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Montasque posted:I posted about this in the nazi thread but gently caress gently caress gently caress. Let's have the guy who just said we'll "completely destroy" North Korea say Russia attacked us.
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Sep 19, 2017 23:12
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SKULL.GIF posted:are you suggesting that humans didn't try to become prestigious or try to accomplish great feats or try to acquire social dominance before capitalism or something not necessarily, but i am suggesting that idgaf about "human nature" arguments
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Sep 19, 2017 23:13
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by disconnecting calls for single payer from any larger socialist program, you're going to wind up with a scenario where by the neoliberal center decides to embrace the European consensus of single-payer healthcare, leading to a situation where the movement peters out upon its "success" instead of continuing to push for a change to the economic system that has hollowed out the middle class over the past 50 years
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Sep 19, 2017 23:14
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:Let's have the guy who just said we'll "completely destroy" North Korea say Russia attacked us. I'm not sure what these people want other than trying to rationalize Hillary's loss.
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Sep 19, 2017 23:15
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WhiskeyJuvenile posted:by disconnecting calls for single payer from any larger socialist program, you're going to wind up with a scenario where by the neoliberal center decides to embrace the European consensus of single-payer healthcare, leading to a situation where the movement peters out upon its "success" instead of continuing to push for a change to the economic system that has hollowed out the middle class over the past 50 years lmao back at it already huh
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Sep 19, 2017 23:15
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when a loving homunculus like Cory Booker signs on the single payer, it should be a sign that your ask is way the gently caress too small
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Sep 19, 2017 23:16
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[quote="“WhiskeyJuvenile”" post="“476563343”"] by disconnecting calls for single payer from any larger socialist program, you’re going to wind up with a scenario where by the neoliberal center decides to embrace the European consensus of single-payer healthcare, leading to a situation where the movement peters out upon its “success” instead of continuing to push for a change to the economic system that has hollowed out the middle class over the past 50 years [/quote] cleaning lady and the au pair didn’t call out today eh?
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Sep 19, 2017 23:16
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Montasque posted:I'm not sure what these people want other than trying to rationalize Hillary's loss. My kokoro wish is that Trump would be a respectable president, and name the perfidious Slav.
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Sep 19, 2017 23:17
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https://twitter.com/ddddarby/status/910261557875007488
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Sep 19, 2017 23:17
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WhiskeyJuvenile posted:when a loving homunculus like Cory Booker signs on the single payer, it should be a sign that your ask is way the gently caress too small has it ever occurred to you that there are literally zero people in here who feel that single payer healthcare is the endgame of politics?
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Sep 19, 2017 23:18
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so disrespectful
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Sep 19, 2017 23:18
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The Kingdom of God will never be realized in the works of man and will always exist in contrast and opposition to it but in the meantime people might not be broken financially by a serious illness so that's cool.
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Sep 19, 2017 23:20
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shut up whiskeymans
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Sep 19, 2017 23:21
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punk rebel ecks posted:What would you say would be the best way to convert the American economy into coops? the dick wolff goes around the country providing a compelling reason for worker coops: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Ihltj9As7s worker coops can be created incrementally by workers with sufficient capital themselves right now the government can institute policies that promote worker coops. in italy since the 80s, italy has allowed workers to take their unemployment compensation as seed capital with other workers to start worker coops. jeremy corbyn has proposed the right of first refusal which allows workers to receive a government loan to form a worker coop if their place of employment is sold or offshored. sanders himself has various proposals for government funding of worker coops: https://www.sanders.senate.gov/newsroom/recent-business/worker-owned-businesses-2014
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Sep 19, 2017 23:22
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Ytlaya posted:To be completely fair, you could make the same argument regarding criticism of mainstream Dems (i.e. "who gives a poo poo if they have flaws, the Republicans are worse"). Humans only work with trial and error, as has been done for their entire history ever since someone ate a poisonous berry and someone else said "yikes, lets not do that cos that guy died." and 30,000 years later a Berber man in Cordoba tried to emulate flight only to come crashing down off his tower and died, only to have first human flight come within 1000 years of that after. So to be fair, you can only convince people with trial and error because its like pulling teeth with them until they see evidence of it not working. If Bernie is the shot right now, you give it the trial period, and capitulate on that. It's not like its set in stone, with an ever fluid exchange of ideas, even more so at this day and age with a much more rapid and exponential ever present change. Bernie has been harping on this for decades for it to even go mainstream, and thats a feat in itself. And there's still way too much work to do, more teeth to pull. It'd be stupid and petty to just dismiss it outright because some of his ideas aren't pure enough. It's active erasure of progress. You have to start somewhere. Lastgirl has issued a correction as of 23:33 on Sep 19, 2017 |
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Sep 19, 2017 23:23
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:My kokoro wish is that Trump would be a respectable president, and name the perfidious Slav. I'm still processing the idea that Putin's single driving force to becoming leader of Russia was to get back at America one day through buying a bunch of Facebook ads.
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Sep 19, 2017 23:28
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the optimistic hope is that worker coops provide such a compelling life experience that americans will voluntarily want to work in the coop sector of the economy rather than the capitalist one
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Sep 19, 2017 23:28
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WhiskeyJuvenile posted:by disconnecting calls for single payer from any larger socialist program, you're going to wind up with a scenario where by the neoliberal center decides to embrace the European consensus of single-payer healthcare, leading to a situation where the movement peters out upon its "success" instead of continuing to push for a change to the economic system that has hollowed out the middle class over the past 50 years I'm going to disconnect ur head from ur shoulders!!! I'm taking ur trolls seriously!!! I'm mad as heck!!!
