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A Strange Aeon posted:I was reading a comic book from 2000 and came across an ad for Kunark that boasted having a player count of 40,000. Surely the player count was higher than that, right? Sankis posted:Was it concurrent player count? That sounds about right for the era, I think. Each server had like 1500 on at peak. Yeah, as much as EQ was a huge success for early MMOs, it was a tiny niche market. An absolute footnote compared to WoW. How many people wanted to pay a monthly fee for an "mmo" when nobody even knew what that meant? 40k concurrent users sounds very right. Total subs would probably be a bit higher but nowhere near the millions of WoW's heyday.
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Aug 28, 2017 05:05
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Sankis posted:Was it concurrent player count? That sounds about right for the era, I think. Each server had like 1500 on at peak. Also, quote from Wikipedia: quote:While the exact statistics on EverQuest subscriptions are not public, computer games analyst Bruce Woodcock estimates, based on public sources such as press statements, that the game had 200,000 subscriptions in March 2000, one year after initial release, with an increase to more than 450,000 subscriptions by July 2003. However, the same analysis points at a sharp decline after mid-2005, back to 200,000 in May 2006
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Aug 28, 2017 11:49
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I still remember being really into EQ and hearing that Blizzard of all people were making an MMO, and I looked at the early footage of humans running around and thinking "this looks like poo poo" And then Sony Verant announced they were making an RTS and I was like "this also looks like poo poo, what are these people thinking swapping genres?" Ends up the Blizzard MMO was pretty cool. The Verant RTS... not so much.
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Aug 28, 2017 21:19
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EQ felt like an unstoppable juggernaut until WoW's open beta, then all of my friends started talking about it and a large group of them (and most of the top guilds) went right to it. I waffled back and forth until 2006 or so but by that point all of my friends were gone and EQ was becoming a box-or-die hellscape which only got worse with mercenaries. You have to remember that EQ2 came out and looked pretty good at the time, then WoW came out of left field to very unexpected success.
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Aug 28, 2017 21:40
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I was never able to get into EQ2. It just doesn't appeal to me like EQ does.
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Aug 28, 2017 21:56
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suuma posted:EQ felt like an unstoppable juggernaut until WoW's open beta, then all of my friends started talking about it and a large group of them (and most of the top guilds) went right to it. Hell, even during the closed beta of WoW, details were getting leaked out like a sieve. It stopped being a joke when it was filtering down that warriors had more to do than taunt and kick, you could drink and eat to heal quick after fights rather than sitting around and waiting 5 minutes, and the like.
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Aug 29, 2017 20:02
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There was a long history of the "EQ Killer". I don't think I knew anyone looking forward to wow until that beta hit. Speaking of betas, I remember in middle/high school (2000-2005ish) being in roughly a million different mmo betas. There was so much poo poo coming out. What a weird bubble that was. I even remember some like pre-release DAOC straight up having spell gems Edit: remember Horizon lmao Zaphod42 posted:I was never able to get into EQ2. It just doesn't appeal to me like EQ does. I've been vaguely interested in it for a long time just due to interest in seeing the world reimagined but boy does its art style suck reaaaal bad. Pilsner posted:I remember many servers peaked at over 3000 concurrent players before they started to hide the player count. Let's say 2000 average, and maybe 30 active regular servers, so I think around 50k players concurrent is pretty realistic around Kunark. However, they hid player numbers already in September, 2001, and it's pretty certain that EQ's subs went up after that. That actually sounds way more accurate. 1500 would be a couple hundred over p99 at peak and eq in its prime wasn't that barren. I think I was lowballing pop while over estimating server count. Edit 2: remember that weird elitest server that cost like 3x the sub fee to play on Sankis fucked around with this message at 17:05 on Aug 30, 2017 |
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Aug 30, 2017 16:47
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Isn't EQ2's graphics engine hilariously awful because when they were "future proofing" it they assumed the industry wouldn't move towards utilizing a dedicated GPU and built theirs around using the CPU? Edit: Really I just have to take a moment and laugh at that future proofing thing again. During the interviews they were SO drat CERTAIN that their game would be gorgeous for YEARS! And current PCs just can't handle our game at max settings yet! i am tim! fucked around with this message at 17:30 on Aug 30, 2017 |
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Aug 30, 2017 17:27
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Is this worth checking out as someone that never played EQ back in the day?
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Aug 30, 2017 18:32
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Elijah. posted:Is this worth checking out as someone that never played EQ back in the day? Do you enjoy outdated games, brutally slow leveling and mechanics that will make you rage? Then EQ is the game for you!
