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HatfulOfHollow posted:What idiot decided 5 points for a kill was a good idea? There's no reason to ever put yourself in any danger. I think this idea could be tweaked and combined with incentivizing staying alive by instead making EVERY kill scale across the server, not just for the individual who got it. Just spitballing but even just a simple scale of first kill being worth one point, second worth two, all the way up to the final chicken dinner kill being worth a whopping 99 points then you can have something like the 500 point to the victor on it as well. It'd be enough to incentivize fighting in the mid to late game while also still thumbing the scale towards whoever comes out on top.
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Aug 24, 2017 19:12
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Is there a prize pool breakdown anywhere? I just keep seeing total prizepool for each day.
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Aug 24, 2017 19:13
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Hamelekim posted:Anything competitive game can be a sport. The issue is popularity and ensuring that the gameplay is what people are looking for. Scoring is an issue, and it's also more heavily RNG-affected than other FPS/3rdPS competitive games.
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Aug 24, 2017 19:13
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If you need convoluted scoring rules around your game because he most efficient way to win is boring to watch, maybe your game is just not suited for esports
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Aug 24, 2017 19:14
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HatfulOfHollow posted:This doesn't fix the issue. It probably only exacerbates it. Once you're sitting on a few kills you would stop putting yourself in danger in order to hit top 10 to earn the multiplier. This is a king of the hill/battle royale game. Final placement has to be huge. This is not CSGO. Why can't people understand that? Rex-Goliath posted:I think this idea could be tweaked and combined with incentivizing staying alive by instead making EVERY kill scale across the server, not just for the individual who got it. Just spitballing but even just a simple scale of first kill being worth one point, second worth two, all the way up to the final chicken dinner kill being worth a whopping 99 points then you can have something like the 500 point to the victor on it as well. It'd be enough to incentivize fighting in the mid to late game while also still thumbing the scale towards whoever comes out on top. That's not bad although it would encourage people to still be very defensive at first because why risk giving away your position for 3 pts.
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Aug 24, 2017 19:15
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you shouldnt have to have incentive's for killing people in a pubg tourney because the goal is just to be the last one standing. if you can do that without killing a single person more power to you (and tell me your secrets please). i don't care if that means more boring gameplay from a spectator standpoint, either.
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Aug 24, 2017 19:16
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Yeah why are kills even being scored. Kills vs survival are two opposing concepts and if you are watching pubg for the gunfights well there are probably more interesting games for that.
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Aug 24, 2017 19:19
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Jeffrey of YOSPOS posted:This is kind of a fundamental aspect of the game though - if you want to incentivize folks to get kills, it kinda has to do it within the game rules unless...you want a tournament for a game that's vaguely like pubg but not really because the incentives are all messed up. In the extreme, if the same person wins all 3 matches with 0 kills, they have to win the tournament if you want to call it a pubg tournament. Anything short of that would be like forcing the players to play dota and calling it a wc3 tournament. You would still get placement points on top of the kill points. So, I'm not sure what the exact numbers are for top 10 but let's say you get 500 points for a chicken dinner. If someone gets 3 chicken dinners with 0 kills they still get 1500 points which is a huge number. In order to match that with just kills using the scale I provided someone would have to kill 15 people per round which would be over 1500 points. So the only thing you need to consider there is if you're OK with giving the tournament to the guy who kills 45 people over 3 rounds and places outside of the top 10 instead of the guy who actually won 3 games without getting any kills. I feel like this game more than other is more about who makes the bigger impact on the game and I'd be OK with giving the win to the guy who made a 15% impact on player population over the guy who sleepwalks his way into the top 10.
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Aug 24, 2017 19:25
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HatfulOfHollow posted:You would still get placement points on top of the kill points. So, I'm not sure what the exact numbers are for top 10 but let's say you get 500 points for a chicken dinner. If someone gets 3 chicken dinners with 0 kills they still get 1500 points which is a huge number. In order to match that with just kills using the scale I provided someone would have to kill 15 people per round which would be over 1500 points. So the only thing you need to consider there is if you're OK with giving the tournament to the guy who kills 45 people over 3 rounds and places outside of the top 10 instead of the guy who actually won 3 games without getting any kills. I think 2 chicken dinners should guarantee victory. I'm happy to rewards kills over, say, getting 2nd place. Let some kill monster stand on the stage, but the winner has to be the guy the game says is the winner. Jeffrey of YOSPOS fucked around with this message at 19:33 on Aug 24, 2017 |
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Aug 24, 2017 19:26
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causticBeet posted:If you need convoluted scoring rules around your game because he most efficient way to win is boring to watch, maybe your game is just not suited for esports You're probably right but have you considered the possibility of giving out points for sick bike flips? But the game right now is the second most popular game on Twitch, so people must love watching this stuff, even without crazy scoring systems. If people can get a kick out of watching ONE guy run around for a half hour which is mostly downtime, it should mean that being able to follow 80-100 guys would make it an even more exciting experience. The game just needs non-poo poo observer tools/camera person. GigaPeon fucked around with this message at 19:39 on Aug 24, 2017 |
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Aug 24, 2017 19:36
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ehhh if I were a tournament doer, I'd make every kill worth one point and then 10, 8, 6, 4, 2 for top five. Ties decided by whichever team had the most wins. IF they tied for wins I'd have them deathmatch irl on stage.
