X-Wing: Let's Fly Some Wangs

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Traditional Games > X-Wing: Let's Fly Some Wangs

Acebuckeye13: Nov 2, 2010; Ultra Carp

Rotation systems can work for card games, but I just don't think it could work for X-Wing. I mean, how would you handle old ships getting rotated out? Are you going to have to buy entirely new ships just for the cards or dials to use your old ones? And what does that do to stop the current pilots that are dominating the meta?

# ? Sep 14, 2017 01:01

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# ? May 15, 2024 10:04

Chill la Chill: Jul 2, 2007; Don't lose your gay

Yeah, card games have expansion icons on them. X-wing would've had to include expansion icons or some other identifier for waves from the get-go in order to not make it a confusing mess.

# ? Sep 14, 2017 01:09

Admiral Joeslop: Jul 8, 2010

In theory, they could finally get around to releasing card packs for existing ships. Doesn't solve the problem for new players; they'd have to rerelease ships with the new cards, or players would have to buy old ships with now useless cards.

I hate having to keep FAQ things in mind, too.

# ? Sep 14, 2017 01:54

Improbable Lobster: Jan 6, 2012; "From each according to his ability" said Ares. It sounded like a quotation.; Buglord

Admiral Joeslop posted:

In theory, they could finally get around to releasing card packs for existing ships. Doesn't solve the problem for new players; they'd have to rerelease ships with the new cards, or players would have to buy old ships with now useless cards.

I hate having to keep FAQ things in mind, too.

Wasn't Disney allegedly keeping them from releasing card-only packs as well or was that just a rumor?

# ? Sep 14, 2017 01:55

Devlan Mud: Apr 10, 2006; I'll hear your stories when we come back, alright?

Improbable Lobster posted:

Wasn't Disney allegedly keeping them from releasing card-only packs as well or was that just a rumor?

Maybe initially, but I think the license agreement has expanded enough that it wouldn't be a licensing issue, FFG just wants to sell you the little spaceship, the cards that come with it are just to motivate you to buy the spaceship.

# ? Sep 14, 2017 02:19

Ringo Star Get: Sep 18, 2006; JUST FUCKING TAKE OFF ALREADY, SHIT

Should have been less named unique pilots and more varieties in pilot skill. Rarely do I see any games with mixed-in pilot skills, someone is either making sure they're PS1 or PSinfinity.

Also give certain generics abilities - like Red Squadron X-Wings get ability to barrel roll before they attack or Black Squadron TIE Fighters can pass unused focuses to others at range 1.

# ? Sep 14, 2017 02:22

JonathonSpectre: Jul 23, 2003; I replaced the Shermatar and text with this because I don't wanna see racial slurs every time you post what the fuck; Soiled Meat

Ringo Star Get posted:

Should have been less named unique pilots and more varieties in pilot skill. Rarely do I see any games with mixed-in pilot skills, someone is either making sure they're PS1 or PSinfinity.

Also give certain generics abilities - like Red Squadron X-Wings get ability to barrel roll before they attack or Black Squadron TIE Fighters can pass unused focuses to others at range 1.

I think you mean:
BLAST MISSILE 3 pts.
You must do at least a speed 2 maneuver to fire the BLAST MISSILE.
Get as many red dice as you can hold in your cupped, open hand and roll them all. You don't need a target lock, focus, or to have your opponent in arc. Green dice cannot cancel out these results. If your target is a ship you may reroll as many of your dice as you please as many times as you want.
"Good luck on the joust!"

Honestly that generic abilities idea is great, just have to keep it reasonable so you don't have a Corran Horn or Biggs squadron.

Today I watched a kid with a TIE bomber fly slowly straight up the middle of the board dropping proximity mines while another kid with an E-Wing hosed around in some asteroids for 2 turns and then basically managed to clip two of the mines just in time for the bomber to come back around and finish him off with its 2 red dice. In-universe you gotta kinda hope that E-Wing pilot doesn't get rescued.

I also watched another kid roll 4 blanks in a row on Kylo Ren's die in Destiny at which point he was out of options and a 2-hp Rey cut him in half at the start of the next turn. All in all a good Star Wars day.

# ? Sep 14, 2017 02:37

bunnyofdoom: Mar 29, 2008; I've been here the whole time, and you're not my real Dad!

