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After my best game as Brandenburg and destroying the Catholics, I want to do a Catholic game. How is making Catholic Germany as Bavaria? Their ideas seems way less than Brandenburg's to be able to take over central Europe.
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Sep 2, 2017 15:02
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| # ? May 24, 2024 00:23 |
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form Westphalia and redefine peace
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Sep 2, 2017 15:07
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So... I was trying to figure out fort Zone of Control and movement, since I saw the AI making... interesting movements... and then I found this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x3KqmV_9-bA This is a dumb system. He's saying it's fine once you get used to it, but these are ugly rules that would frustrate new players. Also apparently I should have been keeping a transport ship with one guy with a leader assigned to it at the Red Sea so my army could crab walk through all of the forts. There was also a system change that was happening at some point but they backed out of it?
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Sep 3, 2017 01:20
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It feels like there were probably good reasons for it considering it must've been annoying to code that way, but I still can't figure out what they are. The other fort system was a horrible failure that only ever worked for giant nations. The current system is weird and awkward, but usually okay as long as you don't think about it too hard and just note that lines of forts will generally stop movement. AnoHito fucked around with this message at 01:33 on Sep 3, 2017 |
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Sep 3, 2017 01:31
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It used to be a lot simpler before Cossacks, I think they added most of the odd rules in then to fix issues with it. I think it's mostly okay now. Stuff like the coastal thing on the Aegean is hosed but that doesn't really come up that often. It'd be nice if it worked better but compared to other issues I don't think it's really as big a deal as people make it out to be; it's still a nice system that makes wars a lot more interesting. Koramei fucked around with this message at 04:21 on Sep 3, 2017 |
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Sep 3, 2017 02:50
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Weren't the changes in Cossacks the ones that they had to undo because players complained?
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Sep 3, 2017 04:14
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nah that was the beta for whatever patch came after Rights of Man.
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Sep 3, 2017 04:20
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Where are the current fort rules documented? For ages now I've been trying to make sense of them, but the only consistent rule I've seen is "The AI can attack your provinces, you can't move past their forts". Paradox has them somewhere right?
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Sep 3, 2017 04:34
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Beamed posted:Where are the current fort rules documented? For ages now I've been trying to make sense of them, but the only consistent rule I've seen is "The AI can attack your provinces, you can't move past their forts". Paradox has them somewhere right? lol, no. Paradox documents pretty much nothing about their games. There's probably a good section about it on the wiki. Or you could watch that video which does a really good job explaining them.
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Sep 3, 2017 04:39
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Beamed posted:Where are the current fort rules documented? For ages now I've been trying to make sense of them, but the only consistent rule I've seen is "The AI can attack your provinces, you can't move past their forts". Paradox has them somewhere right? The guy said he updated the wiki: http://www.eu4wiki.com/Zone_of_control ...but I'd just watch the video dude. He shows plenty of examples and stuff that makes it easier to grasp.
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Sep 3, 2017 04:39
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I feel like my sarcasm was laid on a little too thick. Forts are just another feature that sounded great in premise but just lead to frustration on the part of the player.
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Sep 3, 2017 04:49
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nah Forts and ZoC, even with all its oddities, is a lot better than the system before.
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Sep 3, 2017 07:17
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The 1.19 beta system was really good but the beta they released had some bugs and one rediculously glaring oversight which made people hate it. The rules were incredibly simple and based on map areas. Basically each map area was defined as friendly / neutral / contested / hostile depending on its combination of friendly and hostile controlled forts, and you couldn't move from a hostile area to another area. The design encouraged building more forts in general (AI states would typically have 2-3 times the number of forts they usually do now) and made forts half the current cost and upkeep to partially compensate for this, but unfortunately they didn't have the sense to also reduce the time it takes to siege down provinces, so the main impact of this was to make wars outside of the early game into soul-crushingly boring siege fests. The only other major issue was that in some cases clever use of military access through 3rd parties could let you totally circumvent some forts but I didn't see this as being something which necessarily needed fixing, it encouraged you to plan your early conquests around protecting your heartlands which seemed like a good thing, and there were a few suggestions which might have fixed the issue as well, but again, they never tried any modifications to the one patch before ditching the whole system. I'm still extremely salty about this coming up to a year after it happened because the new system was so superior in concept but was only given a few weeks of public beta testing on a single beta patch with none of the issues people raised (such as sieges now being far too long compared to how common forts were) being even looked at before they totally gave up on the idea. Though they never really talked about it, I assume that some or most of the team internally really didn't like the new system and they only released it as a beta patch because they had already announced that the fort system was going to be changed and it was probably better in terms of expectation management to let people play with a fairly crap implementation and decide that they don't like it (for reasons mostly unrelated to the actual system itself)
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Sep 3, 2017 08:05
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Atreiden posted:nah Forts and ZoC, even with all its oddities, is a lot better than the system before. I mean, maybe, but just like HoI3 DLC, how much of this can be depended on without just buying future expansions isn't dependable.