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Aug 30, 2017 18:51
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Do you like to go back and play old 90s crpgs with lots of numbers and stats? Think of a mid 90s crpg that was designed to be played online. Edit: or think of a mid 90s MUD with graphics It might be neat from a historical standpoint as its really the first modern mmo and set so many different mmo conventions but I can't imagine playing it now without the nostalgia driving me. That said if you do try it I'm super curious to know your thoughts Sankis fucked around with this message at 19:11 on Aug 30, 2017 |
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Aug 30, 2017 19:06
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Elijah. posted:Is this worth checking out as someone that never played EQ back in the day? EQ has that very ultra classic "80's fantasy novel cover art" look and feel that I don't think you can find anywhere else. It could also be interesting from the perspective of simply wanting to see how the MMO genre grew into what it is now. You'll see things in EQ that feel very much like pen and paper RPG mechanics that were forced into the game simply because that's just how you did things in the RPG genre back then. EQ also has a unique design niche of having items that actually do highly significant things beyond just increasing your stats. The game really gives you that feeling of "Frodo just found Sting" and you get really attached to the first major pieces of gear that you acquire for your character. If you're the kind of person that can overlook mechanical cruft and a lack of modern quality of life features in favor of a purely nostalgic, immersive, and social experience, only then would I really recommend EQ to anybody. 
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Aug 30, 2017 19:15
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To sum up everyone's responses: no.
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Aug 30, 2017 19:23
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xZAOx posted:To sum up everyone's responses: YES
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Aug 30, 2017 21:41
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I've got a cleric in the 20s I'd be down to group with. Look for Bertbert in Unrest for the time being.
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Aug 30, 2017 22:21
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Elijah. posted:Is this worth checking out as someone that never played EQ back in the day? I never played EQ till p1999 a few years back and have had a blast. I am a masochist though so YMMV.
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Aug 30, 2017 22:24
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Sankis posted:Speaking of betas, I remember in middle/high school (2000-2005ish) being in roughly a million different mmo betas. There was so much poo poo coming out. What a weird bubble that was. I even remember some like pre-release DAOC straight up having spell gems SO many betas. Back when betas were a thing. (Now its just early access demos) I played betas for so many up and coming mmos that aren't alive anymore today. Weird to think about. i am tim! posted:Isn't EQ2's graphics engine hilariously awful because when they were "future proofing" it they assumed the industry wouldn't move towards utilizing a dedicated GPU and built theirs around using the CPU? I doubt it considering even EQ1 required you to have a discreet graphics card with hardware T&L. I remember it being a big deal that I couldn't run it on my computer at first. Elijah. posted:Is this worth checking out as someone that never played EQ back in the day? It depends. If you like the sound of what is basically fantasy EVE Online, then probably. If you're looking for free2play wow or something you're gonna have a bad time. The game is unbelievably slow and grindy, but in that oppressive environment it forces players to actually meet each other and work together, which modern MMOs completely hosed up.
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Aug 30, 2017 22:47
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It's really hard to overemphasize how much classic EQ forces social interactions that are all but gone in modern MMO's. Soloing is possible, but only in certain circumstances and many classes can't do it at all. That means you need to find groups every play session. There's no LFG tool, no auto teleporter to get you into a dungeon group, no instances. You have to walk to an area of the appropriate level and ask people to group up. That's huge. Maybe they don't need more of the class you're playing. Maybe all the camp spots are full. Maybe there's nobody there at all. In all of these cases you're dealing with what feels like a real world with changing conditions that radically alter how you're going to play. If there's no groups in that area? You either try to solo until one opens up or you go somewhere else. Getting there could take hours walking. If you want to fast travel and you're not playing one of the classes that can do that, you have to find one and ask him/her to transport you. Once you arrive, if you want to bind there, you have to go find someone to do that for you. In so many situations you have to talk to another person. In WoW you can play the entire game to max level without speaking to another person easily. Even selling your loot is talking to other people. There's no auction house. There's a certain area where everyone gathers to shout what they are selling and buying and you sit there waiting for someone to auction off what you're looking for. I can go on and on but that I think is the essence of what makes EQ a different beast from all MMOs that followed it. It's also why the game is very painful to a casual player. You're very reliant on others and can easily be completely stuck with no way to progress, for example if you're playing a rogue and there's no groups around. Being pretty casual myself I'm forced to stick to classes that can, at the very least, solo a bit if I don't have time to find a group. And I try to level in areas where I have the option of grouping OR soloing my time is limited.
