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Shinku ABOOKEN posted:everytime i open a paper its always the same lovely 2 col layout. i just love it when a sentence runs six lines and have 3 words hyphenated to the next line.
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Sep 8, 2017 18:39
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actually the journal supplies the template.
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Sep 8, 2017 18:44
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MALE SHOEGAZE posted:please try not to summon ESR hold on tho: quote:just because the tool is good at doing the job this doesn't describe esr, he's a tool who's not good at doing the job
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Sep 8, 2017 18:52
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Has anyone ever tried to "disrupt" academic publishing by like cutting out the journal and having like "peer 2 peer review"? Like maybe papers would first be tentative, and anyone with academic merit in the field could be assigned to review the papers, and then after their concerns were met the paper would become published and open to the public. Maybe you couldn't publish your next paper until you finish your reviews, and you risk getting banned if you don't put some effort into your reviews or something? IDK I just feel like academic publishing is an extremely stupid industry and it seems like exactly the sort of thing a computer science professor would love to "disrupt".
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Sep 8, 2017 19:15
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VikingofRock posted:IDK I just feel like academic publishing is an extremely stupid industry and it seems like exactly the sort of thing a computer science professor would love to "disrupt". it is mindfuckingly stupid but everyone who has sufficient influence to change it gains from the barriers to entry and lax standards once you're in, so
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Sep 8, 2017 19:20
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Shinku ABOOKEN posted:i dunno man. all of them? random blogposts on the other hand...
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Sep 8, 2017 19:26
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Shinku ABOOKEN posted:everytime i open a paper its always the same lovely 2 col layout. i just love it when a sentence runs six lines and have 3 words hyphenated to the next line. are you sure those are journals though (where pros get involved)? just getting papers off the internet you get the author-formatted one, which will often look like poo poo (especially in pl, as it has mostly the wrong kind of sperg) VikingofRock posted:Has anyone ever tried to "disrupt" academic publishing by like cutting out the journal and having like "peer 2 peer review"? oh yeah, there is a lot of good stuff happening as such. notably most of the most important stuff in many areas get pushed to arxiv first and publicly debated online. the issue, as i commented earlier, is that funding is badly mixed up with historical publishers. if you are not the recognized top of the field you can't mess about with getting your research out there to ~people~. what you need is the publications at the right places, chasing those impact factors (if you don't know the term "impact factor": good, it is quite useless) Cybernetic Vermin fucked around with this message at 19:44 on Sep 8, 2017 |
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Sep 8, 2017 19:38
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Cybernetic Vermin posted:are you sure those are journals though (where pros get involved)? just getting papers off the internet you get the author-formatted one, which will often look like poo poo (especially in pl, as it has mostly the wrong kind of sperg) in cs, you often publish in conferences and call it a day. so in a sense, yes, that is *the* journal version. the author was forced to use that format and received no help other than a latex template. then they put the final version with that bad formatting on their website also. stuff tossed on the arxiv often looks better than the official version because nobody forces a bad format on you
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Sep 8, 2017 21:03
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was just skimming through an article & omg it namedrops tef https://www.prolificinteractive.com/2017/09/06/writing-imperfect-code/ NICE!
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Sep 8, 2017 21:19
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Two-column formats are fine. They conserve space. The absence of glossaries and such is just part of the style; papers are not meant to be tutorials or textbooks. You get used to it, just like you get used to any efficiency-optimised style. Some conferences (seemingly most of SIGPLAN) are moving to a new single-column layout. It's a lot more airy, but since printed proceedings are mostly a thing of the past, I guess that doesn't matter anymore. Here's an example of a paper I saw presented this week at ICFP, which uses this new style: Compiling to Categories (
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Sep 8, 2017 21:22
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CKyle posted:in cs, you often publish in conferences and call it a day. so in a sense, yes, that is *the* journal version. the author was forced to use that format and received no help other than a latex template. then they put the final version with that bad formatting on their website also. yeah, i mean, i do get what you are saying. even in cs though, journal publications are the be-all end-all for any researcher who cannot manage name recognition (i.e. 99% of them), and with journal versions of papers at least editing and professional typesetting comes in and fixes that aspect up (i personally find it to be a humbling experience to get the notes from the pro editors). however, as much as i love typesetting chat (thread anyone?), the broader issue is that the publishers do, by way of the journals, control vast amounts of research funding. it is, fantastically strangely (actually, no doubt, speaking to the good intentions of the actual people involved) not that corrupt, but it is a bad way of doing things
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Sep 8, 2017 21:36
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id be up for lurking a typesetting thread. theres a tex thread in sh/sc but its mostly about technical issues
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Sep 8, 2017 22:01
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Powaqoatse posted:id be up for lurking a typesetting thread. theres a tex thread in sh/sc but its mostly about technical issues  Though to be fair, any typesetting thread probably devolves into tech support and/or that one poster crowing about plain TeX, unless people want to chat about more effective ways to self-harm (HTML/JS/CSS? InDesign? Markdown + magic fairy dust? Rewriting LaTeX in COBOL?).