Just started painting my first dial cover. Felt good to primer it

# ? Sep 14, 2017 02:54

Baron Fuzzlewhack: Sep 22, 2010; ALIVE ENOUGH TO DIE

At the end of the day, two things hold true:

1) FFG can't handle organized play properly.

2) Miniatures games make for terrible tournament play, but great and thematic story or causal play.

# ? Sep 14, 2017 04:29

Ringo Star Get: Sep 18, 2006; JUST FUCKING TAKE OFF ALREADY, SHIT

I feel like actual tournament play should have some clear rules, restrictions, and objectives.

# ? Sep 14, 2017 05:08

Panzeh: Nov 27, 2006; "..The high ground"

In Runewars, FFG has worked it out so that cards tend to be available without having to buy expansions from other factions, I imagine that's the best you're going to get from them.

# ? Sep 14, 2017 05:36

turn it up TURN ME ON: Mar 19, 2012; In the Grim Darkness of the Future, there is only war.

...and delicious ice cream.

I just want more plastic space ships. Give me my Stormtrooper Transport and reprint the Lambda so I can play through the TIE fighter campaign.

# ? Sep 14, 2017 06:00

theironjef: Aug 11, 2009; The archmage of unexpected stinks.

turn it up TURN ME ON posted:

I just want more plastic space ships. Give me my Stormtrooper Transport and reprint the Lambda so I can play through the TIE fighter campaign.

Lambdas are currently available at Miniature Market for their usual discount, get it while it's hot.

Also my dream is to get a playable Startours Starspeeder 1000. I don't care if I have to find a wireframe for it and get it printed myself. No weapons, 30 crew slots, astromech slot, and either non-unique AC series pilot or RX-24 as a unique pilot. Comes with a mission where both players have to cooperate to keep the shuttle alive by blasting storms of comets and ship wreckage.

# ? Sep 14, 2017 06:18

banned from Starbucks: Jul 18, 2004

Ringo Star Get posted:

I feel like actual tournament play should have some clear rules, restrictions, and objectives.

please god no dont turn this game into star trek attack wing

# ? Sep 14, 2017 07:42

Iceclaw: Nov 4, 2009; Fa la lanky down dilly, motherfuckers.

I thought it was rampant powercreep that made ST:AW bad, not objectives. I'd actually be down for some more variety than "kill them all".

# ? Sep 14, 2017 13:56

Devlan Mud: Apr 10, 2006; I'll hear your stories when we come back, alright?

I mean every box set has some objective poo poo in it if that's what you want outta your xwangs.

# ? Sep 14, 2017 13:57

Tekopo: Oct 24, 2008; When you see it, you'll shit yourself.

Iceclaw posted:

I thought it was rampant powercreep that made ST:AW bad, not objectives. I'd actually be down for some more variety than "kill them all".

Upon the multitudes of issues that STAW had, it also had really bad/badly thought out scenarios that were part of tournament play.

# ? Sep 14, 2017 13:58

enigmahfc: Oct 10, 2003; EFF TEE DUB!!
EFF TEE DUB!!

Objectives sound terrible for tournaments. In casual games or as a campaign, sure; but tournaments do not need them.

# ? Sep 14, 2017 14:20

bunnyofdoom: Mar 29, 2008; I've been here the whole time, and you're not my real Dad!

The question is, how do objectives work in Armada? After all, same company makes it, unlike ST:AW

# ? Sep 14, 2017 14:30

ConfusedUs: Feb 24, 2004; Bees?
You want fucking bees?
Here you go!
ROLL INITIATIVE!!

RE: Objectives and alternate win conditions

Alternate win conditions are good, but they can't be half-assed. They've got to be a well-developed part of the game. They're included in both Armada and Imperial Assault. Those games have their own problems, true, but the objectives aren't on that list.

In X-Wing, there are only two win conditions, and they're both related to killing things.
a) Kill everything
b) Have a points advantage when time is up

This leads to a game where you must min-max towards that goal. The ships that are best at killing are the best in the game.

A good objective system gives alternative win conditions that allow for a more rock/paper/scissors-type meta. Do you build the kill squad? Or do you build one for an objective? Or do you still build to go to time? Which is best?

If it were well built, and designed around those objectives from the start, you'd see a tendency to stay away from the extremes. You'd need a list that could kill things, yes, but it would have to be built in a way that it could play the objective game, too.

I don't see any way to get a good objective system into X-Wing as it stands today, but alternate win conditions are one of my top wishes for a rebooted X-Wing game.