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Aug 30, 2017 23:22
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Zaphod42 posted:The game is unbelievably slow and grindy, but in that oppressive environment it forces players to actually meet each other and work together, which modern MMOs completely hosed up. On the lore side the world is also something pretty special. It's a game world that gives no fucks about you. If you go into the wrong tavern in a bad part of town you may find that the NPCs inside aren't super friendly or maybe you just find someone in the world who wants you dead because you worship the wrong god. Unlike most MMOs these days there's no central story where you're the chosen hero instead story exists in little bits and pieces in each city or dungeon to be gathered from quests and talking to NPCs (or reading the manual). The world design is similarly neat. It's huge and sprawling with a lot of varied areas to explore. While there are some exceptions, if you see something plopped down in the world there's probably some kind of story or lore bit associated with it to be gleaned from various places. It's by no means perfect, and being good is highly debatable, but it's very much a style that is rooted in some really old school ideas that isn't seen often these days. This stuff made Everquest one of my favorite MMOs to just walk around and explore. The other was Asheron's Call which did something similar. edit: There's also the "interesting" mechanical stuff that can't happen in the same way in subsequent MMOs. Things like kiting and trains are basically gone due to the fact that leashing exists. Kill stealing in WoW vs Kill stealing in EQ are also entirely different things due to how tagging works. If the evolution of the genre interests you that sort of stuff may be cool to see. Sankis fucked around with this message at 23:41 on Aug 30, 2017 |
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Aug 30, 2017 23:26
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P1999 is the only game in which I've made friends with random internet people since vanilla WoW, and I do so regularly. You go play modern WoW or something and the only time anyone says a word to one another is when they want to be an rear end in a top hat. Enchanter is also the most interesting and class in any RPG imo, so this game also has that going for it. EQ classes in general are pretty unique amongst each other and not interchangeable at all unlike every other modern MMO I've played, and I vastly prefer it that way even if it isn't particularly balanced. Vargs fucked around with this message at 01:54 on Aug 31, 2017 |
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Aug 31, 2017 01:51
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Elijah. posted:Is this worth checking out as someone that never played EQ back in the day? Just watch this, and move on with your life. Don't play our old dumb free game. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqhvTlR1WSc
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Aug 31, 2017 19:55
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Summit posted:It's really hard to overemphasize how much classic EQ forces social interactions that are all but gone in modern MMO's. Soloing is possible, but only in certain circumstances and many classes can't do it at all. That means you need to find groups every play session. There's no LFG tool, no auto teleporter to get you into a dungeon group, no instances. You have to walk to an area of the appropriate level and ask people to group up. That's huge. Maybe they don't need more of the class you're playing. Maybe all the camp spots are full. Maybe there's nobody there at all. In all of these cases you're dealing with what feels like a real world with changing conditions that radically alter how you're going to play. Final Fantasy XI (but NOT XIV) and EVE Online also do the same thing, but they're pretty much the only ones, and XI is totally dead now. All the modern MMOs from WoW forward tried to cater to a mass market and by doing so they made it possible to solo everything, which effectively stopped them from being true MMOs. These days in WoW other players are an active nuisance. Other people get in your way. They kill mobs you're trying to kill for quests which slows down your leveling. So everybody spreads out and does stuff alone and only talks to their friends or guild, and only really groups up for raids. EQ and the other early true MMORPGs that simply wasn't the case, it was the exact opposite. You had to group, you needed other players, each class could only do some things and needed others to do the other roles, and that's just so huge. Its a massive pain, its a massive inconvenience, sometimes you really hated the grind, but without that you simply don't have the same social environment. Also, travel times in EQ are huge. That sucks, but it makes the world feel legitimately big and scary. In games where you can freely teleport anywhere there's no cost to travel and zones may as well be separate from each other and all parallel. EQ making you either take long times to travel around or at least find someone to teleport you (and even then, you can only teleport to some places, not everywhere, so travel is still needed) makes you really appreciate the scale of the world, and really learn the zones. The biggest comparison I can make there is the dark souls series. Dark Souls 1 is still considered by many to be the best in the series, and even those who don't think so can appreciate that the world design is so much better than the later games. Everything is interconnected and you learn all these different paths and shortcuts to get around. In Dark Souls 2 and 3 you can teleport from the beginning of the game, which is very convenient (ESPECIALLY for co-op, which was a pain in DS1) but it completely destroys that interconnected world. If you can teleport you're going to, nobody is going to waste time running back and forth. But then you don't feel that connection, you don't appreciate the scope and scale of the world, and you don't need to find shortcuts between zones, only within a zone. EQ is basically the Dark Souls of MMOs for me, in many ways. The combat is poo poo but the punishment, the fear, the reward, the scale and interconnectedness, its all there. Sankis posted:On the lore side the world is also something pretty special. It's a game world that gives no fucks about you. If you go into the wrong tavern in a bad part of town you may find that the NPCs inside aren't super friendly or maybe you just find someone in the world who wants you dead because you worship the wrong god. Unlike most MMOs these days there's no central story where you're the chosen hero instead story exists in little bits and pieces in each city or dungeon to be gathered from quests and talking to NPCs (or reading the manual). This is another kinda souls-y thing about EQ, in souls you end up being the big hero but only at the end, for most of the game you're just some zombie guy trying to be a hero before you become fully zombified, and the world really doesn't give a poo poo about you. I'm sick of being the obvious protagonist with the world pandering to me. I like that idea of just being a nobody who has to earn their place. Having a realistic world of other characters doing their own things.