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Sep 8, 2017 22:11
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if you have to read a lot of articles, two-column is the layout you want. less horizontal scanning -> easier on the eye muscles
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Sep 8, 2017 22:29
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Hollow Talk posted:and/or that one poster crowing about plain TeX
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Sep 8, 2017 22:37
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yeah, i often un-maximize the browser window or zoom out on PDFs when reading long stuff that uses single-column layout. i dunno if it's my eye muscles but something about reading text full left to full right on a widescreen monitor is more tiring than skinnier columns
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Sep 8, 2017 22:40
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2 col is way better for reading on a phone
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Sep 8, 2017 23:58
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redleader posted:2 col is way better for reading on a phone 
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Sep 9, 2017 01:37
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Gazpacho posted:if you have to read a lot of articles, two-column is the layout you want. less horizontal scanning -> easier on the eye muscles 99% of pdfs will be read on a screen, unless you're printing them all out like a caveman two column pdf on a screen: sure, I'll scroll down the page, then scroll back up to the top of the page to read the next column. this is definitely not at all inconvenient or hard to follow tbf half the problem is with pdf viewers. maybe there's one that fixes this?
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Sep 9, 2017 02:42
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dual columns loving suck on a kindle
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Sep 9, 2017 02:58
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MononcQc posted:dual columns on a kindle 
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Sep 9, 2017 03:00
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I like to email papers to my kindle and it loving sucks
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Sep 9, 2017 03:14
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reading? on a device designed for reading? you loving monster
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Sep 9, 2017 08:03
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maybe dont like doing things that loving suck!!!
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Sep 9, 2017 08:13
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it's too bad the problem of typesetting according to each individual's needs a PDF with the solution to this problem of typesetting according to each individual's needs a PDF with the solution to this problem is self referential like the halting problem and thus can never be solved by computer science the best we could hope for is an endless hierarchy of ways of typesetting a PDF that can never be complete and consistent at the same time, and well that's just not good enough 
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Sep 9, 2017 09:26
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Max Facetime posted:it's too bad the problem of typesetting according to each individual's needs a PDF with the solution to this problem of typesetting according to each individual's needs a PDF with the solution to this problem is self referential like the halting problem and thus can never be solved by computer science what if our pdf lang was turing complet..oh wait it already is
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Sep 9, 2017 10:35
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Cybernetic Vermin posted:yeah, i mean, i do get what you are saying. even in cs though, journal publications are the be-all end-all for any researcher who cannot manage name recognition (i.e. 99% of them) Wait, what are you saying here? Every CS researcher I know publishes in conferences mainly, and maybe only secondarily submits to journals to write summary/detail papers with no page limit. I just checked the last paper I published (at a conference), and of the 56 works I cited, only six were from journals (another five were theses and tech reports).
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Sep 9, 2017 11:14
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Athas posted:Wait, what are you saying here? Every CS researcher I know publishes in conferences mainly, and maybe only secondarily submits to journals to write summary/detail papers with no page limit. i rather overstated it, and it depends on subfield and a bit on what you are pressured to do, but certainly in theory (and many of the adjacent areas) anything actually good is expected to make it into a journal eventually. often projects will go 2-4 conference papers and then restate the collected results in a journal version (and any research endeavor that does not manage that will by many be viewed as suspect)
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Sep 9, 2017 13:43
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Athas posted:Wait, what are you saying here? Every CS researcher I know publishes in conferences mainly, and maybe only secondarily submits to journals to write summary/detail papers with no page limit. my anecdote is different, therefore your claim is obviously suspect. furthermore,
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Sep 9, 2017 14:04
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even if your work will eventually be expanded into a journal paper, that's gonna take years of back-and-forth, and you need to pad your cv with prestigious conference papers right now if you want to ________________ replace blank with the following phrase depending on what decade it is: 1980s: get tenure 1990s: get a tenure-track position 2000s: get a postdoc 2010s: get into grad school 2020s: even look at a grad school
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Sep 9, 2017 19:12
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Lutha Mahtin posted:my anecdote is different, therefore your claim is obviously suspect. furthermore, Maybe I'm just caught in my own bubble (I know the algorithmics researchers seem to like journals somewhat more, but still seem to prefer conferences), but Google's dubious list of ACM activities ranked by the known perfect metric of citation count also seems to support the idea that people tend to cite conferences more than journals (although both #1 and #3 are journals): https://scholar.google.com/citations?hl=en&view_op=search_venues&vq=ACM&btnG= In the PL community the conference dominance has become so great that SIGPLAN is now trying to get the conferences to go along with publishing their papers (after a second review process) in a new journal called PACMPL. The problem this is trying to solve is that some researchers are employed by stupid universities that use stupid metrics to determine your value as a human being, and these stupid metrics only count journal publications, not conferences. What I'm saying is that citation metrics are Athas fucked around with this message at 08:46 on Sep 10, 2017 |
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Sep 9, 2017 19:31
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Athas posted:Maybe I'm just caught in my own bubble (I know the algorithmics researchers seem to like journals somewhat more, but still seem to prefer conferences), but Google's dubious list of ACM activities ranked by the known perfect metric of citation count also seems to support the idea that people tend to cite conferences more than journals (although both #1 and #3 are journals): https://scholar.google.com/citations?hl=en&view_op=search_venues&vq=ACM&btnG= gay! Hahahahaha
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Sep 10, 2017 01:24
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Athas posted:What I'm saying is that citation metrics are gay and fake. don't
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Sep 10, 2017 01:28
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i agree, they are very good 
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Sep 10, 2017 01:44
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im an extremely heterosexual citation metric
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Sep 10, 2017 02:12
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If your citation ring has an odd number of researchers you're guaranteed at least one homosexual citation.
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Sep 10, 2017 02:16
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playground rules: if you and someone else both get cited in a paper, that means youre a couple forever
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Sep 10, 2017 02:25
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im gay
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Sep 10, 2017 02:26
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fart simpson posted:im gay hi gay, i'm dad!!!!
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Sep 10, 2017 02:27
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Powaqoatse posted:playground rules: Paul Erdős was polyamorous
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