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Sep 3, 2017 08:17
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Beamed posted:I mean, maybe, but just like HoI3 DLC, how much of this can be depended on without just buying future expansions isn't dependable.
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Sep 3, 2017 08:37
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RabidWeasel posted:The 1.19 beta system 1.19 was really intuitive which was great, but if it's the patch I'm thinking of, it had serious issues for smaller countries. Those same issues with military access meant that for any smaller country, or any irregularly shaped one, you lost all the strategic control advantages forts gave to larger countries; losing any battle meant death because you couldn't ever find safety to recover morale.
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Sep 3, 2017 08:41
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Yes, it's like a lava lamp.
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PittTheElder posted:1.19 was really intuitive which was great, but if it's the patch I'm thinking of, it had serious issues for smaller countries. Those same issues with military access meant that for any smaller country, or any irregularly shaped one, you lost all the strategic control advantages forts gave to larger countries; losing any battle meant death because you couldn't ever find safety to recover morale. This already happens with the current rules, just in a less easily exploitable way. I personally don't think that it's much of a serious issue at all (I like how it encourages you to control contigious territory of multiple map areas) but it's probably the main reason why they just gave up on the new system because it makes playing in the HRE significantly more difficult as a minor. Though I will point out that you still got benefit from your forts as the enemy would have to route through a 3rd party area in order to move between your areas, wheras you can move your own troops directly between them. This should usually let you outmaneuver your enemies sufficiently that you can avoid getting stack wiped (again, the HRE has the most issues with this due to small provinces and lovely borders)
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Sep 3, 2017 09:35
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oddium posted:Holy Roamin' Emperor This is such a bad pun and so stupid that it needs to happen. This army professionalism is such feature bloat that its making me even more sick of the game. It's more poo poo the game doesn't need. Did we learn nothing from Civilization 4? "A designer knows he has achieved perfection not when there is nothing more to add, but when there is nothing left to take away." Wise words from Spock. Node fucked around with this message at 10:08 on Sep 3, 2017 |
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Sep 3, 2017 10:06
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Beamed posted:I mean, maybe, but just like HoI3 DLC, how much of this can be depended on without just buying future expansions isn't dependable. I'm not sure what you are trying to say here? The current fort system was a free change with patch 1.12
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Sep 3, 2017 10:22
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BeAuMaN posted:So... I was trying to figure out fort Zone of Control and movement, since I saw the AI making... interesting movements... and then I found this video: Wow. I had written off the fort movement system as straight up buggy. I didn't realise they deliberately coded in stuff like the distance rule. "This would be frustrating if I didn't know this rule because it seems so random." No poo poo. The distance rule is a bad rule.
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Sep 3, 2017 10:35
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the distance rule should probably be visualized in game somehow since it's so important
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Sep 3, 2017 11:53
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That guy Reman's youtube channel is a pro-watch if you've got any questions on Trade, Fort Zone of Control or Institutions.
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Sep 3, 2017 13:03
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Atreiden posted:I'm not sure what you are trying to say here? The current fort system was a free change with patch 1.12 Yeah, I'm not complaining about the DLC policy, more whining about the fact that fort mechanics have been in this semi-functional state -since- 1.12. It reminded me of the HoI3 DLC which was literally broken with certain expansions, but wasn't advertised as such. Still, maybe if I watch the video it will make some sort of sense, I just wish Paradox would do a better job of communicating their game functionality beyond relying on the community doing it for them.