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Aug 31, 2017 20:07
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Herv posted:Just watch this, and move on with your life. Yeah this is a good video. I also really love this guy's videos https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3KUkfYfvZ6M
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Aug 31, 2017 20:33
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Zaphod42 posted:Yeah this is a good video. Do people actually pronounce names the way he does? Like Looslin, Waw, Eroodin, Keenos? I'm not an English speaker myself so back when I played on live I totally read those differently.
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Aug 31, 2017 21:16
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Meatgrinder posted:Do people actually pronounce names the way he does? Like Looslin, Waw, Eroodin, Keenos? I'm not an English speaker myself so back when I played on live I totally read those differently. Its a common problem with text-only early games, like I remember in Ocarina of Time my friends and I all pronounced "Kokiri" in different ways. But I pronounce the names a bit different. He's also kinda yukking it up for the youtubes.
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Aug 31, 2017 21:37
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Sankis posted:Edit: remember Horizon lmao I still get emails from them. They renamed to Istaria years ago. http://www.istaria.com/ And yes, they're still running. Meanwhile AOC and COH/COV is not.
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Sep 1, 2017 19:41
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xZAOx posted:I still get emails from them. They renamed to Istaria years ago. http://www.istaria.com/ They average like 600 on peak times. It's more or less a Free UO server population with a monthly fee. Heck, Human characters are free to play even.
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Sep 2, 2017 09:23
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i am tim! posted:Isn't EQ2's graphics engine hilariously awful because when they were "future proofing" it they assumed the industry wouldn't move towards utilizing a dedicated GPU and built theirs around using the CPU? No, integrated graphics was in any computer you'd want to game in come the early 2000s, even if they were junky. Sony Online Entertainment had a completely different hardware miscalculation: They wrote EQ2's game code on a futureproofing assumption that CPUs would continue on the same trend at the time. The theoretical specs they built the engine toward was like a single core 5-6 GHz processor pretty much right before multi-core processors took off in the early 00's. That's why EQ2 was hillariously CPU bound on a single CPU die forever and they still haven't really been able to really unfuck it.
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Sep 3, 2017 07:21
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I've been having a blast running around with my Barbarian Shaman, Toolicus. Just blew all my money on my 19 and 24 spells and I'm making the trek to Faydwer for a change of scenery. Goddamnit, this game. Any decent more out-of-the-way cash camps for my levels other than the lfay sisters that might be worthwhile? Edit: Im currently at 14.
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Sep 3, 2017 16:54
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Fyodorovich posted:I've been having a blast running around with my Barbarian Shaman, Toolicus. Just blew all my money on my 19 and 24 spells and I'm making the trek to Faydwer for a change of scenery. Goddamnit, this game. Any decent more out-of-the-way cash camps for my levels other than the lfay sisters that might be worthwhile? lfay sisters are good money. I don't know about others... there's definitely stuff out there. If you need a port or some plat to get by hit me up in game. Are you in guild?
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Sep 3, 2017 17:14
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Sankis posted:This stuff made Everquest one of my favorite MMOs to just walk around and explore. The other was Asheron's Call which did something similar. Looking back, I can't believe how few places I went in EQ while /playing 200 days over the span of 2 years, but I took revenge and have checked out almost every place in the past 8 years after re-joining. 
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Sep 3, 2017 20:19
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Fyodorovich posted:I've been having a blast running around with my Barbarian Shaman, Toolicus. Just blew all my money on my 19 and 24 spells and I'm making the trek to Faydwer for a change of scenery. Goddamnit, this game. Any decent more out-of-the-way cash camps for my levels other than the lfay sisters that might be worthwhile? You need to get a handful more levels, I'd recommend maybe L20 unless you bring a friend, but gargoyle island in the ocean of tears is a nice out of the way spot to give a try. The eyes sell for ~10 plat each and gargoyles can drop up to 2.
