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precision posted:hold the front door, are there really two people named Aegon Targaryen in the show or is that a holdover from the books Aegon V is Aemon's little brother and is the Egg from the 'I dreamt that I was old' quote. Also same guy as Dunk and Egg. Aerys's father and Danys grandfather.
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Aug 31, 2017 13:36
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TK-42-1 posted:Aegon V is Aemon's little brother and is the Egg from the 'I dreamt that I was old' quote. Also same guy as Dunk and Egg. Aerys's father and Danys grandfather. Although in the books Egg is Aerys' grandfather because there's a whole Targ generation missing in the show.
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Aug 31, 2017 13:46
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Joff dying was cool and the Red Viper is sexy as gently caress, but the rest of season 4 was 30-minute monologues by the Fooking King of Gin Alley sandwiched around topless Ramsay terrifying hardened ironborn warriors with his nipples and dogs. It was p. bad. Not season 5-7 bad, but closer to them than to season one. The Little Kielbasa fucked around with this message at 17:35 on Aug 31, 2017 |
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Aug 31, 2017 14:00
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The legend of Gin Alley and that entire raid really were the warning signs about the quality of D&D's imagination.
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Aug 31, 2017 14:02
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I rewatched some Season 1 episodes recently, and other than being reminded how good they were, it's really funny to think about the tomboy Stark girl eventually becoming a stupid Coldsteel the Hedgehog character
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Aug 31, 2017 14:16
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Max posted:The legend of Gin Alley and that entire raid really were the warning signs about the quality of D&D's imagination. Skull drinking distracted everyone
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Aug 31, 2017 15:20
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Season 4 was one of the Ramsay Torture Porn seasons, right? Yeah, that was bad.
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Aug 31, 2017 15:43
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The only good episodes have Davos in them laying down wisdom
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Aug 31, 2017 15:45
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LinYutang posted:Season 4 was one of the Ramsay Torture Porn seasons, right? Yeah, that was bad. Season 3 also had that, and that was a good season.
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Aug 31, 2017 15:50
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Season 4 is definitely where the show plummeted off the edge of a cliff in terms of quality. It had its moments (the Purple Wedding, Tyrion's trial) but it also had Yara at the Dreadfort, KUNK KUNK KUNK, Jojen getting stabbed by a knife attached to a drinking bird, Olly, etc. Even good scenes like Arya and the Hound's road trip stopped being interesting after a while because basically every storyline was spinning its wheels until the finale. 1 >>> 3 > 2 > 4 > 7 > 6 > 5
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Aug 31, 2017 16:01
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In It For The Tank posted:Season 4 is definitely where the show plummeted off the edge of a cliff in terms of quality. It had its moments (the Purple Wedding, Tyrion's trial) but it also had Yara at the Dreadfort, KUNK KUNK KUNK, Jojen getting stabbed by a knife attached to a drinking bird, Olly, etc. Even good scenes like Arya and the Hound's road trip stopped being interesting after a while because basically every storyline was spinning its wheels until the finale. Basically when they started to diverge majorly from the books they started to loose the thread. That's not to say they didn't do some things a lot better than GRRM, bit far more they did worse (but then, unlike him, they actually did them).
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Aug 31, 2017 16:08
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I remember Gin Alley making me anxious since it was that moment where I said "hmm this doesn't bode well for when they need to start making things up as they get further ahead."
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Aug 31, 2017 16:15
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Decius posted:Basically when they started to diverge majorly from the books they started to loose the thread. That's not to say they didn't do some things a lot better than GRRM, bit far more they did worse (but then, unlike him, they actually did them). Is there anywhere that states that when they started the show, the D&D had expected GRRM to finish the series? He had just released Dance with Dragons right before the first season aired, so it seemed like a reasonable expectation. I had also remember reading an interview that D&D really only expected the show to last through 3 seasons due to the cost, and they really wanted to bring The Red Wedding to the screen. They had an exact detailed plan for how they wanted the show to develop three seasons out. It would also explain why the show started to suffer in quality when season 4 came along. I really wish I could find the interview where I read this, but it's hard because so much crap is written about GOT that it messes up my google-fu.