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Aug 24, 2017 19:36
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Parachute posted:i don't care if that means more boring gameplay from a spectator standpoint, either. Pro-tip the smart tournament organizers DO.
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Aug 24, 2017 20:00
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yeah i'm sure people are chomping at the bit to watch some dipshit swim underwater for thirty minutes instead of watching shroud drop school and kill nine people in forty seconds
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Aug 24, 2017 20:01
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Making the tournament be in 3pp makes it also super boring. Nothing more exciting then watching two dickheads sit behind their trees for a few minutes. Then the guy who moves first gets shot..
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Aug 24, 2017 20:05
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If pubg becomes a regular competitive game I'm wondering how strategies will evolve. Like if everyone follows evermore's strategy there's going to be more fights in the blue and 50 people barreling into the 5th circle. The optimum play may then be to aggressively get the best position in the circle as soon as possible.
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Aug 24, 2017 20:15
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It's a problem because 10/14 players alive swimming in the water because they are unkillable there is a bad experience for everyone. Then you couple it with the bad map design, in this case the very barren beaches to make it even worse.
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Aug 24, 2017 20:38
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Hackan Slash posted:If pubg becomes a regular competitive game I'm wondering how strategies will evolve. Like if everyone follows evermore's strategy there's going to be more fights in the blue and 50 people barreling into the 5th circle. The optimum play may then be to aggressively get the best position in the circle as soon as possible. I usually stay on the fringes but last night I had a game where I finished 3rd mostly because I got an early good spot with tree and rock cover and got 7 lucky circles in a row forcing everyone to come to me. I just laid in the tall grass partially in a bush and would pop up when people ran right on top of me like Rambo in the mud. One dude was sniping people left and right with a kar and he ran right at me getting blasted with an S12 which I'm sure he didn't see coming. Skill goes a long way but there is definitely a lot to be said for position which in this game involves some luck.
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Aug 24, 2017 20:46
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https://clips.twitch.tv/YawningCorrectWhaleTinyFace ok i mean this is cool to watch and all but like did he win? because if he didn't what the gently caress am i even watching for?
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Aug 24, 2017 20:46
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A 50S RAYGUN posted:https://clips.twitch.tv/YawningCorrectWhaleTinyFace maybe step back from the computer and ask yourself that in a broader sense
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Aug 24, 2017 20:48
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A 50S RAYGUN posted:https://clips.twitch.tv/YawningCorrectWhaleTinyFace like the only kill there that seemed like skill and not just that he was playing with mouth breathers was the iron sight lean kill from a slight distance. 5/6 were moron sitting ducks. e: His match would have ended right there if the one guy who was shooting him wasn't blind and deaf.
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Aug 24, 2017 20:49
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sorry, i meant to post a fourteen minute clip of some potato aim goon shooting at a stationary uaz with an ump and missing
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Aug 24, 2017 21:02
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stop saying potato, loll
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Aug 24, 2017 21:07
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that is the first time i have typed the word 'potato' itt
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Aug 24, 2017 21:09
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Looking forward to them ruining the game so it's more fun to watch.
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Aug 24, 2017 21:26
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i don't even think you need to change how the game is played. just make kills worth more points in their entirely out-of-game tournament system.
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Aug 24, 2017 21:31
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Having different rules for esports than the normal game isn't going to help viewership either.
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Aug 24, 2017 21:37
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moush posted:Having different rules for esports than the normal game isn't going to help viewership either. Like disabling the redzone?
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Aug 24, 2017 21:38
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making kills worth more points means that competitive becomes a completely different game from the one people actually play. there is no fixing this dumb esport its an abortion
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Aug 24, 2017 21:38
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the 'game people actually play' is almost entirely divorced from what gamescom is displaying. the average pubg player is not spending the entire match healing in a rock or pretending to be Seaman
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Aug 24, 2017 21:48
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Kills are worth points for rankings. It's part of the measure over multiple games. These tournaments are multiple games. If kills aren't worth anything it's not like the real game.
