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LesterGroans posted:He should have gently kissed his head and wiped his memory. Amateur hour, Kal El. he only does that with people he hosed, tho
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Sep 19, 2017 01:42
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The thing is, though, what Vaughn is saying are just generic platitudes. "For me Superman is color, feel-good, heroic. He’s a beacon of light in darkness." Beacon of light in darkness means different things to different people. In the current political climate, you can't have a "feel-good" Superman because the world is vastly different and people don't want escapism like that. They want a Superhero confronting the issues of their time. In the year of 2017, we have to tell people that nazis are, indeed, very bad and that many in the press are equating the people who oppose them are just as bad. On top of police brutality, rights of violent white supremacists being defended over PoC, a political party actively trying to kill millions of citizens by taking away their health care. You think a "feel-good" film would work? It'd be a hollow milquetoast gesture that only Hollywood can produce. Zack Snyder had it right. Superman was a beacon of light in darkness of a poo poo-rear end suck world and he can't be feel-good because the world isn't working properly and he reflects that. Truth be told, if a beacon of light in darkness means Superman becomes political and defends a marginalized crowd from oppression, I'd be all for that. But that, too, "won't be my Superman" because he's engaging in what white nerds call "politics", a tool of the "SJWs" . I guarantee you, the moment he stops a bully from picking on a trans kid (because that's what a Donner Superman would do) the internet would have a meltdown and it'd be the worst take on Superman since Snyder turned him into a murder-hungry madman who killed trillions of people..
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Sep 19, 2017 01:42
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Detective No. 27 posted:Jor El: You will give the people of Earth an ideal to strive towards. They will race behind you, they will stumble, they will fall. But in time, they will join you in the sun, Kal. In time, you will help them accomplish wonders. That scene is so much more effective in the trailer.
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Sep 19, 2017 01:42
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Equeen posted:he only does that with people he hosed, tho Now we've got ourselves a movie
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Sep 19, 2017 01:47
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LesterGroans posted:Now we've got ourselves a movie superman awkwardly trying to seduce zod and give him the amnesia kiss to save the world would be the only Donner homage i will accept.
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Sep 19, 2017 01:56
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LesterGroans posted:Now we've got ourselves a movie And something Vaughn, director who launched a million McAvoy-Fassbender slashfics, would have done too.
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Sep 19, 2017 01:58
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Ugh I mean I love the Donner movies but hell there has got to be at least a third way to do a Superman movie. Like Returns flops then we get at least marginal success with the last two but they were critically divisive so we gotta go running back to the Donner well to tap those last few drops.
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Sep 19, 2017 02:10
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Not that I even think Vaughn would ape the style in the same way that Singer did, but it is just a weird rear end comment to make in light of Returns. Like that movie already exists and nobody was interested, including all the people saying they prefer that style to MoS.
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Sep 19, 2017 02:14
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I've just seen a lot of Vaughn doing superhero/fantasy kinda stuff and don't really want to see his take on a Superman. I'd like to see another Layer Cake from him though.
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Sep 19, 2017 02:21
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If I never see another Donner-style superhero movie in my life, it’ll be too soon. I like Returns for actually putting Clark in a dilemma he can’t rear end-pull his way out of like the one-and-a-half Donner movies that precede it 100% did, and it’s one of the more gorgeous comic book movies of all time (Newton Thomas Siegel is probably the most underrated cinematographer in Hollywood, just because of what he can do with digital cameras between this and Drive), and it isn’t constantly throwing jokes at the wall like the original does, but I really wish it was the closing of the book on that style of superhero movie. Instead we have like two dozen Marvel movies, which at least 75% of which are aping (Iron Man) an aping (Spider-Man) of that movie in tone and in many ways the inherent structure of it. The day comic book movies let go of a loving 1978 motion picture might be the day they actually assume the place of the closest comparison - the mid-century ubiquity of the Western - in today’s cultural landscape. Like, really, it’s as if you were growing up watching Westerns and all anyone ever seemed to want was more loving versions of Stagecoach, decades on from that movie. I mean, Stagecoach is an unassailable classic, but you can’t make Cat Ballou by aping it, or a spaghetti Western, or even like the latter half of John Ford’s career or the Peckinpah westerns. Or to be even more succinct: movies are a conversation, as all art is, with society. To continue wanting more of what is already a constant tone of modern superhero movies is like just wanting someone to stand at a podium and yell “sibilance” over and over for six hours.
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Sep 19, 2017 02:21
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The Donner Superman on film is less played out than the Dark Knight Batman we've had for decades now.