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Aug 31, 2017 16:17
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Decius posted:Basically when they started to diverge majorly from the books they started to loose the thread. That's not to say they didn't do some things a lot better than GRRM, bit far more they did worse (but then, unlike him, they actually did them). D&D are pretty good when it comes to completing typical writing assignments in school, e.g. "imagine Romeo and Hamlet meet each other over a beer and talk about their problems" but utterly fail when it comes to writing multiple cohesive plots in a sprawling world. An example for the first type of writing is the "famous" Rober/Cersei talk in season 1, an example for the later is season 5 of GoT. Solaris 2.0 posted:Is there anywhere that states that when they started the show, the D&D had expected GRRM to finish the series? He had just released Dance with Dragons right before the first season aired, so it seemed like a reasonable expectation. They did expect him to complete at least TWOW in time for them to use it as a source and a lot of people think the writing of season 5 is THIS bad because they wrote it on the fly, as they wanted to wait as long as possible in the hopes that they get more material. Oh and ADWD was released after the first season finished not before. GaussianCopula fucked around with this message at 17:00 on Aug 31, 2017 |
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Aug 31, 2017 16:36
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Season 4 was boring I thought, s5 was p lame too. 6/7 have been my favourites... 1/2/3 were decent though. 7 is just incoherent game of thrones which I don't mind cuz I never read the books
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Aug 31, 2017 17:43
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i actually forgot the bad bits of season 4 cuz the good bits were real good. i mean the early seasons all have essos and that all sucked poo poo after viserys and drogo died.
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Aug 31, 2017 17:48
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At this point can't we really view the show's creators as stewards of a story that we would never have learned the ending of without their works? There can't be a soul left who thinks there's going to be another book after Winds of Winter.
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Aug 31, 2017 18:16
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Their ending will be quite different at this point, I think.
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Aug 31, 2017 18:38
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Yeah it's worth restating that this whole business with the Night King has absolutely no basis in the books that we know of. There is no clear indication that the Others have a leader of any kind and the name "Night's King" refers to something different. I think they are probably going off of some things that GRRM told them but I don't believe for a minute that they are telling "the" ending of ASOIAF, or that they are even approaching the show that way. It's its own thing and they are not even slightly concerned with catering to book readership at this point.
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Aug 31, 2017 18:44
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DandyLion posted:At this point can't we really view the show's creators as stewards of a story that we would never have learned the ending of without their works? There can't be a soul left who thinks there's going to be another book after Winds of Winter. Do you really believe Winds of Winter will ever come out?
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Aug 31, 2017 18:45
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DandyLion posted:At this point can't we really view the show's creators as stewards of a story that we would never have learned the ending of without their works? There can't be a soul left who thinks there's going to be another book after Winds of Winter. I'd argue that on the contrary, if GoT would never have been made, we would already have TWOW and be waiting for the last book. It's safe to assume that the production of the first season (and the pilot before it) already caused delays for ADWD, so no, if D&D would not have made GoT the chances of us actually getting the real ending would be much better.
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Aug 31, 2017 18:48
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DandyLion posted:At this point can't we really view the show's creators as stewards of a story that we would never have learned the ending of without their works? There can't be a soul left who thinks there's going to be another book after Winds of Winter. im confident that The WInds of Winter and A Dream of Spring will come out at some point im also confident that the series will never be finished because gurm will in the interim discover that he needs 9 books to finish properly
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Aug 31, 2017 18:51
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PupsOfWar posted:im confident that The WInds of Winter and A Dream of Spring will come out at some point You're confident that a 69 year old obese man won't die in the next 12 years?
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Aug 31, 2017 19:12
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Gin alley guy rules. He was the only one other than euron that was actually having fun with the dogshit they gave him. Fookem till theyre dead!
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Aug 31, 2017 19:14
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The best possible outcome would be Winds of Winter coming out next year before the final season airs, but it's not an entire book and ends on another "Meanwhile, back at the wall...." type thing.