# ? Sep 14, 2017 14:31

Tekopo: Oct 24, 2008; When you see it, you'll shit yourself.

I kind of like the way IA tournaments work (although I have some reservations about the system itself). They rotate in/out certain maps and objectives, which is good because it does tend to shake up the meta somewhat, although not completely. The original objectives of Armada, though, were relatively badly thought out, and because of the way they are selected, led to only certain objectives being ever played.

# ? Sep 14, 2017 14:40

ConfusedUs: Feb 24, 2004; Bees?
You want fucking bees?
Here you go!
ROLL INITIATIVE!!

Re: Rotation

Every time a rotation is brought up, you get the same complaints.
a) It's the new stuff that's the problem
b) I don't want to buy stuff again

But ask yourself this: when's the last time you played that Luke Skywalker X-Wing? Can you even remember?

If your name isn't Strobe, you probably can't. I know I've played mine once or twice. A couple years ago. I can't be more specific than that, and I haven't seen one since.

So what are you really losing by dropping the old sets? In most cases, nothing at all.

As for buying stuff again: you can either watch the oldest stuff age into obscurity, never to be seen again, or you can have it re-released with upgraded stats to fit into the current game design space.

FFG will never stop releasing new stuff. New stuff has to have new mechanics or the game gets stale. The game will always evolve. There is always going to be some amount of power creep.

Games grow and evolve, or they wither and die. It's the nature of the beast. The competitive scene would not exist if we were still pushing the same X-Wings and TIE fighters around, five years after the original release.

Plus, who says it's the oldest stuff that has to rotate? Or that rotation has to be permanent? Imagine a world where, every 6 months, FFG defines what expansions are and are not allowed in the current competitive season. It'd keep things new and fresh. Ships that were oppressed by one thing may come back if that one thing is no longer fully viable.

# ? Sep 14, 2017 14:41

bunnyofdoom: Mar 29, 2008; I've been here the whole time, and you're not my real Dad!

I play Luke and Wedge all the time!

Well, I used to, then bomb meta kinda made me give that poo poo up

# ? Sep 14, 2017 14:45

Acebuckeye13: Nov 2, 2010; Ultra Carp

ConfusedUs posted:

But ask yourself this: when's the last time you played that Luke Skywalker X-Wing? Can you even remember?

Three months ago, I came in 2nd at 20-person store tournament :colbert:

(And I've had maybe five chances to play since then).

And yeah, color me skeptical that you'd want me to, over time, re-buy my entire collection just to continue playing tournaments. Especially when many older ships can still be effective, with the right loadout or in the right lists.

# ? Sep 14, 2017 15:14

Friction: Aug 15, 2001

Speaking of rare stuff on the table.

Cutlass Squadron Pilot (21)
Trajectory Simulator (1)
Extra Munitions (2)
Unguided Rockets (2)
Seismic Charges (2)
Thermal Detonators (3)
Lightweight Frame (2)

Cutlass Squadron Pilot (21)
Trajectory Simulator (1)
Extra Munitions (2)
Unguided Rockets (2)
Seismic Charges (2)
Thermal Detonators (3)
Lightweight Frame (2)

"Deathrain" (26)
Trajectory Simulator (1)
Unguided Rockets (2)
Bomblet Generator (3)
Lightweight Frame (2)

Total: 100

View in Yet Another Squad Builder

Maybe even ion bombs? IDK this feels so wrong and right at the same time.

# ? Sep 14, 2017 15:56

Slandible: Apr 30, 2008

Baron Fuzzlewhack posted:

2) Miniatures games make for terrible tournament play, but great and thematic story or causal play.

I see this often as a complaint, but its only true for some of the bigger known minatures. Lots of scrimmage games out there with really solid balanced tournament quality rules. Unfortunately, X Wing is not one of them.

# ? Sep 14, 2017 17:53

bunnyofdoom: Mar 29, 2008; I've been here the whole time, and you're not my real Dad!

Someone on Reddit stole my gimmick

But man, it was needed/

EDIT: That cad bane starviper tho. Holy poo poo

# ? Sep 14, 2017 19:14

Improbable Lobster: Jan 6, 2012; "From each according to his ability" said Ares. It sounded like a quotation.; Buglord

lol

# ? Sep 14, 2017 19:22

enigmahfc: Oct 10, 2003; EFF TEE DUB!!
EFF TEE DUB!!