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Sep 19, 2017 03:31
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Agreed, but its a little harder to make a more revisionist superhero movie, since they're inherently fantastical, while western stories were theoretically possible in real life. Yet even then we have some comic book flicks that tweak the mold. Punisher is closer to Shane, Hancock is kind of Hang em High. There are others, Kick-rear end, Defendor, etc etc
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Sep 19, 2017 03:40
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Davros1 posted:The Donner Superman on film is less played out than the Dark Knight Batman we've had for decades now. Not really. Burton, Schumacher, Nolan and Snyder all have pretty fuckin' different ideas about the character, both cosmetically and fundamentally
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Sep 19, 2017 03:41
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Davros1 posted:The Donner Superman on film is less played out than the Dark Knight Batman we've had for decades now. I dunno I feel like we had a pretty decent variety between Adam West cartoon campiness, Tim Burton dark carnival campiness, Joel Schumacher psychosexual campiness, Christopher Nolan campiness of having the literal Dark Knight from the comics hanging around an otherwise straight-faced crime movie, and now Snyder's take. Edit: Ah beaten.
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Sep 19, 2017 03:42
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I'd go for Fleitcher Superman.
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Sep 19, 2017 03:43
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And yet when Vaughn says "For me Superman is color, feel-good, heroic. He’s a beacon of light in darkness. And that’s what I think Superman should be” people can only see it as one interpretation?
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Sep 19, 2017 03:46
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Davros1 posted:And yet when Vaughn says "For me Superman is color, feel-good, heroic. He’s a beacon of light in darkness. And that’s what I think Superman should be” people can only see it as one interpretation? I don't think it's that part so much as him saying he wants to do a Donner. That's been done.
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Sep 19, 2017 03:49
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I'd love to see Vaughn's take, especially if he can do a long take fight like in the Kingsman.
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Sep 19, 2017 04:01
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If he wants to go Donner then he should go full Donner. Mel Gibson as Superman, Danny Glover as Lex Luthor. No wait, Danny Glover as Superman, Mel Gibson as Lex Luthor. Wait, hm. Actually, it should be Danny Glover as Superman, Mel Gibson as Lex, Gary Busey as Clark Kent, Joe Pesci as Lois Lane, Renee Russo and Chris Rock as the Kents, Darlene Love as Jimmy, and Jet Li as Jor-El.
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Sep 19, 2017 04:03
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Alfred Molina as Otis, Jodie Foster as Miss Kitty (I really loved the casting in Superman Returns, btw) got any sevens fucked around with this message at 04:21 on Sep 19, 2017 |
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Sep 19, 2017 04:14
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Davros1 posted:And yet when Vaughn says "For me Superman is color, feel-good, heroic. He’s a beacon of light in darkness. And that’s what I think Superman should be” people can only see it as one interpretation? No, people were specifically reacting to the Donner aspect of the quote. Did you just not read a bunch of the last page??
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Sep 19, 2017 04:15
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Like, DONNER didn't even get to properly do a Donner. We have 1 and a half films properly made by him and they were cobbled together into a mess after he got fired for doing his job.
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Sep 19, 2017 04:30
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Superman returns was a very good movie about my favorite superhero "Guy Who Owns a Plane"
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Sep 19, 2017 04:34
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When people mean that superheroes should be optimistic as opposed to what Snyder does, they really do mean that the franchise should be feelgood as opposed to truly optimistic. You'll notice that no one actually says what Donner Superman movies are optimistic about, aside from being generally "feelgood" and having a bright, friendly aesthetic. This is because they're not really optimistic, but operate on the level of hokey escapism. Marvel movies are extremely cynical and pessimistic, but are superficially feelgood enough that people don't notice it. Actual optimism demands that you recognize real problems, but still believe that they can overcome no matter how insurmountable. This is why CelticPredator prefers the trailer of Man of Steel to the actual movie: the movie actually gets down to those problems, while the trailer doesn't.
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Sep 19, 2017 04:54
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sjdnCC6n4xk
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Sep 19, 2017 04:54
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There's been a sad lack of Superman punching lasers in the live-action films.
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Sep 19, 2017 07:14
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I hope the superhero craze lasts long enough for them to make a Red Son movie. It would probably be garbage, but it would sure as hell be something to see.
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Sep 19, 2017 13:30
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I would like someone to actually go back to the source material and make a golden age angry socialist Superman movie.