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Aug 31, 2017 19:15
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Solice Kirsk posted:The best possible outcome would be Winds of Winter coming out next year before the final season airs, but it's not an entire book and ends on another "Meanwhile, back at the wall...." type thing. I don't know why fatman can't sit back in his fatman chair and work with a couple of writers and get those drat books done. I don't think it would take that long. Once you have a timeline with milestones and the endgame framed you fill in the other bits.
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Aug 31, 2017 19:18
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Only the GRRM can write GRRM. I respect that.
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Aug 31, 2017 19:20
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R-Type posted:I don't know why fatman can't sit back in his fatman chair and work with a couple of writers and get those drat books done. Because he's already rich enough to afford to eat pizza and watch football all day every day and doesn't actually give much of a poo poo about the series anymore
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Aug 31, 2017 19:37
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Dude has just lost all motivation or interest in the story now that the TV show has take on a life of it's own. I'm sure he wanted to finish it, but at this point it sounds like in every interview he just can't convince himself to write more of it with any consistency or drive. I'm no writer, but the general consensus seems to be if you want to finish stuff you gotta write it almost daily, and he by his own admission has been more interested in writing other stories and doing other projects (that aren't writing) than ASOFAI. I really want those books, but unlike Jordan when he dies I don't think he's even gonna have an outline for how his story really should finish. If he had one I think these last few seasons would have been more tightly written/constructed. Plus it sounds like he wouldn't let anyone write for him anyway. I really wonder when/if we'll ever get a Wheel of Time adaptation. I think it could get pared down to ~8 seasons of TV if you made a point of cutting the poo poo side stories and condensed the long concurrent plots in books 8-11. 9 or 10 would be better to tell the volume of that story, but it could def be cut down to fit 80-90 hours of production.
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Aug 31, 2017 19:50
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precision posted:Because he's already rich enough to afford to eat pizza and watch football all day every day and doesn't actually give much of a poo poo about the series anymore
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Aug 31, 2017 19:50
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VanSandman posted:Do you really believe Winds of Winter will ever come out? We'll get TWOW and the final book (probably split into parts 1 & 2), because GoT is a big enough brand now that there's too much money to be left on table if the series goes unfinished. Now, will GRRM write them by himself? Doubtful. He's an old man who is rich enough now to not give a poo poo or feel pressured to write. He can just stay on the convention circuit and give interviews and go on vacation until he dies. Someone else will finish the books and probably do a couple of spinoff novels and the debate about which ending is canon will go until the heat death of the universe. The Notorious ZSB posted:I really wonder when/if we'll ever get a Wheel of Time adaptation. I think it could get pared down to ~8 seasons of TV if you made a point of cutting the poo poo side stories and condensed the long concurrent plots in books 8-11. 9 or 10 would be better to tell the volume of that story, but it could def be cut down to fit 80-90 hours of production. I love WoT (peep the avatar) but I truly hope we never get an adaptation because the series is just not well-suited for television or film. Jordan doesn't have GRRM's knack for complex character development, dialogue, or even complex world building and whatever would be left after going through an executive-mandated screenwriting process would probably just outright suck. Not to mention that the sheer amount of "magic" stuff would mean a budget pulled in even more directions than GoT. An animated series or something like that might work but honestly who is even clamoring for that? I'm surprised Tor put up the money to get Sanderson to finish the series. Mat Cauthon fucked around with this message at 19:57 on Aug 31, 2017 |
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Aug 31, 2017 19:52
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bbf2 posted:Okay, hot take alert incoming. Bronn is the best and you are a sad person
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Aug 31, 2017 19:55
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I'm fairly certain GRRM has said nobody will be allowed to continue the books if he dies before they're finished. But that will probably depend on his wife, in the end, so it could maybe happen.