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Sep 19, 2017 23:30
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not gonna lie, seeing a clip on the morning news of pelosi having a crowd of people around her collectively read her the riot act for her bullshit gave me a little spring in my step this morning on my way to work.
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Sep 19, 2017 23:30
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Gene Hackman Fan posted:not gonna lie, seeing a clip on the morning news of pelosi having a crowd of people around her collectively read her the riot act for her bullshit gave me a little spring in my step this morning on my way to work. Progress. It's all the little things 
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Sep 19, 2017 23:31
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NewForumSoftware posted:has it ever occurred to you that there are literally zero people in here who feel that single payer healthcare is the endgame of politics? you've got people saying that the workers displaced by single payer will be able to retrain or some bullshit, so I'm really not sure about their larger political feelings quoting from DSA dank meme stash: quote:I'm both surprised and disappointed in everyone making capitalist "creative destruction" arguments in favor of displacement of workers by technological / administrative innovation. You all should know drat WELL that structural unemployment is a real thing, that most displaced folks, especially when they're older, do not find equivalent skilled or semi-skilled work.
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Sep 19, 2017 23:32
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Agean90 posted:my biggest issue with ubi is that lovely landlords wouod hike their rents by however much the ubi is I think there has yet to be a study that has proved things like this happen. This is the same argument made against things like minimum wage
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Sep 19, 2017 23:33
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Lastgirl posted:Progress. It's all the little things incrementalism i can get behind drag em to the left kicking and screaming
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Sep 19, 2017 23:33
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Venom Snake posted:I think there has yet to be a study that has proved things like this happen. This is the same argument made against things like minimum wage its also pretty easily countered by just... y'know... not letting them do that
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Sep 19, 2017 23:34
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Venom Snake posted:I think there has yet to be a study that has proved things like this happen. This is the same argument made against things like minimum wage it's not quite the same but that pretty much happened with the Obama first time home buyer credit just upping prices
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Sep 19, 2017 23:36
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OatmealRaisin posted:incrementalism i can get behind if it involves our metaphorical kicking and their literal screaming, I'm all in favor. edit: metaphorically kicking them right in their (ed) balls. edit edit: (that joke's still a thing we're doing, right)
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Sep 19, 2017 23:36
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WhiskeyJuvenile posted:you've got people saying that the workers displaced by single payer will be able to retrain or some bullshit, so I'm really not sure about their larger political feelings 
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Sep 19, 2017 23:38
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OatmealRaisin posted:incrementalism i can get behind see, centrists use that word but they're so fkn inert so its disingenuous. i would gladly drag them step by step, by their hair, as they flail and smack me in the face, screeching all the way as i stoically with sheer grit and determination, my eyebrows furrowed, my inchward steps purposeful as I am on a fkn mission to help people better their lives instead of just being huffy and arguing with them.
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Sep 19, 2017 23:39
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Incrementalism isn't supposed to be Zeno's paradox.
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Sep 19, 2017 23:40
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WhiskeyJuvenile posted:you've got people saying that the workers displaced by single payer will be able to retrain or some bullshit, so I'm really not sure about their larger political feelings i think i was one of hte ppl you are talking about and i wasn't saying that they'd need retraining lol they literally have 100% transferable skills even within the same broad industry
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Sep 19, 2017 23:41
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if we have single payer then nobody will ever need white collar office workers with advanced experience with excel and databases ever again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Sep 19, 2017 23:42
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Starting anything is the hardest part, and it takes time but once you get the ball rolling its almost as if you have momentum. Weird~
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Sep 19, 2017 23:43
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Honestly I thought WJ was a centrist for a long time until he claimed to be a leftist just because of the way he constantly complains like one so lmao stop engaging him~ He's a closet centrist.
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Sep 19, 2017 23:45
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it's always the people who are laughably unfamiliar with work who thinks that a bolt tightener needs extensive and expensive retraining to become a screw tightener
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Sep 19, 2017 23:46
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Al! posted:not necessarily, but i am suggesting that idgaf about "human nature" arguments I'm saying that the guy who claimed that people would stop trying to "live above the baseline" after a few generations because of the declining psychological effect is completely wrong there's still going to be plenty of these people even 10 generations into a theoretical communist society
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Sep 19, 2017 23:47
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https://mobile.twitter.com/thehill/status/910272319058300930 lol that was quick
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Sep 19, 2017 23:49
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Lastgirl posted:Honestly I thought WJ was a centrist for a long time until he claimed to be a leftist just because of the way he constantly complains like one so lmao stop engaging him~ He's a closet centrist. "I supported bernie up until the BERNIEBROS" is another frequent claim of centrists, so obv we can't take them at their word
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Sep 19, 2017 23:51
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Taintrunner posted:privatized fire departments became a public service when capital realized that raging fires in urban areas got in the way of generating wealth for the capital holders listen to the chapo episode about the sewer socialists
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Sep 19, 2017 23:51
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fits my needs posted:https://mobile.twitter.com/thehill/status/910272319058300930 just chillin between center-left and center-right
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Sep 19, 2017 23:52
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fits my needs posted:https://mobile.twitter.com/thehill/status/910272319058300930 guess the civil war's off back down to four doomsday scenarios
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Sep 19, 2017 23:52
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