Want to see that Space Slug's dial.

# ? Sep 14, 2017 20:48

Admiral Joeslop: Jul 8, 2010

What's the best build you can come up with that denies Target Locks? I threw a lovely one together.

Team Target Lacks

X-Wing: •Wes Janson (31)
Integrated Astromech (0)
Veteran Instincts (1)
R2 Astromech (1)

T-70 X-Wing: •Poe Dameron (HotR) (43)
Autothrusters (2)
•Black One (1)
Push the Limit (3)
•BB-8 (2)
Pattern Analyzer (2)

TIE Fighter: •Ahsoka Tano (24)
Stealth Device (3)
•Sabine's Masterpiece (1)
Expert Handling (2)
Inspiring Recruit (1)

Total: 98/100

# ? Sep 14, 2017 21:27

banned from Starbucks: Jul 18, 2004

Captain Kagi with 2 defenders

# ? Sep 14, 2017 22:27

Tekopo: Oct 24, 2008; When you see it, you'll shit yourself.

bunnyofdoom posted:

Someone on Reddit stole my gimmick

But man, it was needed/

EDIT: That cad bane starviper tho. Holy poo poo

Nera Dentals wasn't all that great, tbh. And how oft is she forgotten.

EDIT: I saw the rest of the card though, loving lol.

# ? Sep 14, 2017 22:34

canyoneer: Sep 13, 2005; I only have canyoneyes for you

bunnyofdoom posted:

Someone on Reddit stole my gimmick

But man, it was needed/

EDIT: That cad bane starviper tho. Holy poo poo

I like how Mace Windu as written does nothing. Can't perform free actions when stressed.

Also, any goons want to play some TTS X-Wing tonight? I've played a couple games now, and am willing to teach around 8pm PST (5 hours, 20 minutes from now)
On Steam my username is canyoneer and my profile photo is of a dog dressed as a mountain man wearing a coonskin cap.

# ? Sep 14, 2017 22:41

Tekopo: Oct 24, 2008; When you see it, you'll shit yourself.

canyoneer posted:

I like how Mace Windu as written does nothing. Can't perform free actions when stressed.

Also, any goons want to play some TTS X-Wing tonight? I've played a couple games now, and am willing to teach around 8pm PST (5 hours, 20 minutes from now)
On Steam my username is canyoneer and my profile photo is of a dog dressed as a mountain man wearing a coonskin cap.

You can still get the evade token though.

# ? Sep 14, 2017 22:46

ConfusedUs: Feb 24, 2004; Bees?
You want fucking bees?
Here you go!
ROLL INITIATIVE!!

If I'm free I'll message you. I'd love to play some wangs.

# ? Sep 14, 2017 23:20

banned from Starbucks: Jul 18, 2004

Yes I would love to play against Dengar and Tel both with regen astros. Fantastic idea

# ? Sep 14, 2017 23:25

theironjef: Aug 11, 2009; The archmage of unexpected stinks.

Someone help me understand. I finally own both Dengar and Nym, what's the Dengar/Nym list everyone loves so much?

# ? Sep 15, 2017 05:12

banned from Starbucks: Jul 18, 2004

something like this

Dengar (53)
JumpMaster 5000 (33), Expertise (4), K4 Security Droid (3), Unhinged Astromech (1), Punishing One (12)

Captain Nym (43)
Scurrg H-6 Bomber (30), Veteran Instincts (1), Autoblaster Turret (2), Bomblet Generator (3), Havoc (0), Engine Upgrade (4), Advanced Sensors (3), �Genius� (0)
96

or you can put torps and boba on Dengar and take out K4

# ? Sep 15, 2017 05:19

canyoneer: Sep 13, 2005; I only have canyoneyes for you

I just clowned on a guy on TTS with rebel alpha list. Guy dropped after Wedge produced 4 crits with a proton torpedo vs. a 1 agility ship.
Wedge is the best :allears:

# ? Sep 15, 2017 05:30

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# ? May 15, 2024 10:04

IronSaber: Feb 24, 2009; oh yes oh god yes form the head FORM THE HEAD unghhhh...

canyoneer posted:

I just clowned on a guy on TTS with rebel alpha list. Guy dropped after Wedge produced 4 crits with a proton torpedo vs. a 1 agility ship.
Wedge is the best

Nice.

# ? Sep 15, 2017 15:40

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