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Aug 24, 2017 21:50
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Uh yeah when people play competitively it looks different because they play to win and don't screw around. This is true in every game. The game set a win condition, the fact that many players in pick up games ignore it doesn't mean that a proper competition should also.
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Aug 24, 2017 21:50
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Thanks to whoever I was playing with last night that recommended Reshade. I think it was RamenNoodles.
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Aug 24, 2017 21:52
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Jeffrey of YOSPOS posted:Uh yeah when people play competitively it looks different because they play to win and don't screw around. This is true in every game. The game set a win condition, the fact that many players in pick up games ignore it doesn't mean that a proper competition should also. we're talking about making the game more enjoyable to spectate. if the game incentive kills more than it currently does, the only change is that people will go for more kills. players wouldn't suddenly not care about getting first place, they would just pursue different, more viewer-friendly avenues to that first place instead of poo poo like squatting in a concrete shack like a loving fallout npc or something.
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Aug 24, 2017 21:54
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A 50S RAYGUN posted:we're talking about making the game more enjoyable to spectate. if the game incentive kills more than it currently does, the only change is that people will go for more kills. players wouldn't suddenly not care about getting first place, they would just pursue different, more viewer-friendly avenues to that first place instead of poo poo like squatting in a concrete shack like a loving fallout npc or something. I mean, I suppose they could change the base game to reward kills more. Make loot 10x more rare it would make killing a guy and taking their stuff way more important. Spectatability isn't all that important to me but I'd still try out that game.
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Aug 24, 2017 21:57
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Jeffrey of YOSPOS posted:Right but....that makes it not pubg, the game you play when you purchase pubg and hit play game. It's like if you showed up to a dota and give a big bonus to the team with the most creep kills instead of who wins. It might be an interesting to watch a game that's like pubg but you need to get kills in addition to winning, but give it its own name because it's totally different. I mean, does anyone really want to watch random dipshits hide in bathrooms for 30 minutes or swim out to sea? Like pubg is not a fun thing to watch when people are doing their best to win because it is more akin to hide and seek than a traditional shootmans game. Which is fine when you are playing and can decide if you want to play like that or not but for spectating it really seems abysmal.
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Aug 24, 2017 22:02
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you haven't really articulated how that 'wouldn't be pubg', though. the tournament points exist entirely outside of the gameplay. it's literally impossible for them to change the actual game, just how people engage with it in a competitive setting. if a win was worth 500 points and a kill was worth twenty, or something, instead of five, the winner of yesterday's tournament was still going to be a guy who won a match, he just won it in a different way. if you don't care about spectatability, why are you commenting on a tournament that exists solely for the purpose of being spectated?
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Aug 24, 2017 22:05
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DrNutt posted:I mean, does anyone really want to watch random dipshits hide in bathrooms for 30 minutes or swim out to sea? Like pubg is not a fun thing to watch when people are doing their best to win because it is more akin to hide and seek than a traditional shootmans game. Which is fine when you are playing and can decide if you want to play like that or not but for spectating it really seems abysmal.
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Aug 24, 2017 22:06
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cosmicjim posted:Kills are worth points for rankings. It's part of the measure over multiple games. These tournaments are multiple games. If kills aren't worth anything it's not like the real game. The game currently awards points for kills and damage.
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Aug 24, 2017 22:07
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Jeffrey of YOSPOS posted:Right but....that makes it not pubg, the game you play when you purchase pubg and hit play game. It's like if you showed up to a dota and give a big bonus to the team with the most creep kills instead of who wins. It might be an interesting to watch a game that's like pubg but you need to get kills in addition to winning, but give it its own name because it's totally different. Dota is not really a good comparison because it's team vs team with a single very obvious win condition. Minor RNG, but not extreme. This game is you vs 100 vs the world with extreme RNG. Even if you are head and shoulders above the other players in every single aspect, you may die early due to a huge number of random factors. That does the happen in dota. The "better team" can lose but only if they make mistakes that result in them playing worse than their single opponent. So it makes sense to alter the win condition, for two reasons, A) to make sure the person who displays the most skill end up on top the majority of the time and B) to make it entertaining to watch.
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Aug 24, 2017 22:08
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Raygun's right. The scoring system is already exclusive to this competitive setting, wanting it tweaked is perfectly legitimate. I'd be opposed to anything other than the last person standing being virtually guaranteed the highest amount of points based on a single game, but that amount should be surpassable over the course of several games if you do really well in the kill department. That should be really hard, but the way it stands it's pretty much impossible. The #1 team of today's first game had the most kills of any team, 11, and were awarded 500 points for winning and only 44 for their kill tally. I'd say 110 points for the latter would be balanced pretty fairly (making winning worth 400 instead might help too).
Lex Neville fucked around with this message at 22:49 on Aug 24, 2017 |
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