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Aug 31, 2017 19:57
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GRRM recently said he gets three chapters done in 6 months. And I don't know if he counts going back and rewriting existing chapters in that tally or not. I would love it if TWOW is ever released. I would in fact lose my poo poo the second that book is announced, I'm seriously a huge GRRM fanboy, I really believe he's a goddamn genius and that the American Tolkien comparison is insulting towards the GRRM. But these books are never getting finished. Never. Like, the man should probably start a new Opus and plan it ahead this time because that venture has a far greater chance of completion. Just take the heat on ASOIAF being too big of a work to actually finish and do something else of an equivalent scale but this time stick to your outline. ASOIAF is never getting an ending.
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Aug 31, 2017 20:00
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Yeah but can GRRM interest you in WIldcards while you're waitng?????
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Aug 31, 2017 20:08
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emanresu tnuocca posted:You're confident that a 69 year old obese man won't die in the next 12 years? rich people hire good doctors and he's probably got most of the easier-to-write bits of TWOW written already and has been stewing all this time over a couple of thorny plot bits, like he did with ADWD. Whatever the case, I don't think he can finish satisfactorily in 2 books there's too many threads hanging and gurm is probably not willing to hypercondense everything by krandomly dropping subplots and teleporting people around, unlike dan & dave. if you conceive of the series as a regular 3-act structure (which admittedly im not sure gurm cares about) then AGOT, ACOK and ASOS were act I, while AFFC and ADWD are probably not the entirety of act II, given the way they ended. he'll keep splitting books ad infinitum like in xeno's tortoise paradox PupsOfWar fucked around with this message at 20:14 on Aug 31, 2017 |
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Aug 31, 2017 20:08
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Just look at GRRM's total state of confusion when Stephen King is talking to him about writing fast. That should tell you all you need to know about when TWOW is coming out. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_PBqSPNTfg&t=3020s
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Aug 31, 2017 20:19
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Preston Jacobs just announced he is writing a novel ... I have no interested in his writing, but maybe he can become a renowned novelist before GRRM dies and then finish the series for him. That would be kinda funny.
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Aug 31, 2017 20:32
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Rap Record Hoarder posted:I love WoT (peep the avatar) but I truly hope we never get an adaptation because the series is just not well-suited for television or film. Jordan doesn't have GRRM's knack for complex character development, dialogue, or even complex world building and whatever would be left after going through an executive-mandated screenwriting process would probably just outright suck. Not to mention that the sheer amount of "magic" stuff would mean a budget pulled in even more directions than GoT. An animated series or something like that might work but honestly who is even clamoring for that? I'm surprised Tor put up the money to get Sanderson to finish the series. I'm not sure there is any interest, but it feels easy for me to see how executives could look at GoT success and then go HEY there was this other long running (actually finished) fantasy series that was an XX number of times best seller maybe we could do something with that! An animated series might be better suited to the setting than live action, but I think there would be even less desire for that. I feel like given you could plan the entire thing before you started it might be easier to budget/cast etc than GoT ended up being where they made story decisions with budget in mind once they had to. It would certainly be considerably more effects driven than GoT which I agree would be a huge $$ concern for producing it. It is probably better suited to a big screen setting, but no one in their right mind would start a series knowing there are 9 more coming (I love Fast and Furious but thats like magic they've managed to make as many quality entries as they have). Harry Potter worked, but it had a much bigger international following, and is easily more than half as long as WoT. I think you're right the answer is probably never, but I always wonder. I feel like your major concerns about the original work could be corrected with proper planning/editors and someone to hem in all the dress straightening, at least unlike GoT they know exactly where the story goes and what needs to be hit. I feel like the books continued to sell well enough for Tor to pay Sanderson to finish it, it had enough of a following with as many books as he wrote they knew they had to get the rest of that potential out of it. Sanderson cranked them out too so I doubt they had to pay him too much compared to what they surely pulled in. vvvvv e: Well I mean I had no doubt someone owns the IP but it being Sony is not inspiring. The Notorious ZSB fucked around with this message at 20:56 on Aug 31, 2017 |
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Aug 31, 2017 20:48
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Wheel of Time has been picked up by Sony iirc, and has been in pre production the last year while they shop around to networks. e: http://variety.com/2017/tv/news/wheel-of-time-tv-series-sony-1202390897/
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Aug 31, 2017 20:49
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