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Sep 3, 2017 20:25
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Pilsner posted:While I love exploring in EQ these days, where my character is a feign-deathing power house, I always felt EQ discouraged exploring for most classes, since death was so brutal and harsh. Even as a Rogue back in the day, with Sneak/Hide, I stayed so much on the safe paths, because I know how weak I was if I was caught off guard, and even with Jboots or SoW, it was extremely dangerous to walk in unknown territory. Even at lvl 60, with raid gear, I could only barely solo a lvl 50 mob, and two at once? Run for the hills. Totally what made the world seem so big and fearsome--everyone probably remembers the first time they took the dangerous journey across the continent from Qeynos to Freeport on foot--dodging griffins and giants, hoping you didn't get mixed up and end up in the wrong zone, /conning every NPC to make sure you weren't going to get attacked partway through. I think there was still some of that in Kunark, where you could get a teleport to the safe area of the Dreadforest or whatever, but then you had to cross that awful zone with the spellcasting spider people. I remember getting a SOW and a levitate and praying I was going in the right direction, because if I ended up landing I would be so, so hosed. I'd love some kind of server where your character is just in God Mode and you can explore the zones--like you said, even if you're max level and have sick equipment, it's still super dangerous to try exploring on your own.
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Sep 3, 2017 20:57
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Fyodorovich posted:I've been having a blast running around with my Barbarian Shaman, Toolicus. Just blew all my money on my 19 and 24 spells and I'm making the trek to Faydwer for a change of scenery. Goddamnit, this game. Any decent more out-of-the-way cash camps for my levels other than the lfay sisters that might be worthwhile? Wisp Island in Erud's Crossing is good. You can turn in greater lightstones in NK for 10p each, plus a good chunk of exp. You can also turn in regular lightstones for significantly less, but it's worthwhile regardless. Don't spend too much time soloing for money, though. It's real easy to burn out on this game if you just go at it alone all the time. Go do some group stuff in oasis or something. The exp will probably be worse and the money definitely will but the entire point of this game is to meet and talk to people.
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Sep 3, 2017 21:16
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Nybright sisters in LFay is a great spot until 16-18. Little camp of bandits on Felwithe faction near the Mistmoore zoneline.
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Sep 3, 2017 21:24
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Vargs posted:
Good advice, unless you've played it out a million times before Unrest or Crushbone are great fun at this level and on Faydwer. Your spells, a set of banded, the best weapon you can afford and HP rings if you can swing it is all you really need until you get the gamechanger pet. SilvergunSuperman fucked around with this message at 21:30 on Sep 3, 2017 |
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Sep 3, 2017 21:28
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Also does anyone on RED have anything interesting for sale? I apparently have 28k in the bank to buy toys with. Rogue, SK and Enc are my mains (all 50+ if anyone ever wants to group up!)
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Sep 3, 2017 21:32
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A Strange Aeon posted:I'd love some kind of server where your character is just in God Mode and you can explore the zones--like you said, even if you're max level and have sick equipment, it's still super dangerous to try exploring on your own. That's *kinda* how live is to a point. You can get up to the 80s with a merc pretty quickly and easily (and for free!), then the first like 10 expacs or something you can god mode your way around anything but raids, heh.
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Sep 3, 2017 23:40
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A Strange Aeon posted:I'd love some kind of server where your character is just in God Mode and you can explore the zones--like you said, even if you're max level and have sick equipment, it's still super dangerous to try exploring on your own. May be hard to find but there's "map viewer" programs for both EQ and WoW that let you do that, just fly around in the levels checking out terrain. That said if you want to see the mobs and everything, the real way to go is to make your own private server, give yourself GM mode, and then explore at your leisure. Its actually not *that* hard to set up your own local private server, I've done it many times.
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Sep 4, 2017 00:05
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Zaphod42 posted:lfay sisters are good money. I don't know about others... there's definitely stuff out there. I'm not in the guild yet, currently camped in west karana casually hunting one of the bandit camps and killing rabid grizzlies as they path by. Sort of meandering towards Freeport to catch a boat. A port to BB would be pretty amazing, but I probably won't be on until later in the week. Thanks for the recommendation everyone, I'll probably hit the sisters for a level or two then head to CB or Unrest for some grouping action. I've been pretty casually soloing for an hour or two as I have time, mostly because of odd play hours. I agree that grouping is way more fun, it was just too easy to solo green gnolls in Blackburrow for fangs and level at a nice clip.
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Sep 4, 2017 00:51
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