the highest data point to drag everything down the first time. I actually didn't get much underclocking out of my EVGA 1080ti, I truly lost on that silicon however I still could shave off a few degrees despite that.
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Aug 24, 2017 23:18
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Paul MaudDib posted:NVIDIA stripped their uarch down to the bare essentials. This started back with Kepler, where they actually slowed down some instructions because making all the instructions take the same amount of time let them ditch the instruction-level scheduler. Maxwell/Pascal take this even further, there is basically nothing except the bare minimum of fixed-function hardware (ROPs/TMUs) that is actually necessary to do graphics. Everything else is either run on the shader cores (eg geometry) or pushed onto the CPU. And every time they strip things down further they plow all the gains right back into putting more cores on the die. Basically Maxwell/Pascal is as close to "nothing but graphics cores" as NVIDIA's engineers can manage. is there a detailed analysis of kepler/maxwell/pascal out there? I know that some little stuff like pascal/maxwell having tiling has been eked out. i thought GCN was pretty dece but if it hasn't been overhauled in 5 years I am actually surprised Vega is competitive at all. That's basically being bulldozer to sandy bridge levels of out of date microarch Also surprised that AMD didn't go full Zeppelin style MCM on interposer for Vega. That would at least cut their yield issues down and give them much needed margin/price competition. One step forward one step backward. Still, Zen appears successful enough that it will hopefully let them invest in a decent new graphics arch assuming Raja isn't fired post-Vegapocalypse e: I found a verilog impl of southern islands here if anyone wants to poke around, this is good poo poo: https://github.com/VerticalResearchGroup/miaow Malcolm XML fucked around with this message at 23:25 on Aug 24, 2017 |
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Aug 24, 2017 23:21
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MCM on interposer is supposed to be Navi, I believe. Vega is such an odd duck because it really should have just been cancelled. AMD had a better gaming chip they already binned (Big Polaris) and now they're treading water until their next actual architecture. Vega really should have just been compute-only/mostly for professional/prosumer tasks like the Frontier Edition was, but AMD made some stupid choices and had to push it as a consumer gaming architecture instead.
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Aug 24, 2017 23:26
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BangersInMyKnickers posted:AMD chipsets were still a shitshow during their golden era. That should have all been in-house and not doing so caused a lot of headaches and kept corporate adoption low. I had nothing but trouble with Via. But nForce / nForce2 were amazing to me. When I went over to them, I finally got what Intel users were saying about stability. I left a system on for days just to see if it would crash, and it didn't.
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Aug 25, 2017 00:05
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I remember leaving on a gaming PC for 3 months in the Pentium 4 era/Windows XP era. That was exciting for the time. Running a windows 98 PC hard with games/other stuff meant you were restarting every day at least. I have a GTX 660Ti that I want to replace, but I don't want to pay buttcoin miner prices for stuff and I have an old Dell 1080p 24" monitor, which I should also probably replace at the same time which makes it real expensive. Just feels like a weird time to upgrade with the new Nvidia stuff 6 months away, but I want to play Battlefront 2 and Shadow of War later this year too 
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Aug 25, 2017 00:18
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canyoneer posted:I have a GTX 660Ti that I want to replace, but I don't want to pay buttcoin miner prices for stuff and I have an old Dell 1080p 24" monitor, which I should also probably replace at the same time which makes it real expensive. You could look at a second hand 970 or 980 to tide you over - not sure how location dependent it is but they’re cheap as hell in my part of the world right now (I guess it isn’t worth mining with them?)
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Aug 25, 2017 00:44
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Arivia posted:MCM on interposer is supposed to be Navi, I believe. Is there anywhere showing how good Vega is exactly at compute?