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Sep 3, 2017 16:40
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RabidWeasel posted:This already happens with the current rules, just in a less easily exploitable way. I personally don't think that it's much of a serious issue at all (I like how it encourages you to control contigious territory of multiple map areas) but it's probably the main reason why they just gave up on the new system because it makes playing in the HRE significantly more difficult as a minor. it was way more than the HRE. the only place the new system was actually good was places like France or Russia where your whole country was multiple areas deep. Otherwise it was pretty worthless. Any kind of irregular shape to your country and armies just had free reign over the whole thing. rolling back from that system was a great decision. it was intuitive and simple but a massive downgrade in terms of functionality. e: oh yeah, I was reading some of my comments from back when it was out and I totally forgot the worst part- they added the wasteland mountains in that patch, but the new fort system made them totally fuckin' worthless. Those have been one of the best additions for the strategic play of the game since release, that by its self being broken was reason enough to ditch the new system. Koramei fucked around with this message at 17:51 on Sep 3, 2017 |
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Sep 3, 2017 17:46
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Prav posted:the distance rule should probably be visualized in game somehow since it's so important A helpful and informative UI improvement that might make the game less opaque for new players? Why that would rob the game of its very heart and soul.
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Sep 3, 2017 18:25
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Node posted:This is such a bad pun and so stupid that it needs to happen. Yeah like I like being able to do something with an individual army, but why not just make drilling add like +.01 to tradition? They could even balance it out with the amount forts give so you could disband forts while drilling troops and not have a net loss.
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Sep 3, 2017 18:33
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Hello, my sweet achievements (All your trade are belong to us, Voting Streak, One night in Paris, Magellan's Voyage)  Crippling France has been my #1 priority, and it went very well with the help of Austria and Castile. Then it was Castile's turn, between me and Morocco-turned-Andalusia both them and Aragon were exiled to southern Italy (then Aragon murdered Castile, exiling them in the New World) Then I started grabbing the Low Countries from the Netherlands and stealing all their colonies. Poland lost the union on Lithuania but they've been allies the whole game and they're pretty strong. Scandinavia is my best buddy since I helped them reconquer Finland from Russia. Tons of fun! TorakFade fucked around with this message at 20:50 on Sep 3, 2017 |
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Sep 3, 2017 18:59
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I'm trying Consulate of the Sea now, Aragon is always such a fun game.
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Sep 3, 2017 19:35
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 Castile, what in the world are you doing? What have you been doing?
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Sep 4, 2017 09:25
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They somehow flipped Sunni. And that looks like Morocco in Badajoz and Galicia? edit: I guess that's Galicia's tag color actually!
Ormi fucked around with this message at 09:57 on Sep 4, 2017 |
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Sep 4, 2017 09:48
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Tag switch to them and find out
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Sep 4, 2017 09:51
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Check their tech levels and the date I pasted in. 140 years and they haven't unlocked a single idea group.Ormi posted:They somehow flipped Sunni. And that looks like Morocco in Badajoz and Galicia? edit: I guess that's Galicia's tag color actually!
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Sep 4, 2017 10:08
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I could see not unlocking a full idea group in that time. So if you tag switch to them you could see if they're halfway through three groups or if they haven't unlocked a single idea or what.
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Sep 4, 2017 10:10
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Prav posted:the distance rule should probably be visualized in game somehow since it's so important It should not be 2 provinces in the first place and not past the fort. Coastal forts need to be fixed as well, as it is they seem pretty much worthless. Currently what you want is forts that are not on coastal provinces and exactly 2 tiles from any other forts you got, it's a bit weird. Also gently caress level8 forts.
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Sep 4, 2017 10:12
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Gort posted:I could see not unlocking a full idea group in that time. So if you tag switch to them you could see if they're halfway through three groups or if they haven't unlocked a single idea or what. Poil fucked around with this message at 10:52 on Sep 4, 2017 |
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Sep 4, 2017 10:46
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Gah how do you do the big blue blob? I.e. What's the most effective way to get to Scandinavia or the balkans
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Sep 4, 2017 10:48
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DoW someone with an ally in that region, then take a province in the peace deal (unjustified demands), then work from there. Depending on what luck you have you can also get the mission to conquer Jerusalem from the Mamluks, that's a nice point to hop there too.
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Sep 4, 2017 11:08
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maybe they chained bankruptcies and lost all their mana
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Sep 4, 2017 11:50
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Castile starts with an atrocious heir who may have gained the throne early. Between having a 0 Admin ruler for a while and possibly spending/losing most of their Admin points trying to hold together a crumbling kingdom, I could see that happening.
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Sep 4, 2017 12:58
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| # ? May 24, 2024 00:23 |
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Probably led by Donaldo Trumpo, popular with the peasantry, but woefully inadequate at everything ever.
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Sep 4, 2017 13:19
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