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Sep 19, 2017 13:37
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CelticPredator posted:He can do Tommy Wiseau pastiche and it would still be great. Vaughn hasn't let me down yet. it is funny tho that you apparently think the Snyder films are too dark and not optimistic enough but you're apparently okay with Marc Millar-type edgy garbage. I find the Kick-rear end and Kingsman films a lot more full of toxic sickness and darkness than MoS or BvS. Luckily he wasn't involved with writing or directing Kick-rear end 2....I haven't seen Stardust....and well, the James Bond Magneto segments of First Class don't make up for how mediocre & forgettable I find the film as a whole. It's definitely more underwhelming in retrospect than MoS or BvS. Punkin Spunkin fucked around with this message at 14:01 on Sep 19, 2017 |
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Sep 19, 2017 13:58
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Detective No. 27 posted:Jor El: You will give the people of Earth an ideal to strive towards. They will race behind you, they will stumble, they will fall. But in time, they will join you in the sun, Kal. In time, you will help them accomplish wonders. You have Zod and you have Clark, a God came to earth, connected with humanity, sided with them to protect and uplift them and be amongst them when it could have gone a terrible way, thanks to good Fathers showing nurture can help guide nature to good ends and what you are born with or "fated/destined" with isn't the end all be all. And going off Jor El's quote, Superman saved Batman's soul through his sacrifice and action. I'd like a Morrison take on Superman from All Star. A fully mature and experienced Superman using the full extent of his capabilities and intelligence to move the world forward because time is limited. He's facing something bigger than him to accomplish wonders that's not a physical threat but is universal amongst all living things. It's like the classic super scientist adventurer thing from the serial comics in the past. Gatts fucked around with this message at 14:02 on Sep 19, 2017 |
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Sep 19, 2017 13:59
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Hot Take: I think Vaughn's movies are generally better than Snyder's movies. I like MoS, but thought that BvS was very meh, and am also excited about MoS 2. Kingsman Snatch Kingsman 2 Kick rear end First Class Layer Cake Days of Future Past vs. 300 MoS BvS Sucker Punch Legend of the Guardians: The Owls of Ga'Hoole Watchmen Both of those lists have some very good movies, but if I can only take one, then I'm definitely going with the top.
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Sep 19, 2017 14:02
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So what's actually better about them?
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Sep 19, 2017 14:04
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Also why is a Guy Ritchie movie and a Bryan Singer movie in your list of Matthew Vaughn movies Did you even go and look at like IMDb or Wikipedia before you made that list
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Sep 19, 2017 14:08
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Lobok posted:If he wants to go Donner then he should go full Donner. Mel Gibson as Superman, Danny Glover as Lex Luthor. No wait, Danny Glover as Superman, Mel Gibson as Lex Luthor. Gods and Monsters storyline: Oscar Isaac or Diego Luna as Superman, Shia Labeouf as Batman, Emily Blunt as Wonder Woman, Viola Davis as President Amanda Waller, Christopher Walken as Lex Luthor, Javier Bardem as General Zod
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Sep 19, 2017 14:12
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Looks like Frank Grillo is coming back to the MCU as Crossbones. Io9 is speculating that he survived being turned into a singularity in Civil War but anyone with two brain cells to rub together can probably guess he will be in Captain Marvel.
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Sep 19, 2017 14:13
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Hot Take: I think Vaughn's movies are generally better than Snyder's movies. I like MoS, but thought that BvS was very meh, and am also excited about MoS 2. Punkin Spunkin fucked around with this message at 14:56 on Sep 19, 2017 |
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Sep 19, 2017 14:21
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The fact that Matthew Vaughn have made entertaining movies out of the cringiest Mark Millar comic means he should make a Red Son movie, not a Donner copycat. Anyway, here is Josh Brolin being shouty as Cable. 
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Sep 19, 2017 14:31
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The MSJ posted:The fact that Matthew Vaughn have made entertaining movies out of the cringiest Mark Millar comic means he should make a Red Son movie, not a Donner copycat. This post was way better before the edit.
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Sep 19, 2017 14:32
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The MSJ posted:The fact that Matthew Vaughn have made entertaining movies out of the cringiest Mark Millar comic means he should make a Red Son movie, not a Donner copycat. Dang, he really beefed up for the role!
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Sep 19, 2017 14:34
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Punkin Spunkin posted:(which every goon is apparently convinced was definitely some Robocop/Starship Troopers poo poo, because, well, of course they are. only way "woke" whitie can justify still enjoying that fascist garbage) As funny as this is, it's another one of those weird "supposed to" takes. Matt even literally says "... you're supposed to be disgusted". Snyder is trying really hard to sell fascism but fucks it up by showing the Spartans killing infants and the Persians having dope catgirl rave parties. Whoops! Like, Occam's razor that poo poo, maybe Snyder didn't intend the exact opposite of what you're seeing. Hell, even if he did who gives a poo poo? If 300 is making Will go "Again, how do you not root for the Persians when you watch this movie?" is that not a good argument that it's not glorifying the fascist Spartans?
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Sep 19, 2017 14:40
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