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Aug 25, 2017 00:56
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dissss posted:You could look at a second hand 970 or 980 to tide you over - not sure how location dependent it is but they’re cheap as hell in my part of the world right now (I guess it isn’t worth mining with them?) is a 960 a meaningful upgrade from a 660 Ti? I mean, it's only like $75 used so I guess it doesn't need to be much of an upgrade
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Aug 25, 2017 01:11
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canyoneer posted:I have a GTX 660Ti that I want to replace, but I don't want to pay buttcoin miner prices for stuff and I have an old Dell 1080p 24" monitor, which I should also probably replace at the same time which makes it real expensive. If you decide not to replace your motherboard, you can get a 3GB 1060 for $200 easily and it will provide a significant boost with the monitor you have. If you go to 1440p, you can either go to the 6GB 1060 for about $70 more (previously $20-50 more before buttminers) or you can buy a used 980 and get 1070-equivalent speed (can not gauge value there, I don't buy used cards.) Keep in mind all of these suggestions assume you'll be a rational person who understands that sometimes games ship with ridiculously high quality presets or VRAM-gobbling shadow garbage that make for better screenshots but terrible gameplay, and that if you see two modes called High and Highest and they look nearly the same but Highest plays like a slideshow, that you can play High and enjoy yourself and not be beating yourself up over the slightly more diffused shadows that you're missing out on. For instance, if you stay at 1080p, the 3GB 1060 can't handle Mirrors Edge Catalyst's "Hyper" setting and Doom's "Nightmare" setting has a hardware check for 5GB of VRAM. But both of those modes that play at 60+ and look nearly identical if you look at side-by-side screenshots. If you're the guy who absolutely must enable the soft shadow option or the hair option that uses as much RAM as the rest of the game combined, then you're already in 1080 territory even at 1080p because of the mining push on 1070s.
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Aug 25, 2017 01:29
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canyoneer posted:is a 960 a meaningful upgrade from a 660 Ti? I mean, it's only like $75 used so I guess it doesn't need to be much of an upgrade The 960 is around the same speed as the 660 Ti.
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Aug 25, 2017 01:31
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The 6GB 1060 likely would have been called the 1060ti had the 3GB version not launched at a later date. If you're wondering what today's version of "your card" is, it's that. If you want the card that can run Hyper/Nightmare settings in 2016/2017 games at 1080p, and play 1440p at High or Ultra depending on the game, that's your card.
Craptacular! fucked around with this message at 01:45 on Aug 25, 2017 |
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Aug 25, 2017 01:41
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If the local computer parts market didn't blow I'd seriously consider selling my GTX 1070 and buying a GTX 1080 Ti. You can't find a 1070 in stock around here and they're $550+ CAD. A 1080Ti is $900 CAD. I seriously think if I pushed it and there were enough thirsty butters around I could probably get one to pay $600 for a loving 1070.
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Aug 25, 2017 01:45
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Are you overclocking the 660 ti? Overclocking would probably get you 15% more performance and close to a stock 960 level of performance. I agree a 960 is too small of an upgrade to be worth spending money on, even accounting for its overclocked performance probably getting an extra 25% faster.
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Aug 25, 2017 01:49
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This looks like a cool unboxing experience.
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Aug 25, 2017 04:51
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craig588 posted:Are you overclocking the 660 ti? Overclocking would probably get you 15% more performance and close to a stock 960 level of performance. I agree a 960 is too small of an upgrade to be worth spending money on, even accounting for its overclocked performance probably getting an extra 25% faster. Yeah, I fired up Afterburner today and just looked up online the settings people were boasting about, and then took it down about 15% less than the bragworthy ones and it appears to run fine. I should have done this 3 years ago because I'm getting a pretty huge (20% average FPS) performance boost in the Rome 2 benchmark already
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Aug 25, 2017 05:14
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kirtar posted:No, the problem is that people speculate based on limited and often vague information. https://www.techpowerup.com/236422/retailers-are-buying-amd-rx-vega-64-at-usd-675-each 
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Aug 25, 2017 05:42
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Ragingsheep posted:https://www.techpowerup.com/236422/retailers-are-buying-amd-rx-vega-64-at-usd-675-each Supposedly that has to do with MA Labs typical price behavior in that price is adjusted based on demand. This is also either a restock order or a really late one since they ordered it on launch day. kirtar fucked around with this message at 05:50 on Aug 25, 2017 |
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Aug 25, 2017 05:44
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PerrineClostermann posted:Isn't that also about the time Intel put out lovely processors and started their illegal rebate program to shove AMD out of the market? Craptacular! posted:The reason I left AMD is because of the motherboard, which was an Asus with a VIA chipset. VIA joined early Rage era ATI on my "do but buy under any circumstances" list after that mobo. My understanding is that Nvidia stepped in and created nForce and saved millions from having to live in a VIA wasteland, with AMD+Nvidia being the fabled "green team" for a few years.
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Aug 25, 2017 05:59
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SlayVus posted:This looks like a cool unboxing experience. That's gotta be a galax board.
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Aug 25, 2017 06:12
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